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Why do you want to? There's not that much reason to do so nowadays given that the damage buff doesn't exist in Domination mode any more. All you'd be doing is refilling your Blue Bar, and maybe stacking more mez protection on yourself (not sure if the mez protection can self-stack).
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Originally Posted by Angelic_EU
How much recharge does it take to make a double-perma-dom? I drafted up a few builds (with different sets combos), at max I can only get +125% without haseten. So, still short of 200% with hasten on.
Is it possible to make a double-perma-dom without outside buff, like SB? Thanks |
Domination lasts 90 seconds and has a base recharge of 200s. The final recharge is 200s / (1 + recharge bonus), so the needed recharge bonus for a given recharge is (200s / final recharge) - 1.
If you want dom to recharge in 90s (perma dom), you'll need (200/90) - 1 = 1.22 = 122% bonus recharge. If you want it to recharge in 45s (perma double dom), you'll need (200/45) - 1 = 3.44 = 344% bonus recharge. This is, as far as I know, impossible solo - in fact, it's only 56% short of the 400% cap. (As an aside, even at that cap dom takes (200/5) = 40s to recharge, so perma triple dom isn't possible.)
And to echo what Carnifax said, there isn't much point nowadays. The mez buff is binary (either on or off), so you don't get any extra mez from stacking dom. There's no damage buff anymore, and the base mez protection should be more than sufficient given how much mez of your own you'll be throwing around. The only real benefit would be more frequent end refills.
@MuonNeutrino
Student, Gamer, Altaholic, and future Astronomer.
This is what it means to be a tank!
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Why do a lot of people seem to forget that Domination has a very significant effect beyond Mez protection and end refills?|
Originally Posted by Carnifax_NA
Why do you want to? There's not that much reason to do so nowadays given that the damage buff doesn't exist in Domination mode any more. All you'd be doing is refilling your Blue Bar, and maybe stacking more mez protection on yourself (not sure if the mez protection can self-stack).
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And yes, you get no extra mez from stacking (Per Muon's post), but I'm really just curious why the main effect of this power is often left out of lists when talking about Domination.
Actually, the mez protection does stack, but nothing else does. I've ran countless ITF's with my Dom's that prevented me from being stunned by Romulus by having Domination stacked.
[U][URL="http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=251594"][/URL][/U]
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Erm, what "very significant effect" does double stacked Domination give which single dom doesn't?|
Originally Posted by Misaligned
Why do a lot of people seem to forget that Domination has a very significant effect beyond Mez protection and end refills?
And yes, you get no extra mez from stacking (Per Muon's post), but I'm really just curious why the main effect of this power is often left out of lists when talking about Domination. |
It certainly doesn't add any extra mez above just single levels of dom, that's for sure.
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Dusts off an old post........|
Originally Posted by Angelic_EU
How much recharge does it take to make a double-perma-dom? I drafted up a few builds (with different sets combos), at max I can only get +125% without haseten. So, still short of 200% with hasten on.
Is it possible to make a double-perma-dom without outside buff, like SB? Thanks |
Presenting once again (whether some like it or not), the Three Stages of Permadom, Dragonball Z style.
Dominator stops fighting his foe,
Foe asks "Why are you stopping? You giving up?"
Dominator: "Oh we'll get back to the fight, I just want to teach you a few things about permadoms,starting with the basics. This is my normal form....."
Dominator powers up: "This is a permadom. 70% recharge from IO sets and 3 to 6 slotted hasten depending on your preference. Likely a clunky build and you risk frequent power crashes, but congratulations you are a permadom!"
Dominator powers up again: "This is what is known as a Permadom that has Ascended past being a permadom, or just call it Permadom 2. 90% recharge from IO and 6 slotted hasten was the minimum for this. Tighter build and fewer crashes."
Foe: "Yawn, big deal......"
Dominator: "Just wait, it gets even better!"
Cut to Recluse and his henchmen:
Ghost Widow: "Has he really found a way to surpass an Ascended Permadom? Is that possible?"
Black Scorpion: "Bah!"
Mako: "Feh! He's just bluffing!"
Scirocco: "Yeah, he'd be what, double ascended? Big deal!"
Dominator's power begins to exponentially build..."AND THIS.....!"
Lord Recluse: "What the.....? WHAT'S HE DOING?"
Dominator: "IS...TO....GO..EVEN....FURTHER.....BEYOND!"
Insert 10 minutes of massive yelling and screaming as the Dom powers up and everyone is too dumbstruck to stop the process.......
Dominator: "Sorry that took so much longer then the others.....it takes a little time to power up to this level. In this form....125% recharge from IO's and you can throw hasten out the window. This is what I call a Super Permadom THREE!"
Is it possible to go beyond this? Only if the devs develop an ingame form of the Fusion technique or else wait for the Incarnate system and hope.
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Originally Posted by Carnifax_NA
Erm, what "very significant effect" does double stacked Domination give which single dom doesn't?
It certainly doesn't add any extra mez above just single levels of dom, that's for sure. |
Not speaking about double or triple stacked. I'm really just curious about why I see a lot of people listing the benefits of Domination as:
End filler
Mez protection
And that's it.
Domination adds mez and mez duration. To me, that's the defining portion of the power, yet it seems to be the part that gets forgotten outside in the cold freezing its little toes off (ok - went too far there
). I also see a lot of people who leave out the extra mez from Domination comment on the lack of +damage. I know that's a very old mechanic, but why mention that and not the mez that's added from hitting that shiny button?
There was a post a while ago where someone was saying that it was a waste of their time to use domination because of the following:
It was an activation that could have / should have been used to do a damaging attack
It doesn't boost damage any more
They didn't have end issues - why do they care about the end refill?
ST Hold + AoE hold was fine for holding bosses
I really, really am just curious why the extra mez is often left out when discussing Domination.
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Because it's really, really obvious and doesn't really need mentioning? Everyone knows it's there...?
| I really, really am just curious why the extra mez is often left out when discussing Domination. |
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Erm, because we are discussing double stacked domination, and why anyone needs it nowadays, not the advantages of domination in general. So the boosted mez isn't really relevant.|
Originally Posted by Misaligned
Not speaking about double or triple stacked. I'm really just curious about why I see a lot of people listing the benefits of Domination as:
End filler Mez protection And that's it. Domination adds mez and mez duration. To me, that's the defining portion of the power, yet it seems to be the part that gets forgotten outside in the cold freezing its little toes off (ok - went too far there ). I also see a lot of people who leave out the extra mez from Domination comment on the lack of +damage. I know that's a very old mechanic, but why mention that and not the mez that's added from hitting that shiny button? There was a post a while ago where someone was saying that it was a waste of their time to use domination because of the following: It was an activation that could have / should have been used to do a damaging attack It doesn't boost damage any more They didn't have end issues - why do they care about the end refill? ST Hold + AoE hold was fine for holding bosses I really, really am just curious why the extra mez is often left out when discussing Domination. |
The boosted mez is one of the best things about Domination (although Ice, Elec and Earth domi mightn't agree 100%) but double stacked domination doesn't add to that.
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Originally Posted by Carnifax_NA
Erm, because we are discussing double stacked domination, and why anyone needs it nowadays, not the advantages of domination in general. So the boosted mez isn't really relevant.
The boosted mez is one of the best things about Domination but double stacked domination doesn't add to that. |
Erm then why mention the lack of damage that hasn't been there since i15?
Why not toss in the it doesn't increase your agro cap as long as we're pointing out the things it doesn't do?
The OP's question was answered in the 2nd reply. I simply wanted to know why I am seeing so many people comment about Domination - noting the end refill and the mez protection - while ommiting the added mez. The same people who generally leave out the added mez seem to tie in the fact that it doesn't add damage any more - something that changed 3 issues ago.
I just found it all very curious. I guess no one can answer that though.
And no, Talen - the rest of the power's abilities are just as obvious. They're right there in game, mids, your favorite CoX website. So I'm not buying that either. It was a nice try though
Sorry Angelic for jacking your thread.
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Because I was pointing out the thing it no longer does, not everything it doesn't do. The thing it no longer does which was also historically the chief reason anyone wanted to get double / triple stacked domination in the first place.|
Originally Posted by Misaligned
Erm then why mention the lack of damage that hasn't been there since i15?
Why not toss in the it doesn't increase your agro cap as long as we're pointing out the things it doesn't do? |
I didn't mention the mez because historically that was never really a goal for anyone aiming for double domination (because it doesn't add to it). I was basically assuming the OP was talking about double/triple dom with familiarity of it from the pre-i15 days, which mightn't be the case and pointing out why it's different (and basically not very useful) nowadays.
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Okay... maybe I can simplify this a bit for you to understand.|
Originally Posted by Misaligned
Erm then why mention the lack of damage that hasn't been there since i15?
Why not toss in the it doesn't increase your agro cap as long as we're pointing out the things it doesn't do? |
The OP/thread is ONLY about double/triple domination.
The original purpose of double/triple domination was to increase damage.
It no longer increases damage, so the original purpose of double/triple domination does not exist.
So extra damage (or not) is relevant to the discussion. The increase mez mag /duration is not relevant, because it never had any say on whether or not you double/triple domination.
Hence, what is to be gained (mez protection and endurance refills) needs to be weighed against the cost/possibility of double/triple domination. When you got your word in edge wise it should have been something like this: "Don't forget that perma Dom is important because of the mez mag/duration, but that's an effect which doesn't benefit from double/triple domination."
Since you just said it ought be mentioned in every discussion in Domination, without reference to the OP, the people already discussing didn't take you seriously and were dismissive. You made it appear as if you don't understand what double Domination entails but were chiming in anyway. Continuing to argue the point isn't rectifying the appearance either.
Hopefully that clears it up.
OP: Going a bit beyond perma Dom isn't a bad idea for the extra endurance, but even if you could shoot for double, you'd be better off putting some sets towards accuracy, or even possibly defense or regeneration.
@Gilia1
I play heroes on Champion.
I play villains on Virtue.
How much recharge does it take to make a double-perma-dom? I drafted up a few builds (with different sets combos), at max I can only get +125% without haseten. So, still short of 200% with hasten on.
Is it possible to make a double-perma-dom without outside buff, like SB?
Thanks