selling off market? now?

Ah, but it's not. That's not what the thread is about. It's not what you posted in your OP. You posted a question.

Obvious meaning: Why are those of you who are doing this doing it?

This thread is about your objection to the practice. It's not a warning. It's not about whether or not it makes sense. It's about you griping, and then arguing when people answer the question in the title.

You saying it's a warning is you completely moving any goalposts implied in your first post. Don't get your undies in a knot when people respond to what you posted instead of what you would rather they focus on.

How have the goalposts been moved?

Yep. And completely irrelevant in regards to the sales venue and the consumer. The document itself is about internal and government regulation in the milk production/processing industry. But has almost nothing (other than establishing baseline pricing) with the final sale price a seller offers a carton of milk to his customers at.

Reading comprehension is a wonderful thing. Try it.

Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.

I don't think the people you're trying to reach generally read these forums. For the few who do come to the boards to buy off-market now at prices that will almost surely drop soon, you could just politely step into those threads and remind them of what's happening. If you really want to warn the many non-forum goers who aren't aware, go in-game and try to tell them there. It's part of what makes this thread so funny. All you're accomplishing now is making yourself look foolish.

I mean, really, can you not see the distinction between real world products and services, perhaps even regulated in some jurisdictions, and in-game virtual items which are absolutely optional luxuries with no real value and no actual impact on anyone's lives? Even past that, can you not see that others do not share your (strange) sense of ethics, and that you're coming across as intolerantly attempting to impose those on the community? And the idea that what's done here is 'illegal' or even analogous to anything illegal, that's just beyond the pale.

I suspect you did just come here to rant and stir up a discussion thread. Perhaps you had When I saw you attempt to paraphrase Lloyd Bentsen (Graystar, you're no Lloyd Bentsen.) earlier in the thread I thought, just for a moment, you were being tongue-in-cheek, but from the later parts of this thread, obviously you're off the deep end.

Seriously, if you don't get it now, I don't see how I could possibly make you see, but since you asked, I'll try, once.

You posted a bunch of links about commodity prices.

(a) Nothing on the CoH market is a reasonable analog to a real-world commodity, not even salvage. Salvage is only required to build CoH's luxury items. You don't need IOs to play, so you don't need salvage to create IOs. Salvage is closer to ivory or raw jade. You use it to build things people want but do not need.

(b) Because of (a) real-world commodity pricing information has no meaningful lessons for us here. The example of paying $6 for milk was never meant to relate to the real world, which is why you posting a gob of links about real world milk prices has no bearing on the discussion. While CoH's market observes supply and demand well enough to make broad informed decisions (exactly like the one about prices being about to crash), its structure causes significant deviations. Over the weekend I sold a level 49 of something for five times the cost of a level 50. Why did someone buy it at that price? I don't know, but the long-term sales history supported it, and apparently that person didn't price compare. (I should also note that they payed twice what I was asking.)

The long and short of it is that people have far more in-game money than patience. If I want money, it makes sense to capitalize on that, literally. If they click "submit", I have not ripped them off. I didn't force them to type in those numbers and click that button.

I have zero problem with you campaigning to make folks more aware. Which is pretty convenient, since I can't stop you anyway. All I object to your moralizing about the people who do it. I can't stop you doing that, either, but I can argue with you about why I do object to it.

Enjoy the screams of the wicked, they are music to my ears.

Machiavelli said "Better to kill a man than deprive him of his patrimony". The market forum always demonstrates who the people are that have the greatest sense of entitlement in the game and who truly scream the loudest when you expose their nature.

The truly sad thing is that they are petty and small in their endeavors.They have no confidence in themselves or their ability to adjust to any changed circumstances. So they vigorously defend their right to do wrong.

If the people selling off market truly felt that they weren't taking advantage, or screwing over the buyer they would tell the people they were selling to that enhancement convertors were going to hit and the value of the goods being bought will change significantly in a short time.


Oh fwiw most states have laws against price gouging

http://apps.americanbar.org/antitrus...g-statutes.pdf

Indeed. All of which refer explicitly to essential goods, or to goods of unqualified essentialness immediately after an emergency or disaster.

You're entitled to think that.

By the same token, I'm entitled to think you're mistaken.

Having read through most of the other posts dissenting with your assessment,
I can't help but wonder how you reached your conclusion.

A few fundamental points about Capitalism that apply here, or in the Real World.

1> Caveat Emptor - it's in LATIN, so you know that idea has been around awhile

2> Free Market: Target, Walmart, Joe Bloe on Ebay, and pretty much any other
entity that sells a product chooses their price. Again, hardly a new concept.

It is not at all unusual, immoral, or illegal to see an item for sale at different
(but usually similar) pricepoints. For a good (and common) example, just check
housing prices among homes with common features (ie. 3Bd, 2Ba, X sqft etc.)

It is encumbent upon the buyer to do a little research if the pricepoint differential
matters to them... "mean" has zero bearing on the matter.

3> Good Faith Exchange: When a buyer and a seller bargaining in good faith,
reach agreement it becomes a "contract" - even in the legal sense of the term
(albeit harder to police/enforce compared to traditional legal contracts). Once
again, "mean" is a non-factor.

In short, provided the agreed exchanges actually occur, the very concept of
"mean" is ridiculous in the context where a buyer & seller agree to a price.

In game, selling on, or off-market is immaterial to the "mean" issue.

In game, there are only two reasons to trade off-market.
- first, to avoid the 10% fee
- second, to receive "fair" value for an item that is worth more than this game's
currency system can handle in a single transaction.

While both of those benefit the seller, it is irrelevant once the buyer and seller
agree to a price for exchange.

So, think what you like, but I think your stated position is seriously flawed.


Regards,
4

Wouldn't want those babies to choke. Plus, kids are too fat nowadays.

A fool and his money are soon parted.

I'm so glad you appreciate that!

Realistically, if someone meets my price point (or exceeds it), mean doesn't even enter into it. At worst, I have something I can either sell on the market with a 10% loss to market fees or *GASP!* use myself (heavens forefend!) on one of my alts.

Honestly, you "feel" so. Thought doesn't really enter into it.

So's this:




So are street signs. People still, regularly, ignore them.

Okay, you've done it now! You've overloaded my indifference meter!

As to the changes coming tomorrow.

People will adapt. Or most will. The marketeers will still make money off other people's ignorance. It's inevitable.

Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.

I actually don't support those laws. Their net effect is to make certain nobody motivated by profit makes an extra effort to get supplies into disaster areas.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtual_economy


I am and will keep trying to bring this back to my original intent.


Dont buy online till prices stabilize.

You may ave more time than me to look up things online. Happily I have a family to take care of. SO as I do not have the time to get exact data on many of the things which we discussed in this thread, I still feel this has been constructive in that I do not see things for sale off market atm that are new threads. Which i think is a good thing.


Insofar as our discussion about prices. I was only trying to use an analog and I never said they are real world in fact i have said"I am also shocked that you will argue with me about this warning.


Do not buy off market for the foreseeable future.

thats what this thread is and you argueing with me about commodities pricing."

and
No I do not have any business in that transaction I dont pretend to. However this thread is a warning to those that might do it.

Watch out. There is change a comin.

and for whatever reason you dont like that im doing this to warn people. Well quite frankly I do not care what you think.
I just dont want to see on the boards I just spent 2+ billion on something worth 300 mill. Wahh.


and i already refered to and ackwoledge its a game here

o in this video game that people are already paying for. Just so i get this straight. I want to be clear what your saying here because i think its important.


So if someone does not know the market is about to change, and they are "stupid" in that they dont spend the time on the market or the boards that you and I do clearly. Its ok to charge them over the cap price. Because thats what this thread is about. If you charge 1 billion ingame and someone who does not know and is not informed. Also this person may have saved for many months to get one of these. You think its ok to charge them over the cap off market, "because they are stupid" is that what you are saying?

and here:

And how could you possibly after all this time continue to talk about a video-game in the real world terms of life and gain and loss.


Its time to stop the roleplay this is not a real market and the devs have decided to KILL yes KILL maybe MURDER or OBLITERATE is better but they have thrown the gauntlet down.


The marketing days are different. Not gone just chanfged profits lowerd. Deal with it. But dont compare this to Microsoft. I knew Microsoft and apple and sam walton. You sir are no Same Walton. So please dont even try to compare this to real life. Cause the people that are trying to sell an io for 2 billion off market are cheating the people buying. They are knowingly and without care defrauding the people buying as to the value of the object they are buying.


and ill say this one last time and you do not have to agree with me and clearly you dont but this is how i feel

:I know what your saying is not true. Selling an io for 3 billion of market now is cheating to someone who does not know whats coming.


Spin it anyway you like its not the right thing to do unless you just need influ and are willing to do anything to get it.

And as i said i dont have the luxury of time to look up your old posts. And i dont agree with what you have said here. I am not arguing the market I am condemning the Off market transaction that might happen NOW in the NOW given whats coming tommorow.

So enough with the drivel about economics. Thats how i feel and you are free to disagree whcih you obviously do.

Hoever if you find someone to spend 3 billion for an io worth 1.5 on marrket today or worth 200 million on weds I will still feel that what you did is wrong.


My marketing and or farming history is irelevant cause i farmed them and used the market we have in the most honest sense of it.


So lets stop talking about milk, gas etc.. and get back to my origianl comment.


Whcih is seeling off market now is like taking candy from a baby. If you think that baby is not actually here thats fine. But i posted things to show you there are still people trying to do that.


If that is you then I dont like what your doing. Period. If you disagree and think what your doing is ok. I dissagree with you.

You do not have to agree with me and i dont have to agree with you but all i was saying and im saying it now for i think the 5th or 6th time


dont buy off market anymore for the forseable future.

That's a fair point.

Potential is just that, a chance. You have a potential to get a black wolf in the superpacks, it ain't working out too well for some people if you haven't heard.

Personally I bought a whole bunch of cheap pvp and purple IOs and recipes for my own conversion and use. I am not going to fall into the trap of trying to convert until one desired IO pops, I use many sets on my toons some will convert to what I want others I'll sell and then buy what I want with the influence.

The influence I made was simply future influence saved in the low cost of the many IOs and recipes that i can convert, influence I would've spent in the future buying that I no longer have to. Also got a bunch of high value pvp and purple IOs in storage right now that i could sell, can't be bothered selling and rebuying, influence is just so stupid easy to get in this game.

How about you read more and speak without a clue less.
I followed every one of those links. I guess they're interesting if you want to read about PRICE SUPPORTS and how the government INFLUENCES prices of various commodities. But they don't FIX the prices.

There is SO MUCH wrong here, that I don't even know where to start.

So, I won't ... Enjoy your delusions...


4

Not at all. Now people have an additional reason to mock your basic premise. You attacked people for behaving as if the converters wouldn't appear, and they didn't appear.

I was warning what might happen if you think I was attacking well thats your opinions.

As far as mocking me please go ahead

as if you had not already been

and then there is this.

but i guess this does not concern you cause all you want to do is throw mud at me and i think you are not at all concerned with worries but with making me wrong and making yourself right. All i can say to you is you would feel that way anyways. Insofar as converters are concerned




DONT BUY OFF MARKET mostly from the people fighting me over this what should be trivial post.

I feel they are full of hate, anger and just want to play board troll hate games.


I await