Lady_Miri

Hey folks.. Silly thought.. so a Scrapper takes Weapon Mastery and uses the Targeting Drone... but they have also been around long enough to get the Combat Pet Vet rewards... and took the Shield or Power Drone powers?

Now has two disco balls dancing around!

*grin*

Nifty.. Nem Staff and Blackwand. Will be neat on my Natural characters, but I'm afraid I'm going to have to put my two cents in with the rest of em. Why the repeat? There are many many cool temp powers out there that they could offer instead.

Nova way back when used to disorent the caster. They changed that thankfully.

You got him Tal! Hold him still while I give him this Thorzine shot!

<.<
>.>

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Patron Powers

Villians got some nasty powers for pvp. They can also acess several froms of web grenades (one being a hold, another an AoE Immobilize), which is brutal with -recharge, -speed, -fly, and -jump if the status effect doesn't get ya. All archtypes can get a pet as well.

What I don't understand is why Stalkers get Snipes. I can see them getting a medium blaster attack (i.e. Slug) or a heavy damage attack (hello 20 footers!), but not snipes. That takes abilities away from other ranged villians against powers such as hurricane or force bubble. But I doubt they will crit from hide or there will be a lot of very angry corrupters.

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I PMd Castle asking fore some reassurance that Stalker Snipes would NOT be better then a Blasters and this is his response.

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The Sniper Blast Stalkers get is less than half the base damage of Blaster Snipe attacks, so with Criticals they are almost as good.


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So yes they will be able to crit from hide after a BU but we still have BU and AIM.

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Just a minor aside, how long did it take for you to get a response from Castle after you PM'd him? I send him a couple around noon PST regarding the 75% redundancy of the Dominator Patron Pools and I've still not gotten a peep from the guy.

Maybe I should put 'Stalker' in the subject, he seems to pay attention to that stuff.

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Got lucky and he must have logged on just after I sent it.. abotu half an hour.

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Patron Powers

Villians got some nasty powers for pvp. They can also acess several froms of web grenades (one being a hold, another an AoE Immobilize), which is brutal with -recharge, -speed, -fly, and -jump if the status effect doesn't get ya. All archtypes can get a pet as well.

What I don't understand is why Stalkers get Snipes. I can see them getting a medium blaster attack (i.e. Slug) or a heavy damage attack (hello 20 footers!), but not snipes. That takes abilities away from other ranged villians against powers such as hurricane or force bubble. But I doubt they will crit from hide or there will be a lot of very angry corrupters.

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I PMd Castle asking fore some reassurance that Stalker Snipes would NOT be better then a Blasters and this is his response.

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The Sniper Blast Stalkers get is less than half the base damage of Blaster Snipe attacks, so with Criticals they are almost as good.


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So yes they will be able to crit from hide after a BU but we still have BU and AIM.

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Another complaint: Why does consume drain so much less endrurance than it's Energy and Ice counterparts? You gain enough back, but it takes very little from the enemys.

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Don't they recharge faster?

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Yes, the end drains from Ice and Energy armor have a recharge of 60 sec. to Fire 180 sec. I'm not sure how that's fair.

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Do the Ice and EA versions deal damage?

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we lost out an equal or greater percentage of our defense. THAT is what I was refering to.


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Let's look at survivability. Let's use ACTUAL NUMBERS . "Pitiful" is rhetoric, Concern. "You don't want to go down that road" is rhetoric. "Doesn't count" is rhetoric. (A buff that you needed is still a buff. A buff that you deserved is still a buff. You didn't have it and then you did.)

Assuming that "1" is someone with no Defense, no Damage Resistance, no nothing. [A Blaster "1" is lower than a Scrapper "1" but all my ratios are Blaster:Blaster and Scrapper:Scrapper.]

Assume that we're fighting something with 65% chance of hitting.

I4 Blasters, with Hover, Stealth, and perma-Hasten [Note that this is different from CJ/Stealth/Hover- it actually makes your argument better]: 17.5% Defense unslotted, 21% single-slotted, and with four "extra" slots in Stealth, 27% Defense.

So they would go from getting hit 65% of the time to 38% of the time.

So they had survivability of 1.7 against this particular badguy.

I6 blasters now [with the same three powers] have 2.5+2.5 = 5% unslotted, 6% with one slot, and with four extra slots [evenly split] they have 8% Defense.

So that 65% badguy is now hitting 57% of the time. And the new Blaster has 18% more hit points.

The new Blaster survivability is (65/57)* 1.18 or 1.34 .

1.34/1.7 is 79%: the I6 Blaster will live 4/5 as long against those enemies as an I4 Blaster.

Now the Scrapper- I use Invulnerability because I know those numbers best- went from an I4 survivability of about 25 to an I6 number of about 5. [I used to say 18 and 3 but Arcanaville pointed out the effects of Dull Pain.]

A Scrapper now can survive 20% as long as a Scrapper then.

To rephrase: you kept about 80% of your defensive survivability and lost 20%.

We kept 20% and lost 80%.

So, Blastermaster, "lost out an equal or greater percentage of our defense" is just, plain, wrong. Even if my math is off by a lot, it's still wrong.

By the way, feel free to point out any flaws in my math. I'm willing to discuss my numbers and correct any errors. That's why I showed my work.

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Note.. hasten does not provide a +def bonus so why bother listing it? Also I can't tell from your numbers posted but you would be better off ignoring Stealth. Once you attack and it suppresses you loose the +defense bonuses it provides. (you would have to have a stealth power in your secondary to keep your +def bonuses).

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So you want it for free?

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No, no, no. I'm just countering those who were worried about some SGs being too small to benefit. It was a happy post, not a whiny one.

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Aye, My apologies. After I posted and read a few later posts I relized that but didn't have time to change my post (shh don't tell the boss!)

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Total Cost for working Salvage storage and a working Empowerment Station: 130,000 Prestige

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7 members at 20,000 bonus Prestige per member = 140,000 Prestige

Minimum number of members necessary to achieve this: 7.

Devs' idea of a small SG: seven members.

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So you want it for free? If you are a two man or solo SG then you have to make some hard choices on what your going to purchase first. At least you don't have to purchase a generator and control elements AND the room to put those in first.

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Do you know where it would be imposslbe to use? 1v1...but wait!!! PvP isn't so supposed to be about 1v1 is it? So why is Castle trying to protect 1v1 only for Stalkers? This is the real impact of a dual range check. It kills AS for repeated use in 1v1 battles when someone knows a stalker is present.

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Oh, if a Stalker misses with AS, Hide drops. What happens when a Stalker's hide drops? Why don't we start simple, and walk through the argument here.

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They run away..

updated my previous post but I saw it was a few pages back..

PvE minions grant 214 HPs, Bosses gave 428.

A friendly stalker stood still long enough for me to kill and then Stygianed Returned and she gave me 291. Gonna have to go find a PvE Lt to compare.. Belah.. as if a warshade didnt have enough problems in PvP with needing corpses.

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So unless they have changed it in the meantime a Player is considered a boss.. which means its 15% for a scrapper crit.

[/ QUOTE ] No. Players are NOT considered bosses, evidenced by the fact that a SINGLE hold still holds anyone without status protection...AND....my hero stats does not report 15% for crits in PvP.

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Maybe I should have been a little more specific..

PCs are considered bosses for power effects like criticals and stygian circle heals.

I will have to see if I can't talk one of my friends into meeting me in a PvP zone so I can check the stygian circle thing there.

Update: Went to Sirens with my warshade and got a friendly stalker to sit still for me..

Out in pve a minion gives me 214hps while a boss gave me 428. The stalker gave me 291.. so I guess it did get changed.

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As far as I can tell, the prerequisites for a Scrapper's Crit... is.. erm...


[/ QUOTE ] is umm... a 5% chance of working. Really really reliable in PvP...absolutely have to have that as a scrapper to PvP. God...I couldn't survive without that 5%.



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Sidenote. Back when arenas first opened I took my warshade into it and actually managed to get a Stygian Circle pulled off on a defeated PC. I got boss level health from it. So unless they have changed it in the meantime a Player is considered a boss.. which means its 15% for a scrapper crit. More if the attacking power gets a bonus to crit chance.

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I don't see why there needs to be such a stricture that already has the limitations of snipe in addition to the need to be close enough to hit.

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Snipes also don't hit someone for 3/4 to 4/5 of their HPs or drop a toggle. Seems to me that AS still comes out ahead.

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I think that power push has the kinda range that we as blasters want. Granted power push is only good for KB, but it does have quite a range on it. I honestly think, that if all blaster attacks had that kinda range on them , the blaster community would be happy with the results. If you add just one range SO, and add Boost Range Buff to it., you can hit a target from quite a distance. It's almost like a snipe attack, except less powerful.

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Taking range to the extreme one day way back in the days of the old 50% HOs I decided on a whim to test my max range. My snipe was 6 slotted with damage/range HOs and I did not have boost range. I was able to snipe greys farther and farther away until finally I couldn't see things anymore. So I got a friend of mine to join my group and she would go stand next to a critter and target it. I would then target her and fire.. from outside my (at the time 400/400 50k graphic settings) draw range. We were giggling and chortling till the Fake Nemisis she was phaseshifed next to and targeting turned around and slammed me with his staff.. from that far away.

I think she picked the Fake on purpose.. cause it sure wasn't grey!

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I tend to focus on single targets in groups, as I only have one AoE attack (energy/energy). Since I focus on one target at a time, it rarely happens that I bite off more than I can chew, unless I decide to go into the melee battle, in which case I probably wasn't to concerned with surviving to begin with.


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Eng/Eng myself. Usually I'm pretty safe also since I'm mostly single targeting and the few who do pull away promply get Bone Smashed, Energy Punched, and then Total Focused in that order.

Maybe Defiance needs a big Defiance XXX orangy to float up so we can see it in action along with an extra line in the battle spam stating how much extra damage we are doing cause we are being Defiant.

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I think Defiance is the Dev's "fix" for Blasters' secondaries.

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I HOPE TO GAWD THAT WAS A JOKE !!!!!!!!!!

/em head explodes right into orbit

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I feel the same way. Castle is going over the Blaster stuff right now and I am willing to wait and see what he says, even if I fear his two most common responses will be 'As intended' and 'Would require an animation change which we don't have the manpower/time for'.

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I tend to run unyielding actually, so groups of 5 yellow/orange. And sonics don't have heals either. But that's not the point. If the defender wants to keep me out of the red, that's their perogative. The point is that the inherent ability can be used strategically, and very effectively.


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So when your running the razors edge and in the red, how do you handle the critters when you pull the aggro (and you will sooner or later) of a boss or LT (or minions if you drop a big AoE on them)off the tank or scrapper? By the time you see them turn and pull out their gun its already too late, their attack is qued and resolved your just waiting for the animation to finish.
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So it didn't work out as well as hoped. But the point is they went through the effort to organize a place where everyone could leave feedback for them. If you really think that asking for feedback is completely different from asking for an opinion, then I guess we will just have to agree to disagree.

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Dev: Miri, whats your opinion on Defiance?
Me: It sucks, dump it.

Dev: Miri, can we get some feedback on Defiance please?
Me: It sucks, heres why. Blah blah blah. Perhaps change it to do bleh bleh bleh.

Opinion doesn't have supporting data, and anything you try to prove without data backing it up as fact I will take as 'your opinion' Hence why I included Statesmans quotes about the various changes.

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I take everything the devs say at face value. So no, I wasn't upset. I can see how many would feel it was misleading, but I also remember when Statesman not only explained why he made the error, but then also apologized. Since he's just a person, I can't really expect him never to make mistakes. Beyond that, since he has clearly learned from said mistakes (hence the apology here), I hold no ill will towards him for it.


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Aye, no one is perfect and even the great Statesman makes mistakes. I can live with that. However some of their mistakes were on test, we pointed it out to them and they did not allow it to go live.

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My regen is still my most powerful scrapper defensively (50 BS/SR, 31 BS/SR, 37 kat/reg), and is without a doubt in my mind still better off than any of my other scrappers. So since after the continued changes the set is still really powerful relative to the other sets, I can't say I have a problem with it at all.


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I find it hard to believe your level 37 regen scrapper who doesn't have access to his level 38 Moment of Glory is better off defense wise then your level 50 Super Reflexs Scrapper with access to Elude. If that is the case then perhaps their Regen tweaks are not complete yet?

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You mean they listened to the feedback and changed the power based on said feedback? Jerks!


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Feedback is not an asked for opinion, feedback is asked for player made data.. or facts.

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My blaster (at level 42) uses defiance very effectively roughly every third spawn when soloing. It's not my fault if the majority of the blaster community can't stop complaining long enough to try to use it strategically. Or maybe I'm just really good. But I tend to think the former is more likely.


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Soloing 3 (lets say your good enough to run on invincible) red con minions is vastly different then trying to handle the aggro from 5.. 6.. maybe even more yellow+ con critters in a mid to large team spawn. Every defender except a Force Field and Trick Arrow has some kind of heal other power. Short of being suicidal and doing what Statesman said ('Want to build up defiance? Maybe run in and get some aggro before the tank does. Or perhaps tell the defenders NOT to heal you.') Every one of those defenders is going to do their damdest to keep you out of the yellow or red.

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Just one incident? Developer Response Threads

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I quote Cuppa,
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Good, constructive feedback from testing the changes. Including any testing data you have gathered. Do not respond to other posters - let your post stand on its own.


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No where in there is it asking for an opinion. In fact they don't want it hence the request to not respond to another poster, our post has to have the strength to stand on its own. They are asking the million other monkeys to write Hamlet because they only have 25 chimpanzees who are making the quills. They are asking us to find the problems and point them out. They will then make their own fixes.

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It's still a step up IMO. We need to take damage either way and it stays in States' vision. At least this way we could keep our health up, get healed etc and not see our inherint bar instantly vanish. The risk being the damage that could potentially kill us the reward being us standing up in Defiance of their onslaught and laying waste to them.

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Ah ok now I understand what your saying. As we take damage our defiance bar goes up, however instead of instantly dropping when we get healed (inspiration or another player) it would slowly decay like Fury or Domination does. Now THAT is an Idea that I like. Mind you I don't like a damage based inherint an a defenseless AT but I don't forsee them changing defiance to something other then that (being damage based).

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ANY inherint that is team or solo biased is flawed.

Gauntlet
Vigilance
Cosmic Balance
Dark Sustenance

Those only do good on teams and are useless outside of them. Every other inherint works the same in a team as solo.

The last thing we should do is encourage the devs to make more inherints that only do any good on a team.

I still vote for a blaster version of fury. However, instead of it building every time you attack/are attacked, it builds as you take hits but is NOT health dependant. So if you drop some health you don't lose the bar. However, it'd drain just as quickly as fury, so to keep your damage up you have to be taking damage. So the risk is there that to use your inherint you need to be under fire, and the reward is increased damage output.

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I don't think any inherint that is team based is flawed, it just happens that those ATs work BETTER in a team and as such their inherint reflects that. Remember the Devs have been pushing for us to Team since pretty much launch.

Now what I DO have a problem with is an inherint that is based on damage recieved, on an AT that has almost NO defenses against said damage. Once that damage starts coming in there is almost no way to stop it except kill the ones dealing it, problem is that there is a good chance the critter already has another attack qued so even if we manage to get our attack off in the short span we are still alive, the killing blow is in route to us. To say nothing of if we aggro a group and they all turn and fire on us.

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I've been reading the dev digest since around issue 2's release. I've never had a problem with any dev conduct that I have seen.


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So you had absolutly no problem with the fact that Statesman said 'No more major power changes'. And then they went and implimented ED. That may not be a major power change, but it is a fundemtal change to how the powers act.

So you had no problem when Statesman stated that 'We are going to be making some minor tweaks to regen' and they have been making changes in the set in almost every issue since?

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Or, I agree with the changes made?
I have personally found it to be the case that with nearly every change this game has seen, the end result has been a more fun play experience for me. Therefore, when States says they're looking into it, I trust him.


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How many of those changes have directly affected you besides ED? You have one hero listed and he is a BS/SR scrapper, how many times have you felt the sting of the nerf bat?

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They can care what we think. That means they ask for our opinions, and give us info, and then a place to respond to said info (like this thread for instance). They can even prioritize their development schedules based on what we say.

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They have not once asked for our opinion on any matter. Any time a question about some power has come up they look at the datamine, come to a decision and then look at the boards as an afterthought.

Demo of scrappers taking on hordes of critters and laying waste to them and using that as their baseline. Only after players crying foul did they take a closer look and relize 'Oh.. sorry.. that was an internal build that has a few differences from live'

Stealth Nerf. Was all set to go live when we had to raise the point of how easy it would be for someone to grief a team with an AoE stealth. The didn't impliment that change to live.

The KB Ragdoll caper. They put in ragdoll and thanks to an unintended bug KB actually has POWER now. Forum goes had been quite vocal about their pleasure with Ragdoll and I saw a few KB related posts. They then IMPLIMENT the fix ignoring the howls of anger and the complaints that KB is even worse then it was before (KBd critters standing up while IN the air). It then takes the better part of a month for a code reversion to come back to live with the 'buggy' ragdoll.

Defiance. The only compliments I've heard about it have been from low level characters. It's as if they didn't bother to test it with higher level blasters who simply can NOT take the risk of running in the yellow or red to get the boost. They even had to come back after the fact and change the point in which bonuses accrue because it wasn't being used, after we the forum community raised holy hell about it.

Please point out to me an incident where they 'Asked our opinion' about a matter.

Defiance currently gives +dam and +acc as we get beat down. The problem is that in the later game we do not get to use it that often cause we can't take more then a couple solid hits from even a minion. My proposel is to add +recovery, +recharge and +defence to defiance.

Then as we get beat down and get closer and closer to defeat we can be stronger, faster, better. They have the technology, they have the capability. We can be that Offensive Juggernat we were billed as!

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I apologize. The change should take effect in the next full build. I thought the latest patch was a full build but I was wrong.

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Yeah no problem. Figure it will go up on test server in a day or four and then live a week or so after.. I think I can manage to NOT go tone deaf in that time..