Unemployment hits Coh/Cov


Adeon Hawkwood

 

Posted

I'll agree with one thing here, Dark Blast is one of the sets on the ever-growing list crying out for a bit of a rejig.


Pity our Powers team seem more focused on messing around with Leagues and super-overpowered-generic-well-powers instead.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grouchybeast View Post
Blasters all have so much recharge slotted, they were obsolete a month before I20 even came out.

Another funny story. Over the weekend I did 5 bafs and saw 3 blasters on leagues, 2 were mine


 

Posted

Maybe it was because I went from CoH to a few months over at WoW, but when I played my priest, I did a discipline priest. Easiest thing I did from lowbie land to mid 50s. When I was playing "healer", I always got a kick out of tossing my shield on the tank that did a portion of the damage back on the attacker, throwing a healing dot (WoW's regen since it doesn't actually have a regen part when in a battle) and then just going and helping wand down the troublesome enemy. I sometimes even had a chance to cast offensive spells and use my mana for that.

Then again, I went from CoH to WoW and knew that buffing was under appreciated by most WoWites and knew what buffing could do in CoH and just crossed some tactics over. Discipline Priest soloing 5-7 equal to +5 level enemies solo? Easy. Just give me a jug of water afterwards.

Edit: This is what Empaths should be doing. Buff those who need it, give regen for the times people get hit, and blast away. Buffing depending on various factors.


50s: Bla- Arch/Mental Cont- Mind/FF, Earth/Cold, Ill/Therm, Earth/Rad Dominator- Plant/Psi, Elec/Earth Corr- Fire/Storm, Arch/Sonic, Rad/Kin, Beam/Sonic, Psi/Time Stalker- Elec/SR Def- Storm/Dark, Emp/Psi, Dark/Elec, FF/Arch, TA/Ice, TA/Elec, Kin/AR, Cold/DP, Traps/Psi Scrap- Fire/Shield Tanker- Dark/Mace, Ice/Kin Brute- Claws/WP, SS/Energy, BS/Elec

 

Posted

I wonder what this crowd's reaction will be when Keyes is released and empaths (and regen, poor crippled regen) have a field day with it.


 

Posted

As a long time Empathy defender player, I can certainly say the set has had its ups and downs over time.

However, now, for me, is the best time to be an Empath.

Reasons?

Who else can cover the taunting tank on a BAF? Not every Brute/Tank/Scrap is hitting 60% def. That Fort buff, and AP/HO keep him/her alive while they pull. Shield defenders can't do much more than bubble. Dark/Rad/TA... To debuff Seige they have to get close and risk aggro from adds. I haven't seen a defender brave enough to try that yet! (not saying it hasn't been done!!)

Who else can stick close to the lead Brute/Tank in the "grab" phase of a Lambda? Make sure they get all those goodies without a scratch. Again, Fort, AB, Heals & Auras all help here. Those AOE debuffs just pull aggro.

In normal play - you now have new toys! Pets that do damage, and that you can buff, Judgement powers to do lots of damage! Perma-mez protection! My Empathy defender was promoted from "support" to "contributor" in my eyes with Incarnate abilities. Far from being dead, I feel this is now a viable set. I can do Carnie tip missions without a tray of break frees!!

There is a lot of high level content where a single AV/Boss can give a tank/brute trouble. And whilst a lot of toons are equipped to deal with it, not every toon is. And when they do bite off more than they can chew, I'm there to help. My Brute, for example, is only just plodding through the incarnate grind. He has no level shift, and against the 54 mobs in the trials, he dies. A lot. He's not IO'd to the max, and isn't very tough.

Yet the other day, he puled Siege successfully. And why? Because there was an Empath on his shoulder all the way. AB, Fort, and healing top up was invaluable.

And if the team is eating everything it can see? Then I get to blast too and not feel like I'm a third rate blaster. Once I have Fortitude on everyone that is

Don't give up on your Empath. We never had it so good. Just remember, not everyone is IO'd to the hilt. Not everyone has a purpled out 'shade. And not everyone knows when they've bitten off more than they can chew.

-H


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laevateinn View Post
I wonder what this crowd's reaction will be when Keyes is released and empaths (and regen, poor crippled regen) have a field day with it.

I don't know, did tower buffed LR in stf justify the stone tank/empath combo ?


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laevateinn View Post
I wonder what this crowd's reaction will be when Keyes is released and empaths (and regen, poor crippled regen) have a field day with it.
Who is 'this crowd' and what exactly is the position they hold and how exactly is that position being shaken or affirmed by the usefulness of 'health buff' in Keyes?


Speeding Through New DA Repeatables || Spreadsheet o' Enhancements || Zombie Skins: better skins for these forums || Guide to Guides

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zombie Man View Post
Gloom is redundant.
Whaaaaat?


 

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Originally Posted by DoctorWhat View Post
... It's kind of sad to see Heals/Empathy become maybe not obsolete but almost pointless in anything besides situations like an STF's Tower Buffed Recluse....
A combination of Sonic and FF Bubbles can make the whole team into tanks, making a tank/healer less needed. This was in fact one of the first strategies we used for a tankless run in Beta for the STF. I tanked LR with a Res/Def Bubbled Dark/Dark/Dark. It wasn't the most successful run, but it was also one of our first attempts.

Sonic and FF Bubbles with Hamis can Cage the Towers and LR, making a tank/healer less needed. Caging runs are still bumpier than the standard trinity run, but that's more due to people not understanding them and listening and really believing in the instructions and differences. If I wanted to remake my STFer, I'd probably go with Illusion/Sonic or Mind/Sonic. FF is still a good choice too, but +resistance is more rare, and +defense is everywhere.

Illusion can use Phantom Army to make a tank/healer less needed for the STF.

A kiting/taunting Scrapper can make a tank/healer less needed for the STF.

So, really, the trinity was NEVER really "needed" for the STF, not even in beta.

On the iTrials, My Traps/Dark doesn't mind getting in close to give the Brute/Tank +defense. She can even solo a few crates herself, if she has to.

The truth is, empathy and trinity tactics were never really needed at all. It is simply a bit more obvious now. On the other hand, empathy has always been contributing to the teams, and will still contribute just as much as it always has. The only thing changed is the perception. Sure my squishies can out perform the average tank, but I still love a good dose of Fortitude and Auras making it that much safer and reliable, I still love having a tank along to take the pressure off of me, so I can concentrate more on offense. Maybe empathy is no longer the star it thinks it was, even going so far as to extort teams into paying them influence for the privilege of getting them to join the team; but maybe empathy was never that star to start with.

(yes, I've actually been on multiple teams over the years where the Stone Tank or Empath tried to extort influence from the rest of the team. If I was in charge those morons were swiftly booted, if I wasn't in charge I swiftly found other company to keep.)


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Laughing_Man View Post
As a long time Empathy defender player, I can certainly say the set has had its ups and downs over time.

However, now, for me, is the best time to be an Empath.

Reasons?

Who else can cover the taunting tank on a BAF? Not every Brute/Tank/Scrap is hitting 60% def. That Fort buff, and AP/HO keep him/her alive while they pull. Shield defenders can't do much more than bubble. Dark/Rad/TA... To debuff Seige they have to get close and risk aggro from adds. I haven't seen a defender brave enough to try that yet! (not saying it hasn't been done!!)

Who else can stick close to the lead Brute/Tank in the "grab" phase of a Lambda? Make sure they get all those goodies without a scratch. Again, Fort, AB, Heals & Auras all help here. Those AOE debuffs just pull aggro.

In normal play - you now have new toys! Pets that do damage, and that you can buff, Judgement powers to do lots of damage! Perma-mez protection! My Empathy defender was promoted from "support" to "contributor" in my eyes with Incarnate abilities. Far from being dead, I feel this is now a viable set. I can do Carnie tip missions without a tray of break frees!!

There is a lot of high level content where a single AV/Boss can give a tank/brute trouble. And whilst a lot of toons are equipped to deal with it, not every toon is. And when they do bite off more than they can chew, I'm there to help. My Brute, for example, is only just plodding through the incarnate grind. He has no level shift, and against the 54 mobs in the trials, he dies. A lot. He's not IO'd to the max, and isn't very tough.

Yet the other day, he puled Siege successfully. And why? Because there was an Empath on his shoulder all the way. AB, Fort, and healing top up was invaluable.

And if the team is eating everything it can see? Then I get to blast too and not feel like I'm a third rate blaster. Once I have Fortitude on everyone that is

Don't give up on your Empath. We never had it so good. Just remember, not everyone is IO'd to the hilt. Not everyone has a purpled out 'shade. And not everyone knows when they've bitten off more than they can chew.

-H
I appreciate all the feedback (good and bad) on my post but yours hits a point I had not thought of.
I am sure a respec will be coming soon but I will not delete my empath. I do wish I had chosen a diffenent blast power but it was my 2nd toon ever in the game and dark blast fit the story background on my toon.

Still I do play more the blast/buff style more right now.
You are right though not everyone is slotted out to the max on every team out there.
It may be harder to find but Im sure they would need the extra support. TY all for the thoughts
Moonbeem


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonbeem View Post
Just to clarify,

My post was to point out the lack of need of all the empathy powers in the teams and tf,s that I have currently been on.
Other may have been on teams which do need it and that is ok but I have not.

Endo needs. dont see em much anymore
defense needs. dont see em much anymore
healing or regeneration needs. dont see em much anymore
status protection needs ( aka-clear mind). dont see em much anymore.

The problem is the lack of need because most other toons have other ways of getting it on their own. which makes empathy dead weight and a defenders dmg (especaily dark like mine) is underwhelming in teams compared to most other archtypes. So I end up playing a different toon that has more effect on the team which brings me to my posting point.
unemployment for the empathy toon.
I read your initial post, and this response to what others stated. I gave it some thought, mainly from my own experience playing a blaster during the incarnate trials and some of the weekly tfs that I've run in the past few months.

My very first 50 is an emp/elec. I still play him, though not as often as my blaster(s) because I prefer blasting to buffing as a primary. And, I think you have a small point. My level 50 ice blaster has tier 4 in all the incarnate slots. And even before the level shift, with a purple inspiration, I could tank for about 31 seconds.

When I first started playing this game, I would always look for the empath, because the buffs and heals were something I understood, and could see the results more easily, and I never ran into a wall with AB like I did with the kin's SB. Lately, I don't look for any teammates because I find I just don't need them. Leveling is faster and easier for me when solo - if only because I don't have to wait for the teams to form (or to form them). (oops, I digressed)

Anyways, I think you have a small point, but now, you can learn to be a real defender instead of just using your primary. Sure, secondaries would be used in a secondary fashion, but if the primary support isn't needed, then use the secondaries.
In my opinion, at level 50, all the AT's should be self-sufficient. Teaming should be something we want to do, not something we must do.


"Most people that have no idea what they are doing have no idea that they don't know what they are doing." - John Cleese

@Ukase

 

Posted

I make judicious use of Dark Blast, Gloom, Moonbeam, Tentacles, and Life Drain. You're welcome to do the same, Dark Blast is a very fun secondary.

Heck, Empathy can actually afford to pick up Nightfall for a second AoE. I wish I could afford/fit it on my Stormie.


 

Posted

I love playing my Empathy/Sonic on iTrials. Fort on the Scrapper or Brute in my team, AB and Fort on Blaster, stand back while iXP rolls in. Rock the heal aura during AV scraps, and cycle my ST blasts for -Res, which is like +Dam for everyone in the League. Cast RAs in the middle of big groups - more of a constant bonus than the quickly-decaying Ageless/Rebirth Destiny!




Character index

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ukaserex View Post
In my opinion, at level 50, all the AT's should be self-sufficient. Teaming should be something we want to do, not something we must do.
Give all ATs access to mez protection and that might be possible, but for now, it isn't.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by rsclark View Post
Give all ATs access to mez protection and that might be possible, but for now, it isn't.
Clarion?


Mains (Freedom) @Auroxis
Auroxis - Emp/Rad/Power Defender Pylon Video Soloing an AV
Pelvic Thunder - SS/Elec/Mu Brute
Sorajin - Elec/Nin Stalker
Neuropain - Sonic/Mental/Elec Blaster

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Auroxis View Post
Clarion?
"At 50" is not synonymous with "incarnate".


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison View Post
Yes it is possible.

Break frees. They drop at any level.
The problem is using them to cover for a triple gimp, low damage, lack of status protection, and low hitpoints/survivability. Sure you can solo, you can also get all the incarnate abilities without running trials.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Another_Fan View Post
The problem is using them to cover for a triple gimp, low damage, lack of status protection, and low hitpoints/survivability.
Could you please spell out which AT you are describing again? Because none of them lack the capability to solo.

It looks like Stalker, but the status protection bit is throwing me off.


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Posted

You know... the OP is right to some extent. The more powerful individuals become, the less they need support. I'd say level 20-30 is really where this game shines as far as team play with a mix of power sets all contributing. Somewhere in the 30s people start to become more and more independent of each other, and eventually a well built anything can take on most of the game's challenging content without help. Instead of working hard to make it possible to succeed, it becomes a matter of how much you contibute to your team's speed of success. Because of this, in the end game, offensive buffs, debuffs, and damage seem to rule. If anyone becomes obsolete in the end game, I think it's the control focused builds and defensive buff sets.

To the OP... emp gives great offensive buffs. You're not obsolete.. you just can't see the results as clearly as you can with some other sets. And yet, to some extent you're also probably right. You may have more run playing another toon in the end game, or more fun playing your toon exemplared down.


I gotta make pain. I gotta make things right. I gotta stop what's comin'. 'Least I gotta try.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison View Post
Could you please spell out which AT you are describing again? Because none of them lack the capability to solo.

It looks like Stalker, but the status protection bit is throwing me off.
Amazing

Quote:
Sure you can solo, you can also get all the incarnate abilities without running trials.


 

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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison View Post
I was responding to what you meant, not just what you said. Nice try, though.
LOL, must be nice to have psychic powers in real life.

Or do you just bend reality so what other people say means what you would like it to ?

Edit: Im sorry there may be a comprehension problem at work. You see getting the incarnate abilities without doing the trials is entirely possible its just not a very desirable thing. I have toons that could have had tier 4 day 1 without doing a single trial its an option I didn't choose. You might not have been able to accomplish this, thus you would think it would be impossible.