Haha, good luck with that.
I would consider re-upping my subs if the spammers disappeared.
Bear in mind though, in my experience of submitting 30 emails some days on just 1 server, that the powers that be for CoH/CoV have not dealt with this problem for at least 5 years (the length of time I have had both of my accounts).
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This is a technical issue why?|
Originally Posted by OMGMOREDEBT
The old free trial, pre f2p, you could not email or send tells until lvl 10. Why not do that with f2p? Too easy? It seemed to cut down on the spammers drastically. And if f2p players have something to say about it, they can subscribe.
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By the way, free accounts already cannot send tells or emails.
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But it did decrease when they limited it to lvl ten. Of course.....They made lvl 10 toons instead of lvl two toons, but it did decrease it. And WW prices did slightly decline as well...
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Originally Posted by afocks
Haha, good luck with that.
I would consider re-upping my subs if the spammers disappeared. Bear in mind though, in my experience of submitting 30 emails some days on just 1 server, that the powers that be for CoH/CoV have not dealt with this problem for at least 5 years (the length of time I have had both of my accounts). |
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Ok...I stand corrected. |
Originally Posted by Hopeling
This is a technical issue why?
By the way, free accounts already cannot send tells or emails. |
Then maybe confine f2p to lfg chat? Where there is a will there is a way. And if nothing changes nothing changes.....Stand Stand in any WW any time of day, and you'll see them broadcasting in local to go to thier site.
And cut and dried flame my post when your paying 1 mil for iron in 3 months.
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and for the record its not just for Tech issues its for Gameplay / Technical Issues & Bugs, and its a game play issue since it inadvertently effect the markets.
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Originally Posted by OMGMOREDEBT
Ok...I stand corrected.
Then maybe confine f2p to lfg chat? Where there is a will there is a way. And if nothing changes nothing changes.....Stand Stand in any WW any time of day, and you'll see them broadcasting in local to go to thier site. And cut and dried flame my post when your paying 1 mil for iron in 3 months. |
What LFG chat? There's no LFG channel. That's why /help is often used to form teams.
Taking away local chat would be pretty absurd, though.
This is not an easy problem to fix, and there's often a direct tradeoff between how well you prevent gold spammers and how well you drive away new players. I mean, make no mistake, I am in principle all for the removal of gold spammers, but there's no good way I've ever seen to actually do it.
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I do agree with you there. When talking to a GM, about one of the several reports that I made I can't quote them due to TOS, but they did hint to there being something done about them in future updates, whether that happens or not is still debatable since in the last few years, not much really has. I will say however that previous to f2p it wasnt as bad as it is now.
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Originally Posted by Hopeling
What LFG chat? There's no LFG channel. That's why /help is often used to form teams.
Taking away local chat would be pretty absurd, though. This is not an easy problem to fix, and there's often a direct tradeoff between how well you prevent gold spammers and how well you drive away new players. I mean, make no mistake, I am in principle all for the removal of gold spammers, but there's no good way I've ever seen to actually do it. |
Im just sick of being an inventor and watching prices go up up up and in the meantime the devils advocate standing behind me going 1000 million 14 bucks! Seems like a connection.
if people didn't pay for the services, there wouldn't be any. Only way to stop the advertising/selling of in game currency is to not pay for it. Unfortunately you can't control that on a global scale, it's up to the individual.
http://www.scene-and-heard.com/cov/covsig.jpg
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I do believe in the past with some game service that they actually drag people into court for this type of thing. Because they're selling what technically is not theirs to begin with.
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Originally Posted by Scene_EU
if people didn't pay for the services, there wouldn't be any. Only way to stop the advertising/selling of in game currency is to not pay for it. Unfortunately you can't control that on a global scale, it's up to the individual.
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First, WRT hero side being 'hot' -- They lie. Sure, it *could* be hot. But they could also be lying. Because they are engaged in an illegal and immoral venture, don't presume anything they say is the truth. Why would truth telling be their one and only virtue?|
Originally Posted by OMGMOREDEBT
I am not going to go as far as to mention company names because that would only be promoting the problem, but some may or may not agree: but they have to go. ON one of their sites it shows hero side as "hot" which means theyre doing ALOT of business.
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Second, run a virus scan on your computer. These sites love to engage in a side business of selling email lists. And so, they'll get your email and all the email contacts stored on your computer not only if you're dumb enough to use their services and give it to them, but if they can infect your computer and simply take it... so much the better.
Third, I'm sure this doesn't apply to you, but I'm mentioning this for all the dear readers out there: Giving an illegal enterprise your credit card number or your game password (so they can level your toon up or transfer INF to you) is a sign that you need to be checked for neurological damage of your brain. They will eventually use your credit card or your game account for their own purposes. There is no honor among thieves.
Speeding Through New DA Repeatables || Spreadsheet o' Enhancements || Zombie Skins: better skins for these forums || Guide to Guides
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Originally Posted by OMGMOREDEBT
I do believe in the past with some game service that they actually drag people into court for this type of thing. Because they're selling what technically is not theirs to begin with.
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Try getting jurisdiction over a Chinese gold seller.
Not
Going
To
Happen
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
The # of RMTers you see in Help varies greatly depending on server population. I primarily play on Justice, and on average, I see maybe one or two a day in the Help Channel anymore. I report them as spammers the second I see them (it's a dropdown function - click on their name, select Report as Spammer, and voila - they are a) added to your ignore list, and b) an automatic notification is sent to the GMs).
The GMs do use these notifications and shut down accounts, plus they continue to improve their own internal filters to catch them or even prevent them forming accounts.
But the single best way to get them to stop?
Stop using their services.
(This is not meant to accuse the OP - this is a blanket statement.)
When the RMTers realize there is no money to be made here in COH, they will go elsewhere, because their ROI (Return on Investment) in COH will suck versus what they could be making elsewhere.
So report them, then ignore them. Teach other new players how to do the same. And before long, we'll be back to our virtually RMT-free environment once more.
Michelle
aka
Samuraiko/Dark_Respite
Dark_Respite's Farewell Video: "One Last Day"
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
MA Arcs - 3430: Hell Hath No Fury / 3515: Positron Gets Some / 6600: Dyne of the Times / 351572: For All the Wrong Reasons
378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)
THE COURSE OF SUPERHERO ROMANCE CONTINUES!
Book I: A Tale of Nerd Flirting! ~*~ Book II: Courtship and Crime Fighting - Chap Nine live!
MA Arcs - 3430: Hell Hath No Fury / 3515: Positron Gets Some / 6600: Dyne of the Times / 351572: For All the Wrong Reasons
378944: Too Clever by Half / 459581: Kill or Cure / 551680: Clerical Errors (NEW!)
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Never say die. NcSoft is also in Korea and there are such things as International Business Law. |
Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
Try getting jurisdiction over a Chinese gold seller.
Not Going To Happen |
Niether here nor there, the original lawsuit started with a Chinese gold vendor that ended up linking back to a us based gold vendor...just saying.
Anyhow, I would definitely look at the case before making a snap assumption, but once it did link back, they settled.
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makes sense except the investment is 0 on thier end, 3 reported yesterday and iggied and within 4 mins same moron was back in ww's boting. I suppose that the time to get the money is an investment but if theyre selling 1000 million for 14 bucks, I highly doubt their hurting for influence. That is if they really HAVE influence to begin with....
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Originally Posted by Dark_Respite
The # of RMTers you see in Help varies greatly depending on server population. I primarily play on Justice, and on average, I see maybe one or two a day in the Help Channel anymore. I report them as spammers the second I see them (it's a dropdown function - click on their name, select Report as Spammer, and voila - they are a) added to your ignore list, and b) an automatic notification is sent to the GMs).
The GMs do use these notifications and shut down accounts, plus they continue to improve their own internal filters to catch them or even prevent them forming accounts. But the single best way to get them to stop? Stop using their services. (This is not meant to accuse the OP - this is a blanket statement.) When the RMTers realize there is no money to be made here in COH, they will go elsewhere, because their ROI (Return on Investment) in COH will suck versus what they could be making elsewhere. So report them, then ignore them. Teach other new players how to do the same. And before long, we'll be back to our virtually RMT-free environment once more. Michelle aka Samuraiko/Dark_Respite |
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I am soooo happy that I can /ah and /vault.
| The go through the tutorial, then park a toon in every ww's on every server. |
"Sorry bucko, but CoH and CoV are the same game." -BackAlleyBrawler
"Silly villain, CoX is for Heroes!" -Saicho
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You don't use AE?|
Originally Posted by OMGMOREDEBT
And cut and dried flame my post when your paying 1 mil for iron in 3 months.
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Run mission.
Roll for common salvage. Stock up on what you need, dump what you don't.
Get your salvage, and get some cash, while getting XP (if under 50) and more cash. Don't even need to be a farmer to do it.
That said, this was a non-issue (RMTers, that is) until Freedom. F2P (even our "hybrid" model) attracts this sort of scum like flies to a honeywagon. You can thank them for a fair number of the restrictions in place already.
Wanted: Origin centric story arcs.
If you've only played an AT once (one set combo) and "hate" it - don't give up. Roll a different combo. It may just be those sets not clicking for you.
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Which most of these Chinese vendors care ****-all about.|
Originally Posted by OMGMOREDEBT
Never say die. NcSoft is also in Korea and there are such things as International Business Law.
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Niether here nor there, the original lawsuit started with a Chinese gold vendor that ended up linking back to a us based gold vendor...just saying. Anyhow, I would definitely look at the case before making a snap assumption, but once it did link back, they settled. |
Now imagine this for every hydra head that pops up.
And how much cash they'd burn through in legal fees. Cash that can be going towards product development.
It is not economically feasible to go after gold sellers.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
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Broadcast and local are two seperate channels. Free players get access to Help, Local and Team. If you limited free players anymore, you'd start losing potential paying customers. The ignore for spammage system really is the best option, short of a GM going all draconian and banning IP's/accounts of sellers and even buyers. I think the EULA allows for it, but if it did happen, they'd be outrage from unaffected, legitimate players (as humans like to complain about something).|
Originally Posted by OMGMOREDEBT
Ok...I stand corrected.
Then maybe confine f2p to lfg chat? Where there is a will there is a way. And if nothing changes nothing changes.....Stand Stand in any WW any time of day, and you'll see them broadcasting in local to go to thier site. And cut and dried flame my post when your paying 1 mil for iron in 3 months. |
A while back (just after the last DXP Weekend), Rubies were selling for over 1 million each. It had nothing to do with companies selling inf, it was because of me experimenting with the market and driving the price to ridiculous amounts for a couple of days. Inf sellers aren't in WW to affect salvage prices, they're their because it's a guaranteed area for traffic. High prices are due to people with too much time on their hands, or people with no patience.
If Iron was selling for 1 million, I'd cash in AE tickets on common salvage rolls (Average cost is 36 tickets, I think) and profit from it with hardly any effort.
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They presumably must pay their staff - even if it's bots doing the actual spamming, somebody has to code and maintain that. They also have to pay for the computers they're spamming from, the power for those computers, the building the computers are in, etc. So no, costs on this are not zero. Even if they were, it was a question of return on investment - if they can make peanuts here, or make more elsewhere for the same cost, they'd leave.|
Originally Posted by OMGMOREDEBT
makes sense except the investment is 0 on thier end, 3 reported yesterday and iggied and within 4 mins same moron was back in ww's boting. I suppose that the time to get the money is an investment but if theyre selling 1000 million for 14 bucks, I highly doubt their hurting for influence. That is if they really HAVE influence to begin with....
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Also, 1000 million is a billion inf. That's not even very much, these days. Prices have risen steadily since the market was introduced, because the game has no meaningful inf sinks. Money enters the economy, but never really leaves, so prices go up and up and up. This would happen even with no gold sellers at all.
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| (OP) Never say die. NcSoft is also in Korea and there are such things as International Business Law. |
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Originally Posted by Hyperstrike
Which most of these Chinese vendors care ****-all about.
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(OP) Niether here nor there, the original lawsuit started with a Chinese gold vendor that ended up linking back to a us based gold vendor...just saying. Anyhow, I would definitely look at the case before making a snap assumption, but once it did link back, they settled. |
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And they were back weeks later under a new name. Now imagine this for every hydra head that pops up. And how much cash they'd burn through in legal fees. Cash that can be going towards product development. It is not economically feasible to go after gold sellers. |
Regarding international law - yeah, that's really more of an agreement between nations that there are certain rules that "everyone" will follow, provided, of course, that everyone signs on. And the Chinese pretty much don't sign on, so anyone trying to "enforce" international contract or intellectual property "law" is hosed when dealing with them.
Altoholic - but a Blaster at Heart!
Originally Posted by SpyralPegacyon
"You gave us a world where we could fly. I can't thank you enough for that."
This is the one of the two main reasons why I jumped to the Exalted server the day it opened. Despite being the #3 server population wise, haven't had a single gold vendor there yet as far as I'm aware of. VIP server ftw.
@Celestial Lord and @Celestial Lord Too
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Not that it really matters, but the one I saw a couple weeks ago wasn't a bot.|
Originally Posted by Hopeling
even if it's bots doing the actual spamming
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Created new Titan Weapon character, decided to run the new tutorial. Was claiming rewards, setting up macros, arranging powers, etc., etc., and saw a gibberish name log in. Just when I noticed and started wondering if it was a spammer, they tossed their message up on /hc. As I clicked Ignore as Spammer, they turned to me and tossed me a present via Holiday Cheer, then immediately logged out.
A bot wouldn't know to find somebody to use Holiday Cheer on. I suppose it may have been an attempt to drum up good press for their site, and I appreciate the free gift (I think I got a Summon SnowBeast?), but it didn't stop me from Ignoring, and I'm still resolute that I'll never use their or any similar service.
The ones that publicly advertise seem to be quick throwaway characters / accounts, but from my experience they have a person physically at the machine logging it on, and that takes (at least a little) time & effort.
Players: Keep reporting them as spammers, and never patronize their services. Devs: keep working on methods that cut into their profit margins. Eventually the money may not be worth the time taken, and you won't see any more of these (or at least not as many).
In the meantime, anybody tempted to pay for inf should instead check the market forums for guides and pay attention to pricing of items on the auction house. While sometimes I hate paying prices for some of the items I want, I've never had to avoid any but the most expensive recipes on the market, 'cause inf is not hard to come by with a little experience.
And if it's xp / levels somebody wants, try running with a static or regular group, like the Justice Superteamers (current team here) I've been running with for a couple years now. We run a new theme group every few months, on Friday / Sunday nights. Everybody who is able to show up at least once per week on one of those nights is guaranteed to hit 50 within those few months, and have a ton of fun in the process. Likely end up with some good drops and inf they can send alts along the way as well.
. . . Huh, I didn't originally intend that post to evolve into a shameless plug.
Guess that's just where my mind is now that we're discussing the new theme. Keep an eye on the Justice server forum if interested, we'll probably post details within a month or so when we've figured it out.
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Hell, one of my clients actually found out that someone had copied their entire COMPANY (we're talking a company of over 1000 people, not a 1-man job by a guy sitting behind a desk in his home office) over in China and was selling under their aegis. They were essentially selling near-perfect copies of the company's products, and they only found out when one of "their" products came back with a SKU they didn't actually produce.|
Originally Posted by Ad Astra
Kinda like the situation where someone tries to hold back the sea by building a wall at the shore - only the waves just go around the ends of the wall anyway.
Regarding international law - yeah, that's really more of an agreement between nations that there are certain rules that "everyone" will follow, provided, of course, that everyone signs on. And the Chinese pretty much don't sign on, so anyone trying to "enforce" international contract or intellectual property "law" is hosed when dealing with them. |
It took massive amounts of time and money to shut them down.
Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.
I am not going to go as far as to mention company names because that would only be promoting the problem, but some may or may not agree: but they have to go. ON one of their sites it shows hero side as "hot" which means theyre doing ALOT of business.
So lets look at this logically:I don't have a problem with farmers. They actually WORK for their INF. But when lazy people that just buy 1000 million for 15 bucks go into wentworths and go crazy buying rares, and have a lvl 50 in 10 hours because some company PL's them and then gives them that much money, is that actually fair to people that played this game for 1,2,3 -7 years previous to the pointless free to play module? I think not.
IN addition, I understand that the f2p model is what it is: a marketing gimmick and a cash cow for NCSoft. Works the same way for the gold sellers.
They pay nothing. The go through the tutorial, then park a toon in every ww's on every server.
This is where the f2p module is an epic fail.
So heres a suggestion:
The old free trial, pre f2p, you could not email or send tells until lvl 10. Why not do that with f2p? Too easy? It seemed to cut down on the spammers drastically. And if f2p players have something to say about it, they can subscribe.
When the spammer spam was cut down with that free trial limitation, an observation I made personally was that the auction prices declined slightly, not much but slightly.
Just food for thought and thanks for your time.
PS: And for the record before anyone goes "just ignore as spammer" and/or "report them"...epic fail....you reportthem they get kicked and back in 3 minutes on a new lvl 2. Just thought I'd save you some typing.