Barracuda Stalker Power - Nice power, wrong AT to use it

Now, it's no secret that I'm pretty negative about the stalker AT in general. It's a less then useful AT that directly encourages an useless play style. For every stalker that plays competently, you have one that plays like a putz (scouting the map, scared to scrap, over or only using assassination strike, etc).

So now we have Barracuda SF. And the stalkers power? Four use kill all non-AV enemies in the room. Useful power, good if the team is getting overwhelmed and the room is filling with the ambushes. But to use it, the stalker has to go in a little side room. It's only 50' from the main fighting area, so the stalker can get there in three to five seconds if things are looking bad.

So running a Barracuda last night, fighting M. Bison... We're fighting him, ambushes coming but we're taking them out mostly, got Bison down by 25 percent... And then I notice that one of the stalkers has spent the entire fight in one of the side rooms, waiting to use the temp power.

I can't help but feel this is the extension of the Stalker Pug Mentality; Oh noes, I'm too fragile for fighting, my character was designed to sneak, not fight, they wouldn't have given my this ability if they didn't want me to use ONLY it. And by giving this power to stalkers, they just reinforce it.
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Currently listening to Blue Öyster Cult's Tyranny and Mutation

There are always bad players. It's no different than an MM who never triggers their power on Reichsman.

Yeah, but the mastermind power doesn't require or encourage the mastermind to break LOS from the fight and AV and stand around waiting for the right time to use his power, all the while doing NOTHING.

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Currently listening to Blue Öyster Cult's Tyranny and Mutation

While normally I would totally agree that stalkers do not add much to a team, I think the 'cuda SF is a bit different.

There are 2 click glowies that only spawn after you clear the boss mobs: mission 1(post cut scene) and mission 3 (I think, or maybe 4 after you enter the 5th collumn base). So after the boss goes down its easy for the stalker to run back and find the glowie (which btw typically is back near the entrance).

Typically when I run it on my stalker in the last mission, I try to have everyone clear a path to the red room (it just makes it easier if there is a team wipe) then they stay in the red room while I free and lead the Patrons back to the room. With the exception of GW they are almost always being held captive by a single minion. They still follow you even in hide which is nice.

One thing about that that 'kill all' power of the stalker. It is nice however, using the dom power and then the corr power results in the same affect so the only time I typically ask or use the stalker temp is when we have had a team wipe and by the time you fight your way back to the red room it is at max capacity. Then its an awesome thing to have the stalker go T9 run into the machine then the lazer room and clear the room (interesting sidenote, Reichs can go into the lazer room and not take any damage, so the stalker better have some good def up when he/she is trying to click that glowie).

I do have one question for everyone, on that 4th mission (I think) the outdoor 5th map where we have to 'question the 5th' does anyone know what mob we need to clear? I've been told you have to clear near the base but I think I've done that a few times and still had to run back and clear a mob near the door.

Problem with the corrupter temp is that is the movement of the spouts is a bit unreliable. I've seen four corr's all fire it off and only manage to clear a third of the held mobs.

Apparently, none of the 5th column mobs take damage from the security room (was hoping to be able to wormhole dudes in there).

It's one of the spawns in the pit in front of the mission. Not sure which one.


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Currently listening to Otis Rush's Not Enough Coming In

I think a lot of Stalkers are failing prey to the negatives of the AT and aren't able to utilize or grow on their strengths. I'm also sure that the general consensus of their abilities spread around almost everyone doesn't help at all. A stalker CAN scrap and CAN survive, but it takes an awareness of what you are capable of and what you can take.

I compare it to what happens when someone discovers the "blapper" side of a blaster: some will scream "WTF, this sucks, i die" and just give up, OR some will keep trying to blap-spam all the time no matter the situation/(dis)advantages, OR even less will learn, adapt, and develop a play-style for solo AND group use. Unfortunately, even those that make it thru still have to deal with the bias. Hard to get those "elites" to hang around for when we can use their skills with all of that baggage.

So you'll have the majority that really believe that all they should do is hide/AS/run away/Hide/AS, repeat. Considering the dev-love for redside, would you expect any less when it came to deciding "hmm, what should the stalker do? I know!:hide/AS/run/away/AOE(AS!!)...thats it!"

I think another problem with Stalkers is that missions are so linear that the "scout ahead" aspect is downplayed if the team setup is able to just smash through stuff. Or the Stalker lacks Recall Friend so they can't really capitalize on that scouting.

Dare I ask Hamster, but which AT do you think should have had the Stalker's power and which power do you think Stalkers should have instead?

While admittedly I picked the worst sets for a stalker for my first one and tend to fall into the Stalker meme! Forcing myself to finish the run with that stlaker has made me a better player. If I'm not the team leader ask before scouting, and if I'm told no scrap it out as best as I can. Case in point. last week on the LGTF I asked
"Want me to go to the end?" SatHam's response.."Why aren't you there already!"

Which is why I enjoy Isos so much. It gives me a chance to improve my skills as a player with all the AT's. By playing with veteran players I learn whats expected and what get complained about.

So if I'm doing something weird let me know. I am not so arrogant to think I know every thing about this game....but I'm willing to learn.

Well after reading this thread, probably want to try BSF with my stalker to see what this power is like. Hopefully later this week.

I know I am confusing people by saying mission #, there are two outdoor maps (well three if you count atlas) the 1st: spawns ambushes that you kill then finally Reichs appears. The 2nd: the normal council outdoor map we are used too with the base at the far back end. The mission objective is 'question 5th'. This is the mission I am asking about.

So that mission you just need to kill X number it doesn't matter where? I only ask because other 'question' type objectives typically have specific mobs you need to take down (I'm thinking of the psychic clockwork mission, where you need to defeat every boss mob).

cool, thank you for the insight.

Hey, I've never refused entry to a stalker on a team or task force. But that doesn't change the fact that it's a flawed AT that encourages stupid play styles more than any other AT.

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Currently listening to the Killers' Sam's Town

I haven't even done the Barracuda SF yet, so I don't even know what ya'll are talking about... But yeah, stalkers are a bit of a broken AT in many respects, if played wrong.

I think the problem is, a lot of people are PLing the stalkers up, so they don't learn what it can and can't do. And those who are actually playing the stalker all the way up, yet still playing "shadow games"... Well, they're either very dumb, or very patient... If I miss on my AS on a minion, I don't wait for it to recharge, I pop my second most heavy hitting attack, and still one shot the mob...(Two to three hits, for most Lts...)

Honestly, they're almost exactly the same as scrappers, only they have better burst damage, and slightly lower defenses... I play mine like a gimp scrapper, and can do some amazing things with it... Anyone else ever off tank an AV as a stalker when the brute died, and half the team wiped? It's really not that hard, if you know how to play the AT correctly...(and also know when to use your tier 9 defense power... That tends to help with survivability...)