More walls of text please!
Seems like you can't win Dazz, you try and do somethin' nice and you get people b*tchin' at you. 
I'll be happy with whatever comes out of this, just as long as we see some PvP events also.
My vote was to call yourselves CoC: Community of Champion
With the motto of "We've got 2 friends just hangin' around, waitin' to help you out!" 
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this! |
Originally Posted by ashcraft
totally agree with you here, silas. What dazz and others are trying to do is create a network of involvement.
We have plenty of people running events and helping the community here but many of them are disconnected. So, like dazz said, when one person has an idea, but no resources and another person has resourced, but no idea... Its very hard for them to connect. There needs to be some sore of group connection that they can both go to and create something together. The problem is that our only example of such a thing here is perc. Dazz is trying to put something different together but he isn't sure what structure will make it the most efficient with the least drama. That's what the survey is for. :-) |
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Originally Posted by silas
For example, that there should be a form of leadership. If you have one person in charge, people will complain they're an autocrat. If you have a commitee, people will complain that their particular needs aren't represented. Or that progress is hindered by endless debate and voting. If you have a huge council, there's the problem of some people having more of a say than others and even more potential for argument resulting in stuff not getting done.
If there is no leadership (because it's not even really a formalized group) people will complaint that it's not organized. I'm okay with that, in the sense of you get out of it what you put in. Everyone equal, everyone gets as much say/representation as they want. |
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That's where we differ. I don't think a group needs to be created, I don't think there needs to be any kind of leadership structure. At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I think what would be best would be if it was just a resource.|
Originally Posted by Dazz Marvelous
I think this is where I have trouble trying to imagine what the group looks like. That's why I have the survey. If we do indeed create a group, it has to at least have some structure and organization. I think that's what we need to figure out. Your statement echoes that quite well.
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In its simplest form, a dang ol list. People can sign up for whatever help they're willing to offer, people looking for help can contact those people.
Joe Moneybags wants to fund events but doesn't care to run them, he can sign up as a potential source of funds. Exciteypants McGiddy loves running events but is poor, he can talk to Joe. Creative John (parents not quite so creative) is broke and too shy to run events, he can approach McGiddy for help running it and Joe for cash.
No committees, no leadership, just a resource for the server. That's all it needs to be, given your stated goal in the OP. Whether what you want it to be something else is another matter.
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<---Not part of a group or commitee. Nor do I want to be at the risk of being alienated.
<--Will run events and try to maximize participation through intrests. Don't show, no worries.
<--Will support other events and show support when available. This is for PERC, non PERC, etc.
Global@SteelDominator
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I respectfully disagree with (what I feel are) some implied undertones in recent replies. What if Dazz...or Cherry...or I...or "Joe Champion" DOES want this to be more than just a simple list? What if there are people who want to be more proactive and organized than just hanging another sticky on the server forum? Does that make he/she/me/we/them self-serving? From the tone of some recent replies; it would appear to be implied as such. |
Originally Posted by Silas
That's where we differ. I don't think a group needs to be created, I don't think there needs to be any kind of leadership structure. At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I think what would be best would be if it was just a resource.
In its simplest form, a dang ol list. People can sign up for whatever help they're willing to offer, people looking for help can contact those people. Joe Moneybags wants to fund events but doesn't care to run them, he can sign up as a potential source of funds. Exciteypants McGiddy loves running events but is poor, he can talk to Joe. Creative John (parents not quite so creative) is broke and too shy to run events, he can approach McGiddy for help running it and Joe for cash. No committees, no leadership, just a resource for the server. That's all it needs to be, given your stated goal in the OP. Whether what you want it to be something else is another matter. |
I see that as community-serving; so I hope there is room for differences of opinion, here. I know that I prefer to make things happen; rather than wait around for circumstance (waiting for the right benefactor to sign up, a date to work between many involved parties, etc.).
I also have concerns about how a "simple list" would function, in application. If people want to donate funds, it has to be tracked by somebody, right? "You can use google spreadsheets!", you say? Good point. But then, who holds all the funds?
"Nobody does! People list as "Willing to Donate" and then people who want to throw events can pitch their ideas!". Another good idea; except that the reality of this situation would predicate everyone needing to post every event months in advance; and everyone who signed up to donate or judge would have to attend the day of, or the event would be short prizes or judges (because if they gave their money or votes ahead of time we're back to somebody having to hold it or count it).
And what of disagreements in a simple list event? Who is the tie-breaker; the public? A popularity contest to decide who wins and who doesn't? I see cause for concern there,as well.
Before this post hits "text wall" status; my point is, simply, that I think loose organization is not always such a bad thing. I also feel it can help things get done with speed, regularity, and organization. It's not about whose name goes on it; its just about organization and result.
I'm not correct; I'm just sharing my thoughts.
-Star
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While I like this idea in theory, in practice I don't think this would work the way it should. At the very least, you need someone to maintain this list, or it would end up just being a giant cluster ****.|
Originally Posted by Silas
That's where we differ. I don't think a group needs to be created, I don't think there needs to be any kind of leadership structure. At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I think what would be best would be if it was just a resource.
In its simplest form, a dang ol list. People can sign up for whatever help they're willing to offer, people looking for help can contact those people. Joe Moneybags wants to fund events but doesn't care to run them, he can sign up as a potential source of funds. Exciteypants McGiddy loves running events but is poor, he can talk to Joe. Creative John (parents not quite so creative) is broke and too shy to run events, he can approach McGiddy for help running it and Joe for cash. No committees, no leadership, just a resource for the server. That's all it needs to be, given your stated goal in the OP. Whether what you want it to be something else is another matter. |
Personally, what I would like to see is a collection of resources, taken care of by a committee (I'm using a very loose definition of committee here) so that rather than there being a gigantic list of "people you can possibly contact" you have a group of volunteers you can contact who help you run it, find people to help run it, help fund it from a "community chest" of sorts, help advertise it, etc. I included this in the survey, but I personally don't care if I see a "such and such committee presents" event every month, but that they're there to help people find the resources they need.
To use an analogy, when you need to do research and go to a library, you can search the card catalog yourself and come up with somethings, but you can also go to the reference librarian who can possibly help you find resources you never would've found on your own. Behind the scenes, the same librarians are the ones maintaining the card catalog so that the most current resources are available, and they're also checking to make sure that no two people want the same resource at the same time.
tl;dr: Silas' idea works, but it would probably get messy if there was no one actively maintaining it.
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Very good points, fair enough. I did say "in its simplest form", but even as say a forum post that gets updated it would have various issues. Like all of the information being maintained by just one person. |
Originally Posted by Stray Kitten
While I like this idea in theory, in practice I don't think this would work the way it should. At the very least, you need someone to maintain this list, or it would end up just being a giant cluster ****.
Personally, what I would like to see is a collection of resources, taken care of by a committee (I'm using a very loose definition of committee here) so that rather than there being a gigantic list of "people you can possibly contact" you have a group of volunteers you can contact who help you run it, find people to help run it, help fund it from a "community chest" of sorts, help advertise it, etc. I included this in the survey, but I personally don't care if I see a "such and such committee presents" event every month, but that they're there to help people find the resources they need. To use an analogy, when you need to do research and go to a library, you can search the card catalog yourself and come up with somethings, but you can also go to the reference librarian who can possibly help you find resources you never would've found on your own. Behind the scenes, the same librarians are the ones maintaining the card catalog so that the most current resources are available, and they're also checking to make sure that no two people want the same resource at the same time. tl;dr: Silas' idea works, but it would probably get messy if there was no one actively maintaining it. |
I suppose my amended view would be: keep it simple and straightforward, but don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.
I mean, I personally would. But that's just me
I couldn't advocate wholesale baby disposal as a Champion community stance. At least not while they're at full health. It wouldn't Scourge.
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I suggest we have this group of five lead the committee, and we call it 'The Pentaverate'
The Queen, The Vatican, The Gettys, The Rothschilds, and Colonel Sanders (before he went tits up)
Obviously, the Colonel's seat would need to be filled
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Originally Posted by Beetle_King
I suggest we have this group of five lead the committee, and we call it 'The Pentaverate'
The Queen, The Vatican, The Gettys, The Rothschilds, and Colonel Sanders (before he went tits up) Obviously, the Colonel's seat would need to be filled |
Go...fine. You've stayed your hour...
(Love that movie. You know what this thread needs? A large, over-sized poster of Atlantic City...)
-Star
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Ummm, i vote for Nator....|
Originally Posted by NATOR
I play the game to have fun, I come to events to hang out with others and have a good time. It seems that people won't like something, some will enjoy something else. No one is always happy, people will complain just to be a thorn in the side of others, and to get a reaction out of it. Can't we all just get along... PLEASE!!!
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peeps stumbling over each other's soggy eggos and slippery banter...
some looking to influence community thru social organizing, others skeptical about their intents of influence.... (is this politics?)
there's some knee jerk reactions, some bad blood/history, some still feeling alienated, and some not letting things go
a Some Peeps looking to positively influence others
b Some Peeps looking for assistance and guidance
c Some Peeps looking to run their own show w/o influence
d Some Peeps looking to be left the hell alone!
e Some looking to please
f Some looking to please themselves
g Some looking to just bellyache as usual
The answer is not to attempt to please all, cuz some may want your destruction! But do what you can in whatever way you can. Cuz some poor schmo is gonna be left out cuz he WANTED to be left out, but he's still gonna bellyache abou it. WHy? Refer to d & g....
What can that poor schmo do to right those wrong done upon him? RUn his own daggone show! Thats what. But quit the bellyaching & fussing for Pete's sakes lol. Offer up some constructive suggestions or run your own show. Dont need no one's permission or communal acknowledgement to do it.
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i think i love you |
Originally Posted by PHlRE
Ummm, i vote for Nator....
peeps stumbling over each other's soggy eggos and slippery banter... some looking to influence community thru social organizing, others skeptical about their intents of influence.... (is this politics?) there's some knee jerk reactions, some bad blood/history, some still feeling alienated, and some not letting things go a Some Peeps looking to positively influence others b Some Peeps looking for assistance and guidance c Some Peeps looking to run their own show w/o influence d Some Peeps looking to be left the hell alone! e Some looking to please f Some looking to please themselves g Some looking to just bellyache as usual The answer is not to attempt to please all, cuz some may want your destruction! But do what you can in whatever way you can. Cuz some poor schmo is gonna be left out cuz he WANTED to be left out, but he's still gonna bellyache abou it. WHy? Refer to d & g.... What can that poor schmo do to right those wrong done upon him? RUn his own daggone show! Thats what. But quit the bellyaching & fussing for Pete's sakes lol. Offer up some constructive suggestions or run your own show. Dont need no one's permission or communal acknowledgement to do it. |
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Originally Posted by CriticalKat
Lol. Dress like a badge was not a PERC cross-server event. It wasn't created by any one but an actual member of the Champion community who just so happened to be a PERC rep. If the event was not ran across all the servers that means it was a Champion event created by a Champion rep which is the case for most of the events you guys have seen. Huge events like Mr. & Mrs. that were ran across all 11 servers are the events that you can be negative about and possibly not be insulting someone on Champion who actually put time and effort in to trying to entertain you to have it not appreciated. That would account for maybe 20% of the PERC events you have seen ran in the last few years on Champion. The other 80% were events Champion organizers came up with for Champion.
There are some reps that are upset by their treatment in PERC, they quit. You guys showing your support of them by making comments that are negative about the organization made up of lots of wonderful people trying to provide you with events is lame. Especially when 80% of the events you have seen on Champion were created by Champion people for Champion people. Even the other 20% were ran by Champion people for Champion people whether they came up with the concept or not. Encouraging people on their quest of moving forward is great. Doing so with negativity towards people who volunteered their time shows a lack of character. |
DEAR CHAMPION, DEAR CHAMPION, II Protectors of Neverland
"8 years Guys....What a Ride"
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Originally Posted by Cobalt Azurean
I didn't take it as snarky. I took it as, "Keep your opinion to yourself unless it agrees with me or can provide a potential change to the event you are providing feedback to." As you said before, you can't please everyone. That means sometimes you are only goin' to get, "that was lame/sucked/blew/etc" and not get some form o' reply that includes a change or tweak.
The trick is not to take it personal. Give it a shot. |
DEAR CHAMPION, DEAR CHAMPION, II Protectors of Neverland
"8 years Guys....What a Ride"
224 LvL 50's
2 birds.... 1 stone
DEAR CHAMPION, DEAR CHAMPION, II Protectors of Neverland
"8 years Guys....What a Ride"
224 LvL 50's
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Originally Posted by CriticalKat
**On a side note there is nothing wrong with people wanting to feel appreciated for what they do. Lets not confuse wanting appreciation with being attention whores.
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What if I want appreciation for being an attention *****?
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Originally Posted by XxBudweiser8xX
2 birds.... 1 stone
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@Celestial Lord and @Celestial Lord Too
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Originally Posted by PHlRE
Ummm, i vote for Nator....
peeps stumbling over each other's soggy eggos and slippery banter... some looking to influence community thru social organizing, others skeptical about their intents of influence.... (is this politics?) there's some knee jerk reactions, some bad blood/history, some still feeling alienated, and some not letting things go a Some Peeps looking to positively influence others b Some Peeps looking for assistance and guidance c Some Peeps looking to run their own show w/o influence d Some Peeps looking to be left the hell alone! e Some looking to please f Some looking to please themselves g Some looking to just bellyache as usual The answer is not to attempt to please all, cuz some may want your destruction! But do what you can in whatever way you can. Cuz some poor schmo is gonna be left out cuz he WANTED to be left out, but he's still gonna bellyache abou it. WHy? Refer to d & g.... What can that poor schmo do to right those wrong done upon him? RUn his own daggone show! Thats what. But quit the bellyaching & fussing for Pete's sakes lol. Offer up some constructive suggestions or run your own show. Dont need no one's permission or communal acknowledgement to do it. |
Bellyachin about Bellyachin...LOVE the duality
Maybe the upper crust just didn't like poor schmo
They asked for opinions and got them. Not all of them are going to be constructive, but that is to be expected and can still be learned from. I honestly don't see any non constructive suggestions about the groups formation. If the group just wants praise and ideas for events that wasn't made clear.
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He forgot h: take passive aggressive potshots, wonder "golly, why can't we all just get along" while offering zero meaningful feedback.|
Originally Posted by Amily
Bellyachin about Bellyachin...LOVE the duality
Maybe the upper crust just didn't like poor schmo They asked for opinions and got them. Not all of them are going to be constructive, but that is to be expected and can still be learned from. I honestly don't see any non constructive suggestions about the groups formation. If the group just wants praise and ideas for events that wasn't made clear. |
Anyway, I'm off to keep the poor down trodden and polish my monocle or whatever.
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Haha... Thanks
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Originally Posted by PHlRE
Ummm, i vote for Nator....
peeps stumbling over each other's soggy eggos and slippery banter... some looking to influence community thru social organizing, others skeptical about their intents of influence.... (is this politics?) there's some knee jerk reactions, some bad blood/history, some still feeling alienated, and some not letting things go a Some Peeps looking to positively influence others b Some Peeps looking for assistance and guidance c Some Peeps looking to run their own show w/o influence d Some Peeps looking to be left the hell alone! e Some looking to please f Some looking to please themselves g Some looking to just bellyache as usual The answer is not to attempt to please all, cuz some may want your destruction! But do what you can in whatever way you can. Cuz some poor schmo is gonna be left out cuz he WANTED to be left out, but he's still gonna bellyache abou it. WHy? Refer to d & g.... What can that poor schmo do to right those wrong done upon him? RUn his own daggone show! Thats what. But quit the bellyaching & fussing for Pete's sakes lol. Offer up some constructive suggestions or run your own show. Dont need no one's permission or communal acknowledgement to do it. |
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Go back to being bad at PvP.
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Originally Posted by XxBudweiser8xX
2 birds.... 1 stone
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lol, cant catch them all, but Ash Ketchum can!
yeah, the previous post was really from a neutral standpoint (with the exception to the bellyachers)
So interpret & misinterpret it in whatever way possible, cuz it was written that way. Whatever the case, some kind of gain is found in whatever way is is viewed - just wanted it out there...
Seems a fight against the established "clique", and a power struggle to create a power shift. Ironically, with all power shifts that idealism created, nothing fills that void except another power in time.
Honestly, i just dont really care about these trivialities at this point. Im happy to do my own thang and have enuf resources and willing peeps to do stuff with.
In the end, if peeps getting butthurt and upset about silly stuff, mebbe its time to step away from the game some and enjoy real life. Cuz at that point, it stopped being a game, a source of entertainment. And really, thats all this is.... (actually im being SERIOUS!)
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Agreed... I pay for my own account(s), play how I want, and whatever comes with the territory. I've thought about leaving the game because peeps were taking it too seriously, but it is a nice way to get away from RL for a while. Once someone starts paying for my account(s), leveling my toons and IO'in them out, then I'll do what they want, but until then... HAVE A NICE DAY!!! |
Originally Posted by PHlRE
lol, cant catch them all, but Ash Ketchum can!
yeah, the previous post was really from a neutral standpoint (with the exception to the bellyachers) So interpret & misinterpret it in whatever way possible, cuz it was written that way. Whatever the case, some kind of gain is found in whatever way is is viewed - just wanted it out there... Seems a fight against the established "clique", and a power struggle to create a power shift. Ironically, with all power shifts that idealism created, nothing fills that void except another power in time. Honestly, i just dont really care about these trivialities at this point. Im happy to do my own thang and have enuf resources and willing peeps to do stuff with. In the end, if peeps getting butthurt and upset about silly stuff, mebbe its time to step away from the game some and enjoy real life. Cuz at that point, it stopped being a game, a source of entertainment. And really, thats all this is.... (actually im being SERIOUS!) |
p.s. no one will ever pay for my game
lol, i dunno.... i attended and enjoyed some of the misc events players & "committees" pushed out. And i unattended plenty i wasnt interested in. But its not like i didnt know what else to do with my time lol....
If there was an event i was interested in doing but i was left out (and sometimes i felt that way), by golly!, i think i'd do it on my own terms!
It reminds me of the times i was specifically declined multiple times to do Masters of the Statesman cuz a person thought i couldnt dualbox at that level he felt the MSTF needed. I felt really alienated and cast out because of him. Oh snap! I was THAT SCHMO!!!
Then i realized if i wanted to get something done MY WAY, i would have to do it then. I organized my own "Masters of" and successfully nailed a MSTF, MITF, and MKTF! It was a great "IN YOUR FACE!" moment for me. Right then, realized an individual has the power to organize anything if they had the strength, leadership, and determination to do it.
And the SCHMO becomes a SCHMO no more, but someone who everyone benefits from...
With that being said... we must team more.
For example, that there should be a form of leadership. If you have one person in charge, people will complain they're an autocrat. If you have a commitee, people will complain that their particular needs aren't represented. Or that progress is hindered by endless debate and voting. If you have a huge council, there's the problem of some people having more of a say than others and even more potential for argument resulting in stuff not getting done.
We have plenty of people running events and helping the community here but many of them are disconnected. So, like Dazz said, when one person has an idea, but no resources and another person has resourced, but no idea... its very hard for them to connect. There needs to be some sore of group connection that they can both go to and create something together.
The problem is that our only example of such a thing here is PERC. Dazz is trying to put something different together but he isn't sure what structure will make it the most efficient with the least drama. That's what the survey is for. :-)
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