Neither Recovery Aura nor Regeneration Aura stack from the same caster. Adrenalin Boost doesn't either, though you could always use it on a second target.
Emp/Dark is a very good combo, but it looks like Burnout doesn't do much for Empathy.
Thanks a lot for the info CW and the supporting page, I appreciate the help.
"Forum PvP doesn't give drops. Just so all of you who participated in this thread are aware." -Mod08-
"when a stalker goes blue side, assassination strike should be renamed "bunny hugs", and a rainbow should fly out" -Harbinger-
Quote:
I agree with this. When burnout hit beta, I really wanted to love it, especially since I already had Hasten and Superspeed, it would have been easy to add in. But after alot of testing, I concluded that the downside completely negated the upside.|
Originally Posted by Codewalker
Neither Recovery Aura nor Regeneration Aura stack from the same caster. Adrenalin Boost doesn't either, though you could always use it on a second target.
Emp/Dark is a very good combo, but it looks like Burnout doesn't do much for Empathy. |
The only powers that could really be leveraged were long recharge powers that I already had maxxed the recharge on. So using them back-to-back saved 40 seconds on their re-use every 10 mins or so (maxxed recharge on Burnout).
The only way I would reconsider this power on my emp is if the recharge on burnout was reduced so that we could leverage the power once every 3-5 minutes with max recharge. This still would be only marginally usefull on my emp, but the benefit would come closer to balance against the downside without being an every-battle power. Which I guess is the reason for the obscenely long recharge.
BIOSPARK :: DARKTHORN :: SKYGUARD :: WILDMAGE
HEATSINK :: FASTHAND :: POWERCELL :: RUNESTAFF
Quote:
I like the way you think. Curiosity is the mark of a good player.|
Originally Posted by CrazyJerseyan
My question is can you double stack powers like Regeneration/Recovery Aura by using Burnout? I know its probably overkill, Im just curious on whether it woud work or not.
|
Although the RAs aren't stackable, they behave the same way as most unstackable buffs in that recasting it won't "waste" them, but will refresh their duration. (AFAIK Vengeance is the only buff that's been hacked to be "wastable".) So you can use Burnout to effectively extend the duration of the RAs every so often. This is more helpful if you have a lot of downtime on your RAs, for example, if you're F2P.
Probably the most dramatic benefit of Burnout to an empath is AB, provided you have one more lucky target to use it on, of course. And might as well toss out an extra Fortitude while you're at it.
And there are opportunities for silliness, as well. Hello, double nuke.
So if you're curious about the power, I say, indulge your curiosity. We're expecting a free respec when Issue 22 hits, so no harm giving it a try. You may discover something unexpected or fun about the power that nobody else has discovered.
Quote:
Good info to have RK. I have incorporated Burnout into a few builds at this point and enjoy how it works, but I havent played a Empath toon in a few years. We'll see how it plays out.|
Originally Posted by Rigel_Kent
I like the way you think. Curiosity is the mark of a good player.
Although the RAs aren't stackable, they behave the same way as most unstackable buffs in that recasting it won't "waste" them, but will refresh their duration. (AFAIK Vengeance is the only buff that's been hacked to be "wastable".) So you can use Burnout to effectively extend the duration of the RAs every so often. This is more helpful if you have a lot of downtime on your RAs, for example, if you're F2P. Probably the most dramatic benefit of Burnout to an empath is AB, provided you have one more lucky target to use it on, of course. And might as well toss out an extra Fortitude while you're at it. And there are opportunities for silliness, as well. Hello, double nuke. So if you're curious about the power, I say, indulge your curiosity. We're expecting a free respec when Issue 22 hits, so no harm giving it a try. You may discover something unexpected or fun about the power that nobody else has discovered. |
Thanks for the input.
"Forum PvP doesn't give drops. Just so all of you who participated in this thread are aware." -Mod08-
"when a stalker goes blue side, assassination strike should be renamed "bunny hugs", and a rainbow should fly out" -Harbinger-
One thing a Defender can do is combine Burnout with it's best friend Conserve Power. My Rad/Rad Def played with a combo of:
Conserve Power -> Power Build Up -> EM Pulse -> Atomic Blast -> Eat a blue pill (anything better than tier 1 will do) -> Burnout -> EM Pulse -> Atomic Blast
The double EM Pulse really wasn't needed as few things weren't held or killed already. I thought of a sillier combo but the number of powers required was just too much.
If a teammate died I would use recall friend to the middle of the spawn then:
Conserve Power -> Vengeance -> Power Build Up -> Aim -> EM Pulse -> Fallout -> Atomic Blast -> Eat a tier 3 blue -> Burnout -> Fallout -> Atomic Blast or if anything is still healthy after the second Fallout, use EM Pulse before the final Atomic Blast. Finally after I recover maybe a Mutation 
No Sig
Quote:
I hadn't thought about the possibilities with defenders; I admit I should have. Necro Masterminds have the ability to have two boss class pets out at a time. I need to turn this around in my idealistic all-defender static team mind stance... 4 empaths, (8?), and 4 TA specialists |
Originally Posted by Rigel_Kent
I like the way you think. Curiosity is the mark of a good player.
Although the RAs aren't stackable, they behave the same way as most unstackable buffs in that recasting it won't "waste" them, but will refresh their duration. (AFAIK Vengeance is the only buff that's been hacked to be "wastable".) So you can use Burnout to effectively extend the duration of the RAs every so often. This is more helpful if you have a lot of downtime on your RAs, for example, if you're F2P. Probably the most dramatic benefit of Burnout to an empath is AB, provided you have one more lucky target to use it on, of course. And might as well toss out an extra Fortitude while you're at it. And there are opportunities for silliness, as well. Hello, double nuke. So if you're curious about the power, I say, indulge your curiosity. We're expecting a free respec when Issue 22 hits, so no harm giving it a try. You may discover something unexpected or fun about the power that nobody else has discovered. |
. With burnout the four empaths can have all 8 teammates adrenaline boosted and have 8 Oil Slicks out at a time! 8 disruption arrows and 8 EMP arrows in the mix would makes things REALLY sick and wrong. If the TAs were all archery secondary, you could toss out 8 Rains of Arrows - no nuke crashes!! Well if it's going to get this wacky, then the empaths could all go fire secondary to ensure the oil lights, with 8 infernos. I am not sure what content could accomodate all the firepower 
Triumphant Defenders Forever
Psylenz FF/Psi, ArticQuark Storm/Rad, Symon BarSisyphus Bots/psn, Max VanSydow Thugs/Dk, Cyclone Symon Bots/stm, Blue Loki Ice/Cd, Widow 46526
HelinCarnate:OMG it is so terrible. I have the option to take 3 more powers but no additional slots. Boo F'ing hoo.
Omg TA burnout team sounds wonderful!
Does sonic liquefy stack on itself? if so that could be quite handy as well
City of Data suggests, yes, you can have two Liquefy patches out with Burnout. Might want someone to confirm that in-game, though.
You could use Burn-out/Auras in a League Trial or a Hami since auras do have a limit to how many they can buff. So my advise is if you can crowbar it into your build without too much trouble I would go ahead and do it. Having two ABs up at once alone is worth it...
/Empaths can turn three people into Jesus, one person into God, and everyone else into the twelve apostles.~Angry_Citizen
Don't you know that discussion of power selection/slotting can ONLY be based on hearsay, rumor, idle speculation, and bald-faced lies??!? ~Elf_Sniper
Quote:
I would have combined the 4 TAs with 4 empaths for max buffing and max debuffing. More than 8 oil slicks seems overkill. The AB boost on all the team would be something in itself to witness. Now consider with burnout and AB how many fortitudes the team could stack |
Originally Posted by Muse to my Ears
Omg TA burnout team sounds wonderful!
Does sonic liquefy stack on itself? if so that could be quite handy as well |
Triumphant Defenders Forever
Psylenz FF/Psi, ArticQuark Storm/Rad, Symon BarSisyphus Bots/psn, Max VanSydow Thugs/Dk, Cyclone Symon Bots/stm, Blue Loki Ice/Cd, Widow 46526
HelinCarnate:OMG it is so terrible. I have the option to take 3 more powers but no additional slots. Boo F'ing hoo.
Man, do I need to level my speeder empath concept. This thread is giving me a nice tingly feeling.
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.953
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
H34LB0T M1N6: Level 50 Technology Defender
Primary Power Set: Empathy
Secondary Power Set: Electrical Blast
Power Pool: Medicine
Power Pool: Teleportation
Power Pool: Concealment
Power Pool: Flight
Ancillary Pool: Dark Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Healing Aura -- Numna-Heal/EndRdx(A), Numna-EndRdx/Rchg(3), Numna-Heal/Rchg(3), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(11), Numna-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(33), Numna-Heal(40)
Level 1: Charged Bolts -- Entrpc-Heal%(A), Entrpc-Acc/Dmg(9)
Level 2: Heal Other -- Panac-Heal/+End(A), Panac-Heal(5), Panac-Heal/EndRedux/Rchg(5), Panac-Heal/Rchg(11), Panac-EndRdx/Rchg(33), Panac-Heal/EndRedux(40)
Level 4: Aid Other -- RgnTis-Regen+(A), RgnTis-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(7), RgnTis-Heal/Rchg(7), RgnTis-EndRdx/Rchg(17), RgnTis-Heal/EndRdx(33)
Level 6: Resurrect -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(25), RechRdx-I(42)
Level 8: Clear Mind -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(9), RechRdx-I(43)
Level 10: Recall Friend -- TSM'n-Rng(A), TSM'n-EndRdx(37)
Level 12: Fortitude -- GSFC-ToHit(A), GSFC-ToHit/Rchg(13), GSFC-ToHit/EndRdx(13)
Level 14: Aid Self -- Mrcl-Rcvry+(A), Mrcl-Heal(15), Mrcl-Heal/Rchg(15), Tr'ge-Heal/Rchg(17), Tr'ge-Heal/EndRdx(40)
Level 16: Resuscitate -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(25), RechRdx-I(42)
Level 18: Recovery Aura -- Efficacy-EndMod(A), Efficacy-EndMod/Rchg(19), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc/Rchg(19), Efficacy-Acc/Rchg(34), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc(37), Efficacy-EndMod/EndRdx(45)
Level 20: Stealth -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def(21), LkGmblr-Def/Rchg(21)
Level 22: Invisibility -- LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(A), LkGmblr-Def(43), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(43), LkGmblr-EndRdx/Rchg(50)
Level 24: Hover -- Zephyr-ResKB(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(31), Zephyr-Travel(31)
Level 26: Regeneration Aura -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(27), Numna-Heal/Rchg(27), Numna-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(34), Tr'ge-Heal/Rchg(37), Tr'ge-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(45)
Level 28: Fly -- Frbd-EndRdx(A), Frbd-Fly(29), Frbd-Stlth(29)
Level 30: Teleport Foe -- TSM'n-Rng(A), TSM'n-EndRdx(46)
Level 32: Adrenalin Boost -- P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(A), P'Shift-EndMod(34), P'Shift-End%(39)
Level 35: Dark Consumption -- Efficacy-EndMod/EndRdx(A), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc(36), Efficacy-EndMod/Acc/Rchg(36), Efficacy-Acc/Rchg(36)
Level 38: Team Teleport -- TSM'n-EndRdx(A), TSM'n-Rng(39)
Level 41: Soul Transfer -- Sciroc-Dam%(A), Sciroc-Acc/Dmg(42), Sciroc-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(48), Sciroc-Dmg/EndRdx(50)
Level 44: Phase Shift -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 47: Dark Embrace -- S'fstPrt-ResKB(A), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(48), S'fstPrt-ResDam/EndRdx(48)
Level 49: Oppressive Gloom -- Rope-Acc/Stun(A), Rope-Acc/Stun/Rchg(50)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Dmg-I(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Run-I(A)
Level 1: Vigilance
Level 2: Swift -- Flight-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Numna-Heal(A), Numna-Heal/EndRdx(46), Numna-Heal/Rchg(46)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- P'Shift-End%(A), P'Shift-EndMod(23), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(23), EnManip-Stun%(31), EnManip-EndMod/Rchg(39), EnManip-EndMod(45)
Level 2: Rest -- EndMod-I(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
test run because i can't start a new thread.
Don't know if this is good or not, wanted to try a complete non attack only buff and heal.
Quote:
Personally, even on a team-only build I find a buff only build to be parasitic and non-optimal. If you took JUST ball lightning and short circuit instead of aid other and aid self, you could contribute AoE damage, and modest endurance drain. What in Statesman's name would you do with a spawn if you tp'd it to you and had no attacks? Resurrect and Resuscitation? Both? Are you planning to miss with heal aura and heal other?|
Originally Posted by Mingsura
[color=#489AFF]
.... test run because i can't start a new thread. Don't know if this is good or not, wanted to try a complete non attack only buff and heal. |
Also consider the nuke. You can target from around a corner and dispatch stacks of foes without them being able to target you.
I know you were going for a gimmick, and I wouldn't kick a teammate for this build on a team, but I would think twice before inviting to a taskforce. It wouldn't be worse than an empath that didn't use powers they had.
Triumphant Defenders Forever
Psylenz FF/Psi, ArticQuark Storm/Rad, Symon BarSisyphus Bots/psn, Max VanSydow Thugs/Dk, Cyclone Symon Bots/stm, Blue Loki Ice/Cd, Widow 46526
HelinCarnate:OMG it is so terrible. I have the option to take 3 more powers but no additional slots. Boo F'ing hoo.
Quote:
Agree with Psylenz. Even as is there's a fair number powers I'd slot different even if I were to make a buff/heal bot build ... Fort, for example, I would ED cap for both Def (first) and To Hit (second). And pretty much no matter how you slice it Medicine pool is a total waste of power choices and slots for an Empath of any stripe.
|
Originally Posted by Psylenz
Personally, even on a team-only build I find a buff only build to be parasitic and non-optimal. If you took JUST ball lightning and short circuit instead of aid other and aid self, you could contribute AoE damage, and modest endurance drain. What in Statesman's name would you do with a spawn if you tp'd it to you and had no attacks? Resurrect and Resuscitation? Both? Are you planning to miss with heal aura and heal other?
Also consider the nuke. You can target from around a corner and dispatch stacks of foes without them being able to target you. I know you were going for a gimmick, and I wouldn't kick a teammate for this build on a team, but I would think twice before inviting to a taskforce. It wouldn't be worse than an empath that didn't use powers they had. |
Burnout works best with long recharge powers that you need up NOW. Controllers I could see would love it, those with powers on huge timers mostly. I doubt melee classes would get much use from it.
The one thing you need to remember is it's costly to use. Your endurance gets cut by 1/4 for one minute, costs HALF YOUR END TO USE and is on it's own HUGE timer. It's not a power you can use at anytime, you need to know WHEN to use it. It's also hard to use mid-battle unless you have some blue skittles stocked up, as you'll liable be using your end to surivie whatever onslaught needs that one power up right now.
That being said, when it's used with forethought, it is awesome.
Quote:
Not to be killjoy, but ran an all TA user STF a few years back and 8 slicks at once is pretty disappointing. There are only two scenarios that happen, first 2 slicks kill standard enemy group instantly and 6 slicks go wasted OR you stack them on an AV and...only succeed to negate out it's regen, but killing is still painfully slow. Now 8 freezing rains is different story, because how powerful -res stacking is naturally.|
Originally Posted by Psylenz
I would have combined the 4 TAs with 4 empaths for max buffing and max debuffing. More than 8 oil slicks seems overkill. The AB boost on all the team would be something in itself to witness. Now consider with burnout and AB how many fortitudes the team could stack
|
As for Burnout, I find it most useful on long recharge powers that can miss allies/enemies (like Heat Loss) or double stacking AoE holds/stuns on doms/controllers in a pinch. It's long recharge makes it more useful for emergencies than min/max efficiency imo.
Not to burst your bubble Ski, but TA does the same amount of -resistance as Storm and 1000 more -regen than Storm. However, against an AV Storm can deal more damage than OSA can easily, but that's 400 damage base for tornado + lightning storm damage on top of your own damage versus 250 damage base for OSA + -1000% regen from EMP Arrow.
Cold Dom would be a better case to argue since it has Heat Loss added in there, so -60% resistance and -500% regen, not to mention the added +def from shields than the other two have to to-hit debuff to attempt to achieve.
Special note: TA Defenders (40%) do more -resistance than Storm Defenders (35%) do, while Cold Dom Defenders remain the same at 60%.
50s: Bla- Arch/Mental Cont- Mind/FF, Earth/Cold, Ill/Therm, Earth/Rad Dominator- Plant/Psi, Elec/Earth Corr- Fire/Storm, Arch/Sonic, Rad/Kin, Beam/Sonic, Psi/Time Stalker- Elec/SR Def- Storm/Dark, Emp/Psi, Dark/Elec, FF/Arch, TA/Ice, TA/Elec, Kin/AR, Cold/DP, Traps/Psi Scrap- Fire/Shield Tanker- Dark/Mace, Ice/Kin Brute- Claws/WP, SS/Energy, BS/Elec
I was thinking of all the debuff - purely debuffing set of TA with 4 empaths (for the 8 Adrenaline Boosts). Consider 8 Flash Arrows with the irresistible tohit debuff on a hard target.
Triumphant Defenders Forever
Psylenz FF/Psi, ArticQuark Storm/Rad, Symon BarSisyphus Bots/psn, Max VanSydow Thugs/Dk, Cyclone Symon Bots/stm, Blue Loki Ice/Cd, Widow 46526
HelinCarnate:OMG it is so terrible. I have the option to take 3 more powers but no additional slots. Boo F'ing hoo.
Quote:
I know it's a concept build, but still, builds like this are why Empaths are bottom of my buff/debuff preference list when I'm recruiting a PUG. Yes, lower than Poison.|
Originally Posted by Mingsura
OH TEH HUMANITY
|
A more effective pacifist concept would have more than just heals and buffs going on. Get some debuffs and mezzes in there, too. This game loves and rewards generalists, because you don't give up any effectiveness in Power A by taking, slotting and using a completely different Power B.
Something along the lines of Emp/Dark or Emp/Sonic will do nicely. Or any other defender secondary with decent mezzes and debuffs. Or any flavor of /Emp controller you like. No teammate will ever complain if you skip the damage slotting on mez & debuff powers for concept purposes. Indeed, some "damage" powers can turn into real debuff or mez beasts if you slot for that purpose.
For example, spamming defender strength Tenebrous Tentacles and Night Fall when they're slotted for debuff, range, and recharge, instead of the usual lousy range, lousy recharge Positron's Blast set? That'll put a significant dent in up to 10 enemies' damage output. Plus stop them from running around and being generally annoying. Other hidden debuff gems in defender secondaries include: Tesla Cage, Short Circuit, Psychic Scream, Psionic Tornado, Howl, Bitter Ice Blast... and many more.
Quote:
You miss the point of what I was saying. 8 slicks only has as much value as 2-3 slicks because anything beyond that is overkill for standard mobs and 8 slicks at once is mediocre against high HP targets. 8 Freezing Rains scale the same way against all targets and has even greater value against high hp targets. I wasn't making a set comparison in my previous post, just a comparison between slick and AoE -res powers.
|
Originally Posted by StormyDarkness
Not to burst your bubble Ski, but TA does the same amount of -resistance as Storm and 1000 more -regen than Storm. However, against an AV Storm can deal more damage than OSA can easily, but that's 400 damage base for tornado + lightning storm damage on top of your own damage versus 250 damage base for OSA + -1000% regen from EMP Arrow.
Cold Dom would be a better case to argue since it has Heat Loss added in there, so -60% resistance and -500% regen, not to mention the added +def from shields than the other two have to to-hit debuff to attempt to achieve. Special note: TA Defenders (40%) do more -resistance than Storm Defenders (35%) do, while Cold Dom Defenders remain the same at 60%. |
Besides, trying to do a serious comparison between an all storm superteam and an all trick arrow superteam would be silly. Either way, everything dies.
I was running a TF with a friend recently and commented on how I really liked his Emp/Dark toon. He sent me a copy of it on MIDS so I could check it out since hes pretty proud of how well it plays too.
I have been playing around with Burnout on some new builds and I remade his toon based on my own playstyle. My question is can you double stack powers like Regeneration/Recovery Aura by using Burnout? I know its probably overkill, Im just curious on whether it woud work or not.
Ive asked a similiar question in the past about how you can tell what powers are stackable in this way with Burnout, got an answer...but after I took a look at the suggestion in game, I still couldnt figure it out.
As always, thanks in advance.
"Forum PvP doesn't give drops. Just so all of you who participated in this thread are aware." -Mod08-
"when a stalker goes blue side, assassination strike should be renamed "bunny hugs", and a rainbow should fly out" -Harbinger-