Windows 7, CoX, and Desktop Windows Manager
By
all_hell,
Posted on: 2009-11-15 12:36 in ALL ACCESS Gameplay Technical Issues Bugs
I have CoH installed on my laptop for market checking. I do run in windowed mode so I don't have any of the issues that you are describing.
Going to upgrade the main system for GR so hopefully I won't notice it. Also what hardware are you running as it could just be something as simple as a driver issue.
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You should thank Support |
Originally Posted by Kinrad
I will monitor this thread in hopes for a resolution. Thanks Obsidious for knowing what to look for and being willing to help out!
 |
I know how to run what they need me to run, sure, but they're the ones handing me the steps.I just have to wonder what the commonality is. I doubt it could be a driver as the system runs fine when no non-MS services or startup tasks are running - meaning the driver interfaces between the OS and game probably aren't suspect. Could it be the nVidia apps, SoundBlaster apps, Google Chrome, AVG, or something else? Hrmmm, maybe I'll try to run the client on my Win Vista laptop tonight and see if I have the same issue there.
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I'm thinking you guys must be running something that I'm not...simply turning off desktop composition was enough to fix things for me. Maybe we should compare what we're running? When I run City I also run the following:|
Originally Posted by Obsidius
You should thank Support
I know how to run what they need me to run, sure, but they're the ones handing me the steps.I just have to wonder what the commonality is. I doubt it could be a driver as the system runs fine when no non-MS services or startup tasks are running - meaning the driver interfaces between the OS and game probably aren't suspect. Could it be the nVidia apps, SoundBlaster apps, Google Chrome, AVG, or something else? Hrmmm, maybe I'll try to run the client on my Win Vista laptop tonight and see if I have the same issue there. |
Drivers (non-native to Windows):
vNidia 191.07
Creative SB X-Fi drivers
Hardware Applications:
Logitech Profiler (for my gamepad and joystick)
Logitech Setpoint (keyboard)
Belkin n52te (keymapping app for little keypad)
MMO Gaming Mouse Software (for mapping keys to my mouse)
Control Center 3 (printer stuff, probably not an issue)
Other Apps:
AVG
Windows Live Messenger
Winamp v5.56
Herostats
Firefox
Teamspeak 2 client
The only other service I can see running that isn't an MS service or related to one of those is the Teamspeak 2 service I have set up to run as a service on my comp.
Edit: also, I have the UAC off and a couple little desktop gadgets for weather and CPU/RAM monitoring.
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I have an nVidia card as well, but this is a laptop, so no SoundBlaster apps here.|
Originally Posted by Obsidius
You should thank Support
I know how to run what they need me to run, sure, but they're the ones handing me the steps.I just have to wonder what the commonality is. I doubt it could be a driver as the system runs fine when no non-MS services or startup tasks are running - meaning the driver interfaces between the OS and game probably aren't suspect. Could it be the nVidia apps, SoundBlaster apps, Google Chrome, AVG, or something else? Hrmmm, maybe I'll try to run the client on my Win Vista laptop tonight and see if I have the same issue there. |
I did have a logitech driver that was looking for video phone calls and I know I disabled that. I have HeroStats, but since the upgrade to Windows 7, I don't run it because it doesn't work in the "on top of the game" mode anymore.
Here's a list of some of the things I disabled on 11/14 when it seems to have stopped:
Services:
Google updater service
Google software updater
lxde_device - (a Lexmark Printer Service)
PNRP Machine Name Publication
Steam Client Service
Remote Desktop Services
Windows Connect Now - Config Registrar
Start Up Programs:
Logitech Vid
lxdeamon (Lexmark Print Program)
lxdemon.exe (Lexmart Print Program)
Realtek Voice Manager
You don't hit smiling monsters - Sister Flame
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Oh my, I wonder if we have a winner? I left that running, but turned off everything else you are mentioning... I need to try this again without Steam running.
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Originally Posted by Chuckers
Steam Client Service
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Make a man a fire and keep him warm for the day, SET a man on fire and keep him warm for the rest of his life.
Incarnates: K'lir(Fire/Dark Corr):Hot-House Flower(Plant/Fire Dom):Kinrad X(Kin/Rad Def):Itsy-Bitsy Spider(Crab):Two Ton Tony(Mace/WP Broot):Teeny Weeny Widow(Fortunata/Widow) : Zeroth Law (Ice/Fire Tank)
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I run in Windowed, too, but I'm on Vista currently.
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Originally Posted by macskull
Things like this are why I play in windowed mode. Haven't had any issues like this since I installed Win7.
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Here's what's strange. I don't have Steam, but I did do something that has apparently fixed the problem. I'll restart later to see which service I stopped on Vista 64 to correct the issue. I should've written them down. I'm sub'd to this thread, so I'll report back once I've come to an assumption. |
Originally Posted by Kinrad
Oh my, I wonder if we have a winner? I left that running, but turned off everything else you are mentioning... I need to try this again without Steam running.
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Can't be Steam here, I don't have it installed. Yes, I'm weird; just don't play too much on the PC except for CoX.
But I am running vNidia ForceWare 191.07. Installed it recently too. Might be suspicious. Not the driver itself, mind you, but the apps that install with it, like the nVidia Control Panel.
Mine's not fixed. Again, for me, it's a minor annoyance.
Also again, it's not just COH that is affected for me. It's really looking more like a Windows issue. Of course, I have the same nVidia drivers installed.
I have those drivers installed too, and I got the issue to stop for me without stopping them. If they are part of the problem then they're not the only part...
I don't know what version of drivers I am using, but I know they are quite old. (as in, there have been at least 3 new versions that have come out that I have not upgraded to).
Make a man a fire and keep him warm for the day, SET a man on fire and keep him warm for the rest of his life.
Incarnates: K'lir(Fire/Dark Corr):Hot-House Flower(Plant/Fire Dom):Kinrad X(Kin/Rad Def):Itsy-Bitsy Spider(Crab):Two Ton Tony(Mace/WP Broot):Teeny Weeny Widow(Fortunata/Widow) : Zeroth Law (Ice/Fire Tank)
Eh well, I'll wait for the next set of steps from Support. Worth a thought though.
Ack, looks like I'll have to do some trial & error:
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Think the Support is probably closing the case since it doesn't seem to be OS or client-based. I've been meaning to clean out my computer anyhow... just wish I had some clue as to the culprit. I'd run with stuff disabled but I'd rather keep my AV enabled and find the culprit.| If the problem didn't occur after following the msconfig instructions it could mean another program that was running caused the issue. You can either continue playing with them disabled since what you disabled is probably not necessary to have running constantly. Or if you want to find out what program is responsible for the issue you will need to enable them one at a time and try the game till the problem comes back. |
More to come when I mess around with it later tonight or tomorrow, I'm sure.
Well, today, I played for about 3 hours and the game never locked up, unless I changed windows. However, after about an hour of playing, Ventrillo kept losing my microphone. Previously, that's always happened with a window flicker that would screw up CoX. I didn't get the window flicker.
When I did switch to vent, restart, and come back, I would have the CoX screen on my monitor, but it wasn't active and the game was running. I would have to click on the tab in the task bar to sync the game with the monitor/screen.
I can live with the vent issue for now, I am glad the game isn't freezing. But it does point at an OS issue (or something running and I am not quite sure if it's actually Ventrillo or not..)
You don't hit smiling monsters - Sister Flame
I have recently started having issues where the game loses the focus of the machine so that my key presses generat error sounds instead of doing things in game. Clicking on the game screen fixes the problem.
Is this similar to what is being reported?
I can't say for sure. However, if you (or anyone) reading this thread is suffering from this issue or similar, open up a Support ticket. If it is something with the client or the OS, the more tickets open, the more likely it will be found. But at this point, all of the evidence gathered seems to point away from the OS, at least in my own case.
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Yes, that sounds like the same issue.
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Originally Posted by all_hell
I have recently started having issues where the game loses the focus of the machine so that my key presses generat error sounds instead of doing things in game. Clicking on the game screen fixes the problem.
Is this similar to what is being reported? |
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I am using XP on an old socket A.|
Originally Posted by Obsidius
Yes, that sounds like the same issue.
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I haven't taken any time to try and see what's causing it though.
Will try to shut off various programs.
I use AVG too btw.
Thats the only thing besides windows that has recently updated on my machine iirc.
Interesting. I'll first try a selective bootup with AVG disabled to see if that's the culprit. They did recently update to a new version, so it has been on my list of suspects.
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I've got AVG too, and I got it to stop....now, that doesn't necessarily rule it out though. There may be some unexpected interactions going on.
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Originally Posted by Obsidius
Interesting. I'll first try a selective bootup with AVG disabled to see if that's the culprit. They did recently update to a new version, so it has been on my list of suspects.
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Well yeah disabling desktop composition entirely when CoH is running will do that
Here's my hypothesis:
A request to disable the Desktop Window Manager was made by a process (City of Heroes).
CoH tries to disable the Desktop Window Manager in full screen, but...
The Desktop Window Manager was unable to start because composition was disabled by a running application.
Another application is already interfacing with the Desktop Window Manager, causing the temporary loss of window focus and the loss of CoH client interaction.
Of course, one could disable desktop composition entirely and side-step the issue. But if the other program can be pinpointed, such action shouldn't be necessary.
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True...it would be nice if it didn't have to be turned off. Thing is, CoH is the only program I've seen in 10 months that disables it. I did notice for a while that after one of the updates it started reinstating the aero desktop when alt-tabbing out, and that's when the freezing issue stopped. After another update, it stopped reinstating aero, and that's when the issue started back up again.|
Originally Posted by Obsidius
Well yeah disabling desktop composition entirely when CoH is running will do that
Here's my hypothesis: A request to disable the Desktop Window Manager was made by a process (City of Heroes). CoH tries to disable the Desktop Window Manager in full screen, but... The Desktop Window Manager was unable to start because composition was disabled by a running application. Another application is already interfacing with the Desktop Window Manager, causing the temporary loss of window focus and the loss of CoH client interaction. Of course, one could disable desktop composition entirely and side-step the issue. But if the other program can be pinpointed, such action shouldn't be necessary. |
I wonder if it's possible that something about the way CoH itself is interacting with the OS is causing it not to issue the order to reinstate the desktop composition when you alt-tab, and then when it gives the order to disable it again it can't because it never reinstated it in the first place. Hm...
The only thing I know is, after playing for about an hour with AVG disabled, the problem stopped. Perhaps AVG is checking for new signatures every half hour, which causes problems with CoH in full-screen mode? I'm only guessing at the moment.
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That could be it....though, logically, mine should do it too then >.< well, I'll play around with it this weekend. Or maybe after school tomorrow...|
Originally Posted by Obsidius
The only thing I know is, after playing for about an hour with AVG disabled, the problem stopped. Perhaps AVG is checking for new signatures every half hour, which causes problems with CoH in full-screen mode? I'm only guessing at the moment.
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Edit: Maybe see if adding the CoH folder as an exception will help?
Things like this are why I play in windowed mode. Haven't had any issues like this since I installed Win7.
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