Too Many Choices?


Bohmfalk

 

Posted

I have an RL friend who just came to CoH last week. He bought Going Rogue, and has already made a ton of characters, deleted them all, and started making characters again. He has yet to get above level 10 on any character. Last night he and I were discussing it and he made the comment that the game just has so many choices available he can't make up his mind what he wants to play. It's obvious from talking to him he's beginning to get frustrated with it. We even went through every AT and discussed each one in detail, in terms of both strengths and weaknesses.

My friend has also begun to complain about how "slow" low level characters are (I believe he means kill speed). I keep telling him that he needs to stick with something long enough to get at least to the SO range and he will see that issue resolve itself. This doesn't seem to have made much of an impression. Every night it's the same scenario: he makes up a new character, and I either exemp down to his level or SK him up to mine. He gets to 8 or 9, then makes something else the next night and the process starts over. At this point he's tried every AT, some of them more than once.

So how in the devil do I get him past this? If he would just stick with one character for a few days, long enough to get to the 20's, he would see that the pace of the game really picks up. Any ideas how I can help him get going? Or do I just need to grin and bear it while he rerolls constantly every single night? Normally I encourage people to try lots of alts, but he's actually burning himself out on the game entirely by cycling through so many characters so fast.


 

Posted

I had a friend who complained that "everything's the same." He had forty characters, none above level 10, at the time. He got whiney when it took him too long to get the reward of new levels.

I had another friend who, it looked like, was potentially going the same route. So we started the "get her a 50" plan: every Tuesday we were going to play the same characters from 8 till 10 PM, and we weren't going to play them any other days. (it mushroomed and now our novelty group with the Elvis impersonator and the jello shot waitress is a top 100 SG on Infinity, or was last time I looked.)

Sounds like part of the problem may be that he's seeing what you can do with your, level 50, tuned and heinous, character. His characters don't work like that! (I don't know if you're purpled or what, but exemplared characters have serious advantages over true new players- even if it's just Sands of Mu and modified SO's.)

Start a new character with him. Say something like "Do what you like the rest of the time, but on Tuesdays and Thursdays we're playing the Stomper Twins" [or whoever they are.] You'll be level 5 when he's level 5 and he won't feel like "maybe if I play a rad/sonic I can keep up THIS time".

It's a theory, maybe a bad theory, but it's the only one I've got.


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Posted

Fulmens makes some good points. Ironically, your friend's taking one of the game's real strengths (its variety and replay value) and making it into a liability. It sounds like you've already tried to strategize and get him invested into a character and that hasn't really worked. At this point I can think of a few possible course of action you might take...

  • Try to get him to commit to a single character. You know this person better than we do and it sound like you've already attempted this, but this is how most people with tons of characters eventually make it through to 50. Take it beyond 'toons' to characters and see if you can get him psyched about one particular character. For some people this means backstory, costume, and/or RP elements. For others it might mean designing the character's build out to the Nth degree and working out all the powers and slotting to have something on the horizon to build towards. If he's played other MMOs before, the concept of a "main" might be familiar to him.
  • Regular playtime. I think Fulmens has a good point about exemplared characters - if at all possible, try to play something his level that complements his choice. This may involve some sacrifice for you or you playing powersets and roles you mighrt not otherwise choose for yourself. If you do end up in a support role I recommend playing a buffer. Debuffers participate in combat and have direct effects on the enemy but as a buffer you work through your teammates. This may make him feel like the star and the 'real hero'. A bit childish, but may be effective.
  • Consider making low-level IOs for your friend's usage - especially if you happen to have a character with Field Crafter. Store them in the base for him. If he's the metagamer/OCD type and wants to work with you on Mids, you could get him a low-level build complete with low-level Sets and fund it yourself. A new player probably won't have the investment or the patience to research, buy up and craft Sets himself even if you provided the inf, but if you do it for him it may have an impact.

Naturally, the danger in all of this is that you may hook your friend on the game only to have him entirely dependent on you and your enabling to have fun. It's up to your discretion how much behind-the-scenes work is acceptable to ensure your friend enjoys himself and how much is just him taking advantage of you.

In any event, best of luck to you both.


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Posted

Sounds like he's seeing your level 50 characters in action and expecting his level 5 to be just as awesome.

In not getting anything past level 10, he hasn't gotten any powersets' signature powers yet.

Examples:

If he's played a scrapper, most of them haven't gotten their mez protection or sigbificant survivability yet.

A Fire Controller gets their signature power (Hot Feet) before it has the ability to actually utilize it effectively because it doesn't have Flashfire yet.

Tanks aren't particularly tough at level 8. He sees yours at 50 and wonders why his keeps dying.

It really sounds like your friend isn't realizing that they need to actually LEVEL these characters before they get good. No character will be as good at level 10 as they are at 50, because the majority of the good stuff is level 20 or above. By redoing the first 10 levels over and over, he's subjecting himself to the weakest point of any character's existence, and deleting them before they get a chance to show him what they can really do.

You need to find a way to convince him to stick with one character long enough to start getting the better powers and better enhancements. Seems like his mistake is constantly deleting them instead of keeping them around for later.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately.

 

Posted

Thanks for the tips guys.
I actually haven't run any of my seriously "IO'd out" characters with him, and did in fact start a new Brute on Friday. We were the same level for one day. I think the mistake I made was in playing the Brute on Saturday and jumping ahead of him. Perhaps when he rerolls again (tonight most likely ) I'll start another character and limit its play to only when he's on. That may help.


 

Posted

Might be worth level pacting with him for the next round of re-rolls. At the very least it will stop you from overtaking him, and might even help him get past the blahs of the early levels if you do a little extra leveling on the side. Just don't let your friend delete that character - he might want to shelve it for a while, but deleting it would make the pact pointless.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steel_Shaman View Post
I actually haven't run any of my seriously "IO'd out" characters with him
But you've played higher level characters exemped with him.

When you exemp a higher level character down, you are still getting 5 levels of powers that he doesn't have yet, regardless of how IOed the character in question is. Your character is better able to handle enemies of that level because you are using powers that aren't normally available at that level.

When he SKs his character up to your level, he is trying to play high level content with a character that doesn't have the ability to handle it yet. If you've ever fought Malta or Carnies SKed up with a lowbie, you know what I mean there.

If you can just convince him to stop deleting characters at the end of every play session he'll find that they will improve as he gets higher.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately.

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steel_Shaman View Post
So how in the devil do I get him past this? If he would just stick with one character for a few days, long enough to get to the 20's, he would see that the pace of the game really picks up. Any ideas how I can help him get going? Or do I just need to grin and bear it while he rerolls constantly every single night? Normally I encourage people to try lots of alts, but he's actually burning himself out on the game entirely by cycling through so many characters so fast.
Another point to consider (which I don't think's been mentioned so far) is whether or not this is your friend's first MMO or not. From what you describe it almost sounds like your friend is more used to a FPS/console mentality where you are pretty much instantly-uber as soon as you start playing. The whole idea of having to "level up a character" sounds foreign to him and that may be the source of his frustration.

Hopefully your friend will have the patience to stick to any character long enough to enjoy the game. But there's always the chance that the "pacing" of an MMO is just not going to be acceptable to him. *shrugs*


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lothic View Post
Another point to consider (which I don't think's been mentioned so far) is whether or not this is your friend's first MMO or not. From what you describe it almost sounds like your friend is more used to a FPS/console mentality where you are pretty much instantly-uber as soon as you start playing. The whole idea of having to "level up a character" sounds foreign to him and that may be the source of his frustration.

Hopefully your friend will have the patience to stick to any character long enough to enjoy the game. But there's always the chance that the "pacing" of an MMO is just not going to be acceptable to him. *shrugs*
This was my first thought too. Like how old is your friend and what type of games has he played before?


Teams are the number one killer of soloists.

 

Posted

Tell him not to delete toons, just roll an alt if he wants. There should be enough slots for him to make a new toon and maybe come back to his other toons after some break time..

Also, having some other buffers on the team will help him feel more powerful. Playing a larger team will help too with steam rolling along. A kinetic with speed boost will help him along too.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steel_Shaman View Post
Thanks for the tips guys.
I actually haven't run any of my seriously "IO'd out" characters with him, and did in fact start a new Brute on Friday. We were the same level for one day. I think the mistake I made was in playing the Brute on Saturday and jumping ahead of him. Perhaps when he rerolls again (tonight most likely ) I'll start another character and limit its play to only when he's on. That may help.
Yep... I'd say have him pick the AT he's liked the most, build something you like to compliment that AT, level pact the two of them right out of the box, call 'em the Smash Brothers and always play them together.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lothic View Post
Another point to consider (which I don't think's been mentioned so far) is whether or not this is your friend's first MMO or not. From what you describe it almost sounds like your friend is more used to a FPS/console mentality where you are pretty much instantly-uber as soon as you start playing. The whole idea of having to "level up a character" sounds foreign to him and that may be the source of his frustration.

Hopefully your friend will have the patience to stick to any character long enough to enjoy the game. But there's always the chance that the "pacing" of an MMO is just not going to be acceptable to him. *shrugs*
CoH will be his 3rd MMO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SerialBeggar View Post
This was my first thought too. Like how old is your friend and what type of games has he played before?
He's 31.
I think part of his problem is the idea that some AT/powerset combo's simply do not solo well at low levels. He seemed to not like it at all when I explained that certain Controller builds are absolute monsters at high levels but at low levels are rather slow and difficult to solo at times.

So while he is used to MMO gameplay, CoH's particular take on it is different enough from what he's accustomed to that it is throwing him for a loop.


 

Posted

Other have given some good advice like level pacting etc.

My advice is from the content side: take him in a group of 8 people on Flashfire's arc in the hollows on a weekend or other time when you can do all of the missions in one sitting.

Have a second character with a pre-loaded bank job mission and take him through that next (also get a team for it) without having to run the 5 radio missions that are rather boring and repetative.

Getting some of the juicy bits of the game under his belt will help get him attached to the character who pulled it off.

The Vazhilok Wasting disease is another good story to duo, but might be too high level.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steel_Shaman View Post
CoH will be his 3rd MMO. He's 31.

I think part of his problem is the idea that some AT/powerset combo's simply do not solo well at low levels. He seemed to not like it at all when I explained that certain Controller builds are absolute monsters at high levels but at low levels are rather slow and difficult to solo at times.

So while he is used to MMO gameplay, CoH's particular take on it is different enough from what he's accustomed to that it is throwing him for a loop.
Well to be fair the general concept that some "classes" work better at lower levels than other "classes" is a game mechanic that's been around for well over 30 years now. That was a core dynamic of Dungeons and Dragons back in the 70s and it's existed in some form in pretty much every other class-based RPG (table top or computer based) since.

Now obviously some games express that concept more strictly than others. But if your friend really finds the idea too "frustrating" in CoH then I'm not sure he's going to have much patience for any class-based MMO.

As I said before I wish him luck regardless. Since CoH was introduced 7 years ago the typical leveling speed in this game has become very quick relative to what it used to be. Not sure how anyone could ask for it to be any faster unless he just wants to PL an instant level 50, get instantly bored, and move on to something else. *shrugs*


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Posted

Have 'em roll a claws/regen scrapper :-)


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