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Off the top of my head I can't recall how many hitpoint's she has, but its a large number ? |
Originally Posted by Arbegla
Thats for her to hit 1 person, having all of them within range. Her heal will heal for 10% of her hitpoints, per target affected. what your saying, is with 4 people in range, she has on average a 34% chance to hit 1 of them, and heal herself for 10%.
Its still very much doable, and she doesn't punch through the softcap, its just the way the percentages compound. she still only has a 10% chance to hit each one, and could very much miss each person, as each roll is independent of the other, they just all happen at once, due to being an AoE. plus, her streak breaker at that range means she can still miss 100 times before it'll force her to hit 1 (at 10.5% chance tohit) |
And just what is the rate she fires that heal ? Often ?
Quote:
/sidetrack|
Originally Posted by Another_Fan
Obviously
Edit: that was a direction I have been trying not to go So let me show you why. # enemies in range, Ghost widows chance to heal 10% to hit chance 1, .1 2. .19 3. .271 4. .34 That is why she has a good chance to get through the softcap if you have people in range and that is why you don't want to bring much melee to a stf, if you do you can go forever and never overcome GWs heal. |
IME, if your whole team is at the soft-cap, having everyone on the team in melee with GW does not add to her time to defeat. On our 7 def / 1 blaster STFs, we all huddle near the 4 patron AVs (although the defenders normally are not in melee range, they are well within her DR range) in order to make sure everyone is within range of group buffs (FS, Dispersions, Steamy Mist, etc.).
I'd also never turn down a scrapper because of GW. Silver Mantis is more frightening, those damn caltrops allow for fast one shots. GW can "one shot" thanks to DoT, but it is long DoT and someone else on the team can usually heal through it. It is also a better strategy to taunt GW from range and then allow the rest of the team to be in melee. Better to lose one tanker's melee damage rather than lose the tanker/scrapper/brute/stalker/blaster/dominator melee damage.
/endsidetrack
Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.
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The scrapper has no other attacks they can use ? They couldn't do say, SC,lightning rod, epic aoe, thunderstrike ? Maybe they could repeat those two at the end ? fitting in the occasional chain induction and jacobs ladder ?
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Originally Posted by Arbegla
And you pretty much said, that you only need as much AoEs and you have enemy hitpoints, so once you hit the threshold of 400 damage, minions die, and 800 Lts die. and a scrapper (i assumed elec/shield) would be able to do that every 3-4 seconds.
The problem is the recharge limitations, and nothing can kill entire gruops of minions and LTs every 3 - 4 seconds. Yes, LR + SC can wipe them all out, BUT even in a fully IO'ed build, thats once every 30 seconds. During that same time, a blaster can rotate more attacks, and do as much, or even more damage. Its in not as big of a boom, but its still there. Thats my point. The pretty boom of LR + SC doesnt negate the MUCH lower Damage per cycle it has, which a blaster can easily out do under the same situations. |
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That sounds like an insanely great team composition. About how much dps would you say are putting out and how much have you debuffed her rate of recharge ?
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Originally Posted by StratoNexus
/sidetrack
IME, if your whole team is at the soft-cap, having everyone on the team in melee with GW does not add to her time to defeat. On our 7 def / 1 blaster STFs, we all huddle near the 4 patron AVs (although the defenders normally are not in melee range, they are well within her DR range) in order to make sure everyone is within range of group buffs (FS, Dispersions, Steamy Mist, etc.). |
CI isn't a true AOE, as the chain can end once it kills something. Thunderstrike and jacobs ladder have much lower area of affect then just about any other blaster AoE attack.
Edit: Plus i've already listed the Damage per cycle of a fire/fire vs a elec/shield, and any number of AoEs combined, will out damage a elec/shield overtime.
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No idea about DPS. A lot. Generally we have a fair amount of slows. How much gets through any debuff resistance, I am not sure. But we usually have a Kin and a Cold sometimes a Storm. That is a big help, for sure. Even without slows, getting to the soft-cap means her heal misses plenty, IME.
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Originally Posted by Another_Fan
That sounds like an insanely great team composition. About how much dps would you say are putting out and how much have you debuffed her rate of recharge ?
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Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.
Quote:
The problem is GW is pretty dangerous and if you plop yourself into melee range you are likely making the encounter have an extended time. That's additional time and risk where something from the list of 1000 things that can go wrong can go wrong and the MO run can fail.|
Originally Posted by ClawsandEffect
Not really. If scrappers are so much better, as is being implied, then one AV out of the whole TF shouldn't be a reason to invite an "inferior" AT instead, now, should it?
What difference should it make between a blaster, and a softcapped SR or Shield scrapper? I mean, it's her heal that we're worried about, right? If it doesn't hit you there's no problem. Seriously? ONE AV is reason enough for a team to invite an AT that is supposedly inferior to a scrapper in every measurable way? And because I don't feel like multiquoting here: If there's a need to be babysat on teams, that isn't the sign of a bad AT, that's the sign of a bad player. I keep hearing all this about "blasters are underpowered!", and I'm just not buying it. |
GW is considered one of the main bottlenecks on the STF, if you can't beat her you can't proceed and she has the potential to be more of a team hurdle than most/all of the encounters leading up to her.
While a team certainly can beat her with multiple people standing in melee range she is one of the few encounters where gang rushing her isn't the best method to defeating her quickly and safely.
But it isn't just GW that encourages MO runs to steer away from additional melee toons. Most MO runs focus on directing all aggro to a single focal point while all 7 other players attack from a safe location. Adding additional melee range characters puts additional strain and chance for failure at the aggro focal point meaning support now needs to be watchful of more players.
Truth be told it is one of the few scenarios where additional melee can actually be more of a liability than adding a blaster(s). But it isn't entirely a result of something being wrong with the additional melee toons, but a conjunction of using an aggro sponge of a tank making ranged toons as safe as possible. The vast majority of encounters don't have such extreme tanking as found in a MOSTF run and as a result aggro happy blasters can easily pull attention back on to the other squishies they are standing near, while scrappers tend to keep it off of them while being sustainable enough for the job.
MOSTF is an example of multiple variables combining to make a blaster generally a better pick for speed and success than a scrapper, but as far as CoX is concerned it is an aberration across the majority of encounters.
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I know there are softcapped fire/mm and arch/mm that can survive against +2's of easy farm mobs, but anyway...|
Originally Posted by StratoNexus
The best influence/times I have seen are vs. uplevel enemies. Even spawns of weak enemies are challenging at +2, especially if bosses are left on (although I suspect that turning them off is the better farming route).
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I"m sure if you asked a good farming brute they'd happily turn down the difficulty to whatever a farming blaster can handle and still do it faster.
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| OTOH, how much better is it for the team if the tanker feels the need to keep aggro off someone? How valuable is it for the game that buff/debuff sees someone who so obviously needs their assistance? What is a reasonable expectation for support to do for a team with a bunch of blasters? |
With regard to tanking, my fire/ss/pyre honestly can't tell the difference one way or the other because I attempt to hold all agro regardless of team composition. I see that and doing solid aoe damage as my main responsibilities. I don't turn off gauntlet (even if I could) on fireball and footstomp just because the team may have more self sufficient toons on it. I can't imagine it being different on even tougher tanks.
It's hard to say. The more my support toon needs to focus on a blaster(s) the less opportunity I have to contribute direct damage and/or put out timely team multiplying debuffs/buffs. That means the blaster now needs to make up for my lost damage that I would have retained playing with a self sufficient toon.
So the way I see it they have to do a lot more damage than a scrapper to make up for my lost damage due to extra support time and due to the fact that they are intended to be the highest damage AT. I can't say exactly how much faster the team should be killing as a result, but it should probably be a tangible shift in performance*
*which it certainly is for archery (omg RoA) and fireblast, but aoe spec scrappers/brutes seem to keep pace with most other blasters on the team front ime.
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The best way (ime) to make GW a pushover is by bringing two high recharge /cold controllers. Double benumb makes her heal pathetic and makes her mag 11 trillion hold last like 2 seconds.|
Originally Posted by StratoNexus
No idea about DPS. A lot. Generally we have a fair amount of slows. How much gets through any debuff resistance, I am not sure. But we usually have a Kin and a Cold sometimes a Storm. That is a big help, for sure. Even without slows, getting to the soft-cap means her heal misses plenty, IME.
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If we have a couple well built colds on the team then I have no reservations about bringing as many scrappers as we want.
The ability of the tank and the support tends to determine what the rest of the team will consist of in a MOSTF
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Arbegla
CI isn't a true AOE, as the chain can end once it kills something. Thunderstrike and jacobs ladder have much lower area of affect then just about any other blaster AoE attack.
Edit: Plus i've already listed the Damage per cycle of a fire/fire vs a elec/shield, and any number of AoEs combined, will out damage a elec/shield overtime. |
I am sorry but before we can go further you need to figure out for yourself why damage/cycle just doesn't matter.
Quote:
The tank is so very very popular because most people don't have access to the required debuffs on demand but can usually scare up a decent tanker.
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Originally Posted by Lolblaws
The best way (ime) to make GW a pushover is by bringing two high recharge /cold controllers. Double benumb makes her heal pathetic and makes her mag 11 trillion hold last like 2 seconds.
If we have a couple well built colds on the team then I have no reservations about bringing as many scrappers as we want. The ability of the tank and the support tends to determine what the rest of the team will consist of in a MOSTF |
Why don't you explain it, pretty clearly, as you have already tried to stand by it, by saying that the scrapper can use thunderstrike/jacobs ladder while LR/SC is down, even though the blaster can use harder hitting, bigger area attacks in less time.
Edit: When comparing AoEs between ATs, they are balanced around damage/cycle. Its how the dev's do it.
Quote:
I have several times, let me try again just using fire |
Originally Posted by Arbegla
Why don't you explain it, pretty clearly, as you have already tried to stand by it, by saying that the scrapper can use thunderstrike/jacobs ladder while LR/SC is down, even though the blaster can use harder hitting, bigger area attacks in less time.
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We have a team of a fire/fire blaster and 7 kins. The kins only knew how to put 1 button in their tray, that's the button for speedboost.* The fire blaster has hasten on auto. The blaster now has a recharge rate of 500% the absolute maximum he can have
His best use of AOEs is
Hotfeat
Blazing aura
Rain of fire
{Fire Ball recharges in 3.2 seconds
Fire Breath Recharges in 3.2 seconds
Wait
Fire Ball
Fire Fire Breath} ^ N
Everything else becomes pointless because adding it in doesn't increase the damage output.
*The granite tankers fantasy
Edit: when you say it takes time to position for the smaller AoEs you are assuming that there is no taunt aura running and there is no slack time to do that.
How does adding in a fire sword circle, or combustion not increase the damage output? so theres no wait?
Edit: Especially when Combustion does more damage then fireball, in the same radius. Yea, 2 second higher cast time, but 1 second lower recharge.
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Actually my error on that, removing the wait time still doesn't help but the original chain I calculated the recharge from the start of casting not the end.|
Originally Posted by Arbegla
How does adding in a fire sword circle, or combustion not increase the damage output? so theres no wait?
Edit: Especially when Combustion does more damage then fireball, in the same radius. Yea, 2 second higher cast time, but 1 second lower recharge. |
The correct chain is
Code:
{
Fire Ball
Fire Breath
Wait
Fire Ball
Fire Sword Circle
Wait
} ^N
Both fire sword circle and fire breath do 41 and 33 damage per the amount of time they take to cast.
Fire ball does 80. If in either of these if you delay fireball by more than 33/80 of a second to get an additional 33 damage you have lowered your total damage output.
So your comparing DPA, and not accounting for recharge (your just assuming, at the recharge cap) when in actual game play, hitting capped recharge, is pretty rare, and even in the best case, you'll be waiting alot more on LR/SC/TS/JL which will do less damage at the recharge cap, then your FB/FBr/FB/FSC chain.
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No that is just why you can't use damage/cycle. |
Originally Posted by Arbegla
So your comparing DPA, and not accounting for recharge (your just assuming, at the recharge cap) when in actual game play, hitint capped recharge, is pretty rare, and even in the best case, you'll be waiting alot more on LR/SC which will do less damage at the recharge cap, then your FB/FBr/FB/FSC chain.
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The at the recharge cap was just to make things as extreme as possible, in your calculations you assumed that there was no recharge and used the base recharges.
Using your own math, at the recharge cap for an elec/shield your looking this chain
LR + SC + JL + TS + JL + CI + JL + TS + JL + CI (repeat)
here your looking at (assuming base damage again)
(290.28+113.44+103.23+134.88+103.23+90.84+103.23+1 34.88+103.23+90.84) = 1,268.08 damage every 18 seconds, due to the recharge limitations on LR + SC
compared to the FB->FBr->FB->FSC (while running hotfeet + blazing aura) chain you alread made, which pulls
(78.83+109.8+78.83+99.54) + (11.12+13.9*2.5) = 429.85 damage, every 5 seconds
18/5 = 3.6. so you'll be able to do the fire/fire chain about 3.6 times per the elec/shield chain, at the recharge cap.
So, in 18 seconds, the elec/shield does 1,268.08 damage, and the fire/fire does (429.85*3.6) 1,547.46 damage..
Hmmm.. even doing it your way the fire/fire is coming out ahead.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Arbegla
Using your own math, at the recharge cap for an elec/shield your looking this chain
LR + SC + JL + TS + JL + CI + JL + TS + JL + CI (repeat) here your looking at (assuming base damage again) (290.28+113.44+103.23+134.88+103.23+90.84+103.23+1 34.88+103.23+90.84) = 1,268.08 damage every 18 seconds, due to the recharge limitations on LR + SC compared to the FB->FBr->FB->FSC (while running hotfeet + blazing aura) chain you alread made, which pulls (78.83+109.8+78.83+99.54) + (11.12+13.9*2.5) = 429.85 damage, every 5 seconds 18/5 = 3.6. so you'll be able to do the fire/fire chain about 3.6 times per the elec/shield chain, at the recharge cap. So, in 18 seconds, the elec/shield does 1,268.08 damage, and the fire/fire does (429.85*3.6) 1,547.46 damage.. Hmmm.. even doing it your way the fire/fire is coming out ahead. |
1. How much damage does an aoe do to something that is dead ?
2. The Fire Blaster has Aim and build up, the Shield Scrapper has Build up and against all odds
Build up recharges in 18 seconds at the cap, and is 1 second of not doing damage vs 2 seconds of not doing damage for (aim+bu)
In the case of the elec/shield
LR+SC+TS+FIREBALL all fit in the buildup damage window.
That Starts at 180% bonus (saturated against all odds+ buildup) and works down as things die.
Edit: This is why when people state aim or build up contribute x% to damage because they increase damage by y and have z duty cycle its a problem.
Edit2: Your shield charge number looks a little low.
Quote:
Shield Charge, pulled from mids, only does 113.44 base damage for a scrapper
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Originally Posted by Another_Fan
Edit2: Your shield charge number looks a little low.
|
1. Lets assuming /8/no bosses for the sake of easy arguments. thats 1 boss(converted to LTs), about 2 normal LTs, 8 minions, or 2 bosses (converted to LTs), 3 normal LTs, 7 minions.
1.a Minions have 430 hps, LTs have 860 hps, bosses converted to LTs have LT level hitpoints
1.b Suvivial is not an issue, due to various things.
2. Assuming Bu and Aim are used as often as possible
2.a Aim is 67.% +dam, BU is 100% +dam plus defiance, AAO is 19.375% +dam for the first mob, 6.875% for any other, capped at 10 mobs, BU is 100%
2.b 95% damage via enhancements, and base recharge
2.c For the blaster your looking at 167.5% damage + defiance bonus (FB = 2% bonus for 8.5seconds, FBr is 8.2% for 10.17 seconds, FSC is 7% for 10.17 seconds, combustion is 6.1% dam, for 10.5 seconds, and Rain of Fire is 2.8% damage for 9.53)
2.d Once you get below 10 mobs, AAO starts dropping off.
2.e Starting outside of each group, say 20ft, so AAO doesn't start saturated as thats about normal gameplay
If chain gets interrupted, assuming next attack in chain will have BU active, but no others *due to travel time*
Elec/shield chain = SC->LR->FB->TS->JL
Total cast time = 1.716+2.772+1.188+3.432+1.848
=10.956 seconds, but JL would be affected by BU in that duration
fire/fire chain = RoF->FBr->FB->FSC->Combustion while running blazing aura + hotfeet
Total cast time = 2.244+2.904+1.188+2.904+3.168
= 12.408, but combustion would be affected by BU in that duration (due to the duration of BU not dropping before combustion is triggered)
elec/shield
LR = 290.28(base) + (290.28 * 1.95)(BU + enhancements) = 856.32 damage
And everything is dead, or close enough.
Repeatable every 90 seconds
SC+FB+TS+JL used on a second group
SC = 113.44(base) + (113.44 * 1.95)(BU + Enhancements) = 334.64 damage
FB = 79.77(base) + (79.77 * 1.76)(Enhancements + AAO) = 220.17 damage
All Minions are dead, AAO drops to only 3 or 5 in range.
TS = 134.88(base) + (134.88 * 1.28)(Enhancements + AAO w/3 in range) = 307.53 damage
with 5 in range of AAO, everything still dies.
Repeatable every 90 second for SC + BU, 32 seconds for FB, and 18 seconds for TS
JL = 103.23(base) + (103.23 * .95)(Enhancements only) = 201.30 damage is overkill damage, while waiting for the big hitters to recharge
Elec/shield took out 2 groups, in the time it took for BU to drop off, accounting for running to the next group.
Elec/shield has to wait about 80 seconds until BU, LR, and SC are available, but only 22 seconds for fireball.
Fire/fire
During 10 seconds, blazing aura and hotfeet tick fives times. To make this easy, lets assume 2 ticks in first group, 3 in the second group.
Blazing aura first tick adds 11.12(base) + (11.12 * 2.62)(BU/aim + enhancements) = 40.25 damage
Hotfeet first tick adds 13.9(base) + (13.9 * 2.62) (BU/aim + enhancements) = 50.31 damage
Blazing aura's second tick adds 11.12(base) + (11.12 * 2.65)(previous + defiance from RoF) = 40.58
Hotfeet second tick adds 13.9(base) + (13.9 * 2.65)(previous + defiance from RoF) = 50.74 damage
Rain of Fire = ((50*1.668)(base for 10 seconds) + (50*1.668 * 2.62))(Aim + Bu + enhancemenets) + ((25*1.668)(reminder of RoF after Bu fades) + (25*1.668 * .95))(Enhancements only) = 301.91 damage(first 10 seconds) + 81.32 damage(after BU/aim wears off)
Fire Breath = 109.8(base) + (109.8 * 2.65)(BU + Aim + enhancements + defiance) = 400.77 damage
Total damage = 301.91 + 400.77 + 40.25 + 50.31 + 40.58 + 50.74
= 884.56 damage
First group dead after 10 seconds
Blazing aura's third tick adds 11.12(base) + (11.12 * 2.73)(Defiance) = 41.48 damage
Hotfeet third tick adds 13.9(base) + (13.9 * 2.73)(Defiance) = 51.85 damage
Blazing aura's fourth tick adds 11.12(base) + (11.12 * 2.75)(Defiance) = 41.7 damage
Hotfeet fourth tick adds 13.9(base) + (13.9 * 2.75)(defiance) = 52.13 damage
Blazing aura's fifth tick adds 11.12(base) + (11.12 * 2.83)(defiance) = 42.59 damage
Hotfeet fifth tick adds 13.9(base) + (13.9 * 2.83)(defiance) = 53.24 damage
FB = 78.83(base) + (78.83 * 2.73)(BU + Aim + enhancemenets + defiance) = 294.04 damage
FSC = 99.54(base) + (99.54 * 1.08)(Enhancements + defiance) = 207.04
Combustion = 83.42 + (83.42 * 1.15)(Enhacements + defiance) = 179.35
Total damage done to second group = 294.04 + 207.04 + 179.35 + 41.48 + 51.85 + 41.7 +52.13 + 42.59 + 53.24
= 963.42 total damage, so the last tick of blazing aura and hotfeet are overkill.
The fire/fire rotation has to wait 80 seconds for BU/Aim, but only 50 to actually repeat the chain without Bu/Aim.
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I would submit that the best AoEing blasters outdoing the best AoEing armoreds and the best AoEing armoreds macthing the average AoEing blasters is probably somewhere near a good balance point. I am not sure we are actually at that point, but it sometimes feels pretty decent in game, but I play a lot of those best AoEing blasters more often then I play those average AoEing blasters.|
Originally Posted by Lolblaws
So the way I see it they have to do a lot more damage than a scrapper to make up for my lost damage due to extra support time and due to the fact that they are intended to be the highest damage AT. I can't say exactly how much faster the team should be killing as a result, but it should probably be a tangible shift in performance*
*which it certainly is for archery (omg RoA) and fireblast, but aoe spec scrappers/brutes seem to keep pace with most other blasters on the team front ime. |
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lolblaws
I don't know. Honestly my /therm doesn't define itself by following around a blaster with cauterize on auto in addition to all my other buffing duties. I feel I get plenty of opportunity to support in almost all team configurations and personally the times that pop up where I need to focus almost entirely on support aren't very fun for me because I have an entire primary largely being neglected.
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I am not implying that buff/debuff/aggro control need to babysit blasters. I am merely implying that if buff/debuff and aggro control simply do their thing, then they will be rewarded with blasters who exceed the norm. I think giving out the good buffs to teammates is quite beneficial over the long haul, despite the small sacrifice in time spent shooting stuff. I would even propose that it is more likely you would have to spend more time not shooting stuff if you spend less time buffing, because less time buffing likely means more time healing or rezzing or running away or dying yourself.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lolblaws
With regard to tanking, my fire/ss/pyre honestly can't tell the difference one way or the other because I attempt to hold all agro regardless of team composition. I see that and doing solid aoe damage as my main responsibilities. I don't turn off gauntlet (even if I could) on fireball and footstomp just because the team may have more self sufficient toons on it. I can't imagine it being different on even tougher tanks.
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Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.
Quote:
I wouldn't say we are at that point either. The difference between archery and fireblast compared to the other blast sets is daunting. |
Originally Posted by StratoNexus
I would submit that the best AoEing blasters outdoing the best AoEing armoreds and the best AoEing armoreds macthing the average AoEing blasters is probably somewhere near a good balance point. I am not sure we are actually at that point, but it sometimes feels pretty decent in game, but I play a lot of those best AoEing blasters more often then I play those average AoEing blasters.
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I'm in the same boat as you, I greatly prefer fire and archery (I like my rad/fire as well, but only as a combo as rad alone doesn't do it for me). The other blasters I've tried largely sucked at aoe damage and had to lean heavily on their secondary to do decent st damage. To me that's a big sacrifice to not be as good as many builds in the game that don't make the same sacrifice.
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| Do you feel the need to follow blasters you team with around all the time because they are so fragile and likely to need a heal any moment? Or do you feel like giving them your good buffs allows them to unleash on their own much better? Or do you just generally not give anyone on your team the good buffs and also only heal when you need it? |
On the other hand, if we didn't ramp up difficulty then we can usually get by with me only buffing the blaster(s) because everyone else is self sufficient enough.
Either way the blasters require extra attention from me. That's time I'm not launching my own aoe's, which to me means they now need to make up for my damage being lost in addition to clearly being more damaging than anyone else. I can't say I've seen many blasters clearly succeed in that task, but I don't think I'm being unreasonable in that demand.
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| I am not implying that buff/debuff/aggro control need to babysit blasters. I am merely implying that if buff/debuff and aggro control simply do their thing, then they will be rewarded with blasters who exceed the norm. I think giving out the good buffs to teammates is quite beneficial over the long haul, despite the small sacrifice in time spent shooting stuff. I would even propose that it is more likely you would have to spend more time not shooting stuff if you spend less time buffing, because less time buffing likely means more time healing or rezzing or running away or dying yourself. |
Blasters need absurd amounts of buffing before they are no longer a concern for the support. Unless of course the team just keeps playing well below what they can handle so the blasters look good.
Quote:
| If you are holding aggro that well, blasters need not fear, so their extra fragility is meaningless, yes? The survivability advantage being claimed as out of whack disappears when the tanker has the aggro (or a controller/dominator has it locked down). |
Just like when the decision to roll a blaster automatically adds 4 defenders to your team so that survivability is no longer an issue we can start saying things like "survival is not an issue, due to various things"
The thing about this game is that no AT is intended to be required. Cool design principle, but what it results in is frequently encountering team compositions that are far from optimal for a blaster to perform at their peak. Having a degree of self sufficiency is a very valuable asset in this game and is likely why 13 of the 14 available AT's range from decent to excellent at it.
FWIW I'm not saying blasters need an increase in survivability. Not at all, but they should (imo) do clearly more damage than anyone and everyone else. If a scrapper can do anywhere approaching the same damage as a blaster then the blaster has already lost. Which on that note, the comparisons that keep getting tossed around keep saying "see the blaster does more damage" yep it does, but I don't see doing 20% more damage (from one of the last aoe chains earlier) works out to being balanced when the scrapper is well over 20% more survivable.
Quote:
I'm not completely sure if you're being sarcastic or not here, but either way that statement just bothers me. Does the ability of a controller to lock down enemies negate the survivability advantage a tank has over a scrapper and therefore indicate the two ATs should have more similar damage? I mean, if the ability to negate the survivability advantage scrappers have over blasters makes it ok for scrappers to equal (or just about that) blaster damage then shouldn't it be ok for tankers to equal scrapper damage too?|
Originally Posted by StratoNexus
If you are holding aggro that well, blasters need not fear, so their extra fragility is meaningless, yes? The survivability advantage being claimed as out of whack disappears when the tanker has the aggro (or a controller/dominator has it locked down).
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I'm aware that's somewhat of a weak argument, but my point is that ATs should be balanced against each other not balanced by the inclusion of another because in the case where that 'other' either isn't there or isn't doing its job effectively then problems will tend to arise. Sadly I don't think blasters are currently very balanced against other damage ATs as far as damage versus survivability goes, and even more sad than that is I don't really think the game would hold up well to a blaster damage increase that would bring their balance 'in line'.
That said, I like my blasters. I think they're fun and I doubt I'll stop playing or making them anytime soon, but I also think they're poorly balanced.
MA Arcs: Yarmouth 1509 and 58812
You know what I find funny... I play blasters.. and I have played scrappers and I can tell you that every one of my blasters can take out a mob much faster than the majority of my scrappers.
Thats from playing.. not sitting around and crunching numbers..
The hard things I can do--- The impossible just take a little bit longer.
If numbers are so much more important than a teammate who is fun to play with, forget about the game altogether and go play with a calculator instead. -Claws and Effect-