Vengeance stacking
By
Darkfaith,
Posted on: 2010-06-20 01:13 in ALL ACCESS Gameplay Technical Issues Bugs
NPC's will always be able to do things that PC's can't simply because they can't adapt like a PC can. So don't expect NPC's to stop stacking Vengeance, or Illusionists to stop attacking while Phased, or the mobs to stop targeting a player as they rez even though players can no longer keep a rezzing mob targeted.
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Well AoE still works even if you can't target them...
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Originally Posted by NezuChiza
... or the mobs to stop targeting a player as they rez even though players can no longer keep a rezzing mob targeted.
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Exploit fixes are generally not included in the patch notes.|
Originally Posted by Desum
I'm almost positive this wasn't written on the patch notes.
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| Players had a feeling it would get nerfed, but how can they nerf stacking when NPCs can do it. They need to fix Nemesis lieuts so they can only do 1 veng stack. |
Paragon City Search And Rescue
The Mentor Project
Ummm, unless they changed it back when I wasn't looking, Vengeance hasn't been able to stack for PC characters since the 2006-04-11 patch.
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Searching doesn't bring up any notes that indicate that this change was reversed, so if it had been then it was a bug. Which would make the change an exploit fix, as Ironblade indicated.
| Leadership/Vengeance will no longer stack from multiple casters. In other words, only one application of Vengeance buffs can enhance a group at a time. |
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the exploit was for a player to die outside of the Vengeance power's activation range; then the guys with Vengeance prepare their Vengeance power by targeting the dead player and clicking on Vengeance; somebody else teleports the dead player into range, Vengeance goes off in an auto-stack. |
Originally Posted by Darkfaith
Ummm, unless they changed it back when I wasn't looking, Vengeance hasn't been able to stack for PC characters since the 2006-04-11 patch.
Searching doesn't bring up any notes that indicate that this change was reversed, so if it had been then it was a bug. Which would make the change an exploit fix, as Ironblade indicated. |
I suspect the "Fix" required code on the back end, which is why it only got addressed now.
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This. |
Originally Posted by je_saist
the exploit was for a player to die outside of the Vengeance power's activation range; then the guys with Vengeance prepare their Vengeance power by targeting the dead player and clicking on Vengeance; somebody else teleports the dead player into range, Vengeance goes off in an auto-stack.
I suspect the "Fix" required code on the back end, which is why it only got addressed now. |
The patch note listed meant that if somebody used Vengeance, somebody else wouldn't be able to come along and use it again while the current buff was still active.
I believe the reason the exploit worked was because with 2 or more people firing the buff simultaneously, the system saw that the player did not already have a buff, and applied them simultaneously.
As mentioned, the fix to this was probably something that required changing the way another part of the system works, so might have been harder or lower priority until now.
On a side note, does the same functionality apply to multiple copies of different Vengeance powers? What if there was a VEAT using theirs at the same time as somebody with the Leadership pool? Does it block one of them from being applied?
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Leadership and VEAT veng wasn't stacking before, except for TP stacking.
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Originally Posted by Master-Blade
This.
The patch note listed meant that if somebody used Vengeance, somebody else wouldn't be able to come along and use it again while the current buff was still active. I believe the reason the exploit worked was because with 2 or more people firing the buff simultaneously, the system saw that the player did not already have a buff, and applied them simultaneously. As mentioned, the fix to this was probably something that required changing the way another part of the system works, so might have been harder or lower priority until now. On a side note, does the same functionality apply to multiple copies of different Vengeance powers? What if there was a VEAT using theirs at the same time as somebody with the Leadership pool? Does it block one of them from being applied? |
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Right, but my question is did the exploit fix take into account each version? We can assume it did, but I've learned never to assume such things. lol
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Originally Posted by NordBlast
Leadership and VEAT veng wasn't stacking before, except for TP stacking.
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I heard somewhere, that it would require making substational changes to the game engine in order to fix TP veng stacking. It seems, last night RSF somewhat confirmed this point of view.
Looks like, the way devs decided to deal with TP veng stacking was to cancel selection of dead teammate while they being TPed.
Still we were able to stack veng at least twice.
One time was by accident: 2 players hit veng around the same time (no TPing of dead body). You can see on this pic the VEAT veng stacked with Leadership veng:
Second time we were determined to stack veng and we succeded in it as well. Again there was no TPing. You can see on this pic the VEAT veng stacked with double stacked Leadership veng:
So, server doesn't prevent stacking the veng. It is still possible to do if you avoid TPing and get lucky with timing.
While it wasn't tested, I believe, it is possible to stack veng even with TP, but would require much better coordination between TPer and vengers, and it wouldn't be as reliable as it was before fix.
I don't know if this was on another thread, but vengeance can no longer be stacked when the dead ally is teleported within the vicinity of 2+ players with the power. I'm almost positive this wasn't written on the patch notes. Players had a feeling it would get nerfed, but how can they nerf stacking when NPCs can do it. They need to fix Nemesis lieuts so they can only do 1 veng stack.