Computer-buying advice.

I have a bad computer situation that I need to remedy, and I was looking for any recommendations.

I want a desktop, rather than a laptop. PC rather than a Mac. I want it to run CoH Ultra Mode without any problems.

What suggestions can you toss my way? I was looking at this DIY kit on Newegg.

If you have a Newegg link for your suggestion: Bonus points!

I've never done a DIY Kit like the above before, but it looks to be the cheapest alternative, and I think I can handle it. I can at least figure it out with internet-help and if that fails, I have friends who can assist.

But if there are better alternatives that are pre-built, that would be cool too. I'm looking to stay under the grand threshold though, so that may be difficult.

Thanks!

The only thing I see is if you only play COH you won't need a 6 core processor. Oh and you will need an OS as well. I've been very happy with my three comps on Win7 64bit.

I have a Windows 7 disc laying around somewhere, so no problem there. I should find it first...

Also, that's good. I will want to play other stuff (many games of which can't be mentioned here anymore), but nothing too graphically-intensive. So, if the 6-core processor is way overboard, what would you suggest? Unfortunately on Newegg, that seems to be the cheapest DIY kit that also includes a graphics card, so if I dropped down lower I would then need a graphics card recommendation.

I'm not sold to the computer I linked by any means. Its red case is ugly.

It doesn't look bad to me. For COH the 6 cores aren't a help; I believe it will only use two of them. However the OS and any ancillary programs will use the free cores so a quad core CPU is a help.

Depending on the other programs you run (Photoshop, video editing or other demanding processor hungry apps) that 6 core CPU may be helpful, but not for COH.

Oh, don't worry about the heat sink being "i7 compatible", to my knowledge most heat sinks work just fine with both intel & AMD... and that one looks like it's pretty efficient.

I'm partial to Asus motherboards; I've had about a half dozen of them over the years and have yet to have one fail. A case is pretty much a case so that's a wash and the power supply looks to be plenty. The heat sink is a good one, Kingston is decent RAM from what I understand and I've heard some good things about the new AMD CPU's.

The video card should do ok, it appears from reviews I've read to be a bit better than the 5770 that lots of folks are having good results on UM with. My only quibble is the Seagate hard drive... maybe it's just me but I've seen several Seagate drives die in my machines so I'm a bit gun shy... I tend to go with Western Digital instead as I've never had one fail out of more than 50 drives in 15 years. Admittedly I do work drives pretty hard in video production; much harder than the typical user and I have had more Seagates survive just fine than I've had die... you just tend to remember the drive that dies in the middle of a project.

It's an OK list of parts.

You still need a copy of the Win 7 64-bit ($100).

The Seagate HD, the 7200.11 series was known for less than stellar reliability.

The HD 5830 video card is alright but the nVidia GTX 460 is similarly priced and is much faster. Downside is it negates the Crossfire multiple video card feature of that motherboard.

As others have pointed out, this game doesn't take advantage of more than two cores so 6 cores isn't a plus. Also the fastest (3.4GHz) Phenom II quad is cheaper and faster per core than that hex core (2.8GHz).

Do you really need a full size tower case and do you like red? The black, windowless version of that case lists for $20 less. It's "baby" brother, also windowless and black, with 2 fewer DVD drive openings but the same number of internal HD bays is $60 less.

And the CPU cooler is a bit of overkill if you aren't going to try to overclock the snot out of the CPU, which would be limited by the rather basic DDR3-1333 Cas 9 memory.

Like I said, it's an OK list of parts.

So I tweaked the list a bit and got this.

• Added the OS
• Went with smaller 1GB but better rated/performing Samsung F3 hard drive
• Factory OC GTX 460 768MB
• Phenom II X4 965
• Mid-tower, windowless black HAF-922 case from the red HAF-932 full tower
• Dropped the 3rd party CPU cooler

Ha, I love the wish list title.

Sorry, misplaced this.

Yes, the HAF-922 is $60 cheaper than the bright red HAF-932. These were the three cases I was talking about.

And I was partially wrong, damn my eyes, the no window version of these cases have a mesh side for mounting side fans instead of a solid side and the 932 still has a partial window along the top. Still less expensive than the full window version.

The bigger 932 also has four USB 2.0 ports on the front panel instead of just two on the 922 as well as an IEEE 1394 port.

OK, a couple of other things.

Currently it's $84 cheaper without the OS. Now what can I buy for that $84.

First we can upgrade the memory, didn't touch that yet so here, still DDR3-1333 but Cas 7 instead of Cas 9 and with heat spreaders for $99 Vs $96. Can give you a few % improvement in memory intensive apps like games. $3 down $81 to go.

Next, kick the video card up another notch by going to the 1GB version of the GTX 460 which besides giving you more memory also gives you more memory bandwidth by going from 192-bit to 256-bit video memory bus (8-9% faster). That's $30 difference, leaving $51.

Lastly lets add back a 3rd party cooler. This is ranked higher than the Cooler Master V8 and is less expensive. Cost $40, leaving $11.

Note I didn't update the wishlist with these changes.

So in the end I'm still $11 under their package deal even with a 3rd party heatsink, faster memory (at least faster timings) and an even faster video card. Still the OS will cost $100 in either case.

You don't need anything real strong to play CoH on Ultra. I built my desktop with only around $300 and can play on nearly maxed out settings (I had to turn something down, I think it might have been Anti-Aliasing). And I think I've been getting around 40 FPS.
I'm using an ATI 4670 Video Card, 2gigs RAM, and 2.6 Dual-core AMD Processor on Windows XP.

And contrary to what Call Me Awesome said, the case is actually very important.
You want it to be big so you can fit any parts you want, you want it to be small enough to easily fit wherever you want to place it, and it needs to be well ventilated with places to attach fans on both the front and back (side could work as well).

If you just go extremely compact it'll overheat quickly from poor air-flow and will greatly limit what parts you can put in it, and if you just make it gigantic it will take up a lot of space, may require much stronger/bigger fans (which would also be louder), and could also potentially limit your hardware options.

I think he was just trying to maximize the hardware bang while staying under the price of the package.

No doubt there's savings to be had if you scale back a little.. it's all a question of budget. Speed costs, how fast do you want to spend?

For example, if you are trying to trim some $ then

Drop the processor back some.. you can go down to a 3.0 gig instead of a 3.4 gig, and drop about $30 off the cpu.. Or better yet, drop back to a unlocked dual core like this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819103846 and droplike $70 off the cpu. The MB he selected has the 'core unlocker' capability, which means you may well get a quad core (if your cpu was downbinned) after all. (it's a roll of the dice, but so far from what I've heard the odds are in your favor) And it's an unlocked cpu so you can probalby overclock it to 3.4 or higher if you are into that kind of thing.

Coolermaster cases are great, but again you could save some there if you needed to, same with the PS which might be a bit of overkill at 750 watts. (although you might also want to drop to a lower power video card, I think an ATI 5770 draws less power than the nVidia unless I'm remembering wrong.

Anyway none of that is knocking with FatherX put together, it's just a point that if that config is outside your budget, then you can shave things down a bit.

For another path to a slightly more affordable system, look at the $750 gaming rig he has linked (which is $671 at current prices) You could take that as a base and go with Most of what he has there, but swap in the MB, and Memory from the wishlist he made for you, and that dual core 'black' Phenom-II I listed above (and hope it turns out to actually be viable as a quad core) That could still be a pretty killer rig, and at a rough guess somewhere close to $750

here is a prebuilt on sale


http://www.microcenter.com/single_pr...uct_id=0337324


saves you a lot of hair pulling

You guys are good at this, ha.

I was trying my hardest to stay under the thousand-threshold, and really, at this point, City of Heroes would be the most taxing thing I put the system through. So as long as the PC can handle Ultra Mode and is future-proof for another year, I'll be interested.

The closest Microcenter is at least 30 miles away. It looks like they will do home delivery though, so that shouldn't stop me.

Trinculo, what is your hesitation on it specifically? Just that I wouldn't be able to add upgraded RAM or anything at a later date?

(As a matter of fact, isn't that a standard concern with Dells?)

well last year i bought a dell 435 from microcenter, after warrenity ran out i replaced hd with a 10k rpm HD and an 750 watt ps,and I threw in a gtx 280, i also upgraded the memory to 12 gigs. I do pc support for a living so the upgrades do not worry me,but a FIRST time builder , might do things thatcould cause problems, It might be better to buy pre-built then learn on a low cost machine, according to dell forums, they ps is is bit underrated(the 450 i got in my dell) maybe the 350 is also. i must admit except for my amiga 1000,I have built my own machines, and it is nice to bring it home un box and have it working in less than 1 hour.(not counting the download of coh time)

just a bunch of options please let us know what you decide

microcenter does have a 7100 on sale too for 799.00,

Yeah, I've built all my own boxen since the Compaq Deskpro (8086 era) (if you don't count the laptops). It is satisfying to know exactly what's in there, and design a good balanced system. ALSO something designed with upgrades in mind, such as faster cpu, more memory, etc down the road. And since I'm an ex computer tech, it's childs play for me.

But I have to admit, the deta in price between pre-built and DYI has been dropping. I'd be hard pressed to come up with a I7 system for the price of that Dell.

(although if I did, it would have a proper PS, a bit better video card, and not fill all 4 memory slots dammit! Which down the road upgrade wise might bring the price closer since I'd not be tossing out at least two sticks or memory and a pefectly good (if undersized) power supply, when it came time to get more ram, or a better video card)

The biggest downside to the dell as FatherXmas mentioned is that it's not really well 'balanced' in that it's got a killer CPU (about 1/4 of the sys cost for dyi of same chip), but then skimps a bit on the video.. Thing is, with respect to CityOf, that means you are going to be limited by the video card most of the time, and basically all that extra cpu horsepower is pretty much going to waste.

That's why most of the systems He's spec'd out, and the tweeks I've suggested (or hybreds 'crossbreeds' of his wishlists, use a slightly less powerful CPU and slightly more powerful video (or less video, but a $750ish price target)

Chain is only as strong as weakest link. A system's performance is limited by the first constraint that occurs in the system, any improvments that don't address that constraint, don't improve the performance of the system. So if your system is limited by the video card, then a faster processor, makes little to no difference, it's just a waste, until you address the primary constraint.

If you're going to build a system around an ati 5770, then you'd just as well save some money on the CPU, and a few other parts, and target a $700-$800 pricepoint. If you're going to spend $1K, then IMHO you'd be better off to go with better video than the 5770. (even if the I7 cpu does kick *** on the Phenom)

Thanks for the input guys.

I had another recommendation, this one, which I have kind of already dismissed, but I thought I should let you guys weigh in on it regardless.

The only drawback in building your own is that YOU have to deal with the manufacturers (plural) if parts go bad during your warranty period. Like my Asus Rampage Formula motherboard just did - submitted an email to tech support but haven't gotten anything back. Will call tonight. It's going to be WAAAAYYYY bigger of a headache than it would be to call Dell, jump through some hoops and then get the part sent to you to replace ... even packing up your machine to send for repair might be faster than getting this taken care of... (anybody ever deal with Asus for warranty repair/replacement?)

So - your call. Plus, if you haven't ever built a computer from scratch ... it's a little scary the first time - and you can fry stuff on first power up if it's not hooked up right. Not trying to talk you out of it, just letting you know that there are some downsides to it.

Storm

Also, you're seeing a lot of AMD here.

Just so you can get an idea of what can be got on the Intel front.

Link

Note, if you have the extra $40-50, I REALLY recommend getting the 1GB GTX460. Because of the way the architecture of the GTX 460 works, reducing memory means they need to turn off some of the ROPs, thus decreasing performance by more than simply total memory reduction on other cards would.

Clicking on the linked image above will take you off the City of Heroes site. However, the guides will be linked back here.