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Could you elaborate ? Were you fighting +4s ? The few times I've seen whirlwind used, it did knockback and scattered everything.
| any melee + whirlwind (permanent knockdown)... I've done this up to level 43. It was a lot of fun, but became pointless since nothing was killing me anyway, and I couldn't perma-knockdown AVs. |
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I've had one of these for a long time. What you end up with is a ranged, AoE spines "blaster". I tried weapons mastery on her, but ultimately decided on body. Energy torrent in the jewel of that epic since it does knockdown (allowing you to safely alpha strike most of the time) and it's a cone like throw spines.|
Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey
Spines + Weapon Mastery - make an all ranged, very AoE focused scrapper (possibly use blaze mastery now)
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I don't have spine burst on the build because I'm usually throwing out throw spines, energy torrent and then an occasional laser beam eyes (or impale depending on how much hitpoints the target has) as filler attacks. I also joust in for the occasional ripper.
Flame mastery would open up some interesting possibilities, but I suspect I'll stay with body because I'll miss the knockdown of energy torrent. However, I know that weapons is viable as flame mastery would be. The only epic I can't recommend is dark. On paper it looks great because there are two (now three) cone attacks in there but the cones are too narrow and torrent (the dark version) has knockback not knockdown.
By the way, secondary is regen which works pretty well as a ranged attacker.
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That toon was about 2 years ago... but yeah, I would use it when fighting up level bosses, so they didn't scatter. I generally solo'd so even when I was scattering things I didn't care, i'd just follow them and hit them again. I got the most use out of it street sweeping freakshow boss spawns in Brickstown. I used claws/regen to do it so I could handle endurance better.
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Originally Posted by Nihilii
Could you elaborate ? Were you fighting +4s ? The few times I've seen whirlwind used, it did knockback and scattered everything.
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I gotta make pain. I gotta make things right. I gotta stop what's comin'. 'Least I gotta try.
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You hit the nail on the head on one of the concepts I've wanted to do for a while. Taking DM/FA up and kitting it out with a whole ton of recharge and actually taking and using the resurrection power. I'm thinking two heals, two build-up type powers, immob+burn, two end recovery powers and now with Blaze mastery, another immob and *FIREBALL*, it'd be a pretty sweet build. Something that gets knocked down every once in a while but plays much like a juggernaut. It's the kind of build that, I think, personifies Scrappers.
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Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey
I'm always interested in finding and trying to abuse game mechanics in new and interesting ways. I think right now that the best way to do that is to build up high +defense on pretty much any toon. But ignoring that possibilty, particularly using more active powers as opposed to just passive/toggle mitigations what other synergies do you guys find interesting? Maybe not something you'd play, but something you're curious about?
... DM/Fire or Spines/fire - using immobalize with burn ... /DA or /FA with a focus on high recharge in thier resurrection power to be used frequently. Anyone have any expirience with doing these, or have a concept of your own you want to share? |
While I haven't really done it with any Scrappers, my Fire/Ice tanker was built to exploit the location AoE mechanics. Ice Patch + Burn was a truly wondrous thing back in the day.
My newer DA/Nrg tanker was built primarily to exploit the AoE stun capabilities of both of the sets (though, soon after I built it, I looked back and decided that DA/Stone would have been a much better built for it).
My Elec/Nrg Blaster was done back in the day when it was actually possible to perma-drain entire mobs effectively (Power Boost + SC slotted for end drain) and built around that concept.
Most of my other toons haven't really operated off of any specific mechanical strategy, especially my Scrappers. All of the others were pretty much designed along the lines of "I wanna have an effective toon and I don't wanna use any FotM builds or sets I've already used".
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MA/DA never found that combo to be that good. MA took more endurance for damage it delt than most any other combo I played. Probably do to lack of aoe damage so that your not using big attacks to finish off people with little health left or possibly due to the fact that it lacks real reliable mitigation in the set. More likly its a combonation of the two, however as far as stacking stuns go...cobra strike is your only reliable one in ma and its the only one that you will make a difference. |
Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey
Here's a few things I've always wanted to try... MA/DA - capitalizing on stacking stuns with Oppressive Gloom. DM/DA with presense - focus on having control with all the fear powers available. Anyone have any expirience with doing these, or have a concept of your own you want to share? |
DM/DA Touch of Fear and Cloak of Fear area really all you need. The presence pools suck as far as stacking, you can never get the recharge down fast enough on either and if you could touch of fear would already be up way faster than them.
Personally if you really want to do either of the two of stacking stuns and fears...make a team of dark armor scrappers...2 OG stuns bosses, 2 cof fears bosses...and you just did exactly what you want with only 2 people. Other combos that play well with dark armor, dark miasma and pet gaze and og in the epics. Illusion control and mind control also offer fears to stack with. Overall I find these options better than presence pool and ma stuns.
You should make a triple dark scrapper, I don't see too many of those around.
Virtue: @Santorican
Dark/Shield Build Thread
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My Kat/Fire is built around high recharge / high damage. No Tough, no Leaping, no -KB IOs. It doesn't die too frequently (yet, only level 41), but I have made good use of RotP.|
Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey
/DA or /FA with a focus on high recharge in thier resurrection power to be used frequently.
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My Kat/Regen was also a Whirlwinder until they changed the Knock-Up to Knockback. Great fun, I still miss WW (I kept it even after the change, but when they made MoG good, WW was the power that I dropped).
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Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey
Caltraps slotted with massive procs and recharge.
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Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.
While I don't think any of these are an ideal approach, and I've never done any of them, I've definitely thought about MA/DA stuns, DM/DA with presence, and (ab)using self destruction with the DA or FA rez.
"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
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While not quite the same, I do have a DA/SM tank that mixes OG and Fault for a reliable AoE mag 4 stun combination. Very effective taking on multiple bosses, and an extremely rare combination in play.|
Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey
MA/DA - capitalizing on stacking stuns with Oppressive Gloom.
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Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey
Spines + Weapon Mastery - make an all ranged, very AoE focused scrapper (possibly use blaze mastery now)
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Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey
Caltraps slotted with massive procs and recharge.
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Nothing terribly exciting, but among my current projects is a DM/ElA brute that I'm intending to take into //Mu to fill out the AoE damage. Very much looking forward to I16 for this one. Also planning to start an Elec/Shield scrapper. Could do it now as a brute I guess, but it feels more like a scrapper combo for me. The Shield Charge/Lightning Rod combo seems, well, wrong.
Dark Armor/Stone Melee Tank Guide [I12]
I do have a ma/da at 50.
I run continously my 3 basic armors, DS, OG, CoD, and combat jumping.
Off the top of my head I believe I have 3.67 endrec/sec. I could get more if I slotted the miracle and numina's unique.
I CAN NOT bottom out my blue bar. Even with constant attacking.
Deathshroud, dragons tail, and exploding shurikens puts out surprising AoE damage.
Caltrops is 6 slotted with knockdown procs, recharge slows, and recharge. I can ALMOST triple stack it.
Typically I tank better than tanks. If i had aggro control it'd be unstoppable.
Run in, take the alpha, hit dark regen. I did have to learn when to time my heal.
At that point in the fight minions are stunned and the boss is as well. I kill Lts first and then start on the boss. Deathshroud and DT take care of the minions. Rinse repeat.
It might be my toughest toon.
Anyone that likes active playstyles Id highly suggest this combo.
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Originally Posted by Shadow Ravenwolf
My favorite combo is Faceplant/DebtCap with the TeamWipe Ancillary
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Originally Posted by Dispari
Yeah, I like Blasters too.
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I've always wondered how would a "perma-dead" Willpower scrapper perform. Among other nice things, the rez gives a +100% recharge bonus for 90s, which could enable very good attack chains. It also recharges in 300s, which means you might be able to perma it and to die before the post-rez debuffs affect you.
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I never realized Will's rez had +recharge... that IS interesting... Problem with willpower is that the way i'd build it, I'm not sure I could turn off enough things to die at will.
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Originally Posted by Nihilii
I've always wondered how would a "perma-dead" Willpower scrapper perform. Among other nice things, the rez gives a +100% recharge bonus for 90s, which could enable very good attack chains. It also recharges in 300s, which means you might be able to perma it and to die before the post-rez debuffs affect you.
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I gotta make pain. I gotta make things right. I gotta stop what's comin'. 'Least I gotta try.
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That's really why I never end up trying these things. They don't really measure up to a typical high mitigation and recharge scrapper build. Perhaps part of my posting this is that I wish these concepts were viable alternatives to give us more uniqueness. |
Originally Posted by Werner
While I don't think any of these are an ideal approach...
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Similar to another responder, I see a lot of these tricks being more useful on a blaster or other squishy.
I gotta make pain. I gotta make things right. I gotta stop what's comin'. 'Least I gotta try.
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There's a small flaw in the abusing Self Destruction idea: Self Destuction does KB, which puts most of the mob out of Soul Transfer's range. If there's nothing in range of Soul Transfer it does nothing at all and you just lay there. Highly aggravated me the time an Energy blaster jumped in and nuked just as I hit my rez, everything went flying and my rez failed. |
Originally Posted by Werner
While I don't think any of these are an ideal approach, and I've never done any of them, I've definitely thought about MA/DA stuns, DM/DA with presence, and (ab)using self destruction with the DA or FA rez.
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FA would work better because even if you can't hit anything you can at least still rez. RotP doesn't require targets to function like Soul Transfer does.
You could build the idea into a DM/Fire ImobilBurn toon I suppose.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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I'm seriously thinking about this on a blaster.... One catch to this is that you lose your click buffs... most notably hasten. I can see myself saying .. "hasten is flashing, let's see if I can draw some agro."|
Originally Posted by StratoNexus
My Kat/Fire is built around high recharge / high damage. No Tough, no Leaping, no -KB IOs. It doesn't die too frequently (yet, only level 41), but I have made good use of RotP.
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RoTF can also be used to get endurance back to full if that's an issue.
I gotta make pain. I gotta make things right. I gotta stop what's comin'. 'Least I gotta try.
I have considered caltrops fully slotted with procs. The dmg procs, the KB, and the -rech slow. I may still make a build with this.
Another thing I always wanted to try is DB/set with a dmg aura. I will give this a go in i16 with DB/ela.
Its always cool to make any AT that is known for one thing be able to do unexpected things well.
"All problems can be solved by throwing enough scrappers at it."
@Riez on Virtue, Protector, Champion, and Exalted server.
My MA/Regen used to have a "you ain't gettin' up" build, with Air Superiority, and Kinetic Combat procs in everything except Crane Kick. The Ragnarok proc in Caltrops was especially amusing.
It was fairly safe, at least solo, since nothing could get up, but the kill rate was less than optimal and I was horribly vulnerable to lag death on teams. What with i16 making Crippling Axe Kick not look so stupid I can't stand to use it, I'm going to respec her into something closer to optimal.
Eva Destruction AR/Fire/Munitions Blaster
Darkfire Avenger DM/SD/Body Scrapper
Arc ID#161629 Freaks, Geeks, and Men in Black
Arc ID#431270 Until the End of the World
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Have a Spine/Fire/Dark at 50 and purpled out. So much fun to play, was my most fun ride to 50. Tentacles is great for locking down a mob then hopping in and laying down a burn patch. I usually save that for farming, if on a regular team, usually it's TT->TS->SB->TS->Next mob.
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Originally Posted by Shred_Monkey
DM/Fire or Spines/fire - using immobalize with burn |
Proud Member of the Paragonian/Rogue Knights
I'm always interested in finding and trying to abuse game mechanics in new and interesting ways. I think right now that the best way to do that is to build up high +defense on pretty much any toon. But ignoring that possibilty, particularly using more active powers as opposed to just passive/toggle mitigations what other synergies do you guys find interesting? Maybe not something you'd play, but something you're curious about?
Here's a few things I've always wanted to try...
MA/DA - capitalizing on stacking stuns with Oppressive Gloom.
DM/DA with presense - focus on having control with all the fear powers available.
any melee + whirlwind (permanent knockdown)... I've done this up to level 43. It was a lot of fun, but became pointless since nothing was killing me anyway, and I couldn't perma-knockdown AVs.
DM/Fire or Spines/fire - using immobalize with burn
Spines + Weapon Mastery - make an all ranged, very AoE focused scrapper (possibly use blaze mastery now)
Caltraps slotted with massive procs and recharge.
/DA or /FA with a focus on high recharge in thier resurrection power to be used frequently.
Anyone have any expirience with doing these, or have a concept of your own you want to share?
I gotta make pain. I gotta make things right. I gotta stop what's comin'. 'Least I gotta try.