All KB Protect IOs Equal?


Adeon Hawkwood

 

Posted

Hey folks. Question on KB protect Global IOs.

I've got a few blasters and corruptors who could seriously use some KB protection. I've been lucky enough to get a Blessing/Zephyr recipe to drop once and the difference on my main blaster was VERY noticeable when I was running my last LGTF. I'd like to carry that advantage over into my beloved redsider squishies, but I'm curious if there any inherent advantage/disadvantage to any of the versions.

Anyway, I noticed that the market has some relatively cheap KB protect IOs (Steadfast Protection), but is usually flat out of any further BoZ's or Karma. I was just curious if there was an advantage to one kind vs. another.

Considerations:

1. Being not an ebil marketeer or someone who does a lot of farming for inf, I am relatively cash-poor (richest redside is about 100M; 80M on blueside; not shabby but I need to budget when IO'ing).

2. I'm not softcapped or building toward softcap anything, so having mule-slots might require a respec or an expensive 2nd build (and see point one for my trepidation with that).


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Posted

The main distinction being where you can slot a given IO -- BoZ slots into any pool travel power, so it's easy for anyone to use. Karma slots into defense I think, so it will go into Hover or Stealth pool powers. Steadfast, being a resist IO, probably is more difficult for some ATs to slot.

I think they all grant 4 points KB protection, if I remember correctly. If you pick up tough for any reason, then go with the Steadfast.



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Posted

Biggest reason for that, IIRC, is defense powers are easier for everyone to pick up, so Karmas are in more demand than Steadfasts.

And Zephyrs are not just universal travel, but have nice set bonuses as well. I don't think any other sets give such nice positional bonuses as it does within the 2/3 slotting bonuses.

Biggest thing to know is that the KB protection IOs are globals (and thus a set bonus), not procs or 120s. So you don't have to have them in an active power, but if you exemplar 4 or more levels below the enhancement's level you lose the bonus.


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Posted

Also, Zephyr has some very desirable defense in the set bonuses for very few slots, which add tremendously to the price.

Organica is correct, all three types are -4 KB protection.

One thing to remember is that the KB protection acts as a set bonus, and will disappear if you exemp more than 3 levels below the level of the IO.


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Posted

All three of the KB protection IOs provide mag 4 protection to KB. The difference is where you can slot them and what other bonuses the set can provide. If I were to guess, I'd say that the Steadfast IO is more readily available because fewer players have a damage resistance power to slot one in. Travel and defense powers are readily available through the power pools, but AFAIK the only way to get a resist damage power is to have one in your primary or secondary or by taking Tough from the Fighting Pool.

So by all means, if you don't need or want the BotZ defense bonuses, buy the cheapest KB protection IO that you can slot.

By the way, the Kinetic Crash KB set also gives KB protection as a 4-slot bonus, but that's only mag 3 protection. (Plus the fact that it's in a KB set, which many players can't or prefer not to use.)


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Posted

SHAME! was Autohit.

Stargeek was slowed.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finduilas View Post
By the way, the Kinetic Crash KB set also gives KB protection as a 4-slot bonus, but that's only mag 3 protection. (Plus the fact that it's in a KB set, which many players can't or prefer not to use.)
My Psi/Mental blaster runs two full sets of those. 6pts KB protection AND 15% recharge bonus. Yum.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Organica View Post
The main distinction being where you can slot a given IO -- BoZ slots into any pool travel power, so it's easy for anyone to use.
There's also a couple non-pool powers BoZ will slot into as well...

Speed Boost and Accelerate Metabolism also take Universal Travel.

I know there are a few others as well, but I can't remember them at the moment.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rajani Isa View Post
SHAME! was Autohit.

Stargeek was slowed.
I haven't slotted Winter's Gift: Slow Resistance (20%) yet .

SB PLZ!!


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rajani Isa View Post
My Psi/Mental blaster runs two full sets of those. 6pts KB protection AND 15% recharge bonus. Yum.
Definitely one of those YMMV things; using 4 slots from a KB set is the last thing I'd consider for my Dark/Mace tank.


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Posted

As I recall, Elude also takes universal travel.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finduilas View Post
Definitely one of those YMMV things; using 4 slots from a KB set is the last thing I'd consider for my Dark/Mace tank.
My Plants/Energy Dom is working on getting 5 complete 6 piece sets slotted, for the recharge, and so far, I have not seen any drawbacks to these. Then again, with his pet plant, vines, and other stuff, when he goes into battle, it is total carnage. So if there are drawbacks, I just haven't been able to notice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rajani Isa View Post
As I recall, Elude also takes universal travel.
Yeah. That was the other one I was trying to remember. However, it would be silly to put a BoZ KB Protection in Elude, since that as a Super Reflexes power, and SR already has good KB protection via Practiced Brawler. Still, Elude could take a Winter's Gift Slow Resistance, if you want to wait that long to get it (level 38).


 

Posted

Don't forget about the Kinetic Crash set that offers 3 points KB protection as one of the set bonuses. I have two sets of KC in my Energy Blaster for 6 points of KB protection.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clouded View Post
Don't forget about the Kinetic Crash set that offers 3 points KB protection as one of the set bonuses. I have two sets of KC in my Energy Blaster for 6 points of KB protection.
Yeah. That was mentioned 6 or 7 posts up from yours.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clouded View Post
Don't forget about the Kinetic Crash set that offers 3 points KB protection as one of the set bonuses. I have two sets of KC in my Energy Blaster for 6 points of KB protection.
*cough*

Someone SB Clouded, STAT!

edit And where is my SB, dang it!!


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willowpaw View Post
Yeah. That was mentioned 6 or 7 posts up from yours.
Sweet, that's what I get for responding to the OP and not reading the thread.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by StarGeek View Post
*cough*

Someone SB Clouded, STAT!

edit And where is my SB, dang it!!
Someone also needs to SB StarGeek as well. (I hereby claim 3 neener points.)


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willowpaw View Post
Yeah. That was the other one I was trying to remember. However, it would be silly to put a BoZ KB Protection in Elude, since that as a Super Reflexes power, and SR already has good KB protection via Practiced Brawler. Still, Elude could take a Winter's Gift Slow Resistance, if you want to wait that long to get it (level 38).
Biggest reason would be if you are worried about having KB protection right after dying but before PB recharges.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willowpaw View Post
Speed Boost and Accelerate Metabolism also take Universal Travel.
Well that's handy since the two corrs in question are a /kin and a /rad =D

My /rad also has Charged Armor, so I could frankenslot resist/end to free up a slot for the Steadfast. Might even see if the Resist/Def global is available out there somewhere.

Quote:
Originally Posted by StarGeek View Post

SB PLZ!!
*grateful /kin SB's for the help*


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by StarGeek View Post
One thing to remember is that the KB protection acts as a set bonus, and will disappear if you exemp more than 3 levels below the level of the IO.
I'm pretty sure this is incorrect. Per paragonwiki:

Set bonuses apply to the character at all times, regardless of the power into which the set is slotted.

AND...

Set Bonuses are constant percent benefits, unaffected by the level of the enhancement or the character.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Heat_Stroke View Post
I'm pretty sure this is incorrect. Per paragonwiki:

Set bonuses apply to the character at all times, regardless of the power into which the set is slotted.

AND...

Set Bonuses are constant percent benefits, unaffected by the level of the enhancement or the character.
No it is correct:

http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Inventio...n_Enhancements
Quote:
These Set Bonuses are always on, even if the power in which the Set is slotted isn't activated, and even if that power is greyed out due to exemplaring! However, you do start to lose the bonuses if you exemplar more than three levels under the level of the IOs in the Set.
http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Inventio...ements#Globals
Quote:
The IOs that act like Set Bonuses give a benefit that most often applies a continuous effect globally to the character. This has led to these Special IOs being called Globals. Like the Set Bonuses, Globals do not rely upon the power in which they are slotted to be activated in order to work. In fact, just like Set Bonuses, the power in which they are slotted can be greyed out due to exemplaring and the Global will still work. However, just like Set Bonuses, the Global stops working when the character is exemplared more than three levels under the level of the Global IO.
I'll add the info to the page you linked so that anyone coming along and checking your link will assume you failed to read the page correctly thereby destroying your credibility on this forum *maniacal laughter* (ok, I'm actually doing it because the info should be there).


 

Posted

But, but... I 6 slotted my credibility with Red Fortune.

Well, it's good to know that the particular Wiki page I referenced was incorrect and is being fixed.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Heat_Stroke View Post
I'm pretty sure this is incorrect. Per paragonwiki:

Set bonuses apply to the character at all times, regardless of the power into which the set is slotted.

AND...

Set Bonuses are constant percent benefits, unaffected by the level of the enhancement or the character.
Well, we know that second statement to be untrue. Set bonuses stop working whenever you exemp more than three levels below the level of the enhancement.

If you follow the link on that page to Global IO benefits, which specifically uses a level 20 Karma Knockback Protection as an example, you'll get the correct statement of "However, just like Set Bonuses, the Global stops working when the character is exemplared more than three levels under the level of the Global IO."

Also see Enhancement Set Bonuses section of the IO enhancement page: "However, you do start to lose the bonuses if you exemplar more than three levels under the level of the IOs in the Set."

edit: Man, I'm just too slow today.


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Posted

Technically, nothing on that page was wrong. The benefit given by a set bonus is, for the most part, constant regardless of character or IO level. Maybe one or two exceptions in which AT mods adjust them. But the value doesn't depend on character level or IO level. Now, wither or not the bonus is granted does. but that's different.


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willowpaw View Post
My Plants/Energy Dom is working on getting 5 complete 6 piece sets slotted, for the recharge, and so far, I have not seen any drawbacks to these. Then again, with his pet plant, vines, and other stuff, when he goes into battle, it is total carnage. So if there are drawbacks, I just haven't been able to notice.
There may not be any for that character, but believe me, for a melée character with a heal that relies on proximity to foes to work, KB is definitely A Bad Thing. It's also pretty much impossible to slot attacks fully for damage if you're using four slots from a KB set.

Besides, Mace tanks lobbied long and hard to get the set improved, and getting rid of the KB was one of the improvements. I'm sure as heck not going to slot it back in!


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