Some general questions about melee banes
PS: I know widows put out more dps, and are probably more wanted in teams, but after fighting lots of bane scouts and executioners, well... they just look badass
That's the reason I'm going bane.
1) You are correct. A Bane's combat training is against ranged attacks, and is a defense power (not resist).
I recommend 1 slot for defense, and anything after that for procs. There are a few really good procs for a passive defense power.
2) Defense debuffs are your weakness, for sure. If you take both your passive armors that'd give you about 10% resists against them. Pack inspirations or be extra sneaky!
Just to note this part of why ranged defense isn't such a bad thing. There are oodles of defense debuffing ranged attacks in pve.
3) I love the pet AI. The Disruptors you get (call reinforcements) are an awesome thing to summon right before you alpha. They will fire wide area web grenades and ball lightning with you. On top of that they have a hold and a ST attack. They are just awesome.
Crab's spiderlings are a little less useful... they're not as bad as Imps, but three little guys running around can spread out your enemies more than you'd like.
4) CT: Offensive sucks. The Res ToHit is about all its good for :-/. I would recommend you take a look at a couple cheaper sets that have global to hit instead. For example, you could put 4 pieces of Crushing Impact in two of your melee attacks, and you'd get more than CT: Offensive offers.
If you were not considering doing sets anyway, I would take a look at just doing +tohit sets. They are often times cheap and only take 4 slots. I would not recommend only doing 1 accuracy in each attack.
Typically, I do SOs (w/ 1 accuracy) from 22 - 27 then switch to sets. The levels leading up to 27 can be obnoxious just because of how much I miss.
@Gilia1
I play heroes on Champion.
I play villains on Virtue.
Thanks, it looks like I'll be picking up the pets then because of their added control. And I'll be dropping CT-O from my build and go with acc slots + TT leadership to help overall accuracy.
I'll be IO'ing eventually, but that's a long ways away (soldier is lvl 2 lol). I plan to test out survivability with generic IOs / SOs first, then see what I want to do in terms of IO sets.
I think the only thing I need to cover early on is the -KB IO.
One last question. I see the thread counts on the different ATs, and khelds / SoAs have some of the lowest numbers. I didn't see that many spiders while leveling up my MM, although I did solo quite a bit in getting to 50.
Do SoAs have a low population compared to the other ATs, and any opinions as to why?
Do SoAs have a low population compared to the other ATs, and any opinions as to why?
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I'd say if you count widows and soldiers as one AT (for population purposes only) they'd be right above Stalkers and Dominators in terms of people looking to team. That'd put them below Brutes, Corruptors, and Masterminds. I always actively search out VEATs when building PUG teams, so I could be way off.
If there really is fewer SoAs, it's not because they are weaker. At worst, it is more complicated to make the best build possible. That's what's epic about them, in my opinion. They require a bit more experience. They do almost as much damage as corruptors, with almost as much survivability as a Brute, all the while with awesome leadership toggles... and crabs bring some pets. Maybe they're just too cool for some!
@Gilia1
I play heroes on Champion.
I play villains on Virtue.
If you were not considering doing sets anyway, I would take a look at just doing +tohit sets. They are often times cheap and only take 4 slots. I would not recommend only doing 1 accuracy in each attack.
Typically, I do SOs (w/ 1 accuracy) from 22 - 27 then switch to sets. The levels leading up to 27 can be obnoxious just because of how much I miss. |
By comparison, your one SO gives at most 38% and each time you level that drops.
Since the black market sucks, you can really go with anything from 15 on up that you can find available. I spend tickets at those levels and find I'm drowning in cheap sets. makes a big difference.
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Thank you everyone at Paragon and on Virtue. When the lights go out in November, you'll find me on Razor Bunny.
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Madam Enigma's History
Hi guys, I was wondering about bane spiders in general, and in spite of having read that bane executioner guide at the top, I still have some questions. Thanks in advance for any replies.
1. CT Defensive and melee. I've read that soldiers get ranged defense as their auto power while widows get melee defense. I assume there's no possible way of changing the positional defense if one were to go melee bane or ranged fortunata. Taking this was the easy choice nonetheless, but should I put more than 1 slot on it? I've read that soldiers can cap their ranged def very easily; it's the melee cap that takes some effort to reach. 2. -defense debuffs. I don't see where soldiers get any kind of protection against this. What do you soldiers do when you've got lots of PPP keldians stacking -def debuffs on you? 3. The pets. I understand these are like controller pets, so I can't compare them to my 50 MM. But, knowing how my zombies like to run around if I don't reel them in with the follow button... Exactly how dumb are these spider pets? I don't want them to run off and aggro spawn B when my team is still at spawn A. 4. What's your opinion of CT: offensive? Could I get away with having it and only having 1 accuracy on my attacks? I had planned on doing 1 acc, 0-1 end red, 1-2 recharge on my attacks, along with the 3 damage slots. Looking over the end costs of toggles and combat jumping, I don't think I'll have a big problem with endurance (taking stamina). |
1. I skipped CT D on my bane and am still running 46% to all 3 positionals. Not really needed once you have a solid foundation for melee and AE defenses as ranged will probably follow in suit.
2. Yeah, all SoAs should be weary of DDR. It's probably our one true shortcoming. Just pick your enemy groups wisely and, if faced with some DDR foes, pop a few oranges. With cloak and placate on your side you can usually win out in the end.
3. The pets are great (esp for the purples: 3 slotting for 3% health and 16% regen? Sign me up!). They are largely a fire and forget weapon, don't worry about having to babysit them, just let em rip! In the higher levels don't expect them to be too durable though. But great mindless damage and control. If you end up going mace patron for shatter armor you can get the blaster pet as well and have 3 robotic spiders.
4. CT O is a waste IMO. With the amount of accuracy you will have access to later in the game through IOs it becomes pointsless as you cannot have a higher to hit chance than 95%. If you end up with a power slot left and no enhancements to plug into it consider one of the low end cost TTs or (like I did) venom grenade with only an acc IO.
if heavily slotted with IO sets, your right. You don't really need CT:O. But then at that point you don't really need Tactics either do you? But until you've got that perfectly IOed out build, CT:O can help out with a slot crunch. For a crab spider at least, you have a lot of powers which want slots. At least 3 added slots to many of them. Some can use six slots. As such, anything to create slotting wiggle room can help out.
Between TT: Tactics and CT: Offensive you can hit a +3 minion roughly 86% of the time. Or at least I do. And that lets me get away with only 3 slotting attacks till I have excess slots. now at level 40 I'm having the extra slots to start putting a fourth one in attacks. however I wont have too many extra slots really. I plan on getting Serum, Frag Grenade, and the two pet powers. Frag Grenade will probably be 4 slotted. Serum and the pet powers will likely get six slotted. Anything extra will go towards a 4th slot in attacks. That way I can slot 4 enhancement sets in attacks.
But then, I didn't ignore the passive +resist powers. I 3 slotted them for resistance. I also 4 slotted CT: Defensive. 3 Def Buff enhancements, and a unique KB Protection enhancement. If I get an extra slot I may try getting one from a resist set too (if I can).
But then, I don't plan my builds around set enhancements usually. I plan any set enhancements around what I can slot after my build's finished.
"The danger is not that a particular class is unfit to govern. Every class is unfit to govern." Lord Acton
Madam Enigma's History
One question about shatter armor. I understand it doesn't cause a stealth or executioner's strike when you're cloaked, but it has that -resistance. What would be your opener? hide > surveillance > build up > shatter > shatter armor > placate > shatter > pulverize?
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Shatter armor makes a great opener if you are out of hide and don't have placate up, especially for ambushes and the like, but the huge executioners strike on shatter is too nice to waste if you do have hide/placate up.
Globals: @Midnight Mystique/@Magik13
My bane used a similar attack sequence, although I never had enough recharge on shatter to fire it off so quickly again. Usually I would open with surveillance > build up > shatter > shatter armor > crowd control, to knock everything around me off its feet and get the build up bonus on the AE, then finish off my main target with pulverize and/or bash (if he was still up), saving placate + shatter for the next biggest target. On an EB I would probably following the first sequence with placate + shatter.
Shatter armor makes a great opener if you are out of hide and don't have placate up, especially for ambushes and the like, but the huge executioners strike on shatter is too nice to waste if you do have hide/placate up. |
Mid's is saying the "base damage" of Shatter Armor is 271! (in pvp mode). Is this correct? That seems waay too high.
In comparison Head Splitter's base is 236 (again in pvp mode).
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Level 45 Natural Arachnos Soldier
Primary Power Set: Bane Spider Soldier
Secondary Power Set: Bane Spider Training
Ancillary Pool: Mace Mastery
perma jump is ---> /up 1
I LOVE fighting Ritki on my Bane. I set the diff on +0/+5 and I have a blast.
It's true, Shatter Armor does a lot of damage in PvP, but keep in mind the base Resists everyone gets (but then as a Bane Resists are something you can disassemble quite well ).
Also keep in mind Banes are hella squishy in PvP.
Achilles' Heel proc in Surveillance FTW.
P.S. Depending on your build and tactics, Banes tend to be better at setting up kills for others than they are at getting kills themselves, but you can certainly get some kills yourself as well.
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One question about shatter armor. I understand it doesn't cause a stealth or executioner's strike when you're cloaked, but it has that -resistance. What would be your opener? hide > surveillance > build up > shatter > shatter armor > placate > shatter > pulverize?
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Shatter armor makes a great opener if you are out of hide and don't have placate up, especially for ambushes and the like, but the huge executioners strike on shatter is too nice to waste if you do have hide/placate up.
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so, I can't get any kind of crit using placate. what am I doing wrong??
perma jump is ---> /up 1
nvm, just found out that the attack has to specifically say "this power will deliver a Critical Strike out of hide", and i was trying to crit with Shatter Armor (SA does not say it crits)
the power description of Placate isn't very clear
-Placate
This Hide is very brief, and offers no Defense bonus, but it will allow you to deliver a Critical Hit.
A double damage Shatter Armor is the whole reason i made this toon
ooh well, adapt and overcome.
perma jump is ---> /up 1
Got my bane this wknd finally
To be honest, my current impression of him is that he's a stalker with fantastic team buffs and mainly relies on purple pills if things go south. Not a complaint, the executioner's strike was totally worth it.
I didn't know this before, but it was nice to have 4 mace variants available. Here's hoping more will be added but I assume they want to keep the signature look of the arachnos mace. That and only those maces have red outlets for the beam attacks.
Hi guys, I was wondering about bane spiders in general, and in spite of having read that bane executioner guide at the top, I still have some questions. Thanks in advance for any replies.
1. CT: Defensive and melee. I've read that soldiers get ranged defense as their auto power while widows get melee defense. I assume there's no possible way of changing the positional defense if one were to go melee bane or ranged fortunata. Taking this was the easy choice nonetheless, but should I put more than 1 slot on it? I've read that soldiers can cap their ranged def very easily; it's the melee cap that takes some effort to reach. 2. -defense debuffs. I don't see where soldiers get any kind of protection against this. What do you soldiers do when you've got lots of PPP keldians stacking -def debuffs on you? 3. The pets. I understand these are like controller pets, so I can't compare them to my 50 MM. But, knowing how my zombies like to run around if I don't reel them in with the follow button... Exactly how dumb are these spider pets? I don't want them to run off and aggro spawn B when my team is still at spawn A. 4. What's your opinion of CT: offensive? Could I get away with having it and only having 1 accuracy on my attacks? I had planned on doing 1 acc, 0-1 end red, 1-2 recharge on my attacks, along with the 3 damage slots. Looking over the end costs of toggles and combat jumping, I don't think I'll have a big problem with endurance (taking stamina). |
2. Pop purples and/or kill them faster
3. The pets are very well behaved and are a great addition. IMO they are a must have power, or else you may as well be playing a NW
4. It's a pretty junky power. If you are ridiculously poor and can't afford to cheaply frankenslot even though it is cheaper than SO's then it can work.
PS: I know widows put out more dps, and are probably more wanted in teams, but after fighting lots of bane scouts and executioners, well... they just look badass
That's the reason I'm going bane. |
Additionally, while widows and banes are both desirable in teams if you find people wanting a widow more than a bane then they don't' understand game mechanics very well. Venom Grenade alone is pretty much > widow on a team
Enjoy your Bane. They are awesome. I eagerly await the day BAB's figures out how to get rid of redraw cause that is going to make Banes amazingly fun to play.
Hi guys, I was wondering about bane spiders in general, and in spite of having read that bane executioner guide at the top, I still have some questions. Thanks in advance for any replies.
1. CT: Defensive and melee. I've read that soldiers get ranged defense as their auto power while widows get melee defense. I assume there's no possible way of changing the positional defense if one were to go melee bane or ranged fortunata.
Taking this was the easy choice nonetheless, but should I put more than 1 slot on it? I've read that soldiers can cap their ranged def very easily; it's the melee cap that takes some effort to reach.
2. -defense debuffs. I don't see where soldiers get any kind of protection against this. What do you soldiers do when you've got lots of PPP keldians stacking -def debuffs on you?
3. The pets. I understand these are like controller pets, so I can't compare them to my 50 MM. But, knowing how my zombies like to run around if I don't reel them in with the follow button... Exactly how dumb are these spider pets? I don't want them to run off and aggro spawn B when my team is still at spawn A.
4. What's your opinion of CT: offensive? Could I get away with having it and only having 1 accuracy on my attacks? I had planned on doing 1 acc, 0-1 end red, 1-2 recharge on my attacks, along with the 3 damage slots.
Looking over the end costs of toggles and combat jumping, I don't think I'll have a big problem with endurance (taking stamina).