Dark Armor Overview for Issue 5

Dark Armor Overview for Issue 5

The following is an overview and commentary regarding the Dark Armor powerset. It is entirely my own misguided opinion. I must acknowledge the great debt I owe for anything of worth in this document to the many wonderful and insightful posters in the Scrapper forum and the many robust discussions fostered there.

This will be a largely qualitative rather than quantitative guide, if you want numbers and slotting suggestions for any Scrapper Secondary then you should have a look at BuffyASummers Scrapper Secondaries in I5 Post.

Dark Armor is a varied powerset providing a good base of Resistance powers and a number of other threat mitigation and utility powers with a bit of a controllerish edge.

Dark Amor has a reputation for being End intensive, which is not entirely untrue, but which has been somewhat reduced in I5 and which can be further reduced by careful use of the right power at the right time. My basic rule is that if I am finishing fights with lots of HP and no End then I was probably running too many threat mitigation toggles.

I would recommend any serious student get as many views of a powerset as they can, and as long as you keep in mind the changes to the powerset as summarised below any Dark Armour related guide will be able to give you ideas.

As always I would advise people that the point of making a character is to have fun, my idea of fun is almost certainly not exactly the same as yours and you should be guided by your own sense of what will and won’t work for you at least as much as what some bizarrely named internet forum non-entity has to say.


Dark Armor Changes

For those already familiar with Dark Armor I include this summary of the significant changes to Dark Armor over the last few Issues (3, 4 and 5).

The only important changes to Dark Armor IMHO are to Cloak of Darkness and Cloak of Fear.

Cloak of Darkness becomes not a great return for slots in I5. The power is still not bad, but a Single Origin Defense Enhancement gets you 0.65% additional Def, so not a high priority for slots.

Cloak of Fear has been nerfed a couple of times. As of I5 it only Cowers Minions, it hits a level+0 mob 50% of the time and the To Hit debuff was reduced (from 25% to 10%). IMHO it is line ball as to whether it is worth the End cost to run and requires 3 Acc and a Fear Enh to give a 90% Cower vs level+1 mobs, leaving you with two slots to Enh the To Hit debuff or cut the sizeable End cost. If you are not prepared to 6 slot it or if you run Oppressive Gloom, which will stun all the Minions anyway, then don't take it.

Changes which are interesting, but are unlikely to affect your choice of powers or slotting:

All toggles can be run simultaneously.
Dark Embrace gives Resistance to Toxic.
Murky Cloud protects from End Drain, this is actually quite nice.
Obsidian Shield protects from Fear.
Cloak of Darkness gives Immobilise resist and increased Perception vs other Stealthed characters.
Soul Transfer got a couple of improvements, but not enough to change anyones mind who was or wasn't going to take a Self Rez power.


The Powers

Dark Embrace - Resist Smash, Lethal (Very High), Resist Negative Energy, Toxic (High)

You get it at level 1 and it is not a bad level 1 power. Dark Embrace provides quite reasonable protection vs the most common Damage types in the game and some protection vs Neg Energy. You would do well to slot this strongly and quickly.

Death Shroud - Negative Energy Damage (Minor PBAoE DoT)

Available at level 2 this power does damage to all mobs in melee range to you.

While it has a reputation as a high End cost power for an AE Attack Death Shroud is not unreasonably End heavy. It does damage equal to the average Scrapper Primary PBAE attack over a period the same as the recharge of the PBAE and for less End.

Running Death Shroud early in a fight means that mobs you engage towards the end of the fight will take fewer single target attacks to KO and mobs that might have hung around on a sliver of HP attacking you and your team will KO possibly without you ever having to target them.

Death Shroud can be hard to run continuously at low levels, but will always give good value for End whenever you are in melee with 2 or more mobs. Like any power once you can slot Single Origin Enhancements it really comes alive. I would slot it pretty much like I do any attack, currently I am running with an Acc, an End and 4 Damage.

Death Shroud is a good addition to any Primary. It adds AE damage to powersets that are lacking in it, ie Martial Arts and Dark Melee, and adds Neg Energy damage to powersets that deal out the more often and more strongly resisted Lethal Damage, ie Spines, Claws and the Swords.

Murky Cloud - Resist Fire, Cold (Very High), Resist Negative Energy, Energy (High), Resist Endurance Drain.

Available at level 4 this provides good Resistance to a wide range of damage types and Resistance to Endurance Drain, which is very handy at higher levels.

This is a power that you should take and slot at least partly. Worth 3 or 4 additional slots, but you don’t have to hurry to get them in, late 20’s is fine. While the majority of damage in CoH is Smash or Lethal some factions of mobs do use high percentages of non S/L damage. And in the level 40+ range some use entirely non S/L damage.

Obsidian Shield - Resist Psionics (Extreme), Resist Stun, Sleep, Hold, Fear (High)

The primary Status Effect resistance power for Dark Armor. It becomes available at level 10 and you will probably find that between level 16 and 18 the Tsoo will make you want to take it.

It gives you high base Resistance to Psi damage, which is rare, but handy to have when you come across it. Worth an additional 3 or 4 slots, but you can wait until the late 30’s to get them in.

Dark Regeneration - Negative Energy Damage (Minor), Heal (Very High)

Available at level 16, but hard to use effectively until you can get a few SO Endurance reducers in it. Dark Regen costs 48.5 End per activation so is a bit of a pain to use without at least 2 End reducers in it. However once you can get the End cost down a bit it becomes a great power, especially for when that opening volley of damage drops your HP bar to Red.

Dark Regen returns about 30% of your HP for each mob hit. This means that it is a good idea not to miss (I slot an Acc), that it works pretty well vs groups of mobs, and that unless you want to try to use it vs single mobs slotting Heals is probably not worth while.

I would hesitate to slot Recharge reducers as the base recharge of 30 seconds is short enough for any reasonable fight.

Cloak of Darkness - Stealth (Moderate), Melee Defense (Moderate), Ranged Defense (Moderate), Resist Immobilise, Increased Perception.

Available at level 20 if you want a Stealth power then take this one. It provides basic Stealth (which in CoH is really just a reduction in the range at which mobs will aggro on you), resistance to Immobilise powers and an increase in the range at which you will see other Stealthed characters.

The Base Defense for Cloak of Darkness was lowered significantly in I5 and slotting a Single Origin Defense Enhancement now gives around 0.65% additional Defense, IMHO not a good return. Cloak of Darkness is still a good power for what it does, but I would slot other powers first if I was looking for threat mitigation.

Like many powers that do several things at once Cloak of Darkness isn’t cheap on End so it might be worth an End Reducer, otherwise slot only when you’ve got nothing else to slot.

Cloak of Fear - Mag 2 Fear PBAoE Aura, PBAoE Accuracy Debuff(10%)

Available at level 28 Cloak of Fear is one of the main unique powers that Dark Armor gets, and while not the game changer that it use to be can still be used effectively if well slotted.

Cloak of Fear pulses every 10 seconds with a base 50% chance to hit every mob in melee range. Each mob hit gets a Mag 2 Fear effect and a 10% To Hit debuff which lasts 10 seconds. If the mob is a Minion the Fear will cause it to Cower stationary and if damaged the Minion will retaliate about once every 10 seconds. LT’s, Bosses and more powerful mobs will not Cower unless they are hit with another power that puts a Fear on them, but do have their Accuracy reduced.

I use to be a big fan of Cloak of Fear because it was so Dark Scrapperish and possibly because it was overpowered. I have several issues with the current version.

Firstly I like my Threat Mitigation powers to be reliable. When I turn on Focused Fighting it always gives me an increase to my Def, when I turn on Temporary Invulnerability it always gives me an increase in my Res. When I turn on Cloak of Fear I pay a pretty heavy End cost to get a chance that mobs near me will be less of a threat.

Secondly I feel there is a now too much overlap between this power and the next, Oppressive Gloom. Cloak of Fear use to affect LT’s, which Oppressive Gloom doesn’t, and it use to have a significant effect on mobs that it didn’t Cower and now it doesn’t. Basically if you are running Oppressive Gloom then the extra that you get for the quite high End cost of Cloak of Fear is IMHO not worthwhile.

On the other hand some people don’t like Oppressive Gloom because the Stunned mobs will wander, and sometimes Super Leap, away.

If you want to use Cloak of Fear and have it reliably hit mobs then you will want to find 3 Single Origins worth of Accuracy for it. If I was going to try to incorporate Cloak of Fear into my build as a regularly used power then I would probably slot it 3 Acc, 2 To Hit Debuffs and an End.

Oppressive Gloom - Mag 2 Disorient PBAoE Aura, Self –HP.

Available at level 35 Oppressive Gloom is Dark Armors other mob control style threat mitigation power.

Oppressive Gloom has a low End cost, a very minor HP cost and is effective without a lot of slots. A single Acc can make it perform strongly; I prefer an Acc and a Stun Duration.

Oppressive Gloom stuns Minions that come into melee range. I think this is great. Some people don’t like it because Stunned mobs can tend to wander away, but while they are wandering they aren’t attacking and I often find they will take one ranged shot at you then run back into the OpGloom field and get stunned again.

OpGloom is particularly good for Martial Arts Scrappers who throw a fair number of Stuns already.

Soul Transfer - Neg Energy Damage (Moderate), Heal (Very High), Endurance Bonus (High), PBAE Stun, Special Temporary Invulnerability and Special Temporary Debt protection.

Available at level 38 this is a Self Rez. Personally I am not thrilled by Self Rezes and this one is a bit quirky, as suits the Dark Armor powerset.

You can only use Soul transfer when there are mobs nearby. Sounds Bad. Using it throws a strong PBAE Stun and makes you temporarily immune to all damage. Sounds Good. That temporarily immune to damage thing, it doesn’t always work. Sounds Bad.

I5 added a period of grace from Exp Debt to all Rez powers and inspirations to encourage people to try to get back into fights and not just lay on the floor until the fight was over then get up. I believe for Soul Transfer that period is 90 seconds.


What Powers should you take

Well I think all the Dark Armor powers do what they do reasonably well, I have personal reasons for not being excited about a couple, but overall none of them are total duds.

IMHO you will want at least all of the Resistance shields and either Cloak of Fear or Oppressive Gloom to construct enough threat mitigation to be a viable Scrapper.

Death Shroud adds End effective DPS to any Scrapper.

Dark Regen is a great oops power for when you get hit hard early in a fight.

Cloak of Darkness is a good Stealth power, which if you chose Dark Armor for concept or theme reasons is something you would probably want, it stops you getting Immobilised as easily and it gives you a small amount of Defense as a bonus.

And Soul Transfer is a quirky Self Rez that if you want one will probably do the job for you.


Slotting

Powers generally need to be slotted well to function well and most of the Dark Armor powers follow this rule.

I would suggest that you -

Slot any toggle (except Op Gloom ) with an End Reducer.
Slot anything that needs to roll to hit with an Accuracy Enh.
Slot all Resistance powers with as many Resistance Enh as you can spare.
Slot powers that primarily do damage with as many Damage Enh as you can spare.

5 Single Origin Damage Resist Enh in Obsidian Shield will hit the Scrapper 75% Cap for Psi Resist, otherwise you can’t Cap any Resist slotting the Resistance shields so go crazy.

Death Shroud I would slot like any attack, I prefer 1 Acc, 1 End and 4 Damage.

I would recommend at least 2 End reducers in Dark Regen, you might want to put 3, and an Accuracy.

Cloak of Darkness leave with an End reducer in the base slot, don’t slot unless you have nothing else to slot.

Cloak of Fear you will need about +100% Acc to hit anything reliably. You can slot 3 Single Ogirin Acc Enh or get Focused Accuracy. Or forget it.

I have found that Oppressive Gloom functions well for me with only 2 slots, Acc and Stun Duration.

Soul Transfers primary ability will work probably just as well without slotting. If you are getting KO’ed enough to be thinking a lot about how you are slotting your Self Rez power then I suggest you may have other problems you should be concerned about.


Summary

Dark Armor gives you a pretty varied and interesting set of tools to keep your Scrapper upright and kicking [Bleep]. It has powers that work by messing the mobs over before they can mess you over. It gives you the opportunity to take a Stealth power without using a power pool. Dark Armour has rare and interesting Resistances to Psi damage, Fear and End Drain.

What doesn’t it have? Dark Armor doesn’t have resistance to KnockDown/Back. This drives many players crazy. Personally I find KD/B to be more of an annoyance than an automatic death sentence, but if you are already pushing the bleeding edge then any disruption to your combat actions can result in a KO.

The two easiest ways to mitigate KD/B are Acrobatics from the Leaping Pool and Hover from the Fly Pool. Both are toggles with some End cost. Hover doesn’t stop you getting KnockedDown/Back, but it does eliminate the need for you to struggle back to your feet, which is about 95% of the disruption a KB/D hits you with.

Dark Armor has no passives. Everything is a Toggle or a Click. This means if you want an effect you are paying End for it. Working out which powers you need to get through a fight and just using those is a part of learning how to use Dark Armor effectively. As I said earlier my general rule of thumb is if I am finishing fights with high HP and low End then maybe I can consider turning off a toggle.


Primaries

Finding synergies between your primary and secondary is something that can give you a lot more bang for your buck. In no particular order:

Spines – Offensive AE and Defensive AE, what could work together better. And the Spines Recharge Debuff will add to the control powers of DA to make you an even better oblique defender of your teams squishies.

Dark Melee – the funky powers primary and the funky powers secondary, sounds good. The Fear and To Hit debuff of Touch of Fear and Cloak of Fear stack, all good. Dark Consumption can help offset your sometimes out of control End costs.

Katana and Broadsword – Mathematically To Hit Debuffs and Defense work really well together, making Divine Avalanche/Parry and Cloak of Fear a synergising combo. Also I can sort of see a tactic using Cloak of Fear to pin a pack of mobs then Broadswords high single target damage to KO them one at a time while their friends look on horrified, could be slow and boring but might be safe.

Martial Arts – MA’s Stun will stack with Op Gloom to make you a Stunning machine.

Claws – can’t see anything particular good, although if you get Follow Up running permanently it should give a decent boost to Death Shroud as well.


Pool Powers

Pretty much whatever Pools you liked for your other characters you will like for your DA Scrapper.

Hasten doesn’t add much to DA as most of the powers are toggles not clicks so Recharge isn’t really an issue.

If you find you like having Stamina on other characters then you will probably need it on your DA Scrapper. If you don’t like having to manage End then I would recommend that you still try to get Stamina, if it doesn’t worry you that much then you may be able to do without.

Fighting. IMHO DA provides you will all the defensive options and capabilities you will need to survive most reasonable fights. If however you want to fight mobs greater than level+2 with some security or to solo spawns meant for teams of more than 4 players then some additional threat mitigation would probably be worthwhile and the Fighting Pool provides it.


Movement Powers

Many DA’s end up in the Leaping Pool to get Acrobatics and fill Dark Armors lack of KnockDown/Back protection. If you really hate getting knocked down then this might be for you.

Super Speed is another popular choice. Since many Scrappers take Hasten it is easy to take another power from the same pool and the Aggro reduction from Cloak of Darkness stacks with the Aggro reduction from Super Speed to make you practically undetectable to normal mobs. Some mobs, like snipers and Rikti Drones will still see you, but you can bump right up to normal mobs and they won’t see you.

Fly and Teleport are probably less taken, but if you like them as movement powers there is nothing wrong with them and other than the IMHO minor things mentioned above there is little to recommend any particular movement power to a Scrapper so chose something you are comfortable with.


Auxiliary Power Pools.

See my Scrapper APP's; A brief overview.


Good Luck and have Fun.

Regards, Screwloose
“Be the change you want to see in the world.”

---

How to Look Stuff Up Yourself - It's Fun and Easy
Looking for Powers Numbers try City of Data.
For Fraks sake read the Guides and FAQs
Global Chat Channels - Australia

Thanks a lot Screwloose. A great guide if I ever saw one. Quick question though, what in general is the priority slotting of DA? I know for /regen its something like Integration>Dull Pain>Quick Recovery>Resiliance ect... I figure six slotting Dark Embrace would be good first but what then? Murky for blanket resitance, or Death Should for AoE(I'm playing spines). Any others I should worry about? Thanks.

---

Much harder to say for Dark Armor than Regen, or even Invuln, as the early powers tend to Defend against a particular type of threat rather than simply add to a general pool of Threat Mitigation like Regen’s range of HP Recovery powers does or broadly vs a wide range of threats as the combination of Temp Invuln and UnYielding does.

With CoD falling behind as a place to put slots and Dark Regen generally needing only about 3 I think that the main place you are going to get your primary Threat Mitigation is in the Resistance toggles. You should try to get those at least 3 or 4 slotted as soon as you feel you can. Dark Embrace first then maybe give some priority to slotting attacks (Death Shroud or your Primary) then Murky and Obsidian when you feel happy with your attacks.

If you decide to go for Cloak of Fear I would try to get it 6 slotted asap as I don’t think that it is very effective otherwise.

It’s not really any different for Spines. My pre and post I3 Spines DA build are at the end of my Spines guide.

I haven’t changed my build at all for I5, mostly because I am just lazy. If I was concerned about being super efficient then I would take the slots out of Cloak of Darkness and drop Cloak of Fear, but when I thought about it I really didn’t know what to do with those slots and that power choice so I just left it

Regards, Screwloose.
“I am not young enough to know everything.”

---

How to Look Stuff Up Yourself - It's Fun and Easy
Looking for Powers Numbers try City of Data.
For Fraks sake read the Guides and FAQs
Global Chat Channels - Australia

As far as I can tell throughout this entire post is more of a repeat of a long ago abilities. A lot of the information is good. However, its misleading and is not reflecting the true results of I5.

Now grated you have to applaud anyone taking the time to report and try to help others, and overall the report is clear, but I hardly think its precise. Moreover this above is just a repeat of older patch notes and results, and not what is really going on.

Dark Scrappers have always been an Offensive Template and originally that was due to the fact that you didn’t get any real defensive properties on your character until level 20- Cloak of Darkness. At this point you desperately needed it as you have basically reached the limit of your Offensive potential.

My Quick Review of Powers under I5-

Dark Embrace
-Resist Smash, Lethal (Very Low), Resist Negative Energy, Toxic (Low).
No matter how much you slot this, or what enhancements you use, it is not [or ever will be] equivalent to any other scrapper damage resistances or skill. Supposedly Dark Embrace was getting an Endurance cost decrease, however results so far have indicated that Damage Resistance has been decreased and in fact Endurance cost has increased slightly over pervious.

This skill currently should be more appropriately named Dark Embarrassment in fact. Its better than a Poke in the Eye, but as far as the post above stating to slot it heavily shows that they are not currently running this type of character.
1. You should never have more than 3 to 4 slots on this before level 20 as the results or desired results from the slots are negligible and you will not notice any difference. Plus you need to save these slots for stuff that actually works and functions. Offense.

Death Shroud
-Negative Energy Damage (Minor PBAoE DoT).
Currently if you take this early it will just end up getting you kill faster that if you didn’t have it at all. For one, you cannot do any real damage with it, and secondly it ends up attracting more villains than you can handle. This was true even under I4.

It’s a nice skill to have, but because you really have no defense anymore [because one or more of the developers had no clue about Dark and what it did or does] you are repeatedly pounded into submission anyway and cannot take on a large mob anyhow [even with Dark Embrace 6 slotted]. Plus the fact that the endurance cost is very high. You can always take this later, but even then your going to get pounded.

Murky Cloud - Resist Fire, Cold (High), Resist Negative Energy, Energy (Moderate), Resist Endurance Drain.
-Actually this is a very handy skill, but you can run without it for a time. Most times you have too anyway, due to the endurance cost of your other armors and your end result of the melee cost of your attacks. However, its actually very effective. You can minimally slot this and still be impressed [compared to your Dark Embrace] as to its effectiveness. Slot no more than 2 or 3 before level 20, and you need to save these slots for stuff that actually works and functions.

Obsidian Shield - Resist Psionics (Moderate), Resist Stun, Sleep, Hold, Fear (Moderate).
-This will become your secondary Armor skill and most likely will run with it on more than any other skill from here on out. Mostly due to the ability to resist STUN and HOLD. It is costly Endurance wise, but not anything like Murky Cloud the true Endurance Hog of this set. Slot no more than 2-3 before level 20 and you need to save these slots for stuff that actually works and functions.

Dark Regeneration - Negative Energy Damage (Minor), Heal (Moderate)-
Firstly you need to bypass this when it becomes available for two very important reasons.
1. You do not have enough endurance to use it in 90% of the situations anway and the overall effect is negligible. Simply put, by the time you have used it, you have already been pounded down to where you started and lost endurance in the process.
2. You need the slots that would go here somewhere else that is actually effective.
Take this at level 26 or later.

Cloak of Darkness - Stealth (Moderate), Melee Defense (Low), Ranged Defense (Low), Resist Immobilizes, Increased Perception.
-Firstly let me say that this was the whole concept behind Dark Armor and why Dark Melee has the worst TOHIT rate of any other character or class within the game. You swing at them and miss, they swing at you and miss. Currently, I have to consider this the worst case scenario out of I5 and the best example of the developers Tomfoolery, and lack of ability to understand the game. Even Tanks were not hit as hard as this. This power was such in demand for and needed for your character even before I5 you had to take this skill over such things like; Stamina. Basically this was a “HaveTo” skill even under I4 at level 20 as your offensive properties are basically peaked and your defenses are peaked and your still getting pounded.

Now if you have managed to get this far with your character here is the point under I5 where you are going to throw in the towel and quit and come and curse the developers. You will probably go a few more levels, but in the end this skill is not functioning PERIOD. Which actually means your character does not function. You have basically topped out and are still doing so poorly that you wont want to continue. You have already taken a bad beating on the way up and not it just going to continue. Everyone else is getting better and your basically stagnate at level 20 for 30 more levels.

The only other solution is have someone Power Level you from 20 to 28 and try again, but the results are basically the same as Cloak of Fear can only effect basically 50% and you are still restricted to small Mobs 3-4 villains of equal level, as you have no defenses and still have a long way to go.

The only real suggestion at this point I can give to anyone is base your character on NOT taking this skill Cloak of Darkness, and take some type of Stealth skill off one of the Power Pools as its at least 10 times more effective. However, if your going to do that anyway pick something else besides DA that actually works and save yourself the trouble. In other words; the developers have taken a Level 20 skill and made it less effective than a skill available at level 6 and 14 level.

The above post indication that this provides 0.65% defense. This could be correct as its below 1% effectiveness and currently its so ineffective I cannot calculate it. Current characters slotted SO’s 1, 3 and 5 show no results defensively from this skill PERIOD. With Cloak of Darkness On or Off no results can be indicated as your hit just as often. Test results have indicated an UNSLOTTED Hover skill has more defensive properties than Cloak of Darkness does.

No real point in going on with the rest of the skills as this class has been destroyed like so many others. The only REAL defensive skill on the Dark Armor tree has been removed and edited not to function. Dark Armor has no real defensives and coupled with the fact that Dark Melee has the worst TOHIT rate in the game just means you are going to die repeatedly on missions as your hit repeatedly and are missing them repeatedly.

Personally, I have found no solution to this yet on all THREE characters, and basically that is because there is no solution. The only real solution is NOT to click DA, Scrapper, and just pay my 15bucks and click a Blaster and [censored], or quit. Maybe I should get a discount and only have to pay 0.65% of that 15 bucks? 98cents, or something like that.

The current satiation with DA and in particular Cloak of Darkness is so horrendous it has to be a mistake, as if someone misplaced a <insert colorful remark here> decimal point. There is no way this type of character will work anymore with its MAIN defensive skill set at 0.65%. Not when it has to stand Toe to Toe with everything as it is a MELEE CLASS.

Now some of you might be saying it cant be this bad. Well, please try it yourself and good luck. : P Most people gave up before level 28 before I5 anyhow. Now????? I wouldn’t even suggest anyone actually even attempt DA/DM. Your better off as a Tank actually. : P

I would actually have to classify DA/DM as the worst class within the game currently with no solution in sight other than a major edit.

---

Great guide. This really helps me because I just started a Katana/DA build. Thanks.

---

@Lasher
First Of The Year

[ QUOTE ]
As far as I can tell throughout this entire post is more of a repeat of a long ago abilities. A lot of the information is good. However, its misleading and is not reflecting the true results of I5.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thank you for your opinion, as Dark Armor was the Scrapper Secondary powerset least changed by Issue 5 it is perhaps not surprising that much of this guide is unchanged from previous guides.

[Some Material Snipped]

[ QUOTE ]
I would actually have to classify DA/DM as the worst class within the game currently with no solution in sight other than a major edit.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am afraid that I5 is pretty much here to stay, while there may be minor changes this is now the level of power that you are going to have to get use to playing with. Possibly fortunately for DA users as they were nerfed the least they are actually use to playing at a power level closest to I5.

I would agree that as the DM DA combination of powersets contains a lot of tactical tricks it can be hard to master for those who were looking for easy straight forward fights, but IMHO it is very effective in the hands of someone who learns to use its tactical tools.

regards, Screwloose.
"I am not young enough to know everything."

---

How to Look Stuff Up Yourself - It's Fun and Easy
Looking for Powers Numbers try City of Data.
For Fraks sake read the Guides and FAQs
Global Chat Channels - Australia

Well unfortunately its hard to convey ones thoughts directly to paper, or print and have it come out as intended, otherwise everyone would have a Best Seller or be a writer. I am particularly well known for this in the industry as I tend to charge strait to the point, therefore they sound a little mean.

I have to thank you for your time and effort in your report, and the original poster. Although I have to give credit to your review I personally believe something has to be wrong here. As if no one checks anyone’s work before its added, or something. I mean this whole Patch is about Balance, [supposedly] so saying that “its here to stay” when the actual results are so imbalanced is not giving the development team enough credit.

That is, unless they are purposely trying to destroy the game.

Clearly, as shown by multiple players, post, evidence, examples, and so on and so on…. Mistakes were made, or left uncheck during this patch, or the code was in error. Its hard for most people, even someone such as myself with a decade of experience in this industry that the results of I5 were the intended, or desired results. If these were the desired results, someone’s vision is sewed and the need to be replaced or removed.

Its one thing to make the game harder, and another to make it impossible. Its also another thing entirely to purposely pick out classes and make them impossible to play, succeed or enjoy. Especially, while others are even better than before, and were already in need of an edit such as this.

I actually want to be clear on this. Many of us understood the need for some edits, but clearly these are not the edits that were needed. Heaven help us if someone ever makes the AI better. Which I might add, what was actually needed first before Nerfs of Skills or characters.

Basically I5 is nothing more than a “Make Work” patch so I guess someone feels better about getting a paycheck this month. 90% of what is in I5 was not even needed, no asked for by the population.

Now in truth, being Dark/Dark for sometime now after hitting Level 20 with characters I did consider myself somewhat UBER [but no more uber than any blaster running around, and less uber than any other scrapper running around].

However, I have to believe players such as the original poster and players such as myself are a the high end of the spectrum which leaves the lowest common denominator out in the dark and unable to use this class. Even a perfect build is basically five steps below that of any other class, even in the same category at the moment.

Now granted, this is Statesman’s Game, and he can build it anyway he wants. However, the trick is to get others to play it, and pay for it. I can tell Statesman one thing for sure; This will not due.

Many people here after CoV hits will be paying approximately thirty dollars a month for this game and the development process and patches are going to have to reflect that cost. Every player of Every Class, Type and Ability are expecting Fair and Unbiased Edits and Implementation of new skills and abilities. Not Temper Tantrums by the development team or ideas and concepts not fully thought out before implementation singling out once class to be the best.

I’m all for balance, but that is NOT what I5 is. I5 is more imbalance, than balance. I5 is more of a purposeful intended attempt to ruin a class and classes and characters of a particular type. Those are just the facts and I’m sorry if Statesman, or the development team do not want to face the facts well…... They will have to face them shortly as more and more accounts disappear.

When you purposely single out individuals and modify them to not function the same as everyone else you have made the first step down the road to ruin and an appearance of bias. Many people will start seeing the game and the developers as Unfair, Bias, Inept, and Incompetent. If one character cannot do just as good as another something is incorrect.

It is actually unthinkable to expect people a year into the game to actually just stop using a character and start all over because a patch has made that character or class unmanageable, or unusable. 9 out of 10 times they just leave and do something else. We all don’t have 24/7 to play this game and actually have jobs and responsibilities that detract from the time we can actually log on and use our characters.

I cannot believe the statement that “this is it”, as I don’t believe anyone is that stupid to shoot themselves in the foot like this and just do nothing about it bleeding to death in the process. Don’t get me wrong, Iv seen it happen, but usually those developers are “one time wonders” and never get another chance and have to go back to work for SONY making <insert colorful remark here> games.

I am sorry, but I cannot share Statesman’s vision on this. The concept is good, the game was better than I thought it would be for its type, but after this I5 fiasco you have to step back and reexamine why you’re here and if these developers can actually do this.

I give this patch a month and after that without some major changes I have to bow out and find something else. The game will not go any further than this with this type of development. Which brings up the point of COV, and if its in this type of condition.

I don’t think it is too unrealistic for many of us to believe that 90% of I5 was not tested beyond the point of Bug screening. No testing of Balance, Effects, and Results were actually done. I sure hope no one was paid to test the balance portion of this patch cause that was money just thrown out the window.

The only other real option I can see at this point is if both Tanker, and Scrapper Classes are going to be this impossible to level compared to every other class they are going to have to only require Half the Experience Points to do so………….. : p Otherwise, who in there right mind would use them.

Which is the actual intent behind I5. If anyone cares to take a look at CoV you may understand why these classes are in the first stages of the attempt to eliminate them from play.

Ruin one game to build another?

I don’t know, you would think for all the money we have been shelling at this game they could hire someone who knew what they were doing. At first I was kind of mad, but actually my anger turned into sorrow. At this point I feel sorry for the development team. These guys have a lot to learn and need a lot more experience.

This experience should be a good example to all the WoodBe developers out there that you have to know more than CODE to develop a game. Just like you need to know more than just how to drive a Car to be an Auto Mechanic .

These guys are in dire need of help if this is the best example of a patch and a balance attempt. They mess up just changing the Oil : P.

---

[ QUOTE ]
As far as I can tell throughout this entire post is more of a repeat of a long ago abilities. A lot of the information is good. However, its misleading and is not reflecting the true results of I5.

Now grated you have to applaud anyone taking the time to report and try to help others, and overall the report is clear, but I hardly think its precise. Moreover this above is just a repeat of older patch notes and results, and not what is really going on.

Dark Scrappers have always been an Offensive Template and originally that was due to the fact that you didn’t get any real defensive properties on your character until level 20- Cloak of Darkness. At this point you desperately needed it as you have basically reached the limit of your Offensive potential.

My Quick Review of Powers under I5-

Dark Embrace
-Resist Smash, Lethal (Very Low), Resist Negative Energy, Toxic (Low).
No matter how much you slot this, or what enhancements you use, it is not [or ever will be] equivalent to any other scrapper damage resistances or skill. Supposedly Dark Embrace was getting an Endurance cost decrease, however results so far have indicated that Damage Resistance has been decreased and in fact Endurance cost has increased slightly over pervious.

This skill currently should be more appropriately named Dark Embarrassment in fact. Its better than a Poke in the Eye, but as far as the post above stating to slot it heavily shows that they are not currently running this type of character.
1. You should never have more than 3 to 4 slots on this before level 20 as the results or desired results from the slots are negligible and you will not notice any difference. Plus you need to save these slots for stuff that actually works and functions. Offense.

Death Shroud
-Negative Energy Damage (Minor PBAoE DoT).
Currently if you take this early it will just end up getting you kill faster that if you didn’t have it at all. For one, you cannot do any real damage with it, and secondly it ends up attracting more villains than you can handle. This was true even under I4.

It’s a nice skill to have, but because you really have no defense anymore [because one or more of the developers had no clue about Dark and what it did or does] you are repeatedly pounded into submission anyway and cannot take on a large mob anyhow [even with Dark Embrace 6 slotted]. Plus the fact that the endurance cost is very high. You can always take this later, but even then your going to get pounded.

Murky Cloud - Resist Fire, Cold (High), Resist Negative Energy, Energy (Moderate), Resist Endurance Drain.
-Actually this is a very handy skill, but you can run without it for a time. Most times you have too anyway, due to the endurance cost of your other armors and your end result of the melee cost of your attacks. However, its actually very effective. You can minimally slot this and still be impressed [compared to your Dark Embrace] as to its effectiveness. Slot no more than 2 or 3 before level 20, and you need to save these slots for stuff that actually works and functions.

Obsidian Shield - Resist Psionics (Moderate), Resist Stun, Sleep, Hold, Fear (Moderate).
-This will become your secondary Armor skill and most likely will run with it on more than any other skill from here on out. Mostly due to the ability to resist STUN and HOLD. It is costly Endurance wise, but not anything like Murky Cloud the true Endurance Hog of this set. Slot no more than 2-3 before level 20 and you need to save these slots for stuff that actually works and functions.

Dark Regeneration - Negative Energy Damage (Minor), Heal (Moderate)-
Firstly you need to bypass this when it becomes available for two very important reasons.
1. You do not have enough endurance to use it in 90% of the situations anway and the overall effect is negligible. Simply put, by the time you have used it, you have already been pounded down to where you started and lost endurance in the process.
2. You need the slots that would go here somewhere else that is actually effective.
Take this at level 26 or later.

Cloak of Darkness - Stealth (Moderate), Melee Defense (Low), Ranged Defense (Low), Resist Immobilizes, Increased Perception.
-Firstly let me say that this was the whole concept behind Dark Armor and why Dark Melee has the worst TOHIT rate of any other character or class within the game. You swing at them and miss, they swing at you and miss. Currently, I have to consider this the worst case scenario out of I5 and the best example of the developers Tomfoolery, and lack of ability to understand the game. Even Tanks were not hit as hard as this. This power was such in demand for and needed for your character even before I5 you had to take this skill over such things like; Stamina. Basically this was a “HaveTo” skill even under I4 at level 20 as your offensive properties are basically peaked and your defenses are peaked and your still getting pounded.

Now if you have managed to get this far with your character here is the point under I5 where you are going to throw in the towel and quit and come and curse the developers. You will probably go a few more levels, but in the end this skill is not functioning PERIOD. Which actually means your character does not function. You have basically topped out and are still doing so poorly that you wont want to continue. You have already taken a bad beating on the way up and not it just going to continue. Everyone else is getting better and your basically stagnate at level 20 for 30 more levels.

The only other solution is have someone Power Level you from 20 to 28 and try again, but the results are basically the same as Cloak of Fear can only effect basically 50% and you are still restricted to small Mobs 3-4 villains of equal level, as you have no defenses and still have a long way to go.

The only real suggestion at this point I can give to anyone is base your character on NOT taking this skill Cloak of Darkness, and take some type of Stealth skill off one of the Power Pools as its at least 10 times more effective. However, if your going to do that anyway pick something else besides DA that actually works and save yourself the trouble. In other words; the developers have taken a Level 20 skill and made it less effective than a skill available at level 6 and 14 level.

The above post indication that this provides 0.65% defense. This could be correct as its below 1% effectiveness and currently its so ineffective I cannot calculate it. Current characters slotted SO’s 1, 3 and 5 show no results defensively from this skill PERIOD. With Cloak of Darkness On or Off no results can be indicated as your hit just as often. Test results have indicated an UNSLOTTED Hover skill has more defensive properties than Cloak of Darkness does.

No real point in going on with the rest of the skills as this class has been destroyed like so many others. The only REAL defensive skill on the Dark Armor tree has been removed and edited not to function. Dark Armor has no real defensives and coupled with the fact that Dark Melee has the worst TOHIT rate in the game just means you are going to die repeatedly on missions as your hit repeatedly and are missing them repeatedly.

Personally, I have found no solution to this yet on all THREE characters, and basically that is because there is no solution. The only real solution is NOT to click DA, Scrapper, and just pay my 15bucks and click a Blaster and [censored], or quit. Maybe I should get a discount and only have to pay 0.65% of that 15 bucks? 98cents, or something like that.

The current satiation with DA and in particular Cloak of Darkness is so horrendous it has to be a mistake, as if someone misplaced a <insert colorful remark here> decimal point. There is no way this type of character will work anymore with its MAIN defensive skill set at 0.65%. Not when it has to stand Toe to Toe with everything as it is a MELEE CLASS.

Now some of you might be saying it cant be this bad. Well, please try it yourself and good luck. : P Most people gave up before level 28 before I5 anyhow. Now????? I wouldn’t even suggest anyone actually even attempt DA/DM. Your better off as a Tank actually. : P

I would actually have to classify DA/DM as the worst class within the game currently with no solution in sight other than a major edit.

[/ QUOTE ]

um... someone doesnt like /da

well i happen to.. even with the changes.. mainly because the only chage that annoyed me was teh CoF nerf.. and that one hurt more then anything else..

so far as the armors go, I use dark embrace and ob cloud mostly. murky is reserved for carnies and sappers mainly.

as far as shroud goes... i have it slotted as screw mentioned, and on an EVEN lvl minion i average 50 a tic.. lts average 30 and an even lvl boss i average 15-20.. not (preI5) fire tank type damage, but it helps!

and no my defenses (aside from psi) arent top of the line (even after all the others took a hit, BUT.. if you play right, you can survive so long as you're willing to accept a little (sometimes a lot of debt)

mind you i still dont bother with the 9th power.. i tried it on test, and i'll still pass!

---

[ QUOTE ]
...Now some of you might be saying it cant be this bad. Well, please try it yourself and good luck. : P Most people gave up before level 28 before I5 anyhow. Now????? I wouldn’t even suggest anyone actually even attempt DA/DM. Your better off as a Tank actually. : P

I would actually have to classify DA/DM as the worst class within the game currently with no solution in sight other than a major edit.

[/ QUOTE ]
I disagree with this poster's observations.

I have a level 27 DM/DA and I love the guy. He was level 24 when I5 went live, and he's been a blast to play ever since.
I've temporarily retired my tankers since I5 to concentrate on my DM/DA scrapper.

I've found that the combination of increased scrapper damage and reduced endurance cost has made my hero stronger after I5 than he was before. Though I never had any experience with the Cloak of Darkness and Cloak of Fear powers before (or after) the patch, so I can't address that. However, I'm doing fine without either.

My only problem is that there are so many good powers in both sets that it's hard to fit them all in.

To the original poster: nice guide, and I appreciate the slotting advice. There's a new update to Joe Chott's Hero Planner at http://joechott.com/coh which has the current resistance number for DA in I5, helpful for people planning their shield slotting.

---

Virtue:
Rockburner, Fire/Stone Tanker (50)
Doc Disaster, Earth/Storm Controller (44)
Icewall, Inv/Ice Tanker (42)
Wings, MA/Inv Scrapper (42)
Shockblast, Elec/Elec Blaster (36)
..and many others.

I'm not sure what has afflicted LoreUndone, but if you're reading this thread with the intention of learning about DA in I5, please disregard his ramblings.

DA was "nerfed least" in I5, IMO and as such, is now one of the top scrapper secondaries.

It never was a bad as its reputation anyway, just expensive and a bit harder to use.

While Screwloose isn't the only place to get DA opinions, he's on the money (as usual)

---

[ QUOTE ]
Well unfortunately its hard to convey ones thoughts directly to paper, or print and have it come out as intended, otherwise everyone would have a Best Seller or be a writer. I am particularly well known for this in the industry as I tend to charge strait to the point, therefore they sound a little mean.

I have to thank you for your time and effort in your report, and the original poster. Although I have to give credit to your review I personally believe something has to be wrong here. As if no one checks anyone’s work before its added, or something. I mean this whole Patch is about Balance, [supposedly] so saying that “its here to stay” when the actual results are so imbalanced is not giving the development team enough credit.

That is, unless they are purposely trying to destroy the game.

Clearly, as shown by multiple players, post, evidence, examples, and so on and so on…. Mistakes were made, or left uncheck during this patch, or the code was in error. Its hard for most people, even someone such as myself with a decade of experience in this industry that the results of I5 were the intended, or desired results. If these were the desired results, someone’s vision is sewed and the need to be replaced or removed.

Its one thing to make the game harder, and another to make it impossible. Its also another thing entirely to purposely pick out classes and make them impossible to play, succeed or enjoy. Especially, while others are even better than before, and were already in need of an edit such as this.

I actually want to be clear on this. Many of us understood the need for some edits, but clearly these are not the edits that were needed. Heaven help us if someone ever makes the AI better. Which I might add, what was actually needed first before Nerfs of Skills or characters.

Basically I5 is nothing more than a “Make Work” patch so I guess someone feels better about getting a paycheck this month. 90% of what is in I5 was not even needed, no asked for by the population.

Now in truth, being Dark/Dark for sometime now after hitting Level 20 with characters I did consider myself somewhat UBER [but no more uber than any blaster running around, and less uber than any other scrapper running around].

However, I have to believe players such as the original poster and players such as myself are a the high end of the spectrum which leaves the lowest common denominator out in the dark and unable to use this class. Even a perfect build is basically five steps below that of any other class, even in the same category at the moment.

Now granted, this is Statesman’s Game, and he can build it anyway he wants. However, the trick is to get others to play it, and pay for it. I can tell Statesman one thing for sure; This will not due.

Many people here after CoV hits will be paying approximately thirty dollars a month for this game and the development process and patches are going to have to reflect that cost. Every player of Every Class, Type and Ability are expecting Fair and Unbiased Edits and Implementation of new skills and abilities. Not Temper Tantrums by the development team or ideas and concepts not fully thought out before implementation singling out once class to be the best.

I’m all for balance, but that is NOT what I5 is. I5 is more imbalance, than balance. I5 is more of a purposeful intended attempt to ruin a class and classes and characters of a particular type. Those are just the facts and I’m sorry if Statesman, or the development team do not want to face the facts well…... They will have to face them shortly as more and more accounts disappear.

When you purposely single out individuals and modify them to not function the same as everyone else you have made the first step down the road to ruin and an appearance of bias. Many people will start seeing the game and the developers as Unfair, Bias, Inept, and Incompetent. If one character cannot do just as good as another something is incorrect.

It is actually unthinkable to expect people a year into the game to actually just stop using a character and start all over because a patch has made that character or class unmanageable, or unusable. 9 out of 10 times they just leave and do something else. We all don’t have 24/7 to play this game and actually have jobs and responsibilities that detract from the time we can actually log on and use our characters.

I cannot believe the statement that “this is it”, as I don’t believe anyone is that stupid to shoot themselves in the foot like this and just do nothing about it bleeding to death in the process. Don’t get me wrong, Iv seen it happen, but usually those developers are “one time wonders” and never get another chance and have to go back to work for SONY making <insert colorful remark here> games.

I am sorry, but I cannot share Statesman’s vision on this. The concept is good, the game was better than I thought it would be for its type, but after this I5 fiasco you have to step back and reexamine why you’re here and if these developers can actually do this.

I give this patch a month and after that without some major changes I have to bow out and find something else. The game will not go any further than this with this type of development. Which brings up the point of COV, and if its in this type of condition.

I don’t think it is too unrealistic for many of us to believe that 90% of I5 was not tested beyond the point of Bug screening. No testing of Balance, Effects, and Results were actually done. I sure hope no one was paid to test the balance portion of this patch cause that was money just thrown out the window.

The only other real option I can see at this point is if both Tanker, and Scrapper Classes are going to be this impossible to level compared to every other class they are going to have to only require Half the Experience Points to do so………….. : p Otherwise, who in there right mind would use them.

Which is the actual intent behind I5. If anyone cares to take a look at CoV you may understand why these classes are in the first stages of the attempt to eliminate them from play.

Ruin one game to build another?

I don’t know, you would think for all the money we have been shelling at this game they could hire someone who knew what they were doing. At first I was kind of mad, but actually my anger turned into sorrow. At this point I feel sorry for the development team. These guys have a lot to learn and need a lot more experience.

This experience should be a good example to all the WoodBe developers out there that you have to know more than CODE to develop a game. Just like you need to know more than just how to drive a Car to be an Auto Mechanic .

These guys are in dire need of help if this is the best example of a patch and a balance attempt. They mess up just changing the Oil : P.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry you feel this way, IMHO /DA is doing very well. Other than what is in my signature I have DM/DA, level 14 that is coming along very nicely.

Yes /DA takes a little more work with all the toggles but it is a great set to play.

---

LoreUndone, your guide has several errors:

You list Smash/Lethal resist as lower than Negative/Toxic in Dark Embrace. Since Smash/Lethal is 22.5% and Negative Toxic is 15%, I'm not sure I understand the math you used to come to this conclusion. Further, you rate Fire/Cold - also at 22.5% - as high, and Energy/Negative - 15% - as moderate, compared to the "low" you rated DE's Negative/Toxic. You also rated Obsidian Shield's Psi resist as moderate, when it's still at 37.5%.

As for Death Shroud, it lets you kill faster and even pre-stamina can save you more endurance than you spend running it. You can use Death Shroud and inspirations to run a mission from beginning to end, with only a couple pauses to recover endurance, at 5th level.

Dark Regeneration should be taken as soon as it becomes available. At 17th level, you can have three end recovery DOs slotted in it, reducing the endurance cost to ~ 33, which is certainly useful. I don't understand your claim that you will take just as much damage as you heal before you're even done using the power, but I guess this falls under the same category as your rating of the various resists.

Cloak of Darkness still provides Stealth, and a tested melee/ranged defense of a bit over 3%. The defense, which is admittedly minor, does not suppress when you attack (unlike Stealth from the power pool), and your running speed is not debuffed while you run it (unlike Stealth from the power pool), so I again find your suggestion that Stealth is superior to be peculiar.

You go on to claim that Dark Melee has the worst to-hit rate in the game, which is simply an incomprehensible statement to make. I mean, it has a base 75% accuracy - the same as most other blast and melee sets. Only the weapon sets and martial arts have higher (5% and 10% respectively). Could you perhaps explain how having the same default accuracy as most other powers equates to "the worst to-hit rate in the game?"

I'm also not understanding how Cloak of Darkness' former 9-10% defense, even slotted to 20-22% with SOs, qualifies as such a decisive part of the powerset in comparison to the set's fairly decent lineup of resists.

I mean, sure, if you have Hasten, Combat Jumping, Cloak of Darkness, and Weave, you're looking at a fairly good defense up to issue 4. But CoD by itself?

You finally conclude[ QUOTE ]
Now some of you might be saying it cant be this bad. Well, please try it yourself and good luck. : P Most people gave up before level 28 before I5 anyhow. Now????? I wouldn’t even suggest anyone actually even attempt DA/DM. Your better off as a Tank actually. : P

I would actually have to classify DA/DM as the worst class within the game currently with no solution in sight other than a major edit.

[/ QUOTE ]and I have to say that I just have to conclude that your guide is some kind of complicated prank. I really hope no one reads it and thinks that you're actually seriously proposing that Dark Armor is weak in comparison to other Scrapper secondaries in issue 5, or that Dark Melee/Dark Armor is a horrible combination with no hope of good performance.

If you're serious, I'd suggest not posting misinformation in the future. It's rude, especially in response to others' guides who are accurate.

---

Elsegame: Champions Online: @BellaStrega ||| Battle.net: Ashleigh#1834 ||| Bioware Social Network: BellaStrega ||| EA Origin: Bella_Strega ||| Steam: BellaStrega ||| The first Guild Wars: Kali Magdalene ||| The Secret World: BelleStarr (Arcadia)

as usual, well put Screwloose, very informative and more importantly, correct. Kali, glad you posted what you did, i was in shock over everything said and wasn't quite sure how to reply. you'd both get stars if they were still around .

---

Reading Lore's post I found myself, for the first time in any forum, literally reading with my mouth open wondering what planet this guy was from. Not that we shouldn't all appreciate someone taking the time to post information, however, the information left should be accurate and posted in a format that is easy to read, understand, and comprehend. Lore's post is none of these as much of the information is just plain wrong.

Screw, imaginary stars for you my friend. Very nice guide. And thank you very much for taking the time to help the /DA community. I shall be using it often and putting it up on my SG site. Cheers.

---

"His Imperial Majesty's Minister of Restraints and Leather" -LHF

Two naughty acronym teams / Ascension / Convenient / Artic and the Chillz / Fap / Other teams I can't remember (sorry.. mind is goin')

This is a great guide, Screwloose. It'll help me immensely in deciding what I should do with my main's (BS/DA) I5 respec, especially the slotting advice. It gave me a lot to think about with regard to what powers to take, though, and I could use some advice. The main issues I'm thinking about are;

Cloak of Darkness and the Leaping pool;
Super Jump is my movement power, so I chose Combat Jumping (+def, res. to immobilization) as my first Leaping pool power. CoD does the same things and more (stealth and perception), making having both of them (as I do now) redundant. On the other hand, redundance might not necessarily be a bad thing, and my other option to unlock SJ is Jump Kick, a simple (moderate damage, I think. Not 100% sure) knockback attack. I already have plenty of attacks in my primary. Besides, JK requires me to redraw my sword after I use it, slowing down my attack cycle. On a side note, I don't have Acrobatics because I too see Knockback as more of an annoyance than a threat.

Death Shoud, Cloak of Fear, and/or Oppressive Gloom;
I currently have Cloak of Fear and Oppressive Gloom. I chose not to take Death Shroud at my last respec because the DoT would negate Fear's attack stoppage if I were using both of them at once. With Lieutenants no longer being affected by CoF, I'm reconsidering that. As you said, fear resistance is rare. That makes it useful for me in PvP. On the other hand, in PvE, OG is now more effective at stopping attacks, and is not interfered with by DS. But, like the last issue, redundance isn't necessarily bad.

Then there are my Fitness powers, which I'm absolutely happy with, and issues with my ancillary pool (Darkness Mastery) such as "Torrent (less damage, but has Knockback), Dark Blast (more damage, but nothing else), or both?", but those are beyond the scope of the guide.

What do you think I should do?

---

Currently published Mission Architect arcs:
Arc ID# 70466: From the Abyss.
Arc ID# 403174: The Serpent's Revenge.
Arc ID# 534236: The Clockwork Angel.

[ QUOTE ]
As far as I can tell throughout this entire post is more of a repeat of a long ago abilities. A lot of the information is good. However, its misleading and is not reflecting the true results of I5.

Now grated you have to applaud anyone taking the time to report and try to help others, and overall the report is clear, but I hardly think its precise. Moreover this above is just a repeat of older patch notes and results, and not what is really going on.

Dark Scrappers have always been an Offensive Template and originally that was due to the fact that you didn’t get any real defensive properties on your character until level 20- Cloak of Darkness. At this point you desperately needed it as you have basically reached the limit of your Offensive potential.

My Quick Review of Powers under I5-

Dark Embrace
-Resist Smash, Lethal (Very Low), Resist Negative Energy, Toxic (Low).
No matter how much you slot this, or what enhancements you use, it is not [or ever will be] equivalent to any other scrapper damage resistances or skill. Supposedly Dark Embrace was getting an Endurance cost decrease, however results so far have indicated that Damage Resistance has been decreased and in fact Endurance cost has increased slightly over pervious.

This skill currently should be more appropriately named Dark Embarrassment in fact. Its better than a Poke in the Eye, but as far as the post above stating to slot it heavily shows that they are not currently running this type of character.
1. You should never have more than 3 to 4 slots on this before level 20 as the results or desired results from the slots are negligible and you will not notice any difference. Plus you need to save these slots for stuff that actually works and functions. Offense.

Death Shroud
-Negative Energy Damage (Minor PBAoE DoT).
Currently if you take this early it will just end up getting you kill faster that if you didn’t have it at all. For one, you cannot do any real damage with it, and secondly it ends up attracting more villains than you can handle. This was true even under I4.

It’s a nice skill to have, but because you really have no defense anymore [because one or more of the developers had no clue about Dark and what it did or does] you are repeatedly pounded into submission anyway and cannot take on a large mob anyhow [even with Dark Embrace 6 slotted]. Plus the fact that the endurance cost is very high. You can always take this later, but even then your going to get pounded.

Murky Cloud - Resist Fire, Cold (High), Resist Negative Energy, Energy (Moderate), Resist Endurance Drain.
-Actually this is a very handy skill, but you can run without it for a time. Most times you have too anyway, due to the endurance cost of your other armors and your end result of the melee cost of your attacks. However, its actually very effective. You can minimally slot this and still be impressed [compared to your Dark Embrace] as to its effectiveness. Slot no more than 2 or 3 before level 20, and you need to save these slots for stuff that actually works and functions.

Obsidian Shield - Resist Psionics (Moderate), Resist Stun, Sleep, Hold, Fear (Moderate).
-This will become your secondary Armor skill and most likely will run with it on more than any other skill from here on out. Mostly due to the ability to resist STUN and HOLD. It is costly Endurance wise, but not anything like Murky Cloud the true Endurance Hog of this set. Slot no more than 2-3 before level 20 and you need to save these slots for stuff that actually works and functions.

Dark Regeneration - Negative Energy Damage (Minor), Heal (Moderate)-
Firstly you need to bypass this when it becomes available for two very important reasons.
1. You do not have enough endurance to use it in 90% of the situations anway and the overall effect is negligible. Simply put, by the time you have used it, you have already been pounded down to where you started and lost endurance in the process.
2. You need the slots that would go here somewhere else that is actually effective.
Take this at level 26 or later.

Cloak of Darkness - Stealth (Moderate), Melee Defense (Low), Ranged Defense (Low), Resist Immobilizes, Increased Perception.
-Firstly let me say that this was the whole concept behind Dark Armor and why Dark Melee has the worst TOHIT rate of any other character or class within the game. You swing at them and miss, they swing at you and miss. Currently, I have to consider this the worst case scenario out of I5 and the best example of the developers Tomfoolery, and lack of ability to understand the game. Even Tanks were not hit as hard as this. This power was such in demand for and needed for your character even before I5 you had to take this skill over such things like; Stamina. Basically this was a “HaveTo” skill even under I4 at level 20 as your offensive properties are basically peaked and your defenses are peaked and your still getting pounded.

Now if you have managed to get this far with your character here is the point under I5 where you are going to throw in the towel and quit and come and curse the developers. You will probably go a few more levels, but in the end this skill is not functioning PERIOD. Which actually means your character does not function. You have basically topped out and are still doing so poorly that you wont want to continue. You have already taken a bad beating on the way up and not it just going to continue. Everyone else is getting better and your basically stagnate at level 20 for 30 more levels.

The only other solution is have someone Power Level you from 20 to 28 and try again, but the results are basically the same as Cloak of Fear can only effect basically 50% and you are still restricted to small Mobs 3-4 villains of equal level, as you have no defenses and still have a long way to go.

The only real suggestion at this point I can give to anyone is base your character on NOT taking this skill Cloak of Darkness, and take some type of Stealth skill off one of the Power Pools as its at least 10 times more effective. However, if your going to do that anyway pick something else besides DA that actually works and save yourself the trouble. In other words; the developers have taken a Level 20 skill and made it less effective than a skill available at level 6 and 14 level.

The above post indication that this provides 0.65% defense. This could be correct as its below 1% effectiveness and currently its so ineffective I cannot calculate it. Current characters slotted SO’s 1, 3 and 5 show no results defensively from this skill PERIOD. With Cloak of Darkness On or Off no results can be indicated as your hit just as often. Test results have indicated an UNSLOTTED Hover skill has more defensive properties than Cloak of Darkness does.

No real point in going on with the rest of the skills as this class has been destroyed like so many others. The only REAL defensive skill on the Dark Armor tree has been removed and edited not to function. Dark Armor has no real defensives and coupled with the fact that Dark Melee has the worst TOHIT rate in the game just means you are going to die repeatedly on missions as your hit repeatedly and are missing them repeatedly.

Personally, I have found no solution to this yet on all THREE characters, and basically that is because there is no solution. The only real solution is NOT to click DA, Scrapper, and just pay my 15bucks and click a Blaster and [censored], or quit. Maybe I should get a discount and only have to pay 0.65% of that 15 bucks? 98cents, or something like that.

The current satiation with DA and in particular Cloak of Darkness is so horrendous it has to be a mistake, as if someone misplaced a <insert colorful remark here> decimal point. There is no way this type of character will work anymore with its MAIN defensive skill set at 0.65%. Not when it has to stand Toe to Toe with everything as it is a MELEE CLASS.

Now some of you might be saying it cant be this bad. Well, please try it yourself and good luck. : P Most people gave up before level 28 before I5 anyhow. Now????? I wouldn’t even suggest anyone actually even attempt DA/DM. Your better off as a Tank actually. : P

I would actually have to classify DA/DM as the worst class within the game currently with no solution in sight other than a major edit.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not to be rude LoreUndone, but ah... just what the heck are you smoking? How the heck do you figure dark regen is useless, or that you will take just as much damage as it healed? I clocked it at 1400 HP healed at one point during a mission. I had 419 HP max at the time. With one enemy it is better then a respite, with two enemies it will heal you from severly hurt, three plus enemies will take you from 1 HP to full in one use. And you say it's useless?!

I have a level 18 dark/dark scrapper, and he rarely uses his primaries. He still solos all his missions. If I stop paying attention I die, if I'm paying attention almost nothing can kill me, that includes hazard zone spawns.

You claim that taking death shroud early is going to cause you to face plant. Huh? Please explain that statement. It doesn't agro anything not already in melee range of you. It does tons of damage if your surounded. I have it slotted with DOs, and it rocks. Since when is ten damage or so every second or two to everything in melee going to kill you? At low levels I charged into a pack of 5 minions and a LT, I focused on fighting the LT. By the time he was dead most of the minions were already dead or almost dead.

Your saying that it doesn't matter how much or little the damage resist shields are slotted, they will never work as well as the other tank and scrapper sets. And your point is? It has OTHER threat midigation items. It posesses the best self heal in the game, a DoT aura that simply rocks, a pbaoe stun, pbaoe fear, stealth... Dark armor is about being a swiss army knife, you have the tools for the job no matter what the job requires. It is not about being a hammer when you need a screwdriver. I looked at this power set and thought "Hay, this would work great for soloing". So far I have not been proven wrong.

You claim CoD is useless, but since when is the ability to sneek past the enemy useless? I've seen many timed missions where I wished I had it already. Oh, by the way in case you didn't notice, the set isn't about gaining defence. If you want +defence go with super reflexes. The set is about the age old idea that if the enemy can't attack (dead or controled) you have 100% defence to anything that oponant could do to you. If the ten guys around you are dead (death shroud helps with this) they are not attacking you. If they are feared they are not attacking you. If they are stunned they are not attacking you. If they don't know your there... once again they are not attacking you. Once they notice you, switch to another way of keeping them from attacking.

Once again, just what are you smoking? It's obviously the really good stuff if you can't figure out that /DA is not about pure defence. /DA is about being versitile. your whole post is nothing but trying to claim my dark/dark scrapper's five defensive powers (and one I will take soon for stealth) are useless. If that was the case I never would have gotten to level 18 with Slimy Sam. I don't play him much, maybe an hour or two a week, I created him about three weeks ago, he's level 18. That is not useless.

Screwloose, I must applaud your guide. It's truely top notch.

---

"The danger is not that a particular class is unfit to govern. Every class is unfit to govern." Lord Acton

Madam Enigma's History

[ QUOTE ]
This is a great guide, Screwloose.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks. And thanks to everyone else who has posted positively or constructively.

[ QUOTE ]
Cloak of Darkness and the Leaping pool;
Super Jump is my movement power, so I chose Combat Jumping (+def, res. to immobilization) as my first Leaping pool power. CoD does the same things and more (stealth and perception), making having both of them (as I do now) redundant. On the other hand, redundance might not necessarily be a bad thing, and my other option to unlock SJ is Jump Kick, a simple (moderate damage, I think. Not 100% sure) knockback attack. I already have plenty of attacks in my primary. Besides, JK requires me to redraw my sword after I use it, slowing down my attack cycle. On a side note, I don't have Acrobatics because I too see Knockback as more of an annoyance than a threat.

[/ QUOTE ]

CoD does have the drawback of doing several things in the one power. This bumps up it's End cost and means that if you are getting any of the things it does from another source it starts to look lack lustre.

You are not really going to get much use out of Combat Jumping or Jump Kick as far as I can see, but the added mobility of Combat Jumping and it's cheap End cost would probably swing me towards it.

I use to run CoD so much that most of my regular teams knew that if I was visible I wasn't ready to start fighting. Now I tend to turn it on and off as seems appropriate.

[ QUOTE ]
Death Shoud, Cloak of Fear, and/or Oppressive Gloom;
I currently have Cloak of Fear and Oppressive Gloom. I chose not to take Death Shroud at my last respec because the DoT would negate Fear's attack stoppage if I were using both of them at once. With Lieutenants no longer being affected by CoF, I'm reconsidering that. As you said, fear resistance is rare. That makes it useful for me in PvP. On the other hand, in PvE, OG is now more effective at stopping attacks, and is not interfered with by DS. But, like the last issue, redundance isn't necessarily bad.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was very harsh on Cloak of Fear when the I5 changes were first posted, however with more time to think about it I feel that it is probably in the same scale as other Scrapper Threat Mitigation powers so it just got hit in the general defensive reduction that all powers got.

DS and CoF aren't totally exclusive. Cowering minions have a Retaliation Check cycle and they get one retaliation each Retaliation Cycle, which seem to be about 10 seconds to me.

This means that mobs with slow recharge attacks are less affected by Cowering than ones with fast recharge attacks.

And if you or your team are doing any AE damage then the mobs only get to Retaliate once in their Retaliation Cycle no matter how many times they got hit so you might as well hit them lots.

However a little like CoD CoF does several things at once and if you have something that does some of those things, like Op Gloom nullifying Minions, then CoF starts to look a little less effective.

I kept both CoF and OpGloom, but run CoF a lot less freqently these days.

[ QUOTE ]
Then there are my Fitness powers, which I'm absolutely happy with, and issues with my ancillary pool (Darkness Mastery) such as "Torrent (less damage, but has Knockback), Dark Blast (more damage, but nothing else), or both?", but those are beyond the scope of the guide.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am an almost idelogical anti-Stamina poster, but even my Spines DA scrapper has Stamina. I've not felt a burning need for it on my MA SR scrapper, but no doubt it would give me certain advantages with him too, I just don't feel they are worth giving up 3 powers for.

I like Darkness too, it suits my desire to have lots of tactical tools to use in play. I went with Dark Blast, Pet Gaze and Tenebrous Tentacles. Dark Blast replaced Brawl in my attack cycle, a Single Target Hold is great for shuting down annoying mobs like Malta Sappers and TenbTentacles is just cool looking (% .

For my perspectives and some links look for my Scrapper APP's overview linked to in the Scrapper guides and faqs thread.

[ QUOTE ]
What do you think I should do?

[/ QUOTE ]

Read lots, have fun (% .

regards, Screwloose.
"I am not young enough to know everything."

---

How to Look Stuff Up Yourself - It's Fun and Easy
Looking for Powers Numbers try City of Data.
For Fraks sake read the Guides and FAQs
Global Chat Channels - Australia

[ QUOTE ]
Then there are my Fitness powers, which I'm absolutely happy with, and issues with my ancillary pool (Darkness Mastery) such as "Torrent (less damage, but has Knockback), Dark Blast (more damage, but nothing else), or both?", but those are beyond the scope of the guide.

What do you think I should do?

[/ QUOTE ]

I took the Dark mastery, mainly because it fit what I wanted for my toon. Now since then I've realized something, I love it! Hell as everyone has said OG makes them wander off.. well hell.. just toss Tentacles in as you charge, and they can't wander (and yes 2 */DA scrappers running OG can effect up to a boss.. makes you want to get 4 or 5 together and see if you can affect an AV with it.. or maybe thats just me). another good part of it is .. PetGaze on sapper means no end drain on group! or me just in case

I respec'd out of CoF and while I miss it's effect, I can now atleast have all 3 armors, shroud and CoD up at once and not go totally dry in a prolonged fight (damn sappers). I just dinged 49 and MEANT to pick up Combat Jumping, I've found I need a little more immob pretection then I get from CoD, stupid me didnt pay attention and hit jump kick by mistake. ah well.. its another attack *eyeroll* um... 44 respec anyone?

---

Brilliant guide..


-Alex

---

Ah, yea, thanks for the free account disinformation.

Now, back to the originally scheduled thread...

Want to thank you for the guide, screwloose! Lots of good info... I can't go on test right now so I'm gonna take your advice to hard and bite the bullet with a live, untested respec.

It's OK because, well, I tend to pay my blasters more anyway so if it doesn't work, np!

---

I've taken Death Shroud at early levels on my two /DA scrappers, and it is a big help. I did a simple test to decide; on Test, I took it at about 8th level (no slots in it), turned it on, and jumped between 3 white Skulls and stood there, running unslotted (one TO End reduction) Dark Embrace. Two dropped and one ran, I was down to about 20% hit points. If it can do that completely unslotted, that tells me it will be doing a good job of whittling down more typical yellow/orange foes while I'm busy once slotted.

I do have to be a bit careful on teams, where there are more foes around. I definitely need to have some support to survive the aggro it generates in large spawns. But if I'm on a team, I expect that the tanker will hold some, the defender will debuff some, the blaster will take some aggro off me, etc.

Recommended!

---

Thanks for all the nice words, just adding some info on End costs dredged up from the Testing Server forum by Hejtmane

[ QUOTE ]
Ok this is what I got from the boards during I5 updates so take them for info gathered from the boards from the test server

DE .2
MC .2
OS .3
COF .4
DS .71
COD .39
OG .12

[/ QUOTE ]


regards, Screwloose.
"I am not young enough to know everything."

---

How to Look Stuff Up Yourself - It's Fun and Easy
Looking for Powers Numbers try City of Data.
For Fraks sake read the Guides and FAQs
Global Chat Channels - Australia

Firstoff, to the OP, nice guide Screwloose; of course I don't necessarily agree with everything you suggest, but it is clear where you are coming from, and you explain your reasoning well . Bottom line--No one who follows your suggestions will be choosing a bad path. You are a credit to the DA community.

As for you, Lore, I do agree with some of your observations on the apparent development methodology of the game and the nature of the progession into the integrated CoV environment, but saying DM/DA is the worst Scrapper combination in the game today is not what I would call a rational conclusion, unless you assume that DM/DA can only win in I5 by playing Scraptroller, which I would say is not a true statement.

It has always been a little different than other Scrapper combinations in that it required micromanagement skills, and tactics make a big difference in the outcome of many fights. Even at the highest levels "real fights" have a strategy requirement.

My I5 testing indicates that DM/DA has lost its edge in terms of herding up and killing a big gang, but it is very competitive in its ability to stand in and fight. Admittedly, sometimes the fights look a little bit different than they used to, but it performs at a respectable level compared with other Primary/Secondary combinations.

Besides possibly claws, DM gained the greatest benefit from the 12.5% Scrapper damage boost. It retained all of its cool, Batman-Utility belt abilities and went up in damage class while high-damage Primaries get to waste more extra damage in the targets they already overkill.

The reason I say this is b/c DM damage was all sub even-con minion damage, and now, at L50, six-slotted with ++ SO's (assumes Focused Accuracy, obviously), it's basic attack chain can take down three even-con minions per cycle without Soul Drain.

This is a huge increase in efficiency and encourages DM Scrappers to be very damage-oriented. With the drop in DA toggle costs and the fact of the stinky, unattractive thing that CoF has become (although it does have situational value), it is no longer an endurance war to simultaneously have a DM defense and a DA offense.

DM gains access to Soul Drain right around the time the game starts getting a little bit tough, so I am not sure that (in)accuracy arguments make as much sense past L26.

I am definitely biased, but even in I5, I think DM/DA is the best available Scrapper combination for overall power, strategy, and fun (of course I thought it was in I3 and I4 too, so what do I know?).

---

Many thanks for the updated summation of DA. In light of Issue 5 I decided to dust off my shelved Kat/DA scrapper, and this will help immensely!

---

[ QUOTE ]
There is no way this type of character will work anymore with its MAIN defensive skill set at 0.65%. Not when it has to stand Toe to Toe with everything as it is a MELEE CLASS.

Now some of you might be saying it cant be this bad. Well, please try it yourself and good luck. : P Most people gave up before level 28 before I5 anyhow. Now????? I wouldn’t even suggest anyone actually even attempt DA/DM. Your better off as a Tank actually. : P

I would actually have to classify DA/DM as the worst class within the game currently with no solution in sight other than a major edit.

[/ QUOTE ]

Firstly to Screwloose: well done. Very informative, and likeably opinionated.

Now, onto Lore...

You actually make a couple of valid points Lore, but the majority of your post is so vociferously uninformed (as the quote above shows) to be puzzling.

Do you really believe what you've typed? You've obviously put a LOT of time into typing a lengthy rant about why you feel Screw's post is not precise and why you think that the set's completely ineffective because of CoD's lack of spectacular defense, etc...

You're certainly entitled to represent your opinions, but I don't think you'll find many supporters here.

As for your belief that /DA is an impossible set to play... you may want to check out the /DA guides out there.

As you can see by the responses to your thread, there are more than a few of us, and it is our belief that they're a fun scrapper to play.

Mine is my favorite toon to play, as a matter of fact...

---