Berzerker_NA

It would work if they could charge for it, though. People have to get over their sense of entitlement, and accept that MM players are just too small a portion of the overall population to have art resources directed our way.

For the Devs, any cost spent on improving art has to be justified by an expected increase in purchases, so..... if 92.85% (13/14) of the population doesn't even play MM's, and wouldn't make a purchase decision on the basis of MM's no matter what bells and whistles get thrown at that class, then they need another revenue source. Provide the revenue by being willing to shell out Paragon Points, and then NCSoft has hardly any choice but to provide that content. And I for one don't care if it's fair. I just want the content.

I agree that the game shouldn't be as simple as pushing an "I win" button and waiting to be rewarded, but.... it also shouldn't be as simple as the enemies getting to push a "you lose" button and then having to just hosp your way to victory by hoping you take out one or two of them before you go down each time.


It's a game of being faced with a problem and then using a certain amount of creativity to work out a solution. Usually your powers are supposed to help you do that in some way. You rearrange how they use them and overcome obstacles. However, for tanks and -regen there is no solution. No creativity to express, no strategy to work out.

The strategy is "You're not a tank anymore. Play your AT as a low damage scrapper and hope that works out for you."



Crowd control? Not all the tank sets have it, and there are no crowd control pool powers, so you might as well forget that. If that's your answer, then your answer is really "bring a controller, and stop playing tanks."


Temp powers? really? What happened the "game not being made more difficult when the inventions system was introduced"? There is not suppose to be any such thing as an enemy in this game for which it would be necessary to resort to inventing.


Actually, that's the whole point of a tank. Most things that are a knee to the groin for someone else are supposed to be taps on the shoulder to you. Enough taps on the shoulder and you still go down, but the idea of a power that hurts you *more* than other AT's is absurd.

That would be like giving an enemy a special resistance that disproportionately stops blasters from damaging them.

The problem is it's an old game. Development costs are easy to cover when there's a huge subscriber base because you're only eating up a couple cents per player of their subscriber fee when you hire a graphical artist to make some new images. However, good artists artists don't work for cheap. They know what they've got to offer and they charge accordingly.

At this late point in the game's life, you're just going to have to accept that new art is just plain always going to carry a new fee. 1/14th of the player base (MM's are just one of the 14 AT's out there) isn't going to be enough to support it.

They do seem to be strapped for art resources. But.... then why not just make it a pay per content thing? I'm sure nearly everyone who frequents this forum would jump at the chance and shell over the appropriate quantity of cash.

One problem is how to address all 6 MM Power Set's. Demons, Bots, and to a lesser degree Zombies require more than just costume designs on a basic character model. For the others, I'd love to see them hold a costume contest for it. "Henchmen themes", and then give out some swag to the winners in exchange for the right to use their design.

That's something I've needed some clarification on. If I slot end redux from a pet damage set, does that still apply to his slows, or does it only apply to attacks that deal damage?

Similarly, if I put a healing/end IO on my demons, will that affect the end cost of their attacks as well, or just the healing?

At low levels, their resistance is usually around 30-40%, between defense and resistance. They both

1) - Take damage slower
and
2) - Regenerate it faster.

Both matter to their survivability, because the team healer can't just focus everything on one guy all the time. And, of course, at low levels, their mitigation is going to be spotty at best. Only so many power choices, and not all resistance choices are even available yet.


Well, my observations are for teams that had run multiple missions against multiple enemy groups, and then strangely managed to always break down against CW. The tanks in question had shown themselves to be good, sensible, tanks otherwise, just not against that enemy.

With even a very, very small amount of regen, a good, strong tank might be able to hold an enemy at bay indefinitely on their own. Take the regen away, and there's now a clear time limit on how long they can go unhealed.


Except against tanks, who - as you yourself mentioned - are supposed to have mitigation.

You might as well not bother trying to softcap them for /thermal. You'll need all the end you can get to keep them healed.

Enforcers' leadership powers are about a 7.5-8.5% boost each (for a total of 15-17% def if the thugs stand in both auras), depending on what level they are. More if you enhance them (23% would be quite average I think). If you have gang war, then you can slot both Edict of the Master +5% defense and the Expedient Reinforcement +5% defense, bringing the total up to 33%. But you're not going to close the gap from there to 45%. Your own leadership power only adds maybe 3.5% if you enhance it well, but costs a ton of endurance.

For /Traps, the needed 12% to reach softcap is easily gained from FF generator.

You're missing the important difference. If you have 500 max hp, then 0.6% of that per second is 3 hp/second. If you have 1000 max hp, then 0.6% of that per second is 6 hp/second.

Tanks regenerate faster by virtue of having a higher max hp.

I would agree with you if CW weren't observed to be special in this regard. Resistance and Syndicate both also def debuff, but I don't observe tanks to fail as often when fighting them. You see the tank go down to 7/8 of his hp in the first round and you're thinking he'll be fine. (21 seconds would have been long enough to get those hp back at 0.6% regen...probably how long it will be before the strongest damage attacks of the CW will come back online?)

It's an easy problem to miss if you don't actually take the numbers and calculate them. Every 173 seconds, an average, un-enhanced, character regenerates their full health.

It used to be that I didn't ask myself that question either. Until after about the 5th time that a tank that had been performing wonderfully everywhere else in Praetoria started flopping in CW battles. That made me start asking the questions. I realized that we'd been relying on that tank to regenerate some of their HP in battles, so the healer wouldn't be the *only* thing keeping them up. Then I tried running some tanks in Praetoria, and it confirmed my suspicions. In solo play, a tank's only hope of winning is to get into a protracted battle and simply outlast their opponent. You're not going to out damage them, or even out damage/hp them. You have to be suffering damage slow enough that you can regenerate it faster than you lose it.

However, if you face CW, they'll debuff your regen down to zero immediately and keep it there. No matter how slow you lose HP then, you're guaranteed to crash before you can win. (Unless you use the "buy lots of greens/purples, use them all up on a single spawn, then go out of the mission to buy more for the next spawn" strategy.)

I agree. Either direction would be fine. I feel like it's only fair for some mobs to be able to debuff regen, since that's the main strategy players use to defeat GM's and AV's. But... there's a reason the Devs saw fit to give them a resistance to it. It's because it simply made it too easy to defeat GM's otherwise.

Maybe someone should take the same logic and apply it back to us players?

I agree there. It should be sown into the powers the same way Defense Debuff Resistance is sown in. Each tank set should be different in the degree to which it resists, and which powers grant resistance to it.

That's at least reassuring.

In the early levels of Praetoria, you're not exactly using your final build. However, even otherwise, a Tank's fast regen is the primary reason you put them out front. They're there to absorb damage for the rest. Take away the regen, and they've still got their resistance/defense powers, but their hp mean very little in a protracted battle because your healer is still healing the same amount of hp per heal. It will be the same benefit if they heal the blaster instead of the tank.

In Praetoria I don't even recruit tanks for my teams (I'm usually a MM myself). There's no point. They just get debuffed to death and then crash.


Regen is one of the stats I monitor. It's very rare that I get into a fight vs. Praetorian CW and don't see it go full red (by which I mean dip into the negative) and stay there for the entire battle.

That's why I'm suggesting to give tanks -regen resistance. Not -regen immunity, just resistance. I mean like in the same way that most tanks have -def resistance. It's built into their powers in small amounts that add up. Tanks should have at least some advantage. Otherwise it negates the whole concept of what a "tank" is supposed to be.