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"We need more damage" is simply not a good reason to reject Defenders and Controllers en masse from your LFT searches.
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People are so sensitive - I have never had much of anything against defenders, defenders are beautiful people. BUT - when I hire a defender to come on board my teams, it is not for their damage. I could give a heck less what flavor of defender they are, they all taste great and are less filling. But the purpose of a defender is to defend. If they increase our damage in the process, bonus. If I need damage, I hire blasters, scrappers, or khelds. Used to include fire tanks in that, but not so much more since Burn got nerfed into obsolence.
I was just on a nearly-all defender/controller team the other day. Drove me nuts - We were doing OK considering, and we were making headway, but it was just fundamentally wrong. We were all linebacker and no running back.
For the life of me, I have difficulty understand why people chaff so much against the archetype stereotypes. I think defenders resent it more because all the narrow minded simpletons out there hassle them with R u h34l3r?
Well, I'm not too sensitive about the healer thing, I play the way I feel I can best cotribute at the time. But after your last statement, I wonder if you really understand how all the different powers can help each other.
When I'm putting a team together I look at the powers and AT present and go from there. An example is if it's a melee heavy team I will broadcast that I'm looking for a Kin. with one addition I have increased the damage of the team + melee healing + his own blasts.
I just disagree with your thoughts in this area, and where this is in the guides section beginners need to hear all sides.
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Everyone pulls their weight.
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Great advice, but IMHO hard to judge just from a script or from their endurance bar.
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If you find someone who seems to be standing around a lot, hardly using their END, that's a warning sign.
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In principle, yes, but again, it's a bit hard to judge it objectively.
In heavy lag animations are often skipped or reversed, for example. (E.g., my DM scrapper would look like he's the one on the receiving end of a Shaddow Maul, when in fact he's the one administering it.) So someone may appear to stand around when they're in fact actively attacking.
As for the endurance bar, pretty much any regen scrapper nowadays and most defenders can regen endurance almost as fast as they use it. Any of my higher level regens, between QR and Stamina see their endurance bar go down very slowly when not actively drained by a Sapper or Carnie, and usually not at all if some form of recovery aura (also including Rad's AM) is applied on top of it.
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I have a little script I wrote that can parse a demo file and tell me how much damage people did in the last mission. It isn't perfect, given that you only see damage that happens near you. But it can give you a real good idea.
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While indeed it can give you some idea, I would be wary of taking it as more than just an idea. If you take damage output as the only indicator of someone's contribution, you've for example discriminated against anyone with, say, the Leadership pool which uses their endurance to boost the others' deadliness. E.g.,...
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Last night I teamed with a level 50 Blaster who did less damage than his Emp Defender SK.
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... might (or might not) mean the defender just spent too much time blasting. I'm not saying defenders shouldn't blast at all, far from it, but I do occasionally run into one which I have to heal with the Medicine pool because he's too busy blasting to even heal himself.
... or it might mean he was an Ice Blaster, which get Blizzard as their final power, while the Defender had a Nova or Thunderous Blast and Hasten. Or the Defender had Psychic Blast which, by sheer virtue of being undefended by most opponents, can easily out-damage, say, AR in _some_ missions.
Comparing strictly the damage output tends to favour:
- AOE-heavy builds over one-target high-damage builds (e.g., Fire will inherently top the list, just as it usually does in the Punisher rankings),
- damage-intensive builds over team-oriented utility builds (e.g., Fire beats Ice, and Fire Control beats Gravity Control... even though Gravity has much longer holds that the team can benefit from.)
- berserk builds and play-styles over defense-oriented builds (E.g., until the 30's, a defense-oriented Invuln or Dark Armor scrapper will be out-gunned by everyone else, but can tank even an elite boss without needing a Defender's full-time attention. Conversely it would be very easy to build a purely AOE build with no defense, e.g., Spines/DA taking only Death Shroud and Dark Embrace (because it's mandatory) and top that damage chart, or better yet a Blapper with Combustion, Fire Sword Circle, Blazing Aura and some assorted pool attacks. But you'll need one defender doing nothing but keeping you alive. I.e., one defender which hardly has any time left for the rest of the team, or to do any blasting of his own.)
So basically I'm sure you know how to apply that intelligently, but I'd caution anyone against following such an indicator blindly.
Well, in short, every team member must adapt their playstyle according to the makeup of the rest of the team. Some situations are more difficult. I have one example:
I'm a scrapper. The team had 2 defenders doing healing and the rest were ranged as well (blasters, controllers). So what we have is 7 ranged attackers and one melee. I found that I couldn't "go in" and attack or I wouldn't get heals. If I stayed with the ranged group (the whole team) I was not effective. they said, well just stay with us and if anything gets close to us, you can kill that. Ok, that made me feel like a "just stand there and look pretty" kind of thing because they are not using much of my potential.
They finally got a tanker on board and I stuck to the tankers back into the melee. Still, both healers stayed behind the squishies and the group died a lot. I told them, "hey, get one defender to tag the tank and keep him healed because if he lives, he will taunt, I will kill, and the rest of you will live a LOT longer. And dont worry about healing me, I'll do fine."
Well they eventually had both healers on the tank and I, the deaths stopped completely, and the squishes took almost no damage. And we proceeded to rock the house. the tanker thanked me cause he didn't think the group knew what they were doing, but was not going to beg or complain for heals either.
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People are so sensitive - I have never had much of anything against defenders, defenders are beautiful people. BUT - when I hire a defender to come on board my teams, it is not for their damage. I could give a heck less what flavor of defender they are, they all taste great and are less filling.
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I don't have a problem with looking for Defenders when you need defense. I'm pointing out that your decision to skip them when you need offense is based on misconceptions.
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But the purpose of a defender is to defend.
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A purpose of a Defender is to defend. Another is team buffing/mob debuffing. They're the closest to a hybrid AT this game has. The greatest flaw in their design is the name "Defender". Among the original ATs, they're third-best at protecting teams from the bad guys. In fact, the only ones worse at it are the two that weren't designed to even try.
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If they increase our damage in the process, bonus. If I need damage, I hire blasters, scrappers, or khelds.
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But that's the thing. Adding anything but a FF Defender to a medium-to-large team will increase that team's total damage output by at least as much, and probably more, than adding one of those ATs you mentioned will. I'm not "chafing against the archetype stereotype". That's simply how the DMG bonus/RES debuff math works out. Nothing personal.
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I was just on a nearly-all defender/controller team the other day. Drove me nuts - We were doing OK considering, and we were making headway, but it was just fundamentally wrong. We were all linebacker and no running back.
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We'll just have to disagree here. If it works, it works. One of the consequences of CoH being deliberately designed so no AT is vital is that teams of all one AT can perform surprisingly well.
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Met a controller, not even out of his teens, wanted to know if the team wanted him to HERD)
Conversely, if you're talking to someone who knows what they're doing; by all means, consider an invite.
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Some controllers do have the ability to herd in their teens: /Rads (with Radiation Infection) and /Storms (with Snowstorm), if you don't mind the herd moving s l o w l y. (/Storms get much better at it at 20, when they get Hurricane.) Since mobs don't mez so much in those levels, and hp disparity versus melee'ers isn't as great, it is possible, though a defender of the same sort (or a Dark/) would be better-suited to the task.
Why not invite him and see? When someone suggests a tactic that seems unusual, you should see if it works, though also prepared to RUN! if things go awry.
I was actually planning to make the reply that Jeff_Alexander and Raxer already beat me to about adding defenders, but I'll elaborate a little.
The reason I think you make the mistake about not hiring defenders for offense is because 2/3 (or more) of defenders are empaths (and some 1/2 of those "pure"), and two of their three offensive buffs are single target (RA excepted), so the whole team, unless small doesn't benefit. Throw in Rads/, Storms/, and Darks/, and each has a power that, if played thoughtfully, can increase every team member's damage by 30%, while simultaneously slowing incoming damage (thru redux, knockdown, or slow). Kins/ can add even more at high levels, as you know. More defenders than other classes also take Leadership powers as well, buffing your offensive output even further. And defenders & controllers make it much safer for blasters to go wild with their AoEs, killing mobs faster.
I suspect your "linebacker" team had a tank for the other member (a lineman?), and the bulk of the defenders were empaths without much in the way of blasts.
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Finally - you can't be afraid to tick people off. Some people are going to think you're a idiot, others will think you don't know what you're talking about. In fact, you can't be afraid to let the majority of the people on the server think you're crazy. CoH is a microcosm of life, if you're lucky - you might make friends with an extremely small percentage of people and the rest will tolerate you. If you're fortunate enough to lead some effective groups, folks might start to send you the "so what are you up to?" tells. THOSE ARE A COMPLIMENT. You want people to want to team with you. Always reinvite those people!
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A compliment? I team with someone for a couple of AV's and they want to be buddies? Based on what?
That's not a compliment, that's boredom linked with desperation, in my opinion. If you're not on my global, no need to be asking me what I'm up to.
But that's just me and I'm certainly not typical.
"Most people that have no idea what they are doing have no idea that they don't know what they are doing." - John Cleese
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Some simple maths. Let's say you have a team of 7 Fire Blasters. (Yes, not a good team mix, but bear with me for example sake.) Adding another one will boost the total damage by 14.3%.
Adding a single Radiation Emission defender will add 25% base damage from the Accelerate Metabolism damage boost alone. Which can mean anything between just that in the single digit levels, and 13% of your total damage when you've already enhanced everything to 94% in the 40's. Possibly even more from having more endurance and recharge rate. And that's just from the buff.
If the defender took Assault from the Leadership pool, that's another 18.75% base damage increase on top of AM. Slice it any way you will, but he/she has at this point already added more damage output to your team than another fire blaster would.
Stack some debuffs on the enemies too, and it can become scary. E.g., Enervating Field boosts your damage by _another_ 23%, applied multiplicatively on top of all the enhancements, buffs and inspirations you might use, even if you were at the damage cap.
One more thing about defenders is that, unlike some other MMOs (e.g., WoW), buffs and debuffs of the same type _do_ stack.
E.g., in WoW, if one Paladin boosted your mana regen, another isn't even allowed to cast the same buff on you, unless it's a higher level version of it. And if it's higher level, it will replace the old one, so you're back to just one buff anyway.
Ditto for auras (similar to COH's PBAOE toggles, e.g., to Leadership): if there were two paladins in the same team and one was already boosting the team's defense, I had to switch to giving them something else, or one effect would be lost.
Ditto for debuffs: if a hunter had already slowed a target, a second wouldn't even be allowed to use the same spell on the target, unless it's a higher level version. And again, the higher level version replaced it.
In COH such things don't happen. COH allows stacking buffs or debuffs sky-high and then some.
What I'm getting at is that the "but we need a mixed team with specialized roles" is true for WoW by design, but not necessarily true in COH.
In COH you can have for example a team of exclusively Rad defenders and the stacked buffs and debuffs will add up to something scary. The debuffs alone can peg an AV at 5% chance to hit and not too much damage per hit either.
And the stacked recharge boosts alone mean you can unload a Nova or Nuclear Blast or whatever in every group of enemies on the way, and have it at the damage cap at that. (In fact, at more than the damage cap if the enemies saw some generous application of EF first.)
Basically, again, AT's are important, but how you use them is much more important.
It's not "chaffing against the archetypes", it's just using them for what they _are_. Yes, defenders defend and most can heal. And by all means, they should do it when it's needed. No ifs, no buts, no "but blasting's more fun". But if that's all you've understood from that AT, you don't even start to understand the AT and how to use it.
And one more thing about ATs. Anyone can hold the helm when the sea is calm, and anyone can win a battle with an ideal army and numeric superiority. That's no feat. The good leader is the one that can make use of what's available.
Sometimes you don't have an Empath or FF available for a Malta or Carnie mission. (Yes, FF too. I wish more people would read the description of Insulation Shield in the game, to end the mis-conception that Empathy is the only thing that protects from end drain.) Sometimes you don't have 4 level 50 Kheldians just waiting to be your damage dealers. Sometimes you don't get a Tanker for your AV mission. Etc. You'd be surprised what else can work there.
If I can add my own two cents...
It is true that in a team of 7 Blasters, adding one more Blaster (or a Scrapper for that matter) doesn't change the damage output as significantly as adding a buffing/debuffing Defender. However, if I (a Dark/Dark Defender) am in a team with an Empath and a Controller of some stripe, I'm going to want to add someone with a little more punch to take the best advantage of all those buffs/debuffs/mezzes.
If you want to argue math, if the Defenders do (for example) 50 points per shot, and they're able to increase their damage output by 25%, they'll be doing 62.5 points of damage per shot. If I bring in a blaster who does 80 points per shot, that same increase will bring it up to 100 points a shot. Enemies fall down a lot faster than if I brought in another Defender.
I think the point is all about wanting to create optimum groups that compliment one-another's abilities, not an attempt to pigeon-hole anyone into any particular role. If you've already GOT a lot of offensive ATs on your team (Scrappers, Blasters, to a lesser extent Tankers), the team would benefit much more from a Defender or Controller than another shooter. Likewise, if you've got 4 Defenders, get yourself a blaster or scrapper or two for Pete's sake, unless you like knocking down bad guys veeerrry sloooowly.
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Likewise, if you've got 4 Defenders, get yourself a blaster or scrapper or two for Pete's sake, unless you like knocking down bad guys veeerrry sloooowly.
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You're playing with the wrong defenders (unless you're at low levels). Rikti office bldg mish last night +1-+3 to the party with a Fire/Rad, Ice/Storm, Rad/Rad, and a Dark/Dark defender. We mowed through the opposition, and upon checking the damage log I realized I hadn't been hit on the second floor. If you're co-ordinated (with two Enervating Fields, AMs, a Radiation Infection, a Tar Patch, and Freezing Rain all at once, in this case) your enemies' defenses and resistances are pitiful, and they melt before you.
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when I hire a defender to come on board my teams, it is not for their damage.
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When I design Super Teams, I include exclusively Defenders or ATs with Defender secondaries precisely because of their contribution to team damage. Small teams get more bang for their buck from a Blaster, I'll grant you that. But large teams get more bang for their buck from certain Defenders, and are usually safer as well.
Since we're both on Freedom, let me just say the following... Please look for Blasters and Scrappers when you want more damage. And please recruit Defenders that mainly help defend your team. I'll happily take the other Defenders. :-)
Goodbye and thanks for all the fish.
I've moved on to Diablo 3, TopDoc-1304
As an experiment, I think people who have defenders ought to make up all Defender teams consisting solely of their powerset. I've been on all Rad/* and Dark/* teams. I have friend that have done kin/* and storm/* teams as well. The universal reaction is astonishment at how effective the teams are.
I've been on all blaster teams. When well led and with appropriate strategy, all blaster teams are amazingly efficient.
I'm not advocating any particular team composition, but it can pay to think outside the box.
Incidentally Rad/* and Dark/* play very well with each other.
a couple of other tips to comsider...i usually find when im forming a team or adding to one...while im scanning the team lists and sending off tells i usually ask the team to speak to their contacts and fill up their lists with fresh missions...i like to really keep the flow going...
also if a person that has just joined the team says im going afk for a min doesnt do the afk outside...i watch them like a hawk and if they not back in about 5 mins i boot them...what im tending to notice is that the longer your teamed with a group the longer poeple will tolerate you going afk...if you have been in a TF or doing missions for hours together its cool if they go afk for ages...but if they just join and then say afk and are gone 5 mins they get booted...sorry i have had to deal with leaches before...they tend to join and enter a mish and go afk sometimes without saying anything. i find this really irritating, as we are busting our chops at the front line, often risking or suffering death and you get someone who thinks this is a PL session...BOOT!!
next i would say when it comes to a team with a little lvl spread ie 2-4 lvls, i usually find as long as the missions are just TOUGH not IMPOSSIBLE, i usually try to focus on the missions of the highest lvl folk...since they tend to provide the best xp...tho if a lower lvl mish person requests their mission to be done i always try to fit it in...
finally...dont be surprised if the first battle after team formation ends up being a slaughter...(as in YOU being slaughtered) because it takes a battle or two to get the tactics right...but if you notice its because the same person/people are doing something wrong...(ie a blaster pulling with a fireball into the middle of a mob dont laugh i saw it done) then at first try to educate...i find since im a long time altoholic i know all the archetypes and at least the basics in how to use them that sometimes a prod in the right directions can turn them back to the light...but if problems persist, there is a reason the star gives you the power to boot...nothing worse than a few team wipes to make people drop the team...
on a side note about team wipes...usually people WILL tolerate the occassional death, some classes more than others (blasters looking at you) but if the team wipes continue a sign people are not happy (sign?? more like brick over the head hint...) is the number of poeple saying ahh gotta go sg calling...(come on people just saying...im outa here the blaster keeps agroing mobs and im sick of dying...) so in closing unless the team leader IS the idiot who keeps causing the team wipes, send him/her a private tell asking if they can wrangle the debt machine back into line, or if it is the leader causing the problems a subtle suggestion in their ear may make them realise that the fireball pull, MAY not be the best pull technique...sometimes you will get an earfull of abuse and they quit/or boot you, either way your better off...but sometimes they say what you sure, and then you one step closer to a better team, and start molding a better player...
good luck guys remeber there are a lot of new players and they dont read the manuals/boards...so out in the field we can still educate... 
Well, I'm certainly not saying that it's bad to have a balanced team either. I was just arguing that adding a defender may, depending on their primary, actually increase damage. That's all.
I will, however, aggree with that the converse of my example is also true. If you already have 7 Rad defenders, there is merit in taking a blaster as the 8'th member. If nothing else, because with 7 AM's you're already at the damage cap anyway, and an 8'th wouldn't push you any further. Ditto for the debuffs.
On the other hand, at that point you hardly need more damage anyway.
Excellent original post, and most of the rest of the thread has good information as well. One thing I'd like to throw my 2 cents in on:
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directive 1 - NO BLIND INVITES. Ask, always ask. It won't kill you. No conjunctions, no leet speak, no canned macros. FORM A COMPLETE SENTENCE. Do not ask people who are not flagged lft.
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This is absolutely correct except the last bit. In some situations, you may want to ask folks that aren't flagged. Many a time I've asked someone flagged as 'Not Looking' if they'd like to help with an AV or a Giant Monster, and they've been happy to help. Use this sparingly - don't go sending off tells to random non-LFT people every time you start a group - but it's a valid option in some situations.
I most definitely agree that leading can be a lot of work, but it's very rewarding. Usually that reward is just the satisfaction of a job well done at the end of the mission, but sometimes you get a little bonus. Earlier this week I was on a 5-villain team doing an outdoor Longbow mission, and my Internet dropped for a minute. I got back online and found the team in disarray, everyone running around aimlessly and nearly dead from over-aggroing mobs. Got everyone organized, recovered, and we went back to methodically pounding heros into the ground. After a few minutes, one of the dominators says, "Without your leadership we're lost...glad you came back." Stuff like that makes the effort worth it.
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directive 1 - NO BLIND INVITES. Ask, always ask. It won't kill you. No conjunctions, no leet speak, no canned macros
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I honestly think Blind invites are fine and people (especially on the forums) make a big deal out of them like some how their precious time is wasted with a blind invite. I mean we have the different flags representing what kind of team you are looking to participate in (regardless of whether people choose to use them). I guarantee it takes more of the leaders time to type something for possibly 7 others than it takes the recipient of an invite to just click yes, check out the amount of people on the team, and possibly ask about the level range if they are suspicious. Now some of you are going to be like "Well what about AT diversity, I just won't play on a team that doesn't have x amount of whatever" I have played since release and while some team combos are easier than others, the game is easy enough to beat missions with just about any team combination.
Sorry it took me a while to get back to this - I'm actually a little bit flattered that this thread didn't die off into the depths of forum history as I'd orginally imagined
The major trend of disagreement as I percieve it, is the school of thought that disagrees with directive 2, for reasons like, an adequately played defender can enhance the amount of damage the part does. Not disagreeing with that, but the intent of directive 2 was to state my belief in the importance of archtetype/class balance. I cannot abandon that belief. I have seen TOO MANY teams wipe that pay no attention to it, because they think they can stick any old combination of people together who are available at the time.
The most recent example of this was a cobbled together attempt to do the transcendence trial that I could tell was going to fail before it ever began. 5 blasters, 2 scrappers, and me (an empathy defender). I tried to express myself, but they went forward with it anyway. Most memorably was a blaster who somehow managed to make it into his late 40's clinging to the belief that he was not squishy, and took exception to it, when I said, "I cannot keep up with this many squishies". After enough deaths and wipes they tried to convince me that deaths don't matter to high level players because they think it's funny. In his defense, he never wavered from the belief that he was not now, nor had he ever been squishy. Personally, all I saw was a team display full of wildly gyrating health bars.
Someone said somewhere that the devs intended for no class to be essential. That's a nice/optimistic thought, but IMHO, they failed miserably. I've been playing for YEARS, I base my opinions on my observations. Among those observations are the following. The odds of success in a mission increase dramatically if some care is used with regard to class balance. The odds of success in an extended campaign or task force increase exponentially if attention is paid to certain basics. The first of which is class balance. The second of which are the madatory classes. I've never participated in a TF or extended campaign that went WELL that didn't have a 1) solid tank, and 2) solid empath. Period. No exceptions. Sometimes they succeed lacking those elements - but they almost always struggle. In my experience, the secret to a successfull task force, whether it be numina, positron, or anything inbetween is solid class balance, a solid tank, and a solid empath.
I find, it's beneficial - whether you're a beginner, or experienced, to mind the group as it forms around you. If the leader is filling up on running backs with no linebackers - expect you're going to get sacked.
Oh, I did want to take a second to shout out to some of my regulars. At least one of the tanks I pick on on a semi-regular basis found this thread - I didn't notice if he's lurking or posted to it. Hey, Criogenus!
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In my experience, the secret to a successfull task force, whether it be numina, positron, or anything inbetween is solid class balance, a solid tank, and a solid empath.
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Great original post but the above does not reflect my experience. I think that thinking about defenders as one class is not helpful in the context of team-building since the different builds do very different things.
My only other qualm is the "don't invite people who aren't LFT". I use the LFT flag when I am looking for a team but I frequently accept invites when it isn't on. I don't accept blind invites since if the person can't bother to write a sentence then in my experience it is often a bad sign. But if I am doing missions and I don't have LFT up and get a tell saying that a team my level is doing a mission in the same zone as me I probably will accept.
There is a space for comments in the LFT screen and if people put "not interested in teaming" I don't bother them. But lots of people who aren't "LFT" aren't necessarrily iron-clad opposed to it. I send a tell. If I don't get a response or get a "no" I don't bother them again but I get a lot of "yes" responses.
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I've never participated in a TF or extended campaign that went WELL that didn't have a 1) solid tank, and 2) solid empath. Period. No exceptions. Sometimes they succeed lacking those elements - but they almost always struggle. In my experience, the secret to a successfull task force, whether it be numina, positron, or anything inbetween is solid class balance, a solid tank, and a solid empath.
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Hmm... Well, I'd try to argue with that, but the words of someone from the "How to know you're in a pick-up group" thread come to mind. Namely, the words of Shikra:
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I've learned through painful experience that when one of your teammates says "We can't do this task force without a healer/tanker/whatever," then they're invariably right--THEY can't.
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My emphasis there.
Again, you'd be surprised what works, if you actually know the archetypes and know the enemy. E.g., since you mention TFs, _the_ easiest level 24 respec trial I've ever been in didn't involve an Empath at all, it involved a Mind Controller. Deceiving/Confusing the shield generators made them bubble _us_ and the reactor, instead of the Sky Raiders.
Incidentally, the same applies to Malta: you'd be surprised how you _don't_ need an Empath if every single Sapper works for you, draining the other Malta instead of you. Controllers can do stuff like that.
More TFs. Croatoa? I can't even remember one where we had a Tanker or Empath at all. The easiest, though, involved a kinetics defender, a force-field controller, a scrapper (me) and a few blasters. Between bubbles, pets, and fullcrum shift, those witches didn't stand a chance.
AVs? The easiest AV teams I've been in involved a Stone Tanker and a Force-Field defender.
Etc.
But, again, I'm reminded of the wise words of Shikra.
Anyway, here's my "constructive" part for the day: the best leaders I've grouped with (and there have been quite a few) were _not_ the ones who could give a good pep talk and a good excuse after yet another team-wipe. The best ones were, in fact, those who told you what tactics to apply to _not_ end up with a team-wipe, and thus needed no excuse.
In fact, that should probably be Directive 1, and _the_ first thing to apply, before all the psychology and excuses parts:
Directive 1: plan, formulate tactics, and _communicate_. All the time. Stuff like "now we rest", or "wait, Sapper ahead", or "TP and kill one of them, then everyone hits the elevators to lose aggro", or "just one thing before we start: if you're the last one standing in the trial and can't res, don't fight and die too, just heal the reactor while the rest of us run back from the hospital" (ironically, due to the leader's extensive knowledge none of us died there at all, but it was nice to see planning ahead anyway) beats a thousand "but we had no empath" excuses afterwards.
One rule of mission selection I like to follow is that people who have been in the group for a while should have their missions chosen over the person who just joined. Nothing breeds resentment like feeling skipped over. Granted, there are sometimes good reasons for not doing person X's missions - in a different zone, the person is too low or high level for their missions to be worthwhile etc.
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...but the intent of directive 2 was to state my belief in the importance of archtetype/class balance. I cannot abandon that belief.
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I can. I stopped believing that long ago. Sure it's a good general rule for PUGs, because that's what most people have heard and believe. But that doesn't make it true. I've been playing in Super Teams of my own creation for over a year, and none of them ever included a Tank or Empath. Take a look at the Buffer Overrun link in my sig, and check out the videos from long ago.
That said, I certainly agree that you can't just throw a team together with whoever accepts your invites. That way lies madness and debt, at least for large teams. If you want to get away from the "1 tank, 1 empath, 6 others", you have to do it in an intelligent manner. You need to figure out how to limit incoming damage to a level you can handle. There are many ways to do that.
Goodbye and thanks for all the fish.
I've moved on to Diablo 3, TopDoc-1304
I am a lowlevel (14 at the time or writing) Controller: gravity, kinetics and teleport sets. The kind of charrie you pat on the head and smile at. But my Transfusion is a lean, mean healing machine, and the holds are useful for keeping the Morties at bay while you slaughter their precious creations.
I, as a rule, accept most Blind Invites. I do. I'm desperately trying to get myself to 15 so I can PvP with a friend... And if the XP is handed to me, I'll take it, and ask for more.
I do very much appreciate a tell before the invite; I appreciate the leader more and tend to get really excited about the team.
The best teams I've been on had some melees (tanker and a scrapper or two), a couple of healers - whether it be O2 boost or a hardcore rez'er - and then as many ranged-powered Arch's as possible. (mostly 'cus it's hard for us defenders and controllers to solo in the lower levels so we're always LFT)
But I've had bad times also. The most recent bad experience: A kamakazi defender two levels below the average of the team, aggro'ing the heck out of a pack of outcasts and then going AFK while we're trying to get him rez'd... for the fifth time. And then he starts the cycle again. And again. (I eventually got fed up, and kept him on a short leash with my Recall Friend while the team was resting 'cus he flat out refused to wait for them)
...
Some teams have no direction ("Uh.. I guess we can hunt, or something...")
Some teams have bad mishes, (yeah, we usually share the same contact, but we DON'T have to do FrostFire three times in a row)
Some teams sit around waiting for this and that (I can understand if you're in Boomtown, and the mish is in the Hollows... But tell us again why we can't start without you?)
And some teams like to dissolve into nothingness just as we get to the door.
...
I don't find team build has much affect on the outcome; it really depends on the experience, willing-ness and IQ level of the members - barring the few, obviously bad, combinations.
Teams should move fast - if someone's AFK for dinner, move on. Choose missions more-or-less close to each other in location. (And if not, at least make sure everyone can get there safely. We don't want to wait for people to jump back and forth from the Hospital)
Mish's should be made for the average-level of the team. DON"T pick the highest member's mish... unless the spread isn't that bad. Same for lowest.
Blind invites often lead to ragtag teams... But -can- excel if you know what you're doing.
You may be impressed by the firepower of the Tanks, Blasters and Scrappers, but the root of all good teams is a couple smart defenders/controllers.
Give everyone a chance, but if they suck, don't put up with it. Drop a few hints, and don't shy away form the kick button. (I often don't follow my own advice, and my experiences aren't that great for it.)
Finally: Make sure everyone's enjoying themselves. A happy team is a prosperous team.
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I've been playing for YEARS,
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Uh huh... years... which is the plural of year, which means by definition two years or more. Since the game hasn't been out for more than two years, that comment is impossibly false.
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Anyway, here's my "constructive" part for the day: the best leaders I've grouped with (and there have been quite a few) were _not_ the ones who could give a good pep talk and a good excuse after yet another team-wipe. The best ones were, in fact, those who told you what tactics to apply to _not_ end up with a team-wipe, and thus needed no excuse.
In fact, that should probably be Directive 1, and _the_ first thing to apply, before all the psychology and excuses parts:
Directive 1: plan, formulate tactics, and _communicate_. All the time. Stuff like "now we rest", or "wait, Sapper ahead", or "TP and kill one of them, then everyone hits the elevators to lose aggro", or "just one thing before we start: if you're the last one standing in the trial and can't res, don't fight and die too, just heal the reactor while the rest of us run back from the hospital" (ironically, due to the leader's extensive knowledge none of us died there at all, but it was nice to see planning ahead anyway) beats a thousand "but we had no empath" excuses afterwards.
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Truer words were never spoken. The best teams are are made that way from strong leaders that knew strategy and tactics and knew how to apply them, working along with team members that knew how to follow wise counsel. With a strong and wise leader and teammates that are willing to accept AUTHORITY, anything is possible. Also, while having good team balance can make a team easier, it is NOT necessary at ALL. Note my signature saying below, and read my Combat Guide in the provided link to see some more tips.
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Uh huh... years... which is the plural of year, which means by definition two years or more. Since the game hasn't been out for more than two years, that comment is impossibly false.
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I really must dispute that, I'm not trying to be argumentative, but didn't we even get a badge for playing during the second anniversary of launch? Think it was celebrant? I never liked people making false claims, I'm not in the habit of making them myself. But it's fine - I understand some folks will be skeptical.
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and more controllers and defenders won't help you damage that AV faster then he regens.
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Untrue. Every Defender primary (and Controller secondary) other than Force Field has a way of increasing the damage output of a team, although Empathy's takes a couple of minutes to apply at its full strength due to recharge times, and Storm's is unwise to use without AOE holds/immobilizes or on AVs because it scrambles mobs and makes aggro unpredictable. Some even have powers that turn off mob health regen completely. In a large or even medium-sized team, just one mob resistance debuff can result in a greater decrease in its expected lifespan than adding a Blaster or Scrapper will cause, and in a small team it's comparable if the debuffer also has attacks.
"We need more damage" is simply not a good reason to reject Defenders and Controllers en masse from your LFT searches.