Kanto2

I find it a bit hard to try using game mechanics into RP.

There's several flame powered characters in comics and they don't go about killing people. Intimidation comes first to mind, aking to Torch of the Fantastic 4.

He usualy traps non powered villains in cages, or strikes the fear with fiery displays but doesn't lob a 'fireball' at a mugger's face.

Unfortunatly we lack that, and NPCs do not surrender so we have to pummel them, which would mean a Torch from the Fantastic 4 coming to CoH *would* have to 'fireball' a mugger in the face to stop him.

Even so there's the question of strength applied. Strength and skill. Who ever has played NWN know the bane of teams were over eager wizards throwing fireballs and scorching everyone, friend and foe.

But not the good wizards, the ones who had an eye for the radius of spels and would throw the fireball just to that it would explode way behind so that the explosion would just so lick an enemy's back and not touch the fighter battling it.

By that who ever thinks a fireball *must* have a 20' radius or a rain of fire *must* be 40' wide with napalm like rain falling and consuming everything to the bone isn't going at it right, IMO.

Powers and spells can be toned down just like a practised brawler can jab at someone's plexus or knee someone on the face. Pain is a great deterrant (which unfortunatly isn't coded in). Most people would give up after getting whacked a few times or having every hair on their body singed by a controlled fireball.

In CoH we must continue until they are down.

I really doubt a majority of people (even the darker heroes of which there was a fair representation in this tread) would go about gleefuly killing every single encounter.

Personally I could never get into the Spider-man/Batman thing of capturing a known mass murderer, putting him in jail, he escapes, murders dozens of people, is caught, sent back in again.

It would be against their backstory to kill and I would not want them to do so as it rather gritty to do so, but I value an hero as someone who makes sacrifices for the greater good.

Staining one's soul by killing that maniac (Joker/Green Goblin) so that dozens, hundreds of innocents are not would qualify as heroic in my humble opinion.

Political Correctness and inflated moral views of our modern day thinking does not apply. Rules only work if both sides are using them and when we get to the point that one side says 'Don't kill, it's against the Law! It's imoral!' and the other side is poisoning by the hundreds or setting city wide bombs, then something *is* wrong.

Is the moral high ground worth more than hundreds of people's lifes?

By this I won't even go into the thing of heroes killing, but the State, with mass murderers in their power, are happy to send to them to jail (where they have escaped dozens of times) instead of giving a trial (without the BS of 'he's insane, so it's not his fault, lets not give him the death penalty') and getting rid of those cancers.

This would apply to CoH as well. *Some* groups are just so evil and dangerous that wiping them out is what? A favor done to the rest of the world?

Comic book heroism wouldn't really work in a more 'realistic' setting. I'm claiming CoH realistic simply because a large number of people play it, giving it that human spark which is lacking from comics where it's as much as being populated by NPCs doing what one person (the writer) tells them so.


Word Tread's being too serious and I'm not helping.

Interesting numbers there, it's food for though.

Interestingly as well, according to Sherk's planner, Shriek is rated as Minor damage and does 2.7 by the brawl index. Howl is marked as High damage.. and does 2.3.

Granted that it is a AoE cone, but High damage and less that the Minor attack?

Now I'm a bit torn about the whole Assault thing. The return seems poor. Though I wouldn't pick Howl because it is an Aoe who would draw agro, this char being more about being support and helping, not blasting, I'd might pick Shout sooner. With its 10 second recharge it wouldn't quite be a chain attack coupled with the other two, but a dead enemy is no longer a threat and Shout's damage would help killing something faster.

Hmm, is it just me or is assault not really worth having considering the constant endurane drain?

I confess the calculations kind of passed over my head. Something like a fulled slotted brute doing 100 dmg and with Assault it would be 105 dmg instead?

Whereas with -res if 100 dmg it would be.. ?

I went for Sherk's Planner and it seems to be more actualised and informative. The numbers seems promising and having Dispersion Bubble at 20 is glorious for me By 22 just me and one of those friends I conned into joining me should cap the res of a whole team, even a brute who is supposed to be at 90%.

Thanks for everyone's answers

P.S. seems Assault is 18.5% for a corruptor, so just between us two we are boosting almost 40$ of the team's damage, the -res not included.

Many thanks It's just what I was looking for as figures. I remember Clarity being mentioned as only used when over Warbugb, it should've tipped me off that if it was available at 20.... Right O

It doesn't change too much my plans though. Sonic Siphon I originally intended as 2 accuracies and 2 recharge but by level 40 I was overflowing with slots and not quite sure where to spend them, so I added many 'useless' slots around. You reckon one endurance reduction? 240 seconds inbetween means I don't have to lay them down *too* often.

I'll see how it goes and remember your advice.

Knowing the -res of attacks was a *great* help as well, and exactly why I posted on the forums hoping for answers. With what you've told it seems I would gain more in tweaking my powers and add more attacks for the stacking. Pity the single attacks are but three, but with those three I might be able to stack enough (it's also a good thing to decide an attack chain, such as start with the one who lasts longer and then work down. Or perhaps use the first as a preparation for the others).

Perhaps shave one accuracy and put recharge if I am to play with Tactics. Not sure I really want to have that one, but I reckoned it wouldn't hurt.

My ice/kin had Tactics and Assault but I respecd out as it drained my endurance too much (she's very very blastery).

This character here is meant more obviously for support than blasting (or such is the concept), which means more laying back, shielding, healing, keeping Disruption up and targetting through someone to lower the res.

I convinced two friends to play with me. If we stick to it, three sonics laying shields and siphons and Disruptions and Assault and -res from attacks... ^_^

Le sigh. European forums really are dead. Do so wish I could post on the US forums instead.

That can be arranged ^^


01 : Sonic Siphon recred(01) recred(3) Empty(3) Empty(39) recred(42)
01 : Shriek acc(01) acc(5) dam(7) dam(9) dam(11) recred(37)
02 : Scream acc(02) acc(5) dam(7) dam(9) dam(11) recred(37)
04 : Sonic Barrier damres(04) damres(15) damres(17)
06 : Sonic Haven damres(06) damres(15) damres(17)
08 : Assault endred(08) endred(40)
10 : Aid Other hel(10) hel(13) hel(13) inttim(21) inttim(21) recred(39)
12 : Hasten recred(12) recred(27) recred(27)
14 : Super Speed runspd(14)
16 : Disruption Field endred(16) endred(40)
18 : Aid Self hel(18) hel(19) hel(19) inttim(23) inttim(23) recred(40)
20 : Hurdle jmp(20)
22 : Health hel(22)
24 : Stamina endrec(24) endrec(25) endrec(25)
26 : Clarity Empty(26)
28 : Shout acc(28) acc(29) dam(29) dam(34) dam(37) recred(39)
30 : Tactics thtbuf(30) thtbuf(31) thtbuf(31) endred(31)
32 : Dreadful Wail dam(32) dam(33) dam(33) acc(33) acc(34) disdur(34)
35 : Sonic Dispersion damres(35) damres(36) damres(36) endred(36)
38 : Resuscitate recred(38)
41 : Amplify recred(41) recred(42) recred(42)

Pros : You can wade in and tear down through missions. You'll survive great since mobs go for your henchies first (just don't make the mistake of attacking first, lett the henchies go first).

Cons : Boringly easy. I've stopped my MM at 33 because it's just too dull even at the highest difficulty. Soloing is fun at first but pretty soon you'll be wanting teams just for the added danger, something to keep you awake, eh?

Point, click, dead. Point, click, dead. She's pretty much my most powerful char but I can fall asleep. Guess Bot/Dark was too much. A Ninja/Trick Arrow should remove all dangers from falling asleep ^^

This was just simply I came up as I pondered what type of character to play. Something that could protect my team and stuff.

It's something I could play with a friend I'd convince, so the shields would stack, as the offence.

01 : Sonic Siphon recred(01) Empty(3) Empty(3)
01 : Shriek acc(01) acc(5) dam(7) dam(9) dam(11)
02 : Scream acc(02) acc(5) dam(7) dam(9) dam(11)
04 : Sonic Barrier damres(04) damres(15) damres(17)
06 : Sonic Haven damres(06) damres(15) damres(17)
08 : Assault endred(08)
10 : Aid Other hel(10) hel(13) hel(13) inttim(21) inttim(21)
12 : Hasten recred(12) recred(27) recred(27)
14 : Super Speed runspd(14)
16 : Disruption Field endred(16)
18 : Aid Self hel(18) hel(19) hel(19) inttim(23) inttim(23)
20 : Hurdle jmp(20)
22 : Health hel(22)
24 : Stamina endrec(24) endrec(25) endrec(25)
26 : Clarity Empty(26)

It's only to 26 since I reckon after that I can pick what I want having what I absolutly needed.

As can be noticed it's pretty poor in offense, but if I did play with my friend we could put around 60% res to a whole team thanks to both our shields, by level 35 with Dispersion I reckon we'd max the res even on a brute.

Disruption shows as 16% damage in the builder (does Disruption stack on the same brute? Anyone knows its radius?), so I though, with Assault it would be 26% (Assault is 10% for Corruptors, right? Not sure), which again with my friend playing would mean we could give a 52% damage boost to the team, more if we consider we could use Sonic Siphon by targeting through the brute thus adding a 30% extra (correct numbers for Sonic Siphon?) + which ever piddly ammount our sonic attacks would bring.

Aid other for some healing, if things get hairy then SS for some stealth, Hasten and go about spaming heals (please, no comments about corruptors not being healers, if it saves the team from faceplants then there's no shame in doing it in my book).

So, basicly, a team we'd play in would have 60% res to all damage minus psionic, a 52% damage increase (not including Sonic Siphon which could be spammed around), a heal that can be stepped up with Hasten, and eventually Dispersion Field which would also stack (though level 35 is faaaaar away).

At 28 maybe grab Tactics. It's lots of toggles but with only two attacks (maybe Shout at 30?) and Stamina there should be no great endruance drain plus the fact it's not for soloing but for teams.

Thoughts? Ideas?

Me I'm more blastery, I do so adore laying the hurt.

I have a Ice/Kin and I mostly blast to my heart's content with a SB to the right players before each fight (usualy the brutes and corruptors, but the doms as well, any character I see who could use a faster recharge or is sucking air) as well as a ID for the alpha taker. That done I blast away with a few heals here and there.

As some pople mentioned, some fights (some teams even) we can blast happily and some times we have our hands filled trying to heal and buff/debuff. Which is why I loved Cors more than Defenders. With Defenders I'm mostly stuck with. .well.. defending, since 'offending' is going to be mediocre.

Just like when I rolled an empath and felt really useful (Hollow PuGs FTW!) until I teamed with a good controller and then I'd be twiddling my thumbs and taking pea shots at enemies.

With my new AR/Rad I'vebeen neglecting my attacks (waiting on flamethrower + ignite + full Auto) in favor of my debuffs. That worked well so far, even with TOs and DOs the debuffing is noticable.

Nothing quite like debuffing a boss and then plum ignoring it until the end of the fight to kill all minions and him just flaying at the air ^^

It's all dumbness about spectators making a fuss.

I was watching the fighting over Sirens, by the guns and the sea and someone nabbed me. So what? All I did was pull the respawn windown a bit lower on the screen and kept watching the fights and chatting over broadcast.

D'uh -_-

...I'm humiliated on PvP.

I know I go down pretty fast then three or four guys pile on my Corruptor, and that versus a scrapper it's touch and go, but it was my first time of getting obliterated by a blaster.

Somehow he had jumped into the Villain base and was there, in front of the door waiting. I came out, waited for the PvP timer to run out and tried attacking. He used Freeze Ray and blasted me to oblivion.

I'm like, okay, I just repspeced and did get Freeze Ray for PvP, so I go out, wait for the timer and go all out, Freeze Ray, Ice Storm, my three attacks. Maybe about half life, he recovers, freezes me again and blasts to oblivion once more.

Waah -_- Four attemtps later another corruptor shows up and the two of us manage to kick his butt.

I'm traumatized HAX! Nerfxxxorxxs blastorxxs!

Someone comment already, I have a similar stalker and I'm trying to figure a good build

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edit: And Gorgon, why does you name make me think of cheese?

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Gorgonzola is a cheese

I tried PvP and enjoyed it. But I confess it had me gritting my teeth. Fortunatly I know the symptoms and the minute it stops being fun I leave and go PvE.

But as one of the above posters mentioned when I left with Lil Kitten, or Techno Witch, and have around 4-6 heroes pounding on me, killing faster than it takes for me to reach the fighting area, then.. not fun.

One hero is good, Techno survives better than Kitten, but even with Kitten against one hero, even a scrapper, I get a fair chance of survival. Against two heroes the odds are heavily stacked but I can squeeze a few frantic (and enjoyable) minutes of dodging, shooting, healing, etc.

But against three, four, five, or as yesterday, seven/eight heroes smacking me as soon as I put my nose out, then no. Off I go.

The major problem with PvP so far is that the teams I find are there merely to share the bounty and rep, I rarely, rarely, raaaaarely see someone trying to take command and destribute roles, I rarely see the team waiting and trying to move as group, they go in one at a time, are picked off, respawn, run back.

Meh.

I'll still PvP, but holds are my bane, the usual 'hold and then two energy based heroes pound on me' is getting hold. I'll be forced to buy BFs I guess.

Personally I tried the hot-spotting when I first got to Siren's, but it really doesn't work very well. I'm not even speaking of debt, though that too is present.

Without debt I believe there would be more hop spot fighting, but as it is I feel it is completly ignored, everyone's happily PvPing and the hot spots remain ignored.

Btw, do any of you gain XP in Sirens? I killed a few NPCs wandering too close, includering a couple orange wardens, and all I got was a message giving me infamy, no XP mentioned.

Did have a scrapper today, name of Spines, who would manage, somehow, to time his super jump just so that he would fall near the villain hospital exit, just behind the drone as the door exit would hide him from the drone.

I found interesting that he found the way of simply walking into an enemy base. I suppose he would wait for someone to leave unwarily and then deal hurt.

Unfortunatly twice he did it twice I so happened to be by the exit, already buffed and with all my henches summoned, so I slapped him around a bit and when he came to kill me the drone nabbed him. Second time my bots managed to kill him (Tar Pit + Fearsome Stare + Twilight FTW!)

Unrelated, I was suprised that my MM actually managed to play. Killed a few dunno how, made myself into an hinderance. Quite fun. Fortunatly I had picked Hasten at 30 so I could put my henches up quickly each time I'd die, otherwise the summoning and buffing would be pretty bad for PvP considering the quickness of deaths.

My MM rarely is targeted in PvE, I guess what the detractors of this improvement naysay i the fact they won't be able to ge in Bodyguard mode 24/7.

Then again I've played with MMs who kept on dying, I really don't know how they manage to get so much agro, perhaps because they were Traps.

Anyway, I feel this isn't a 24/7 thing but the equivalent of PFF : brown stuff hits the rotating air circulatory device, hit Bodyguard which grants a respite, flee/heal, break Bodyguard and target offender.

I decided to try PvP this week-end. My only experience had been a couple months back, right when I began as the team I was in decided, in chit chat, to go the Arena.

That first experience spoiled as it was me, a corruptor, with another corruptor and two stalkers. As can be imagined myelf and the other corruptor would happily blast each other for meager damage but some sort of fun (we were all under level 10) while the stalkers would simply ambush and one shot.

After the other corruptor giving up and me dealing with two stalkers who could not see each other thus leaving me the only target, who also could not see them, I too gave up in disgust. It reminded me too much of NWN's shadow dancers.

So, anyway, I decided to try PvP again with my level 26 ice/kin. It's been a very good character IMO, good damage, fast heals, good buffs and SB can be the life and soul of a team at times.

I confess it was plenty fun. I must've stayed there for the whole morning. First me and a friend went for the hotspots and helped the villain side win, then even tually some heros came along and we two beat them (I was amazed that we won ^^ ).

Very fun, very clean, jibes thrown left and right in that banter most PvPers like with none of the insults of cowardice.

By then I had acumuated some debt thanks to the pesky longbows but it was all good.

We eventually migrated to the ocean in front of villain base as it had no NPCs to dispense debt and since we were being killed rather fast anyway.

Fun started to dwindle a bit as we had a few stalkers who did help, a few MMs who.. er.. looked pretty and were good cannon fodder ^^ and a few corruptors (me and my friend). I say the fun dwindled because the other side was mostly scrappers, which my little corruptor would whittle their HP slowly (even with Assault and three SOs) and they'd heal a big chunk. Still doable if we focused on a targe a time.

Unfortunatly one of the scrappers had managed some sort of build based on cyclone (or is it hurricane? I'm a newbie yes), some thing that knocked us down while dealing 170-200 dmg. Very very effective.

My own fun was finnaly completly soured by a controller who would hold me while everyone else piled on. I confess I *could* have bought a dozen BFs and used them, but I didn't want to waste my cash, and after my 10th or so attempt to go in, be held, killed, respawn etc I decided to go back o the hotspots. No can do as the heros followed.

Anyway, bottom point. In balance of my morning of PvP I got two SOs (a pleasant surprise, though I suspect I could've earned enough influence to buy them in PvE) and a good ammount of fun. Slightly marred as some of the children started with insults and threats of bodily harm (because yes, it's widely known that threatning violence over the Net makes people stop doing whatever it is they were doing) and the fact I was rather helpless as soon as attention were on me.

I could take is as a compliment. The dom in our team was number one in the To Kill list, but I was second ^^

I'll try it again, but I'll have to figure something against holds, maybe respec, add freeze ray, ID, maybe toss out Assault and Tactics.. Hmm.. something to ponder. PvE's still my baby though

Max is correct.

(Go on, slap it on your sig )

Three that I remember.

Shriek, single hit, Scream, a good sizable DoT that I always found good damage, and Shout. I might be mistaking the names, it's been a while.

Shout is very close range though, counts almost as melee since you need to go right in. It's the most damaging though.

I had a blaster with Sonics, was fun, but I found it lacked a third attack long range when I didn't want to go close.

I'd usualy let the fight start and use my two long ranges, then when it was well under way I'd use the cone attack, which would always bring a few running to me. I'd meet them with bone smasher, Shout and... whatever that power was, that did knockback, the first one.

I've made a build which isn't very original I fear, though at least I invented it myself intead of copying from the forums O

I'm a bit stalled as for what to pick after 30 though. The idea was to have a machine gun type of character (triple siphons, hasten and mutual speed boosts) since a mirror of this build is used by a friend and we're leveling together as we play twin sisters.

Exported from version 1.5C of CoH Planner
http://joechott.com/coh

Archetype: Corruptor
Primary Powers - Ranged : Ice Blast
Secondary Powers - Support : Kinetics

01 : Tranfusion acc(01) acc(3) hel(3) hel(5) recred(5) recred(7)
01 : Ice Bolt acc(01) acc(7) dam(9) dam(9) dam(11) acc(31)
02 : Ice Blast acc(02) acc(11) acc(31) dam(13) dam(15) dam(15)
04 : Siphon Power acc(04) acc(17)
06 : Aim recred(06) recred(13) recred(31)
08 : Swift runspd(08)
10 : Siphon Speed acc(10) acc(17) recred(19) recred(19) recred(21)
12 : Hasten recred(12) recred(21) recred(23)
14 : Super Speed runspd(14)
16 : Health hel(16)
18 : Bitter Ice Blast acc(18) acc(23) acc(25) dam(25) dam(27) dam(27)
20 : Speed Boost endrec(20) endrec(33)
22 : Stamina endrec(22) endrec(29) endrec(29)
24 : Assault
26 : Tactics thtbuf(26) thtbuf(33) thtbuf(33)
28 : Ice Storm
30 : Inertial Reduction Empty(30)
32 : Blizzard Empty(32)

------------------------------------------

I'll want Blizzard, but I'm stuck for the rest. I might respec out of SS which is a bit of a pain to travel with and go for IR, or perhaps Flight since the supposed slowness of it doesn't bother me compared to the cool and easy traveling factor.

I've only played to 28 with a MM, but as a rule of thumb what I fight in teams is reds and purples, I've yet to fight in a team at that level and go for whites and yellows, so I'm fussy about having three accuracies in order to not miss.

Of course that having no other experience than a MM at 'high' level I don't really know, do two accuracies + Tactics enable a steady success rate? Or something like, 60/70%? I kinda prefer overkill to be completly honest since I abhoor whiffing (we do plenty of that to last us a life time when we're low levels).

The real strength of the build is the fact it's played with a duo. So far it has been superb (I'm level 20) since we siphon power and buff each other, hit Transfusion and heal both at the same time. Not to mention two stacked siphon power/speed on boss make it much easier to tangle with.

My prob is endurance, though soon as I get to 22 and my friend to 20 so she can SB me, it should be good O

Any ideas will be welcome

Thanks

As probably my last post on the subject since opinions will not change and behaviours will hardly be different, I remembered something when it was mentioned to /petition about abusive language.

I was playing a MUD, text based game RPG, and though I wasn't that great at it, as in I didn' go for the uber mobs to make uber gold and rare items, I did play at it regularely and for many hours, so I had my share of fun. i'd like to help newbies with equipment since it was a game that every week would reset, and thus we'd love praticly all our equipment and have to hunt it over again.

Anyway, one of the coders of the game was a bit of jerk, a great coder but a terrible person. One day he uses broadcast and says he just created a new emote called Hiccup.

I, and several others, imediatly try it. Also imediattly there's a spam of of 'X has killed itself!' as the MUD had a broadcast when a player died.

Turns out the coder had made a self-kill emote and tossed it for kicks and giggles at the players.

A death meant a level loss, to me who played around 3-4 hours a day it would mean three days to regain that level.

When I, angry at the 'joke', cussed at the coder in question I got an imediate admonishing from another coder, saying if I cussed on shout once more I'd be banned.

So here we go, it's okay to do grief, but not to cuss.

As like what I picture a team of stalkers sitting at the entrance to a PvP area and killing all which enters, or using skills that push or knock back into turrets, drones, fences, etc.

That would be okay, cussing would be a /petition.

Meh.

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This is a really discriminating point of view and i totally not accept it. You wanna tell me education has to do with how u behave in a PvP zone? Well fyi there are many non educated people out there that behave a lot better than people with university diplomas and are far more respected. Education has nothing to do with that tbh and i dont think if u have a Chemistry Phd you are bound to be more elegant or kind towards others.

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You're correct, English is not my firstt languange and the nuances show sometimes.

When I said education, in English it means 'learning-in-school'. Education, or educação in Portuguese means manners, what mother taught of not eating with one's elbows on the table, covering one's mouth when sneezing, giving our seat to an elder.

That's what I meant, sorry for the confusion.

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What class were you playing in NWN ? I never had much trouble with the shadowdancers, because after their first him i'd use Time Stop and acid fog, then cloud of bewilderment and thunder strike.

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I didn't PvP much (or even at all), and tended to stick with clerics since I was 99% of my time in RP servers. Clerics being as they are over NWN I could be a damage dealer when smacking stuff, heal, raise, and during RP a cleric was quite interesting, be it a good cleric or a lawful evil cleric of Mask

Even in RP servers there's some PvP, of course, but it has no comparison with real PvP. PvP over RP servers are true assassinations. It's hitting when unexpected for a kill. Not go to a specific map, everyone's ready for a fight.

Even so I could deal with SDers and be a major pain in their butt thanks to pumping the apropriate skills and some spells for a high-ish Listen.