New Dawn

i dont know how far you have got with this build as far as changing it by now but i would try things out to suit yourself, my emp does pvp, she is a haste-superspeeder, recall friend-tper and has stealth, so far she has been good as a fly by defender (standing still would get me killed) so i am a disappearing act because i just tp anywhere. i rely on the strength of wills for mezz protection and they are easily gained from pvp zones that work for 3 minutes each, having said that she can be kept mezzed buffed by another.

i've got my suggestions next to your listing

empathy.

healaura: - 3rechg/3heal more heals per sec but if im close enough to do that im a bit of a aoe target i like to use this heal as i superspeed past.

healother: - 2 rechg 3 heals 1 range

absorb pain: - 1 heal is 90% of normal hp add 1 or 2 more if you like to heal ppl to full who are normal hp + 40%hp. i have 3 rechg 2 range 1 heal myself 3 rechg may appear suicidal to some but not while i am using regen aura it isnt.

cm: - i like mine quick-fire and do everyone fast before heading out or doing as many people i get the chance to as the moment arises and then proactively buff when i can in case i dont get to when people need it (3 rechg 1 end 2 range)

fort: - mine is 3 rechg/3 def it has enough tohit to use against +5 lvls once people have slotted plenty enough accuracy for themselves tohits is more low level necessary. But 3 people eluded is nice and if you as an emp recieve adrenalin boost then omg more people are eluded.

rez: 1 slot - your gonna have to find the slotting yourself but i like atleast an endurance

RA: - you could empty to 3 rechg test it, i would certainly lower the end cost as well and see how many end mods you think are required

RegA: - same as above except 3 heals, this is counter to rads basically 3 heals maybe best way to go.

adren: - i have 3 rechg, 1 end, 1 end mod and 1 heal but go on your personal findings, have a rad defender use their -regen on a team mate in pvp and see whats required.

mental blast: - not enough damage to worry anyone but the -recharge secondary effects in psionics can help the team if spammed and to a minor extent but i just have an acc.

psy wail: - atleast worth 2 accuracies

hasten: - 3 rechg now

fly - i like to flyby heal with ss or appear buff and disappear with tps, there are -fly attacks about a plenty and then you have no travel power.

leadership - im never hanging around in a group to get a good smacking and ive seen defenders trying to make it useful in arena matches, defenders tended to be chased away from the group and killed off more often than anyone, id much rather be hard to get and slip in the occasional buffs and carry on being hard to get, having said that the team allowing that to happen maybe perhaps down to bad team dynamics.

health: - health is ok of you think hurdle or swift would be useless to you other than that you have heal aura
stam: - 3 slots is all thats worth having

psy mastery - this set i love, why blast one or two at a time and be hit back when you can try to control and forget about them for a while?
dominate: - ive got this 2 acc 3 hold 1 rechg iirc
mass hypno: 2 acc 1 end 3 rechg its a toggle dropper to many due to it being a sleep, chances are if they require 2 acc to hit they could be resistant to sleep or depending on what their buffed like are they?
mind over body: - whatever you feel necessary, i live all the psi res i can get but you wont see that much in pvp
telekin: - this is like gold imo 2 end slots 2 range (it has a wider cone then) and 2 rechg to get it back reasonably quick after someone has killed your anchor, not as good as a controllers telekinesis but i like it for defensiveness.

And HELLO VIXEN GIRL!

IMO any epic is useful for PVP or PVE i cant see how it matters. The epics are there for you to add to your build something you lack. Focused Accuracy isnt only +per which is helpful in order to tank but is also useful versus -tohit. There are so many secondary effects, ways of slotting and building a tanker it isnt actually easy without the key powers adequately slotted to really go wrong. The playstyle of the tanker to suit the team and the play of the team to suit the tanker is what really matters.
If you only had a trick archer for a defense set in the team you wouldnt play as though you had an empath would you?
What i am saying is you could have a basic build but if you and everyone else in the team plays to suit the type of defender in the team you are still capable of getting through the missions adequately enough.
Even, even level AVs can be tanked on passives that arent worth much with a good defender around. You can also tank and the team can play to not even need you to use most of the epics.
Its always handy imo as something personally favourable to me to have a -fly and a hold. I get them from my secondaries and my attack chain is comfortably there from my secondaries therefore i dont need to get into choosing an epic because it has this or that. Some people who play Firetanks have consume and stamina and yet still get conserve energy. Now they maybe saving on endurance slotting for another type of slotting but depending on their secondary would be whether or not i'd personally rather would of got for example char from pyre mastery because of my playstyle or so that they can solo sappers better rather than "needing" someones help. Only if i was /axe or /fire would i leave energy pool well alone because of my playstyle, as for all the others they can do just fine enough with any epic and a good "enough" gameplan.
People with their builds can cope with different epics in different ways.
I have gone Inv/ss/energy, and my other tanks will finish up ice/ice/ice, fire/fire/fire and stone/stone/stone and i have no doubt they can all get through the same stuff.
(Well okay im a little bit more worried about the firetanker in RV as it lacks def, hp and a panic button).

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Completely forgot about def penalty on invincibility, so tough hide is a good idea.

Invincibility is one which is definately not needed for a scrapper, seriously from my experience in PvP, your not going to have that many people around you and after you. Unless you plan on fighting mms all the time, just don't bother with it, its just an extra strain on endurance.

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The defence penalty is from unyielding which is actually less that 5%. Invincibility will negate that with one in melee and offer a tohit buff whereas tough hide won't. Tough hide also wont offer an increase in defence with additional foes in melee or range but at least it doesnt have an endurance cost even though invincibilities endurance cost is minor.

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I was bored at a certain point, so i made a full list of all my alts. Need a team or any form of help.. these are my characters:

CoH
(50)Sinergy X
(50)MaceX
(37)Mika.
(34)Encore
(26)DarkestNightX
(26)Sinergy X1
(24)Sinergy X3
(22)Sinergy XS
(19)Lira Lee
(13)SinergyX
(12)Hao Lee
(07)Lisa Williams
(02)Sinergy X2
(06)Brika Elfling
(01)SalvageKeeper
(12)Hanibi
(09)MikaX

CoV
(34)Sinester X
(32)NurishaX
(21)MaceX
(18)Hui Lee
(16)BroozerX
(12)Nina Williams
(07)DarkTerror

Wanted to add AT+set.. but then i had to back to work

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Dude are you really going to play all 24 of them? oh wait i think i also have 24 myself on 1 account alone...17 caped how sad is that? I so need a life.

Your right Jiaozy i spoke to Velvet Noir about it today (i needed to confirm because looks can be decieving) it takes just more than 1 hit and his attack rate is something like every 3 seconds at most and her additional survival comes from regen powers being perma because of haste and adrenalin boosts basically everything is always on hand she pretty much always has heals and superb regen. The always having a heal i find interesting.

This is going to be your second tanker and i'd hope you have some idea of how to play this tanker and keep aggro so that your health bar is the only one moving as much as possible, but personally i really cant see this build accomplishing that for much of the way. Rooted slows you and gives you no vertical movement so whilst your mezzed protected in order to keep your armours on and do your job you have no real decent means for recoveries ie a patrol you were not aware of shows up. Personally i'd have tp self in there early so that you can move fast when needed to gather mobs into your mudpots and taunt also in there early to save on the endurance of having to tp self into a small mob and by flyby taunt to rooted you can herd faster. Herded groups as you know make for faster kills and are better for keeping as many foes debuffed to add to yours and the teams survivability (until some numbnut kills the anchor that is). The haste and superpeed would most definately come later in order to accomplish the change and i'd perhaps go without one attack but atleast other people in the team can kill faster through multitargetting as opposed to people single targetting in their own private fights. Haste i see the point in and superspeed i guess would be superflous or conceptive but affordable.

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You need to take out Healing Aura from that equation. You can't really get close enough to the tank/scrapper to fire it without dying.

Don't forget that Hamidon hits a lot harder than an AV as well, although I'm not sure if you can simulate that.

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I've taunted hamidon his ranged attacks are alot harder than an av's ranged attacks but there is no one hitter. I think a scrapper is killed within 3 without heals thats less than 3 but more than 2 basically, a regen can think "omg everyone used their heal at the same time, i'll use my back up's" and with a stone he could be "everyone has used their heal at the sametime i am not +hp yet, my heal hasnt recharged" then more incoming damage happens and just as everyones heals are recharged he faceplants. The tanks lack of survivability less than a regens in a union hamidon i am willing to say could from empaths "healing at the sametime, not using absorb pain for extra heal under a regen aura blanket (which could be nice seeing as heal other is of long recharge against hamidon and compared to heal aura), not using buffs like adrenalin boosts to boost recharges and instead be afk with an auto clicked healother of which isnt even specified to maximum heal per second ie 3 recharge 3 heal. So despite seeing more survivability from a regen and dr rock's welcome maths i can see how and why a tanker should and could be good not to mention i've said what goes on in the healing team before. The faster adequate holds are applied the lower the dps of hamidon and its when you have the longer breaks between his attacks survivability really begins.

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Best person to ask for claws/invul for slotting would have to be dawnie, she knows her stuff

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I have a claws/sr with combat kick cos she is pve and concept and a inv/ss tank (pvp and pve valid i'd say).

I'm not too clued up in pvp (hoping to learn from you guys sometime) but i reckon i know my figures, i'll read what you pvp guys have said and come up with a build after.

My immediate thoughts are though:

01) --> Strike==> Acc(1) Acc(3) Dmg(7) Dmg(11) Dmg(15) EndRdx(37) claws is damage over time multitarget set, not high burst enough to get fast kills and with peoples methods of recovery could have longer fight durations hence the endurance slot - but i really havent got into pvp yet, claws i think is more amazing pve.

12) --> Follow Up==> Acc(12) Acc(37) Rechg(46) 3 dam if ever viable would also be nice here but for priorities

14) --> Super Jump==> Jump(14) i'd have a bind to toggle off this and use first attack cos i forget to turn it off so mine has an endurance in it.

20) --> Health==> Heal(20) Heal(48)hurdle for jump speed

24) --> Aid Other==> IntRdx(24)i like stimulant myself for pve clear the mind of the actual healer pve

28) --> Invincibility==> DefBuf(28) DefBuf(39) DefBuf(39) TH_Buf(40) TH_Buf(40) EndRdx(40) tohit buffs are worth about 20% of 5% each thats 1%, very little imo and with so much acc already in the rest of the build hardly worth it, endurance cost is low already, i'd check to see if more endurance couldnt be saved elsewhere. In a duel SR figures of defence (without elude) wont often do much either for not getting hit however worth keeping for pve imo.


30) --> Aid Self==> IntRdx(30) Rechg(43) Heal(43) Rechg(46) i'd go 2/3 int min with no defense or no real secondary effects in primaries (and you wont knock everything back without combat kick - which i use) and 1 recharge and 3 heal, interrupts should cut the action time to effect down.

35) --> Tough Hide==> DefBuf(35) DefBuf(36) DefBuf(36)each worth 20% of about 3.75 percent which is so little

38) --> Unstoppable==> DmgRes(38) DmgRes(39) Rechg(43) i think the res cap for scrappers is about 70%. With passives 1 res is enough in the case without passives its two, i find 3 recharges good. i dont mind unstoppable crashes whilst in pvp i might have less defeats overall if at all.

44) --> Focused Accuracy==> EndRdx(44) EndRdx(45) EndRdx(45) TH_Buf(45) TH_Buf(46) 3rd end redux is low reduction i would have 2 end 3 tohit

47) --> Energy Torrent==> Acc(47) Acc(48) Range(48) Dmg(50)its of less damage and higher end cost than laser eyes because the figures for damage are to be multiplied for multihitting and the endurance cost is divided for multihitting, more pve than pvp, laser eyes would be better unless you are after masterminds. oh wait shockwave then torrent then shockwave then torrent then eventually..who knows.

Try the build with 1acc, 1 end 3 dam 1 rechg with foc acc,
2 acc 3 dam 1 rechg or 2 acc 3 dam 1 end against blasters and scrappers basically and find out whats good and tell me cos i aint played around much pvp.

i've changed the look of your build to move imo wasted slots to make it less endurance hungry (because the build is).

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Level: 50
Archetype: Tanker
Primary: Invulnerability
Secondary: Energy Melee
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01) --> Temp Invulnerability==> DmgRes() DmgRes() DmgRes() EndRdx() EndRdx()
01) --> Barrage==> Acc() Acc() Dmg() Dmg() Dmg()
02) --> Dull Pain==> Rechg() Rechg() Rechg() Heal() Heal() Heal()
04) --> Bone Smasher==> Acc() Acc() Dmg() Dmg() Dmg()
06) --> Combat Jumping==> DefBuf() you can jump higher with sj on for a sec
08) --> Unyielding==> DmgRes() DmgRes() DmgRes() EndRdx()
10) --> Taunt==> Taunt() Taunt() Rechg() Rechg()
12) --> Swift==> Run()
14) --> Super Jump==> Jump()
16) --> Whirling Hands==> Acc() Acc() Rechg() Dmg() Dmg() Dmg()
18) --> Health==> Heal() Heal() Heal()
20) --> Stamina==> EndMod() EndMod() EndMod()
22) --> Invincibility==> DefBuf() DefBuf() DefBuf() Taunt()
24) --> Resist Energies==> DmgRes() DmgRes() DmgRes()
26) --> Tough Hide==> DefBuf() DefBuf() DefBuf()
28) --> Build Up==> Rechg() Rechg() Rechg()
30) --> Boxing==> Empty()
32) --> Unstoppable==> Rechg() Rechg() Rechg() DmgRes() EndMod()
35) --> Energy Transfer==> Acc() Acc() Rechg() Dmg() Dmg() Dmg()
38) --> Total Focus==> Acc() Acc() Dmg() Dmg() Dmg()
41) --> Tough==> DmgRes() DmgRes() DmgRes() EndRdx() EndRdx()
44) --> Weave==> DefBuf() DefBuf() DefBuf() EndRdx() EndRdx()
47) --> Conserve Power==> Rechg() Rechg() Rechg()
49) --> Laser Beam Eyes==> Acc() Acc() Dmg() Dmg()??? nuts to pass up stun for that
---------------------------------------------
01) --> Power Slide==> Empty()
01) --> Sprint==> Empty()
01) --> Brawl==> Empty()
02) --> Rest==> Rechg()
01) --> Gauntlet==> Empty()
---------------------------------------------

Still the total fight duration capability of this build is really low imo for soloing, i dont know if you get into all that attack chain stuff. I'd say energy pool is only good if you already have a hold or a stun in your secondaries to preoccupy a sapper for the duration you can drop him. For me this build would need stun and then i'd need to be in on the sapper quickly before he can do anything and id need taunt to flyby one group of malta away from another. Focused accuracy would allow you to take accuracies out of your attacks (but leave 1 acc per attack) and slot for endurance, if you wanted to exemp for a tf then you only have to swap the endurance slots for accuracies on the attacks you are to keep but i'd consider the enemies on the tf's when making judgements.

I find whatever is in the primaries should be enough for a tanker (unless your fire). Most tanks with tough and weave are gonna be buffed from defenders sets anyway facing an AV/mob or the AV/mob gets debuffed. If i want weave i'll buy lucks, if i want tough i'd buy sturdies meanwhile whilst i dont i can be more offensive whilst soloing, in pvp or in teams on the run of the mill usual missions.

If as a tanker you can make good pulls to remove chances of alphas (flyby taunts, herd bottlenecking etc), to allow defenders to begin debuffing without aggro, to allow people to multihit everything in safety (provide them with range and space) so that mobs die fast you dont have to worry too much about damage sustainability because mobs wont last long enough.

If i had a inv/em tanker it would look like Shannon she is fine solo and in teams i dont think anything needs to be feared except for someone having a noob moment. The SS would be swapped for EM id probably have 1 less secondary on favour of air superiority.

1) The more defensive a build becomes the less offensive it is so it fights for longer and takes hits for longer and so you needed that defense,
2) the less tools a tanker has (ie a -fly, holds or stun) the more awkward the enemy can be and so you need more defense,
3) the less skill with tanking to suit the defender you have in the team the more defense is required and finally
4) the less skilled team mates you have then the more prayers are required and on this last note i would most certainly have tough, weave and a ranged hold from an epic pool if that was always the case but id be solo and in pvp worse off.

Looks pretty much right to me, looking at the scrapper section as far as survivability and the line of immortality, it says what i think arcanaville has been saying about scrappers (at this time i dont know where this chart comes from btw).

But different scrappers survivability ratings change during different periods of fight duration and certainly against different enemies.

i think cryptic have their own way of working out survivability that no one has fully broken yet but as far as i am concerned this in practise rings true:

DA>Regen>Invuln>Super Reflex

providing your pretty damn good with the dark armour build and play.

Happy Birthday Raz!!

i hope its a special day for ya and drink all the alcopops you want cos they are lovely, in fact dont even share!

I do need a education in english dont i, even i have to imagine where the fullstops go etc.

In game versus enemies with tohit debuffs or high defence your blazing aura can miss and keep missing, you wont stand a a real good chance in aggroing them and keeping them on you unless you put accuracies in it. Ive done my tests and you can do yours by all means, whether its spectral daemons, tsoo sorcerors using hurricane or storm shamans using hurricane from the banished pantheons your ability to miss it pretty damn good. Blazing aura isnt autohit so accuracies like in anyother attack are worthwhile to keep aggro. One of my fire/ice tanker friends versus the levels he faces has gone and had to put 3 accuracies in blazing aura to keep aggro during the lvl 30-35 range, 2 wasnt enough so i'm told and i did see his aura missing, no damage = no taunt. I myself have 3 accuracies of the bat and since seeing that my aura was inaccurate versus tsoo whilst on TO's I will keep accuracies in it. i might drop down to 2 SO's from 3 for the "usual" and just buy the accs when i know i might need them.

If your in a situation where you dont get to taunt all through missing with blazing aura and the defender gets mullered good luck you can use attacks aoes will gauntlet what they can hit maximum and single target attacks will hit upto 5 with gauntlet if you hit someone, but its a small aoe and like i say upto 5, not necessarily 5. You could not necessarily hit anything and cause no gauntlet whatsoever and if you do hit something then the gauntlet duration is scaled to the endurance cost of the power not the damage so once taunt duration is over whoever does the most damage wins and the gauntlet duration is not much, it takes a constant string of attacking to keep foes preoccupied on you and for all of them attacks to hit. I think its poo personally and i would think tanks have been robbed of a truly decent inherent power when my heaviest attacks are recharging and i use my lighter ones to miss and have aggro stolen. i exemped to level 6 with my invuln and had serious (what i call serious) problems keeping aggro from the nova i was with.

I like taunt as it doesnt miss pve, when your out of endurance you can still gain aggro and when your tohit is floored you can still gain aggro. Face to face with something that can one hit you in melee or hit you lightly in range its nice to have and guarantees it will hit and taunt.

Stonetanks are the least maneuvreable and taunt is beneficial by saving on the endurance of tping around to recover fast foes into your mudpots that could otherwise wipe your team and taunt on a firetank is good to have something which is autohit when you cant hit a thing. The other two types of tankers are more greyer areas needing taunt less and your ability to tank exceedingly well will always be partially down to the team your with.

Believe me a fire/fire with no taunt is very tempting considering on what else is on offer in regards to being more fun but when i invite an empath to the team i wouldnt want to find out he only has heal aura and lots of weak blasts or be as useful as a flipper in the sahara desert and i do see some tanks in there 20's being just as useful as that. Telling me they cant start tanking till 26 or something with obvious build flaws as to why they cant.

Taunt as well as everything else gives a tanker more ability to tank under more varied conditions.

Please dont say this post is going to open up another can of worms please!! I should start saying "do what you like, if people like what you do and if you like what you do then good. If i was to ever team with you i'll be one way or the other from watching what happens.

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You're now talking about a completely different method of tanking Hamidon.

I'm not bashing Unions strategy, since we've had this argument already, but I don't think this method of tanking hamidon is as good as the method we use on Defiant. As I said, though, I don't want to go into that argument again.

In your first post, though, you made it sound like you were commenting on the Defiant method of tanking Hamidon (one tanker backed up by two empaths). In this method of tanking hamidon, a tanker is far better than a regeneration scrapper.

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I didnt mean to do that. I understand the hitpoint theory i use it on the defenders when i am tanking lvl 53 psionics. All they see is hitpoints and its all up to the defender to keep me standing (whilst kiting) then if they like their reputation i know they are on the ball.

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The more healing support you have the less regen rate matters and the more being just a big bag of hit-points helps.

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With 6 defenders on anyone as soon as the taunter takes a hit they all heal the taunter, then the taunter takes another whilst heals are recharging, ive seen tanks last a pretty long time but i've seen velvet noir just take it a hell of a lot further having reconstruction with its relatively fast recharge must of been useful. The heal of reconstruction adding hitpoints as frequently as its needed. Empaths dont get close enough to use auras because hamidons attacks are aoe's, its suicide but it shouldnt make too much difference to the calculations unless fight time is considered length of time between almost 0 healthpoints to time it takes to be healed plus recharge of heals. Also i dont know how you set all the settings but every time i set it 1 AV with or without support fight duration changes, health changes, removal of kheldians etc but i still get regeneration outgunning stonetanks for regen is your fight duration set to something like 10 seconds whilst mine is 300 or what? What i will say is that from looking at sherks herobuilder this morning at healthpoints and regen everything did look to swing in the stonetanks favour. Just in practise what i dont see from some other empaths in the team is use of absorb pain or buffs and healother is used when its not needed due to it being on auto (which i never did).

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It really helps to know where this build lies on the solo <----> team spectrum.

I'd agree with teleport tho. Concept reason I suppose?. Helps to know if any particular powers wanted for concept reasons.

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??? from what ive said it wont matter.

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After healing the taunter in 3 or 4 hamis i still think regen scrappers were easier.

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In which issue? Union have done one Hamidon raid post-i6, which they used this strategy for. Your experiences just aren't relevant any more.

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The level of damage hamidon hits with in one attack is less than the hp of a scrapper without the +hp but its frequency of attacks is what has to be countered against, a one off +hp heal every so and so and some regen is not as good as regen, + hp +reconstruction + ih even in this issue. The level of damage and frequency of damage hasnt changed. When it comes to healing oneself against unresistable damage regens cant be competed with and that helps.

The damage is unresistable so go make a stonetanker on dr rocks coh/cov comparison chart make a stonetank with rooted, no resists just health, haste and earths embrace and then make a regen scrapper with all its heals, no resists, health and haste and read the figures for sustainable damage. For me even in practice it stands out as completely obvious.

I'm not saying tankers arent good enough hell no, if half the afk healers in the hami tank werent afk with heal other on auto and actually used their +regen + recharge buffs, the tanks should of been better off, a whole lot more so stone tanks.

To prove to me that regens arent better dealing with untyped damage is going to take some maths from you and not "ooh your experiences just arent valid anymore" but whatever works works and the more lag the better to ensure it.

One thing i will say is that had stone tanks been as buffed as they could and should of been, i could be agreeing with you as hp recovered per tick would of been greater and if more empaths under a blanket of regen aura had absorb pain then well i think the prospects would be amazing.

I'm finding the idea of you picking teleport over something like haste and superspeed or combat jump and superjump curious but all that slotting in combat jump??? those slots would of gone straight into my attacks so i spend less times in mobs.

Some of it is dissimilar to how i've planned my icetank but id much rather get remarks from those who have lvl 50 ones than make anymore.

Well ok just 1 more, rather than all that slotting in frozen fists, icicles would have more love for one with damage slots as it effects upto 10 at a time doing 10 times the damage it says in herobuilder, just think about that anyway.

As a firetank leaping pool is the easiest way to go, you might want acrobatics for better quality of life although missions with a severe amount of knockbacks in them can actually be avoided but only for so long. Hover is okay providing your okay with it but most i already know people arent. I am convinced you can make an effective firetank from one with hover and flight pool but that wont be as easy.

As a stonetanker TP self imo is best as it helps you get around better whilst having to keep rooted on.

For ice or invuln you the choice is more a matter "suits you sir!" but you get extra defence from combat jump or more hp more often from haste.

Fire/fire eats xp still imo. I stuck all my tanks on test made non team tanks out of them (not suited for all/most enemies) with a completely selfish build and tried them. The fire/fire cleaned up the same level set sized mob as my other tankers, in half the time, for half the endurance but had less hp left at the end of the fight. Its probably the most fun tank to solo with if you like complete carnage with orange figures flying everywhere. My ingame tank is less destructive at the moment as id actually like to tank.

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Were you physically just standing there? With lots of endurance? If so, that would explain it possibly. If you were actually taunting, actively holding aggro, etc, and noticably doing something, indicating you didn't have time to attack, then I agree, they're idiots.

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Taunting is a bit hard atm since i havent gotten it yet (not hit 10 yet) but running around like a crazy person keeping everyone affected by my taunt aura and keeping punchvoke up is hard work at that lvl...

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At this level with lack of slotting because your preparing your armours and heals for when you hit 12 gauntlet is pretty poor. Its duration is endurance related of which /ice tanks are low on end consumption. Your doing your best to use aura to hold 10 probably on a team that doesnt probably allow you to consolidate and hold aggro easily. If the team cant see that then your better off without them. Kicking you for that is just noobish imo. My experiences have been different all my tanks but my invuln took taunt at lvl 4 when they could but you cant so it cant always be easy. Relying on your aura to do something effective may require you to hover it over a foe for upto 2 seconds not always easy on teams that cause groups to splinter either. Im just glad i never had to wait to 10 for taunt.

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also for the taunt team, would regen scrappers with a taunt power be useful, i know they dont have as much HP but being regen means they are best for surviving hami attacks, and all scrapper sets do have a single target taunt in them.
just a suggestion

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From my experience as a healer to the hami taunter regen scrappers are ten times better than a tank and yes ive been in the hami tank team a few times.

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Can a regen scrapper get 3000+ HP when entering the bubble? No. Tanks are better. All you need for a hami-tank is a lot of HP nowadays, and tanks have way more than a scrapper. Regenners used to be used when IH was a toggle, since it was possible to perma dull pain and then tank hamidon with no support whatsoever. Since IH and DP can no longer do that, real tankers are way better.

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From my experience as a hami tank healer I agree fully with Shannon: regens scrappers are better than tankers thanks to the regen. Yes, having loads of HP helps, but only so much. However, I wasn't on Jiaozy's raid and I don't know how taunting was done on his version so my experiences are solely from the 'typical' raids.

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The regen means nothing when you have 3 empaths spamming Heal Other on you. The reason that regen was used pre-i5 was because they could tank hamidon with no support. Now, they need support to be able to do it so having more HP is more important than having more regeneration. Tankers get more HP, and so are better.

Look at the track record in i6 on Defiant. We used to use Mr ?, a claws?/regen scrapper to tank. Moving him into the bubble used to take at least 3 attempts, even with 10+ PA droppers grabbing the aggro. Don't forget, this is i5/6, so PA actually worked. He used to die a few times during the raid as well, causing problems for the clearing/holding groups.

Now lets look at the track record for when we've used Novocaine, an Invulnerability/EM Tank. Number of deaths moving him into the bubble? 0. Number of deaths during a raid? 0. Not only that, but we back him up with two Empaths usually, rather than the 5+ that Mr ? used to have.

I'm not saying that Mr ? and his team are bad players, as player skill isn't a factor in this. All the whole tank team has to do is green ring one power and keep firing it. Occasionally the Empaths have to group up for RA so they don't run out of end, but really that doesn't take any skill at all. Those are the facts. Tanks are better than Scrappers at tanking Hamidon at the current time. In the past Scrappers may have been better, but that is not the case now.

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It wasnt so much the regeneration but reconstruction helped and i dont know about defiant hami raids but on union you would have 6 empaths and only 3 then were not afk merely spamming heals at times when its not needed. You soon find out about whose afk when you have to move left and they stayed where they were. Also when it come to buffing the taunter they werent bothering when they should of. I soon knew who id wouldnt want supporting me i can tell ya.

A tank with a +hp heal and aid self maybe the better idea than thinking rooted would be THAT good.

After healing the taunter in 3 or 4 hamis i still think regen scrappers were easier.

I will say though jiaozys last raid was impressive and the amount of actual game time involved was good 15 minutes i believe which is quite possibly the least we have seen healing a taunter in that amount of lag would or could be easier as our reaction times wouldnt need to be as fast.

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also for the taunt team, would regen scrappers with a taunt power be useful, i know they dont have as much HP but being regen means they are best for surviving hami attacks, and all scrapper sets do have a single target taunt in them.
just a suggestion

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From my experience as a healer to the hami taunter regen scrappers are ten times better than a tank and yes ive been in the hami tank team a few times.

well anyway the toggles are or were afaik 12.5% def, 3% of 12.5% is:

12.5% / 100 * 3% = .375%

dread to think what the 4th slot on the passives offers...

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when I slotted mine, i went for as MUCH as I could within the ED limit, 4th slot only giving 25%, thereafter 5%, that 25% to my view still adds up over passives and toggles combined. But that's my opinion and so far works alot better for me than all 3 slot, as an extra 25% does all add up.

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Raz if you said 3rd slot giving 25% and thereafter 3% i wouldnt be confused. But, it looks to me like your mixing up the 3rd slot with the 4th and the schedule B enhancements with schedule A because you said 5% thereafter and not 3% thereafter. You either may of had too many late nights:P or! had too many late nights

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60% cap and 4 SO = 59%

small lowering of the 4th SO (25% or so) but overall still worth it, and helps cs higher ACC sumtimes ive found.

anything over 4 is a waste.

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what 60% cap?

Primaries are most essential on a scrapper imo. Just having enough to do maximum damage over time with minimal misses within a good enough attack chain is enough though. Although 3 slotting toggles for defence a very good move but only when you can stop buying T0's.

If you have slots to spare (as in not worth spending elsewhere) then add 2 slots to the passives by the same token if you cant add an extra 2 slots per passive then it maybe possible your overslotting somewhere like do you need all that travel power, all that recharge etc most of the time?

By managing 4 slots on any secondary you arent going to gain much survivability. Not as much as you would by first 3 slotting all defences, slotting 3 health, slotting 3 slots in combat jump even, having 6 slotted aid self with between 5 - 6 slots in all the attacks needed to make up a viable attack chain, nicely slotted power pools and epics for utility. I certainly find it very hard to see where i can add a 4th slot in any of my secondaries and most certainly would be a case of seriously not finding no matter how hard i tried somewhere better.

A 4th slot in added to the 3 toggles and the 3 passives would add .6% to .7% to defence to all it can and 6 slots for that i just wouldnt find worth it.

Mine works okay, i can only imagine maybe you had them on stay or something.