Bill Z Bubba

Played one without knowing about keybinds and tray swapping? Annoying.

Ever shifted to nova or dwarf to find that your tray didn't swap or it did but all your powers are greyed out forcing you to shift back and forth to get them to work? Annoying.

At least the idiocy of toggle based mitigation without mez protection was finally dealt with by having toggles suppress instead of turn off. Now we're just left the annoyance of turning back on human toggles after form shifting or ignoring the forms altogether.

The list goes on, of course.

There isn't a mathematical expression for fun. But there is one for effectiveness.

I'm not telling anyone how to have fun or that they aren't having fun.

I am going to easily state that X is better than Y by the numbers.

I am going to state that form shifting is clunky and inefficient.

I am not stating that if you don't run at +4/x8 you're not having fun.

I am stating that if you can't while others can then your character must be weaker than those that can.

I am not telling anyone that weak characters can't be fun. Fun is subjective.

AT capability is not.

Not ONCE have I EVER stated that Kheldians aren't fun for anyone because of their poor design. That would be idiocy. People have fun with all manner of things.

All I'm waiting for is for people to quite lying to themselves that poor design equates to a challenge and to drop their idiotic superiority complexes based on "well, I play the Challenging ATs" when instead they're just getting by and making do with the klunky and poorly thought out AT.

Remember all those posts of mine stating that I enjoy my Warshade? It's still true. Bad design or not. EDIT: And he's got nothing but basic IOs.)

I worked AROUND that bad design. I ignored the forms. I accepted the lack of mez protection. I play to the strengths of the good powers while ignoring the lousy powers.

Which is exactly what all the pro-Khel posters state they do with theirs. Play to the strengths of the AT!

As we all should.

But please quit spewing the ridiculous statement that "Khels are Epic because of the storyline!!" The Khel storyline isn't the Illiad. There's nothing epic about them. They're nothing but another AT in a game.

They also aren't "challenging." If I had enough masochism I could solo an FF/Ene defender. Khels soloability is VASTLY superior to that madness.

Street sweep to 6. Take Nova at 6. Respec into human/dwarf at 21-24. Slot up dwarf and lean heavily on it when fighting mezzers. No problem.

Does that mean the AT is well designed? Nope.

A good design doesn't lead to annoyance.

Yes, let's weed out all those paying customers that play to have fun! Let's get rid of them! We'll make sure that this is City of Spreadsheets so that only those of us that don't mind spending a billion inf on our builds can do anything of worth!

Let's return to the days of rooting mez protection and toggles that lock you out of other toggles because that will bring back CHALLENGE!!! You want your negative energy damage resistance? Say goodbye to your S/L damres!

/sarcasm off

How's that Khel of yours do solo at +4/x8 by the way?

Why not run in so that both LR and SC are buffed by AAO? I realize that it doesn't look nearly as cool, but if you're going for max damage it would seem to be the thing to do.

It amuses me greatly when people ignore math while laying out baseless blanket statements in support of their opinions.

Scrap Focus: 1.64
Brute Focus: 1.96
Scrap Dam Mod: 62.562
Brute Dam Mod: 41.708
Scrap Adjusted Damage: 102.6
Brute Adjusted Damage: 81.7

Brute needs:

102.6 = 81.7*(1+X)
1+x = 1.256
x = .256

Soooo around 13 fury IF neither player has any enhancements slotted.

If I were to sit there, I'd be KBing spawns back into the squishies. That doesn't make much sense.

Which is probably why I prefer to be off that chart bouncing between the two spawns northeast or northwest of this chart.

Scrappers don't get fury.

Brute base damage is actually higher but the brute damage modifier is lower.

In the end, brute claws is greater than scrapper claws.

It builds fury like every other attack, yes.

Tanker: The thing that keeps squishies alive while I'm killing things that get highlighted when I hit tab.

Blaster: The thing that makes things I've got highlighted fall down instead of me making them fall down.

Defender: The thing that sometimes makes me cause things to fall down faster.

Controller: See defender. Side note: Causes things to stand still instead of being tossed around room. Annoyance.

Kheldian: See all of the above.

Brute: Cousin.

Corruptor: See Blaster and Defender.

Dominator: See Controller.

Stalker: Kill thief.

VEATs: See Kheldian.

Mastermind: Annoyance.

And that statement, like every other statement I've made on the topic, is true.

I could have added that Evis crits 15% of the time all the time but only hits 5 enemies and that only IF you have it lined up just so. Shockwave hits a max of 10 enemies and you almost have to work at it NOT to hit 10 since the cone is so huge.

I've also stated in the past that if you are invul or WP you should consider going eviscerate over shockwave. I've also stated that if you can fit them you should take all three AoEs with Spin being the must have of the three.

I've stated a great many things. At times I realize that those reading the thread don't need more than a quick and light post, while others I find myself called out to answer with far more detail.

I already stated that I won't be wasting my time comparing KD versus KB mitigation. There's no point to it. It's a flavor issue and those that continue harping on it will continue to be ignored by the devs in exactly the same way they have been since CoH went live.

Don't want the knockback? Don't take the power. Don't like folks using KB on your teams? Kick 'em. Either way, nothing will change.

MB, there are controllers and defenders out there that can solo giant monsters. There's not a scrapper possible that can do that.

The question comes down to what CAN a kheldian do better than anything else?

There IS an answer but it comes at what I consider too high a cost.

Kheldians can plug PUG holes. Tank goes down? Dwarf up. Blaster face plants? Go nova.

I don't begrudge you your fun. Hell, I envy it. The VEATs are just as bad for me on the boring scale. Why play a widow when I've got two claws/sr characters? Can't got fortunata because psi/mental attacks give me a splitting headache. Can't do crab because IT feels klunky. I have one bane and she's been stuck in the high 20s for a looooong time.

But at least VEATs do immediately add to a team and start at level 1 with higher than normal recovery. In contrast, those that use the forms rock hard with nova from 6 until 22 when blasters fly past them on damage output.

The statement "not all ATs are for everyone" is very true, but I don't see the point in anyone backing up their preference for X by stating things about the AT that just aren't true.

No Khel will EVER tank as well as a tank. No Khel will EVER blast as well as a blaster. All they can do now, all they've ever been able to do on teams, is plug holes when they appear. No holes? No need for a Khel.

Does this mean I won't team with them? Hell no. I can do a 5th diff ITF with 8 scrappers, I don't care what I'm teamed with. And I do now and always will love watching a warshade in action.

Let's just make sure that we're not tossing around half-truths and untruths when trying to defend our favorite toy.


EDIT: I feel like I should add something I posted a long time ago. Khels can tank better than defenders, blast better than scrappers and control better than blasters.

Actually... given a few hours of number crunching I probably could come up with the exact facts given enemy group X at difficulty Y.

Is it worth the time? Nope.

Some powers in this game do knockdown. Some do knockback. Lots of folks whine about knockback.

As for me fighting +4s? Yes. It started with the RWZ challenge. Now with the new diff settings I get to fight them whenever I want. Council and CoT are a cakewalk. Carnies and Arachnos hurt like hell.

I have two claws brutes. When done, both of them will also be fighting +4s. Because it's fun. I won't care that my brute will still do KB vs KD like the scrapper does against +4s. It won't matter to me.

But I've always soloed a lot, and when I do team the only time I watch my Knock is IF the lead tank suffers heavily because of it. Other than that, I send enemies flying all over the place because it pleases me to do so.

Handclap does no damage. Shockwave does. My experience with SW obviously differs from yours. The mitigation it provides turned my claws/ea from "meh" to "finally." Before Energy Drain it was "oh gods below make the pain go away."

I've chosen shockwave over eviscerate for a very long time. Perhaps because Eviscerate's animation is retarded. Perhaps because SW hits 10 while Evis hits 5. Perhaps because I laugh a lot when using it, especially when incoming damage drops to zero because some of those knocked back get stuck in walls.