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as you said earlier. there isn't a huge amount of Cannon, what there is available on the Main game site for free, and really shouldn't take more than a hour to get though.
what stuff there is in the game from stuff like the Keldian arcs is (in my opinion) OK not to know. I mean that's sort of the point of that stuff is not to know it till you encounter it.
But saying know stuff like "Nemesis tryed to take over the US after the second world war" is incredibly unlikely unless your character has never been educated at all.
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Technicaly he did try and take over after the second world war, seeing as he keeps trying to do so.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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as you said earlier. there isn't a huge amount of Cannon, what there is available on the Main game site for free, and really shouldn't take more than a hour to get though.
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About Paragon City locations, about very general knowledge on the famous heroes, a timline... yes.
But generally, arguments about being "true to canon" are often not about that kind of info.
If you want to play a hero in Paragon City, a basic knowledge of the city history is generally going to be presumed by most people. Things like the citizen crime fighting act should be known to ALL, as it's the very basis of your hero license.
Other canon I tend to treat as badge related. If a person has badge A, then I expect them to know the canon related to badge A; just like if a person is playing epic AT B, I expect them to be familiar with the basic canon related to epic AT B. If they choose to ignore said canon, but fail to communication that to players X, Y and Z; then they only have themselves to blame when their character gets treated as a nut.
Canon forms the very basis of the world we play in; and ignoring it is a terribly short sighted thing to do. Work around it sure; as long as you let people know, but IGNORING it? Not a good idea, IMO.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
but that's the only kind of info that we have as Cannon. Anything else that doesn't show up in the game, is personal speculation.
the problem was not that it "Disagreed with Cannon" but was simply that no information was supplied that they were anything other than the outward appearance, even a ((Send a tell for flange sense info)) would have helped.
almost everyone fudges the origins of their power if it's not ultra specific like, for instance, a PB/WS, and even they they may be using those powers to fudge another thing, as long as it is mentioned some were, then people can roll with it.
This is just a personal theory, but wouldn't a peacebringer/warshades energy be supressed when its in a host, a kinda hide from the things that eat me/ stick me in a starship as fuel ability?
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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This is just a personal theory, but wouldn't a peacebringer/warshades energy be supressed when its in a host, a kinda hide from the things that eat me/ stick me in a starship as fuel ability?
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As there is no canon to indicate something like this in either direction; the simplest presumption would be no, unless the player has something in their bio to tell other players this.
It's this basis that Ellie's ability to sense other kheldians is based. Unless they're doing something to suppress their energy signature, she knows what they are. Just like her sense of smell will allow her to breach someones secret identity, IF she meets them in both hero garb and civilian, and IF they're not doing something to mask their scent (When Nevermore found out, he was NOT amused and next day was wearing a pheremone masking device 
). She never lets on that she knows though.
However, her senses ARE listed in her bio, so people can let me know if she can't sense things about them.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
not really, the PB is the combination of a human and a Keldian. All their powers steam from using that energy, which doesn't seem very suppressed to me.
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not really, the PB is the combination of a human and a Keldian. All their powers steam from using that energy, which doesn't seem very suppressed to me.
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And when they aren't using their powers? when they are sleeping, having a drink with friends, using the bathroom?
Take it like Superman or a DBZ character, if they were allways using whatever power supes them up then they'd cut through a urinal when ever they whent for a whizz and possibly the wall behind and several buildings.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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Take it like Superman or a DBZ character, if they were allways using whatever power supes them up then they'd cut through a urinal when ever they whent for a whizz and possibly the wall behind and several buildings.
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Hence why it took Clark forever to get jiggy with Lana.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
[ QUOTE ]
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This is just a personal theory, but wouldn't a peacebringer/warshades energy be supressed when its in a host, a kinda hide from the things that eat me/ stick me in a starship as fuel ability?
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As there is no canon to indicate something like this in either direction; the simplest presumption would be no, unless the player has something in their bio to tell other players this.
It's this basis that Ellie's ability to sense other kheldians is based. Unless they're doing something to suppress their energy signature, she knows what they are. Just like her sense of smell will allow her to breach someones secret identity, IF she meets them in both hero garb and civilian, and IF they're not doing something to mask their scent (When Nevermore found out, he was NOT amused and next day was wearing a pheremone masking device ). She never lets on that she knows though.
However, her senses ARE listed in her bio, so people can let me know if she can't sense things about them.
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I'd say that the need for an army of void hunters would be a cannon reason for it not just being a case of that perfectly normal person looks a bit peace bringery to me.
I mean why would they need mind controlled slaves to hunt them down when they could just sit in the street and follow people home?
I mean yeah if they walked around all the time with blazing light coming from their eyes then it'd be fairly obvious.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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Take it like Superman or a DBZ character, if they were allways using whatever power supes them up then they'd cut through a urinal when ever they whent for a whizz and possibly the wall behind and several buildings.
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Hence why it took Clark forever to get jiggy with Lana.
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The Mall Rats reference Woman of Tissue, Man Of Steel stuff has been out of date for like a decade before the film came out :P
Still hate it when people bring it up though.
Superman has a forcefield that affects objects that he touches, hence people not being incinerated when he flys with Superspeed while holding them and why he doesn't just pierce though heavy stuff when he lifts it.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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And when they aren't using their powers? when they are sleeping, having a drink with friends, using the bathroom?
Take it like Superman or a DBZ character, if they were always using whatever power supes them up then they'd cut through a urinal when ever they went for a whizz and possibly the wall behind and several buildings.
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when your not running, are you still warm? it would just boost massively when they are using their power, it will still be there all the time unless they are actively shielding it.
Plus i don't really thing you can suppress something with out bleeding it away. which would be equally obvious.
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I'd say that the need for an army of void hunters would be a cannon reason for it not just being a case of that perfectly normal person looks a bit peace bringery to me.
I mean why would they need mind controlled slaves to hunt them down when they could just sit in the street and follow people home?
I mean yeah if they walked around all the time with blazing light coming from their eyes then it'd be fairly obvious.
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Except that a Void Hunter (and any quantum wielding mob), instantly knows who the Kheldian is, and targets them as soon as they're in aggro range. What gives them that information? A void has a Nictus shard implanted in them, a quantum just has the gun itself (sensors possibly?). Either way. Voids and Q know instantly, so there IS canon to indicate khelds can be easily recognized.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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I'd say that the need for an army of void hunters would be a cannon reason for it not just being a case of that perfectly normal person looks a bit peace bringery to me.
I mean why would they need mind controlled slaves to hunt them down when they could just sit in the street and follow people home?
I mean yeah if they walked around all the time with blazing light coming from their eyes then it'd be fairly obvious.
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Except that a Void Hunter (and any quantum wielding mob), instantly knows who the Kheldian is, and targets them as soon as they're in aggro range. What gives them that information? A void has a Nictus shard implanted in them, a quantum just has the gun itself (sensors possibly?). Either way. Voids and Q know instantly, so there IS canon to indicate khelds can be easily recognized.
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Or that most times you encounter Void you are actively using your super powers no?
Even if its nothing more than sprinting along you'd still be using the Kheldian energy and thus detectable.
Or to put it another way if a Kheldian was easy to detect when not using powers why use a an Army of highly Visable matching uniformed troops?
why not simply hunt them down and snack on them with out drawing attention to your actions by having a Putty Patrol?
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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Or to put it another way if a Kheldian was easy to detect when not using powers why use a an Army of highly Visable matching uniformed troops?
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Hence the existence of Quantum mobs. The Council have distributed these weapons freely amongst the criminal element of Paragon, so they can hunt Khelds at will. The Void troops are, IIRC, a mercenary force run by the council.
And it doesn't matter if you're using your powers or not. The instant you enter aggro range with one of those mobs, they target and fire; so they are able to detect you. Using your powers is irrelevant.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
[ QUOTE ]
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Or to put it another way if a Kheldian was easy to detect when not using powers why use a an Army of highly Visable matching uniformed troops?
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Hence the existence of Quantum mobs. The Council have distributed these weapons freely amongst the criminal element of Paragon, so they can hunt Khelds at will. The Void troops are, IIRC, a mercenary force run by the council.
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A force run by the council so that their new boss can find lots of Kheldians to eat.
Which if they were easy to detect when in 'hiding' she wouldn't need to do, she could just sit outside a police station and wait until one goes home from a shift and eat them that way.
Rather than have a massive mercanery army that basically annouces "I'm trying to eat you little squidy!" to the entire population of Paragon city.
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
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For the record and despite my late and little participation to this discussion, I just want to say I usually ignore "canon" in CoH.
Because when I had a vague interest about reading it, it was (still is ?) spread a bit there and there.
Because, once "true to canon" starts to be important in your gaming, you generally get arguments over interpretation.
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WARNING - SPOILER ALERT
I'm going to ignore the rest of your post for the purposes of this reply, simply because I agree with pretty much all of it - I don't care if someone wants to play a scrapper as a Kheldian, or a vampire, or a psychic capable of hearing every tiny surface thought from everyone on the planet all at once (yes, there was a CoH RP character who could do this - but I'm not going to get into that).
I'm a little bothered by the fact that you say that you ignore "canon" in CoH. Well, okay, but you're saying that... Statesman is not the most powerful hero in the world, the Rikti never invaded (twice), Nemesis is not behind everything, Kheldians don't exist and therefore there are no Peacebringers, Warshades or Nictus, Paragon does not rest on the remains of an ancient city called Oranbega, Rikti (if they actually exist) are not humans from another dimension. That's just off the top of my head.
In fact, by ignoring canon, you are declaring that the world and history in which Paragon City exists are, as far as you and your characters are concerned, irrelevant. Haven't happened. The story arcs in the game don't happen. None of the villain groups or their plots exist as far as you are concerned, because they ARE the canon in this game. When you RP through a story arc that says "Kheldian's cannot bond with an unwilling host unless that host is severely weakened physically or emotionally", and it makes an important plot point for that story arc, because otherwise Requiem would already rule the universe, you ignore the canon as false. As someone who GMs a lot, my first thought is 'what are the consequences of a Kheldian being able to bond with anyone they want?"
The wisdom of Shadowe: Ghostraptor: The Shadowe is wise ...; FFM: Shadowe is no longer wise.
; Techbot_Alpha: Also, what Shadowe said. It seems he is still somewhat wise 
; Bull Throttle: Shadowe was unwise in this instance...; Rock_Powerfist: in this instance Shadowe is wise.; Techbot_Alpha: Shadowe is very wise *nods*; Zortel: *Quotable line about Shadowe being wise goes here.*
"Easy to detect" is relative. A normal person won't be able to tell the difference unless they're using their powers... But someone either of the same species, or using weapons designed to kill them; can. And that's the point of this discussion. Ellie is a PB, she has the senses to detect another member of the same species UNLESS they're actively doing something to prevent such detection. There is plenty of game canon to indicate this is possible.
The player had nothing in their bio to indicate they were a kheldian, and nothing to indicate they were hiding that fact. Ergo, my character considered them not a kheldian.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
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"Easy to detect" is relative. A normal person won't be able to tell the difference unless they're using their powers... But someone either of the same species, or using weapons designed to kill them; can. And that's the point of this discussion. Ellie is a PB, she has the senses to detect another member of the same species UNLESS they're actively doing something to prevent such detection. There is plenty of game canon to indicate this is possible.
The player had nothing in their bio to indicate they were a kheldian, and nothing to indicate they were hiding that fact. Ergo, my character considered them not a kheldia
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Must ask when you have ever been attacked by a void/quantum while not using any powers at all ((including passives))?
Or to put it another way if Arakhn can just see who a peacebringer is why use voids and the council at all?
Why not just simply jump them in the streets and eat them there?
Brawling Cactus from a distant planet.
Because kelds aren't totally passive beings that would just sit there and be eaten?
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Must ask when you have ever been attacked by a void/quantum while not using any powers at all ((including passives))?
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Lots of times. Hell, I've been fired upon by Voids when just running (no sprint) down the street and didn't see him lurking in the alley.
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Or to put it another way if Arakhn can just see who a peacebringer is why use voids and the council at all?
Why not just simply jump them in the streets and eat them there?
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Because the game canon says that they use Voids and Quantums; simple.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
[ QUOTE ]
Because the game canon says that they use Voids and Quantums; simple.
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And also Arakhn has better things to do than go out into the streets. After all, why bother when you have an army of voids to do the job for you?
The wisdom of Shadowe: Ghostraptor: The Shadowe is wise ...; FFM: Shadowe is no longer wise.
; Techbot_Alpha: Also, what Shadowe said. It seems he is still somewhat wise ; Bull Throttle: Shadowe was unwise in this instance...; Rock_Powerfist: in this instance Shadowe is wise.; Techbot_Alpha: Shadowe is very wise *nods*; Zortel: *Quotable line about Shadowe being wise goes here.*
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I'm a little bothered by the fact that you say that you ignore "canon" in CoH. Well, okay, but you're saying that... Statesman is not the most powerful hero in the world, the Rikti never invaded (twice), Nemesis is not behind everything, Kheldians don't exist and therefore there are no Peacebringers, Warshades or Nictus, Paragon does not rest on the remains of an ancient city called Oranbega, Rikti (if they actually exist) are not humans from another dimension. That's just off the top of my head.
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It might be wording. "Ignoring" doesn't mean necessarily going to oppose it and looking for conflicting theme.
I meant "ignoring" as "if someone comes with a concept that is conflicting the canon but has sense in the RP'ed story, I'm going to have the player ideas prevail over canon sources"
In other words, if you're coming with a character pretending to be the stronger of the world, I am not going to browse the websites and various wiki and fan production to search something to oppose you.
Admitting such a claim or not isn't going to be related to canon source. I will accept it or not depending on how you present the information and how you handle that claim.
So, I am ignoring the canon because I don't consider it binding and will not have it stand in the way of something interesting, I don't mean I play in my own little version of CoH.
This also works mainly because when/should it happens, it comes from players who are not mixing "twisting canon to their own story/concept purpose" with "twisting the canon to start god-moding everything and everywhere".
I won't rule out Rikti invasions just for the sake of doing it. But I might accept some story bits contradicting with canon, about Riktis, if it serves a story purpose and is done in a well thought manner.
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I won't rule out Rikti invasions just for the sake of doing it. But I might accept some story bits contradicting with canon, about Riktis, if it serves a story purpose and is done in a well thought manner.
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But then what do you do if a different person comes along with contradicting story bits about Rikti, but which equally serves a story purpose and is done in a well thought out manner? Do you accept both and therefore break your own immersion, or do you reject the second persons view? If you do that, you might as well reject the first persons too, as both are presented equally well.
Far easier to stick to the official canon. At least then you know where things stand.
@FloatingFatMan
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
as you said earlier. there isn't a huge amount of Cannon, what there is available on the Main game site for free, and really shouldn't take more than a hour to get though.
what stuff there is in the game from stuff like the Keldian arcs is (in my opinion) OK not to know. I mean that's sort of the point of that stuff is not to know it till you encounter it.
But saying know stuff like "Nemesis tryed to take over the US after the second world war" is incredibly unlikely unless your character has never been educated at all.