ST Hold Comparison

Is there any way to check the effectiveness of single target holds for controllers?

My DC/Poison is offered 2, Dark Grasp at T2 and then Paralytic Poison at T7

It seems to me that two ST Holds is unnecessary, but one solid one is a good thing. Often a combo of sets can offer two... so the real question is... which is best and by how much?

Are primaries all the same or do they vary? Same question to secondaries and how do primary and seocndary holds compare?

I looked on the Cohtitan wiki and can't see much there. Any thoughts/suggestion?

"You got to dig it to dig it, you dig?"
Thelonious Monk

All ST holds that come in a controller's T2/3 pick should all be the same duration, endurance cost, activation time, etc. Same damage too, though iirc Mind and Fire's damage is a little higher than the ones in other sets.

The holds that come in secondaries usually don't offer any damage and their hold time is about half to 2/3rds that found in a Controller's primary. Also, I don't know if the holds in a secondary have the chance to "Overpower"... i THINK they do, but not certain.

2 holds are good if you want to hold a boss or stack holds on harder targets, or if you need to hold multiple targets (when an immob just won't do). But like I said, the holds in secondaries don't hold for as long as in your primary.

Some Secondary holds will have a secondary effect (Like Time Stop from TM also offers -Regen), but I don't know of all the extra effects for all the powersets off-hand.

For single target holds, you'll find the hold offered in the primary offers a better duration than ones you'll find in your secondary. The difference is about 8 seconds on the base duration, about 13 seconds slotted with two level 50 IOs. Additionally, the holds found in your primary receive a bonus to accuracy (90% as opposed to 75% for holds found in secondaries). So yes, the holds in primaries are better than those found in secondaries.

As to single target holds across control sets, they all share the same duration, recharge, endurance cost and accuracy*. However, the do not share the same activation which can make a significant difference. The fastest activating holds are Char and Dominate, both at 1.32 seconds; the slowest is Tesla Cage at 2.376 seconds. That means Char and Dominate will begin recharging 1 second earlier than Tesla Cage. In most scenarios that's not a big deal, but it can make a significant difference if you're trying to hold an EB or stacking holds on AV.

*Blind is one notable exception because it does a small AoE Sleep as well.

Thanks people some useful info.

My thoughts are generally that at lvl 50, with either hasten or enough recharge, on a reasonable team, even if I'm the only controller, my primary ST hold and my Area hold should be enough. If the attach chain goes: Debuff Defence, ST Hold, Area Hold, ST Hold again and the mob is still tring to introduce my face to his fist, I really shouldn't be hanging with him should I? A further hold might not work anyhow... I mean, many mobs just ain't gonna get held, period. It seems reasonable to say that any additional benefit of a second ST hold would be greatly outweighed by being unable to take an alternate power.

"You got to dig it to dig it, you dig?"
Thelonious Monk

One other advantage of a second single target hold . . . you can use it as a IO set holder. It's not quite a "mule" since the power has some uses, but close. If you are slotting for Recharge, it is another place for a Baz Gaze set. You can get Ranged Defense from it as well.

On any controller combo that has a second single target hold, I find that I usually take that hold leveling up (before I have a lot of recharge), but then drop it with my final build unless I need it to hold an IO set. The points made above are valid that the power can be skipped once you have enough Recharge in your build, and the controller primary single target hold is better.