What Powers Accept ACC but Don't Need It?
By
Adeon Hawkwood,
Posted on: 2011-07-12 17:46 in Archetypes and Powers General Discussion
I don't think there is a solid list, although City of Data has the information:
http://tomax.cohtitan.com/
Powers I know of that meet that criteria:
Flash Arrow (only needs it in PvP)
Smoke Grenade (-perception is auto-hit, the - to hit is not)
Poison Gas Trap (doesn't accept normal accuracy enhancements but does benefit from set IO accuracy enhancements for the initial hold)
FYI: Acid Arrow is not auto-hit at all.
Taunt?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Taunt needs Acc in PvP.
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Originally Posted by PapaSlade
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It does.|
Originally Posted by Rangle M. Down
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Taunt needs Acc in PvP.
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In PvE it's autohit.
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More specifically, Taunt for Brutes and Tankers, Confront (and its renamed variations) for Scrappers, and the Taunt in Dwarf form for Kheldians are all auto-hit in PVE, but require a hit roll in PVP.|
Originally Posted by Oedipus_Tex
Taunt?
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The two taunts found in the Presence Pool always require a hit roll, even in PVE.
@Roderick
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Originally Posted by Smiling_Joe
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My Black Dwarf taunt power always seems to miss at least ONE target in PVE.
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Originally Posted by Roderick
More specifically, Taunt for Brutes and Tankers, Confront (and its renamed variations) for Scrappers, and the Taunt in Dwarf form for Kheldians are all auto-hit in PVE, but require a hit roll in PVP.
The two taunts found in the Presence Pool always require a hit roll, even in PVE. |
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Originally Posted by Shubbie
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Originally Posted by Roderick
More specifically, Taunt for Brutes and Tankers, Confront (and its renamed variations) for Scrappers, and the Taunt in Dwarf form for Kheldians are all auto-hit in PVE, but require a hit roll in PVP.
The two taunts found in the Presence Pool always require a hit roll, even in PVE. |
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Originally Posted by DarkSideLeague
My Black Dwarf taunt power always seems to miss at least ONE target in PVE.
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Tanker Taunt, Brute Taunt and Scrapper Confront are all autohit in PvE but require a tohit roll in PvP. Considering the PvP vs PvE population I'd just as soon that they removed the ability to slot accuracy in those powers altogether; the fact that you CAN slot accuracy leads many to think that they NEED to when they're actually wasting a slot.
Another oddball power is the Stone Armor aura Mud Pots; the taunt component is autohit but the damage component has a tohit roll. I believe there are several other similar powers.
COH has just been murdered by NCSoft. http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
Tornado may qualify. If I'm understanding the CoD entry for it correctly, there are no aspects of the power that require a tohit check. It doesn't take straight accuracy enhancements, but most of the sets it takes include accuracy, and it even takes Accurate Defense Debuff sets.
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Really? I thought it was a clone of the Tank/Brute version (I don't play Khelds, so no personal experience there). Does that mean that they don't get the -range in their taunt either?
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Originally Posted by Call Me Awesome
Keldian Dwarf taunt is a port of the Presence Pool power Provoke and is NOT autohit in PvE, it needs accuracy in order to be useful.
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@Roderick
Fulcrum shift... I think lol
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@spyder-
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Hmm, checking with Mid's it looks like at some point the accuracy of Dwarf Antagonize was raised and it also claims a -range now. I was not aware of those changes from when I leveled my Kelds; back then it was a near direct port of Provoke. I imagine that happened a few issues ago when Kelds were buffed. Looking at the Mid's numbers I'm tempted to dust off my pair of long retired 50 Kelds. |
Originally Posted by Roderick
Really? I thought it was a clone of the Tank/Brute version (I don't play Khelds, so no personal experience there). Does that mean that they don't get the -range in their taunt either?
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Here's the numbers for Dwarf Antagonize and Presence Pool Provoke:
Dwarf
Acc - 112.5%
MAG - 4
Duration - 35 seconds
-Range - 75%
Provoke
Acc - 75%
MAG - 4
Duration - 14 seconds
No -Range
I would still lean towards slotting an accuracy into Antagonize since you're likely to be facing a fair number of +2 or higher and you'll want it to hit.
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Originally Posted by _SPYDER_
Fulcrum shift... I think lol
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COH has just been murdered by NCSoft. http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
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The -range in Antagonize was added at the same time it was added for Taunt and Confront, in I13. As far as I am aware it has always had the 1.5 accuracy modifier, but I can say with certainty it predates I13.|
Originally Posted by Call Me Awesome
Hmm, checking with Mid's it looks like at some point the accuracy of Dwarf Antagonize was raised and it also claims a -range now.
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Ignite: The power accepts accuracy enhancements, but the pet it summons does not. Ignite itself is autohit, as a summon, so slotting accuracy does nothing for either aspect.
The pet summoned by Burn is the same, but accuracy does affect Burn's initial hit as that is dealt by the power itself.
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What are you basing that on? According to the CoD entry for Ignite and Burn, neither are autohit and both have 1.0 accuracy.
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Originally Posted by Wonderslug
Ignite: The power accepts accuracy enhancements, but the pet it summons does not. Ignite itself is autohit, as a summon, so slotting accuracy does nothing for either aspect.
The pet summoned by Burn is the same, but accuracy does affect Burn's initial hit as that is dealt by the power itself. |
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Ignite, the power, accepts accuracy. Ignite, the power, is autohit, as powers that do nothing but summon pets generally are.|
Originally Posted by Supernumiphone
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Pets_FlameThrower, which Ignite creates, and which you linked to, is not autohit and I did not intend to imply it was. It also accepts only damage enhancements.
Slotting accuracy enhancements in Ignite therefore has no effect the power Ignite, in itself, nor is that accuracy inherited by the entity it creates. This runs counter to the general expectation that summoned entities inherit the slotting of their parent powers.* Which was my point.
Burn, the power, has non-pet-related effects that do benefit from accuracy. Pets_Burn, which it summons, and which you also linked to, similarly does not accept accuracy enhancements and will not inherit their effects from Burn, the power.
* As far as I know it is still the case that Acc/whatever damage set IOs and acc/dam HOs will both skirt this limitation, as they are considered "damage" enhancement types regardless of what they actually enhance.
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Interesting, I leveled my PB back in issue 4 and leveled my WS most of the way in the issue 5-12 era. I know that at least at that time (pre-real numbers) I had considerable problems with accuracy on Antagonize and needed two accuracy SO's in it for it to be reliable.|
Originally Posted by Wonderslug
The -range in Antagonize was added at the same time it was added for Taunt and Confront, in I13. As far as I am aware it has always had the 1.5 accuracy modifier, but I can say with certainty it predates I13.
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I'll admit that I haven't played either in situations where Dwarf taunt was really critical in a long time; the PB was pretty much retired when issue 9 hit and the WS has been a "play a day or two, leave a month (year) or two" most of the rest of that time.
Apparently I'm largely basing my thoughts on Antagonize from the state of the power in the issue 4-8 era without realizing it.
COH has just been murdered by NCSoft. http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
Doesn't Taunt still require a to-hit check against AVs? Or am I mis-remembering?
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Nope, sorry. Fulcrum Shift uses accuracy.
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Originally Posted by _SPYDER_
Fulcrum shift... I think lol
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Taunt does NOT need a tohit check vs AV's, but normally autohit taunt auras like Invincibility, Against All Odds, Chilling Embrace and the like DO have a tohit check when facing an AV.|
Originally Posted by Cyclone_Jack
Doesn't Taunt still require a to-hit check against AVs? Or am I mis-remembering?
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It's another reason why Taunt is such a useful tool in tanking; for most things you can rely on your aura to do the heavy lifting but if you're facing an AV, especially a +level AV, you can't count on the aura holding the aggro.
COH has just been murdered by NCSoft. http://www.change.org/petitions/ncso...city-of-heroes
Flash Arrow and Glue Arrow are two that you don't need acc at all in pve but you need in pvp.
I think you are more interested in powers that can take acc but it is unnecessary to slot for acc because it hits so often?
Besides the auto-hit powers in pve, Ignite could be one of them but I would still put one acc if I am fighting +2 level.
Ignite, Rain of Fire, Freezing Rain may not need much +acc.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
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Though it is flagged strangely if I recall, making accuracy less of an issue. |
Originally Posted by SteelMountain
Nope, sorry. Fulcrum Shift uses accuracy.
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And I think the initial part is auto-hit? I have never, ever, ever seen that portion miss, but the part that jumps around from mob to mob might.
Hi All,
I haven't been able to find an answer to this question anywhere.
There are some powers that accept ACC enhancements, but a to-Hit check is only performed in PvP.
I'm looking for a list (or some way to tell so I can compile my own) of powers that accept ACC enhancements but do not need them for PvE.
Note: I'd also like to include a subsection of powers that have partial use for ACC enhancements (like Acid Arrow, which I believe the debuff is auto-hit and the negligible damage requires a to-hit check in PvE)
Thanks in advance!
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Nrg/Nrg Blaster - 50
Fire/Axe Tanker - 41
Claws/Invul Scrapper - 50
Earth/Emp Controller - 50
TA/A Defender - 50
Peacebringer - 50
Warshade - 50
Fire/Dark Corrupter - 50
Nrg/Nrg Brute - 50
Blade/Regen Stalker - 50
Ice/Ice Dominator - 50
Thug/Poison Mastermind - 50