You can stack single target holds. You can stack the aoe hold and hold/slow fields. Eventually with the defense buff and times juncture, you will be able to use the pbaoe stun safely.
Lewis
Random AT Generation!
"I remember... the Alamo." -- Pee-wee Herman
"Oh don't worry. I always leave things to the last moment." -- The Doctor
"Telescopes are time machines." -- Carl Sagan
I've been testing on a Dark/Time and that's what I plan to re-roll one of my favorite characters as (currently a Mind/Rad).
I've found Time's Juncture and Farsight a very nice boon on characters that play in or near melee. Since dark will play a bit closer due to Heart of Darkness (PBAoE stun) it should benefit nicely. The additional debuff from TJ, on top of all the to hit debuff from Dark, will also help keep the Haunts alive while they're out provided your in melee with them. The greatest problem is that Dark/Time is going to be a very tight build.
Dark/dark won't likely share that problem. Fade and Soul Absorption are a bit lackluster if they don't receive any buffs before going live. Black Hole is essentially the current Dimension Shift, with no announced plans to change that.
Dark/Dark and Dark/Time are going to be very popular.
The development team and this community deserved better than this from NC Soft. Best wishes on your search.
I certainly intend to make both of those combos. 
My first Dark controller may well be Dark/storm though. Gotta do it!
But Dark/Time should be well amazing, yo!
Lewis
Random AT Generation!
"I remember... the Alamo." -- Pee-wee Herman
"Oh don't worry. I always leave things to the last moment." -- The Doctor
"Telescopes are time machines." -- Carl Sagan
Hmm, I hadn't given storm a lot of thought. Heart of Darkness and Thunder Clap would mesh well at least.
Ketch,
With all the immobs locking mobs in tornadoes, think of the pure damage that the set could cause. You could choose to strategically commit massive damage, or have massive mitigation by knocking around all the enemies without roots...
Tornado and the AoE immobilize are a given for most control sets. However, Dark/Storm may have a more difficult time pulling it off because its immobilize is a cone. Fire, Plant, Earth, etc. can more easily cover a very large area of foes to negate Tornado's knockback by simply spamming their immobilize while Dark has to consider their positioning for better coverage.
Quote:
Just a slight correction: Fire, Plant, Earth and Ice all have -knockback in the Immob. Illusion and Mind don't have an AoE Immob, and Grav and Elec don't have -knockback in their AoE Immob powers. |
Originally Posted by ketch
Tornado and the AoE immobilize are a given for most control sets. However, Dark/Storm may have a more difficult time pulling it off because its immobilize is a cone. Fire, Plant, Earth, etc. can more easily cover a very large area of foes to negate Tornado's knockback by simply spamming their immobilize while Dark has to consider their positioning for better coverage.
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So that's not "most" -- it is exactly half of the current sets.
It seems to me that Dark/Storm should be an awesome pairing . . . and if I didn't already have four */Storm controllers at 50, that's what I probably would roll up. Besides, theme-wise it would fit the ole' "It was a dark and stormy night" trope.
LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control
C'mon now, let's not nitpick. If 50% of my M&Ms are blue, 25% are green, and 25% are yellow, it's valid to say most of my M&Ms are blue.
One area where I would give Dark/Storm some consideration is how Hurricane may help position mobs for better usage of the cones.
Quote:
Would you also say that most of the M&Ms were not blue?
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Originally Posted by ketch
C'mon now, let's not nitpick. If 50% of my M&Ms are blue, 25% are green, and 25% are yellow, it's valid to say most of my M&Ms are blue.
One area where I would give Dark/Storm some consideration is how Hurricane may help position mobs for better usage of the cones. |
Let's just nip pointless semantics in the bud here.
Most - greatest in number; greatest in amount, degree, or extent
Four sets can spam their immobilize to minimalize knockback, two sets cannot spam their immobilize to minimalize knockback, and two sets lack an immobilize. That's 4:2:2. If that doesn't satisfy one's qualification for most you can add dark to the mix and look at it as 5:2:2 or simply 5:4.
Quote:
Actually, "most" is more than 50%. For a 4:2:2 grouping, you might say that the largest number are in the 4, but not that 4 are "most." We can't add in Dark because it is subject to change -- it is not a current control set.|
Originally Posted by ketch
Let's just nip pointless semantics in the bud here.
Most - greatest in number; greatest in amount, degree, or extent Four sets can spam their immobilize to minimalize knockback, two sets cannot spam their immobilize to minimalize knockback, and two sets lack an immobilize. That's 4:2:2. If that doesn't satisfy one's qualification for most you can add dark to the mix and look at it as 5:2:2 or simply 5:4. |
And picking nits is what I do . . . I'm a lawyer who does a lot of business law contract work. And this is the Internet where it is our job to threadjack whenever possible over the stupidest and most microscopic details as though they were vital to all of human existance.
LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control
Quote:
Well then... in the spirit of nit picking. Most is not always more than 50%. If we go back to my bag of M&Ms with 50% blue, 25% green, and 25%, blue would be the most common; if sampled randomly, blue would be the most frequently color chosen. In neither case, however, would it exceed 50%.|
Originally Posted by Local_Man
Actually, "most" is more than 50%. For a 4:2:2 grouping, you might say that the largest number are in the 4, but not that 4 are "most." We can't add in Dark because it is subject to change -- it is not a current control set.
And picking nits is what I do . . . I'm a lawyer who does a lot of business law contract work. And this is the Internet where it is our job to threadjack whenever possible over the stupidest and most microscopic details as though they were vital to all of human existance. |
But re-addressing the original topic, the changes that have been made recently to Dark Affinity have left a better impression of it in my mind than it initially had. Fade has been given resistance in addition to defense and is permable with a significant investment in recharge. My initial attraction to Dark/Time was mostly to pair powerful to hit debuffs with powerful defense buffs courtesy of Power Boost. That may be a bit of overkill. DA's mixture of buffs may prove more potent in the right build.
Quote:
Stupidly picky grammar discussion:|
Originally Posted by ketch
Well then... in the spirit of nit picking. Most is not always more than 50%. If we go back to my bag of M&Ms with 50% blue, 25% green, and 25%, blue would be the most common; if sampled randomly, blue would be the most frequently color chosen. In neither case, however, would it exceed 50%.
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Ah, you see you are changing the object of the adjective. Your original use of "most" was quantitative rather than comparative. "Most" referred to the number of controller sets in your original usage -- you stated, "Tornado and the AoE immobilize are a given for most control sets." In fact, Tornado works with an Immob with -knockback for half of the current control sets which is not "most."
When you change it to "most common" then you are changing the object of the adjective to "common" which is a comparison between groups rather than the group itself. When one group has twice the number of items compared to two other groups, then "most common" is correct. It would be equally correct to use "most common" if you had 20 blue M&Ms, and 16 Red M&Ms and 17 Yellow M&Ms. Even though the blues were not more than 50%, they are still the "most common." However, you would not correctly state, "Most of the M&M's are blue." The same analysis applies to "most frequently."
But enough of this. My initial stupidly picky and completely unnecessary correction was, in fact, correct.
Quote:
| But re-addressing the original topic, the changes that have been made recently to Dark Affinity have left a better impression of it in my mind than it initially had. Fade has been given resistance in addition to defense and is permable with a significant investment in recharge. My initial attraction to Dark/Time was mostly to pair powerful to hit debuffs with powerful defense buffs courtesy of Power Boost. That may be a bit of overkill. DA's mixture of buffs may prove more potent in the right build. |
LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control
Semantics fight! Someone get the gauze, this may get bloody.
@Mental Maden @Maden Mental
"....you are now tackle free for life."-ShoNuff
Well, to avoid subduction into the sucking swamp of semantics I agree that the changes to /DAff make quite a difference.
Plant/Storm was my most recent 50, so I'm disinclined to start with a Dark/Storm out of the gate [internal dialog] though I probably should dust off and finish Lavan Fire/Storm, I think he was like 42ish?[/internal dialog].
Which brings me back to either Dark/DAff or Dark/Time. I guess I'm leaning towards Dark/DAff at this point, partially because I think it'd be great fun to have Fluffy as a secondary pet on a Controller. I don't see Dark/DAff being nearly the AOE machine that Plant/Storm is, but I think it might be an ideal combo for playing with my kids. A Controller with both strong single target and AOE control AND massive -tohit debuffing and healing? Sounds kinda perfect for keeping a less than min-maxed uber optimized team on their feet and fighting.
To me Dark/DAff looks like it may be one of the most well rounded Controller combos yet. It's got a bit of everything and should make for a VERY versatile controller.
I've got zero experience with /Time, but I'm guessing that Dark/ really won't need the extra control that /Time brings to the table in the form of single and AOE control. The big question mark in my mind is the impact of the self +Rech from /Time vs the stacking of -Tohit coming from /DAff and Fluffy.
Arg
I absolutely love /Time and this thread makes me really want to make one. BUT I'm going to resist for now as my last controller was an Ill/Time. I also never make complimentary themed characters (fire/fire, energy/energy etc) so I'd like to finally do that this go round (probably even taking it to villain side for Soul Mastery). After will be an Ill/Dark to go with my group of Illusionist/Stage Magician themed characters.
Just need to work out my "concept" for the Dark/Dark.
@Mental Maden @Maden Mental
"....you are now tackle free for life."-ShoNuff
Other than /Time, /Dark, and /Storm does anyone see any other pairing for Dark/ that has interesting potential?
/TA, /cold, /rad I think any of those could prove interesting.
@Mental Maden @Maden Mental
"....you are now tackle free for life."-ShoNuff
My first controllers out of the gate will be dark/storm and fire/dark. But I think force field and poison are pretty interesting.
FF will eventually be able to self soft cap defense, and even early on you will be able to more safely use the pbaoe stun as an opener, thanks to the defense from dispersion bubble. Plus the haunted ghost things can be defeated, so bubbling them (and the wolf) could be fun and helpful.
I also think dark/poison is gonna be really wicked, esp against hard targets. Between the confuse and the poison hit debuff toggle, youll also be able to stick around in melee and use the stun aggressively. Plus, dark/poison has a cool Egyptian mummy sort of vibe, which I like.
Lewis
Random AT Generation!
"I remember... the Alamo." -- Pee-wee Herman
"Oh don't worry. I always leave things to the last moment." -- The Doctor
"Telescopes are time machines." -- Carl Sagan
Quote:
Dark itself is a solid control set so it should pair well with anything really. Ice and FF both pair their defensive buffs well with Dark's -to hit. Shields of any kind could help keep the Haunts up for their duration. Debuffs, of course, are going to help speed up damage and further to hit debuffing potential. The only set I don't see any particular synergies for is Empathy.
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Originally Posted by Madadh
Other than /Time, /Dark, and /Storm does anyone see any other pairing for Dark/ that has interesting potential?
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Been quite a while since I started a new Controller, been playing lot with my 9 and 10 year old kids and they generally need me on a *mature* control build ;-). I've got tons of Controllers (maybe not as many as Lewis, but then who does? ) and Dominators, they remain by far my favorite ATs.
) that have played /Time more than I (which is, like, pretty much everyone here) what are your thoughts on the synergies between Dark/ and / Time?
Anyway, I've been waiting for a Dark/ set since I-2 so I HAVE to roll a Dark/ controller when I-22 drops. :-)
Soooo the question is: Dark/Dark or Dark/Time?
I've played enough Dark powersets to have a pretty good grasp on the synergies on Dark/Dark, but I haven't really played with /Time much at all as I haven't leveled up a new Controller alt in quite a while.
So I ask my fellow Controllers (Esp those that remember ye olde "solo controller project" and the Control channel
TIA for your thoughts.
Arg