My Build And The Incarnate System
By
AnElfCalledMack,
Posted on: 2010-12-02 19:04 in Player Questions
If I were you, I'd go for Spiritual (Recharge).
I notice you don't have Hasten, and basically Rage and Taunt are the only powers where you may not notice an improvement. Spiritual will give you noticeably faster Unstoppable and Conserve Power, plus you'll probably notice it in a few attacks.
Looks like you are in the 120-180% range with Rage on, and higher with Invincibility, so if you feel you are good against +4 Bosses through AVs, you probably don't need that.
And if you're not feeling end issues, the Cardiac isn't gonna do much.
Musculature will offer a negligible improvement for all your attacks save Hurl and Footstomp.
Btw, why not focus more on Footstomp? I used to love Footstomp + Fire ball with my Inv/SS, ymmv.
Wouldn't going with Spiritual actually cause some sort of endurance issue by making my toggles more active ?
Quote:
Recharge only affects toggles by making them come back up faster when they're turned off.|
Originally Posted by RiggsMcClane
Wouldn't going with Spiritual actually cause some sort of endurance issue by making my toggles more active ?
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Simply building for +Recharge without concern for anything else can cause endurance issues, though, since your attacks will be recharging faster, so you'll be using bigger, better, and more endurance-consuming attacks more often. And it's attacking that really causes the endurance hurt on most builds. So slot your attacks for end reduction (which you've already done), and you should be OK.
Add the fact that more recharge will give you more Conserve Power uptime, and you're not going to have any problems from taking the Spiritual Boost. Anyone who can flatline their endurance while CP is up is either being sapped or is truly gifted. Oh, and it'll give you a little bit more out of Dull Pain and improve its uptime, too, especially if you pick up the Radial Boost as your uncommon.
Quote:
Not the toggles, but any click powers will be up more often - and possibly firing more often as a result. This will show up in endurance drain, but if you have that managed well it shouldn't matter.|
Originally Posted by RiggsMcClane
Wouldn't going with Spiritual actually cause some sort of endurance issue by making my toggles more active ?
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But, the nice thing about incarnate slotting is if you find that to be a problem set up another boost and swap it.
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Okay, ran a test. Went to RWZ and got in some hits on a practice dummy. I ran about three and a half minutes using all my toggles and rotating through SS before I ran out of endurance. Me thinks I have no problems there. 
So spiritual may be the way to go.
Uh, here's something kinda odd. While in RWZ I decided to test out the musculature boost since I'd already made it. I first found a chief mentalist and knocked him around with ss and jotted down the average damage I was dealing before the slot. I then added it to my alpha, found another chief mentalist and got less damage . . . with it. I tried this several times. Here's the before and after:
Pre-Alpha
Jab -123
Punch -151
Haymaker -247
Knockout -536
Footstomp -188
Post-Alpha
Jab -113
Punch -124
Haymaker -203
Knockout -440
Footstomp -236
The only thing to increase was footstomp . . . Now, what's that all about?
You probably already confirmed all this, but:
Was Rage on for both tests?
Were they the same level?
Did you have any other buffs that might've affected your damage?
The results almost look like you fought a higher level mentalist when the alpha was slotted, or maybe it had received a buff from a nearby ally. I haven't slotted it, yet, so only conjecture as to what could be causing it.
Also, I assume you were fighting things that were many levels gray to you. I wonder if that could have something to do with it. Try finding some even level rikti in PI, for example.
Okay, my mistake. I should have known just to look at my average damage in the enhancement manage section. Here's the new results:
Pre-Alpha
Jab 60.38 (99.6)
Punch 88.80 (99.6)
Haymaker 145.63 (99.6)
Knockout 316.12 (99.6)
Footstomp 105.77 (67.4)
Post-Alpha
Jab 63.29 (109.2)
Punch 93.08 (109.2)
Haymaker 152.65 (109.2)
Knockout 331.37 (109.2)
Footstomp 124.42 (96.9)
Okay, I'm kind of torn. I went with musculature but I'm now having second thoughts as to whether I should go core or radial. On one hand the 45% damage increase is very tempting though I'm not sure I'd get much from the 45% to immobilize. On the other hand radial seems a lil better rounded out in the end.
I guess I just need someone to come in and argue why I should take one over the other. lol I'm seriously not sure which to choose.
Side Note: In the end would a tank with core or radial win over the other? I'm not so much into pvp but I'm just curious as to the results.
Quote:
musculature, eh... well, how much do you need/want endmod? Conserve power doesn't seem to take it, but you'd get some use in unstopable and inherrant stamina. You seem to get no benefit out of tohit debuffs. Run speed, while nice, won't do too much beyond getting you from point 'A' to point 'B' a bit faster if you hoof it.|
Originally Posted by RiggsMcClane
Okay, I'm kind of torn. I went with musculature but I'm now having second thoughts as to whether I should go core or radial. On one hand the 45% damage increase is very tempting though I'm not sure I'd get much from the 45% to immobilize. On the other hand radial seems a lil better rounded out in the end.
I guess I just need someone to come in and argue why I should take one over the other. lol I'm seriously not sure which to choose. Side Note: In the end would a tank with core or radial win over the other? I'm not so much into pvp but I'm just curious as to the results. |
Unless you are desperate for a little more recovery from two powers, the extra 3 boosts in the musculature radial don't look that useful to a Inv/SS/EM tanker. Really, the only thing in musculature you would seem to benefit from, at all, is the damage boost. If you're already up against the ED cap, the T4core has 30% boost that ignores ED, while the T4radial has 22%.
So, is the loss of an ~8% damage enhancement worth some endmod and runspeed? *shrug*
"My inner mind has become a reality-cracking overgod. He torments me! Help!"
Okay, so maybe I screwed up taking musculature. I don't have any major end problems and I'm at the damage cap. Now that the alphas been out a while what's considered best for an Inv/ss tank?
Well, the alpha slot is, for all practical purposes, another SO of a given type in every power that will take it, subject to ED. What you want to do is look at where your powers could benefit from another SO of enhancement and then get the appropriate Alpha.
It gets a little more complicated with the higher tier alpha boosts acting as multiple SO types and with a progressively greater portion of it ignoring ED. As you've discovered since you're already at ED cap for damage the Musculature didn't do much for you. I prefer to evaluate a character's performance and then decide where it could improve... and this will vary from character to character based on slotting.
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Though I don't find myself needing end all too often anymore cardiac does come with a range and damage increase. While it's hard to resist spiritual due to the added attack rate. I do, only ever so often, find myself waiting on a power or two to pop back up. So would I benefit more from end, damage, and range or attack rate, disorient, and heal for my particular build?
I just don't want to make another mistake as I already have.
With my Inv/SS Tanker I went Spiritual - here is how it could benefit your build:
Common - Attack Rate boost (everything but especially Dull Pain and Foot Stomp)
Uncommon (Radial Boost) - healing (Health, Dull Pain and Physical Perfection)
Rare (Total Radial Revamp) - Stun (Jab) and To Hit Buff (Rage)
Quote:
Look at it like this; to get a tier 4 shard, you have to combine 2 tier 3s plus other stuff. So continue to build up the one you feel was a mistake with that process in mind, and it's not such a bad position to be in after all...
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Originally Posted by RiggsMcClane
I just don't want to make another mistake as I already have.
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Quote:
FYI, the Cardiac comes with Damage Resistance, not Damage. Would have thought it a typo, except for making the same mistake twice.
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Originally Posted by RiggsMcClane
Though I don't find myself needing end all too often anymore cardiac does come with a range and damage increase. While it's hard to resist spiritual due to the added attack rate. I do, only ever so often, find myself waiting on a power or two to pop back up. So would I benefit more from end, damage, and range or attack rate, disorient, and heal for my particular build?
I just don't want to make another mistake as I already have. |
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It's looking like recharge for me. I've really begun to notice the recharge time on my powers and they're taking a bit to long. Especially on the necessities. Knockout, footstomp, rage, and conserver power.
Okay, Im slowly getting a grasp of the Incarnate system but Im wondering which of the four powers best fit my build at the moment. Im not looking for build help so much but an idea as to where the alpha slot can help me most. With inherent fitness, conserve power, and physical perfection I dont seem to have many issues with endurance at the moment. So I chose to go with musculature. Im not that good with the numbers and wonder if it was a wise choice with my current stats. Will I get visible improvements or should I have gone with one of the other power choices?
Hero Plan by Mids' Hero Designer 1.803
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Level 50 Science Tanker
Primary Power Set: Invulnerability
Secondary Power Set: Super Strength
Power Pool: Fighting
Power Pool: Flight
Ancillary Pool: Energy Mastery
Hero Profile:
Level 1: Resist Physical Damage -- RctvArm-ResDam(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(3), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(3), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(9)
Level 1: Jab -- S'ngH'mkr-Acc/Dmg(A), S'ngH'mkr-Dmg/EndRdx(11), S'ngH'mkr-Dmg/Rchg(11), S'ngH'mkr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(13), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(13), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(15)
Level 2: Temp Invulnerability -- RctvArm-ResDam(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(34), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(36), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(36), S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(36)
Level 4: Dull Pain -- Dct'dW-Heal(A), Dct'dW-Rchg(5), Dct'dW-Heal/Rchg(5), Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx(7), Dct'dW-Heal/EndRdx/Rchg(7)
Level 6: Punch -- S'ngH'mkr-Acc/Dmg(A), S'ngH'mkr-Dmg/EndRdx(15), S'ngH'mkr-Dmg/Rchg(17), S'ngH'mkr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(17), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(19), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(19)
Level 8: Haymaker -- S'ngH'mkr-Acc/Dmg(A), S'ngH'mkr-Dmg/EndRdx(21), S'ngH'mkr-Dmg/Rchg(21), S'ngH'mkr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(23), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(23), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(25)
Level 10: Unyielding -- RctvArm-ResDam(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(37), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(37), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(40)
Level 12: Resist Energies -- RctvArm-ResDam(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(37), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(46), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(50)
Level 14: Taunt -- Mocking-Taunt(A), Mocking-Taunt/Rchg(25), Mocking-Taunt/Rng(27), Mocking-Taunt/Rchg/Rng(27), Mocking-Rchg(50), Mocking-Acc/Rchg(50)
Level 16: Kick -- Dmg-I(A)
Level 18: Invincibility -- HO:Cyto(A), HO:Cyto(42), HO:Cyto(43)
Level 20: Knockout Blow -- S'ngH'mkr-Acc/Dmg(A), S'ngH'mkr-Dmg/EndRdx(29), S'ngH'mkr-Dmg/Rchg(29), S'ngH'mkr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), P'ngS'Fest-Acc/Dmg(31), P'ngS'Fest-Dmg/EndRdx(31)
Level 22: Tough -- RctvArm-ResDam(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(45), RctvArm-ResDam/Rchg(45), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(45)
Level 24: Air Superiority -- Mako-Dmg/EndRdx(A)
Level 26: Fly -- Zephyr-Travel(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(43)
Level 28: Tough Hide -- GftotA-Def/EndRdx(A), GftotA-Def/Rchg(40), GftotA-EndRdx/Rchg(42), GftotA-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(42)
Level 30: Rage -- AdjTgt-Rchg(A), AdjTgt-ToHit/Rchg(33), AdjTgt-EndRdx/Rchg(33)
Level 32: Unstoppable -- Aegis-ResDam(A), Aegis-ResDam/EndRdx(33), Aegis-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(34), Aegis-Psi/Status(34)
Level 35: Hurl -- Thundr-Acc/Dmg(A), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx(40), Thundr-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
Level 38: Foot Stomp -- Erad-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(A), Erad-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(39), Erad-Dmg/Rchg(39)
Level 41: Weave -- GftotA-Def/EndRdx(A), GftotA-Def/Rchg(46), GftotA-EndRdx/Rchg(46)
Level 44: Conserve Power -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 47: Physical Perfection -- P'Shift-EndMod(A), P'Shift-EndMod/Acc(48), P'Shift-End%(48), P'Shift-EndMod/Rchg(48)
Level 49: Resist Elements -- RctvArm-ResDam(A)
------------
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- Empty(A)
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Gauntlet
Level 4: Ninja Run
Note: I also have two performance shifters in stamina and a numia in health.