The_Foo

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It's fixed internally. Should arrive on the test server "Soon" (aka hopefully the patch after next).

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Good ol' Weirdbeard.

How weird is that beard? It's so weird that it was decreed a Wonder of the World, shaving punishable by mass fines or death.

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You know I've actually never recognized this bug before, maybe it doesn't work with Battle Axe.

Funny thing though, just today a Blaster challenged my Tank to an arena match, and I decided to, thing was I missed him about 90% of the time, in all seriousness. Even with build up (slotted with ToHit SOs), my attacks all have about 2 Acc SO's on average, I was even running Invincibility (slotted with a ToHit SO) and I missed him that many times! I checked his info, he had NO defense powers at all, not even combat jumping or anything from the pools. He never stopped moving, seeing as he was a Super Speeder.

He was also 3 levels ahead've me.. so either something is up with Axe (just like the other Tanker primaries) or a 3 level gap really makes a huge difference in defense.

[/ QUOTE ] Axe has that problem, too
I ran a test last night with ChillGiant, my level 15 Ice/Axe tank. I hunted in atlas with out Chill Embrace on. I would arrest one member of a group, and set Gash to auto. After they failed to hit me, they would run. I would chase and bump into their back (so as to not over shoot them), Gash would activate, but no hit or miss message. {So much for the Streak Breaker} It would use End, though. The longest streak I had was 6, after that the mob would forget about me and stop running. ---S P L A T--- This went on for about a half hour.

Then I turned on Chilling Embrace, and I hit every mob I bumped. I think this is because the mob wasn't out of range when the attack went off???


Thank You, WeirdBeard !!! The sooner the better!!!
And thanx to you, Ravenlute , for all the testing you did! Five stars for YOU!

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It definately is buggged for axe. Here's a demo I recorded a while back of an Axe test when we were first characterizing the bug.

CE doesn't have the same bug because it is a PbAOE with a non-zero radius. Even if things move, their speed would have to exceed the amount necessary to put them outside that radius before the power fired in order for the same "bug" to occur.

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I really feel un-observant.. I have no idea how I even got to 40 and never noticed this bug

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Well, the bug wasn't always there, for one. Two, in the PvE game, things tend not to move around as much. It's only versus people and frightened NPCs (the running kind) that you'd see it.

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First...I confirm that we're working on right now (as in pohsyb in the next room) to add CoV costume parts into CoH if you own both games....

Then we repeal the hated stealth nerf. The reason why: many well reasoned posts. It's that simple. You guys pointed out the problems.

AND now...we're changing the way Archvillains spawn. A ton of forum goers disliked adding so many AV's into missions a while back...so we've come up with a solution. If the team size and mission difficulty are ABOVE a certain level, an Archvillain spawns. Below that, players will face only an Elite Boss. If the mission is set on the first two levels of difficulty, it takes 4 heroes or more to spawn an Arch Villain. On the third level, 3 heroes or more. On the fourth level, 2 heroes. On the highest (Invincible), a solo hero will spawn an AV. Note this works in BOTH City of Heroes and Villains.

In order to incentivize larger teams, Positron is going to add a bonus to AV rewards!

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Wait, that's not my mom. That's our French-Canadian cleaning lady! What have you been doing?

Dear lord, man, she's 78!

There are no meetings, only the hive-mind.

I've also not experienced this phenomemon with my Brutes or Stalkers, so it's a CoH problem at the very least, and probably specific to Tankers.

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....I wish I would read the tanker forums more often.

I must resist the urge to use this deficit against any tanks I duel with my Brute.

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I say use it. It's not like the Devs are paying much attention to us. Maybe they'll notice combat logs.

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Neeto: Well it isn't exactly that total focus is not bugged, it may be that it has more range than most other attacks. If TF is anything like KO blow, it might be the case. I still wonder why the power pools don't have this problem... <_< Maybe you or I should do the following test. Activate KO blow or TF and have the targeted player fly or jump extremely high into the air quickly and see what happens, to see if it is really bugged or it just has good range.

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I think Stun and KO Blow have that bonus range. They both used to be low-damage and high secondary effect, but when they bumped up the damage on KO, they didn't touch the range. I assumed that was on purpose, as I have reported it in the past.

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Yes Concerning PvP, I've done some testing on Test server last night with a Fire/Stone Melee Tank in Warburg and the results were the same. For the sake of the devs i'll point out excactly how i tested with him.

We both had combat jumping and CJ doesn't have a suppression, so we opted to use that travel power to Jump around and test. What i did was I just into his melee range, and without stoping, I would jump away while he had queued up an attack from the stone melee line of attacks. By the Time his End was at half bar, I wasn't even hit once! When i asked him how many "Miss" messeges he had recieved he said 2. And thats 2 misses out of like 20 or so attacks. That means 18 attacks came in bugged.

Next I allowed him to beat on me while I stood still. He hit me like 16 times out of like 20 attacks. None of the attacks were bugged; everything either hit or missed.

Then we switched roles. Once again all my Energy Melee attacks were bugged consecutively as he ran around, but Total focus hit everytime. So we tested Totall Focus, and the results were just as i suspected. Total Focus is not bugged! This may be the reason why so many people think TF is so good compared to all the other Tank melee powers. It's because it's working right!

The last test was boring. He stood there and I smacked him and i only missed once; no buggs were found if the target stood still. However, now that i know the Devs have the code to solve this issue since TF is fixed, why haven't they used the coding in TF to fixed the rest of the Tank Melee powers yet?

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I actually tested things out with my level 50 Inv/EM against NPCs in Galaxy City.

TF is *not* working properly. I think it works more often due to the length of the animation or something, but it's definitely bugged, as I missed level 1-4 enemies with it and received no MISS! message.

I have a demorecord of it. Interesting, it's bugged and showing me to be in a different location than I was when I was doing it live. In the demorecord, I'm approximately 10' away from where I actually was. Could this be indicative of how the server's actually reading my Tank's location? Is that why I can't hit things when they're moving: the server thinks I'm out of melee range?

Alright, it's a lot of weeks later and I haven't updated. Why? Frankly, I don't feel it. I don't think Tankers are in a place where they're particularly valuable or fun right now, so I'm holding off, praying for changes.

If I get back to Tanking, I'll update the guide. Until then, this stuff is still pretty current, so it should be fine.

This is not a bump. This is me posting to say: I love Brutes.

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Fine. No beards and flat chested isn't plausible?

How does this grab you. The circle of thorns specialized long ago in diverse magics, but it was found that men had a talent for manipulating minds and the elements, while women had a talent for possessing spirits and summoning demons. Today, when a hero ventures into Orenbega nad confronts a Behemoth, he is confronting a female CoT member.

This explains the lack of external genitalia on the Behemoths.

[/ QUOTE ]Dude, I'd hit it.

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Why are there so many Canadian Devs? I am Canadian, from Newfoundland, living in Houston Texas, so I am kinda curious. The marine industry brought about 30 of us to Houston but I never knew the gaming industry farmed in Canadians too?

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Well, to be precise I'm not a Dev at all, but on the OCR Team.

I think like stand-up Comedy, Canadians are just well-tempered for some jobs. (I have no idea, I'm just making this up as I go along).

I'm not sure that there are really that many of us, but we do try to support each other a tremendous amount. And I've heard from some good Canadian friends that their Canadian-identity characters get the best reactions from other players online...

cheers,
Arctic_Sun

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Plus, that secret plot to insidiously place a Canadian in major positions in every business in the US so that we can take over using brand recognition and tasty, tasty maple syrup!

...oh, crap. Pretend you didn't read that.

I said pretend!

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Castle = coolest dev EVER!

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Dev, maybe. Red name? Cuppa still wins

She has an insanely tough job: herding belligerent nerds in an online forum.

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CuppaJo and her team do a fantastic job.

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I have to say that Castle has made my job much easier, as have all the AT reps we have. Thanks Y'all!

And believe me, Cuppa is the #1 advocate for Hero AT reps. I think the producers hate hearing me on the phone about it.

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When you say, "all the AT reps", would you happen to have a list of them to share?

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Hobo, please do not remind me about how pitifull my damage is in PvP.

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Why do you shout at me when I suggest Defenders need more damage output then?

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Castle,

I appreciate the response, but the impression your giving is that User documented bugs in a friendly and well thought out format only get attention from developers willing to put in an extra amount of overtime out of the goodness of their hearts rather than having dedicated resources to address these very serious concerns.

At the very least you give the impression that the community doing these things is pretty much a wasted time and are/have been likely ignored for a very long time as player concerns are basicly being/have been ignored.

Like I said, I very much appreciate you looking at these issues Castle, but to me this just re-enforces the notion that the dedicated users are being ignored. It certainly explains why the fact that Controller Storm powers have been operating at Defender Strength or better for over a year.

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Not it at all. Many of the issues in the list already make it into our bug database. Most of the things I am looking at are considered fairly low priority in the grand scheme of things. Yes, I know that there are some fairly egregious issues on the various user compiled bug lists, and they should probably be higher priority than they are -- and that is why I take time during my lunch hour and when generating data from spreadsheets to look at issues that are important to you guys, rather than just looking at our bug database.

As for other community reps, that's on the "Things to do" list. After CoV beta ended, we decided we wanted to continue the idea, but being short on personnel, especially those who have an in depth knowledge of the powers system, we've not yet decided how to go about it. It will probably happen at some point in the not so distant future, but it is also possible we never get a properly trained core group to divvy up the responsibilities effectively.

In the meantime, I do what I can.

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I volunteer. Seriously. I'll work for peanut wages and sleep in a cot under my desk.

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Maybe a Tanker's inherent power should have more to do with Defense than with control then?

Don't Scrappers have a better chance to Crit on Higher Level opponents? (I thought I read that in game, maybe I'm mistaken though).

What if Tankers had boosts to their defenses based upon who was attacking them, such that higher level opponents still did more damage to them, but not as much as they would do to another AT of their level?

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Scrappers get a better chance at crits vs. Lts or Bosses. Opponent level doesn't factor into the critical chance equation.

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Anyway, don't know if I have much of a solution. Maybe raise the Taunt cap to 10 and up base Tanker Def/Res by 10%. Possibly combine those kind of changes with a reduction in offense?

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There's a hard cap on aggro now, 17. Upping Taunt to 10 would just make it easier to hit that cap and it's already very, very easy. (Literally, jump in a spawn with an aggro aura, and start hitting stuff and you'll get 17.)

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If that was the goal, the game design isn't proper now. When I saw Statesman in person and mentioned that my SG had no tankers in it (we didn't aim for that, just nobody made any), he told me "You're going to need them."

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Heehee. He just meant you needed someone to Tank the majority of the I5/I6 nerfs.

They did their job!

I'm just here to point out that the past tense of "pay" is "paid". "Payed" is "to let out (a line or cable) by slackening".

How weird is that?

I'm just gonna get out an old tool of mine to respond to my buddy Circeus here:
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The goal of the game is to make sure there isn't an ideal team composition. So, yes, a Scrapper, with buffs, can tank, but not as well as a Tanker. Why? Because 1) a Tanker starts with higher resistances/defenses and 2) he has Punchvoke and thus can manage the aggro better.

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Re (1): doesn't matter, Defender and Controller buffs are so strong, and the differnece between Scrappers and Tankers defenses is so narrow that when viewed in terms of buffs that can be applied, the difference becomes a non-issue. When it takes just as much buffing and/or healing to keep a Scrapper alive to accomplish the same task, which is where the game is right now, the difference in initial values and caps become meaningless. So the Scrapper becomes the better choice because they can contribute more damage.

Re (2): But the question isn't does he manage agro better, it becomes does the fact that the Tanker can manage agro better matter. And the answer again is the fact that he can becomes meaningless.

It is true that pre-I5 a Tanker may have overshadowed both Controllers and Defenders too much. But now Controllers and Defenders overshadow Tankers too much, and are also capable of making other ATs overshadow Tankers too much.

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Quoted for emphasis.

Jack/Statesman, please pay attention to what's being said here. This isn't a "we used to be super" complaint, it's "our role is probably unnecessary because we can't do it better than others to a degree that is meaningful".

Oh WeirdBeard. Why is your beard so weird?

Thanks for the explanations. Any chance of getting a look at the base to-hit progressions vs. minions? My feeling is even-con minions are working fine at the 75% chance for us to hit them, but I get the feeling that the increase/decrease vs. +/- enemies of varying levels has changed from what it was post Issue 1 "Purple Patch".

Thanks!

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According to Comics, Tankers should survive the most damage and do the most damage. But then, what is the Scrappers's role if they do less damage and survive less?

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I think the problem is that the Scrapper is what should've been the Tanker from the get go, or the Brute is. This creature that can wade into hordes of even-level enemies doesn't exist in MMOs or comics.

Ask yourselves: does Wolverine or Batman do more damage than Colossus or Superman?

The difference between Scrapper and Tanker in comics is one of skill/training vs. brawn/resillience.

In a game I made, Scrappers would be melee debuffers with critical hits that are self-buffable. Think Parry or Divine Avalanche with a +crit. Tanks would be what Brutes are, basically.

The issue with Tanks has always been sticking an MMO concept on the juice and shoehorning it in.

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This morning, I had PMs in my box saying the Accuracy of Dark Melee, Energy Melee and Claws seem to be wrong. I've gotten similar PMs about Ninja Blade as well.

We've tons of data here which all support that accuracy is working as intended and players still have a base 75% to hit even level critters.

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Castle, has the to-hit chance vs. yellow and higher-con minions changed?

Unyielding. Please. FADE.

The throbbing bass of it through my sub-woofer is rendering me sterile.

While we're at it: Rage.