Ninja = most damage
Merc = more control, stupid DoT
Downside, Ninja's like melee (except oni) and your forcebubble keeps them actualy out of melee range. Good part, required some tactics, is to force all mobs into 1 corner and let your ninja's shred them to pieces. Other hand, ninja's by base have defence, adding your bubbles only make them more 'defensive'. Bots imho are best with FF.
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Both are... under used. Infact Necro, Ninja and Merc are under used, I see Bots and Thugs every day. Personaly, Go Ninja. You'll never have as much on your plate as looking after your Genin; so it's a high demand, high reward set. Mercs are alot safer and much easier to control, But try Ninjas please, the Oni rocks and so do Junin(<-Spelling?)
I'm goning to have to disagree with X here and say if you are using FF as a secondary then Ninjas become 10x more appealing. Having innate +Def as standard Ninjas are the ones who will benifit most from the +Def given by FF. (you know you don't have to use Force bubble... infact I don't; the last 3 FF powers are skippable IMO.)
Last point: Ninjas man! Freakin' NINJAS!
Well, I have a Merc/FF and I can honestly say that in the endgame, having a controlish primary and a defensive secondary isn't really that great. You're not doing damage and can't debuff the enemy or buff your troops for better damage. Even EBs are real pain with Merc/FF if you don't use Temps. It's not that you don't stay alive, it's that you can't really kill big things fast enough solo.
Go for Necro if you want Control, and well, Bots if you want damage. Ninjas are bumbling fools that run around (and out of your shield/buff range) and only will annoy people in your team. And as Sin said, the last 3 powers are in fact skippable, as is PFF if you plan on running the defensive PBAoEs/Leaderships to full effect.
My 0.02EUR, but I'm in a bad mood today, so your truth might vary 
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Ninja. Mercs are stoopid 
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And as Sin said, the last 3 powers are in fact skippable
[/ QUOTE ]Call me crazy but I could have sworn that I said that 
Yup, that was you. Then again, u say you disagree with me on the ninja/FF, but then you say the exact same as me.. Ninja profit most from the def-based set 
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With FF I would recommend Mercs, because Ninjas tend to randomly decide to suddenly swap to melee figthing.
Doesn't make them less fun or any less powerful though.
Ninjas FTW
Ah but then you say Bots are the best with FF X, which I kinda agree on... I guess I just like Ninjas because they are so rare.
Don't be like everyone else! Roll a Ninja MM!
Side Note: I'm not fond of FF as a secondary for a MM though, It either forces you to be a bubble bot for the whole team + your pets, and sometimes even other peoples pets... which really sucks for you. Or you can go solo and have 0 friends because you think 'Your pets are more important' (which they are, but that's a different argument)
DeBuffing MMs are just as good solo or on teams.
(I really do wish FF didn't make you Bubble bot #2371... but it does.)
Downside with merc/FF, your damage on high lvl will be serious low. Ninja have 2 crit-hitters, fire damage dealer (with nice mez attack) and smoke bomb (give pet 10 sec crit ability - wich can be nearly perma). With just a few macro's you can keep most ninja pets where they belong, melee range and keep Oni next to you.
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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
And as Sin said, the last 3 powers are in fact skippable
[/ QUOTE ]Call me crazy but I could have sworn that I said that
[/ QUOTE ]
you're imagining things, it was the voices in my head that really said that.
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So... my opinion: The same as everybody: NINJAS
I played Mercs a bit, but my Main is a Lvl 42 Ninjamaster, i have to say: Nothing is more fun than seeing a burning foe getting an "Soaring Dragon", flying 3 meters high and then getting roundhousekicked from three men in grey at the same time, catapulting him whirling over some boxes crashing into a wall... but... ok i am mean.
My experience with ninjas: against single enemies, powerful or not: knockuped, knockdown, hold for a minute burning... often they deal no damage at all against my men. Against multiple foes: meh... sometimes i dont even lose ONE ninja, depending on the type of foe (on relentless).
There is just one thing that bugs me about Ninjas: The Oni... the theme just doesn't fit so good. i would prefer a old Pyro-Ninja or so.. same Powers, but different look. Man i hate the Face of that Oni...
My Experience with Mercs: (I havent played it much, never got the Mega-Commando)... Well boring... There are many MANY small numbers over the foes' heads... but well... thats it.
So Ninjas Style = 10x Mercs Style, i think.
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My Experience with Mercs: (I havent played it much, never got the Mega-Commando)... Well boring... There are many MANY small numbers ofer the foes' heads... but well... thats it.
[/ QUOTE ]
And after Commando and 32 upgrade.. those small numbers remain small but the ammount only gets more and more and more and more and... ya well, u get the point
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Am currently trying both ninja's and mercs, and finding the AI of both driving me nuts compared to Necro.
Ninjas want to be both melee and ranged and run around like idiots, mercs put their guns away during fights to draw them again and I spend a lot of time shouting at the screen.
Mercs seem alright damage at low levels, though the first upgrade is pants compared to most others. Ninjas get a nice upgrade on the other hand and the Oni does rock (from what I'vve seen he's as good as the lich and you cant ask for more than that) The T3 on Mercs seems to be a complete fool, but he's a complete fool with a big gun so I guess he might still be usefull.
All in all am glad I have my necro cause I cant find much joy with mercs or ninjas.
"Well, they found my diary today.
They were appropriately appalled
at the discovery of the eight victims
They're now putting it all together.
Women wrapped in silk
with one leg missing
Eight legs, one body, silk,
spider, brilliant!"
I wanna see you at lvl32 with mercs, i think you gonna trow your monitor out of the window (specialy if you compare the 2nd upgrade with Ninja or Necro).
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[ QUOTE ]
I wanna see you at lvl32 with mercs, i think you gonna trow your monitor out of the window (specialy if you compare the 2nd upgrade with Ninja or Necro).
[/ QUOTE ]
I find it sad that comments like these, can pass without any opposing views. But that is not allowed, obviously.
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I find it sad that comments like these, can pass without any opposing views. But that is not allowed, obviously.
[/ QUOTE ]
And so whats the use of posting this then?
50)Sinergy X/(50)Mika.
(50)MaceX/(50)Encore
Sign the petition, dont let CoH go down! SIGN!
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I find it sad that comments like these, can pass without any opposing views. But that is not allowed, obviously.
[/ QUOTE ]
And so whats the use of posting this then?
[/ QUOTE ]
Yes, indeed. What is the use of posting anything here. I do ask myself that often enough.
The comment might however vague in nature, indicate that there are different opinions floating out there. That there is more than one view, regarding Mercenaries, and their value. Even if not uttered here. For various reasons.
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So no one's going to give me a reason to hold out hope on mercs then?
I have actually seen a very good Merc/FF MM, but I've never seen helpful advice on mercs. People say stick it out, but no one says why, Sin has actually explained on a long thread why he doesn't like them and at the moment I am not finding my experience any different to his. People can say dont be down on them, but its not that their underpowered that bugs me, its that their AI is infuriating. Anyone going to offer me some hope that will improve as I level?
"Well, they found my diary today.
They were appropriately appalled
at the discovery of the eight victims
They're now putting it all together.
Women wrapped in silk
with one leg missing
Eight legs, one body, silk,
spider, brilliant!"
No. AI issues get worse the more pets you have. Until Thugs and Mercs get a 'fix' to stop them playing around like morons I shall be using Bots... as they really do have almost 0 issues.
Mercs are better at ranged combat over foes; but a good Mastermind can put Ninja's to far better use.
Depends on your playstyle.
If you can't stand the Mercenary AI as it is, you better find something else to play, immediately. Because waiting for a significant AI improvement, will see you die of old age, most probably. It's just not gonna happen. IMHO.
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Let me direct you to the latest post, on the US forums, regarding this matter:
Mercs any good?
Love my mercs, their only subpar quality is their weak alpha strike, but thats because both spec ops usually fire web grenades as their opener, wich is an entirely good thing
Their AI is the best of the different classes I have tried, robots seem hellbend on going to melee range at least once every fight, undead and ninjas on the other hand, are unwilling to give up their 1 ranged attack, and will happily stand 20 feet away puking again and again.
Mercs rarely go for melee range, maybe once every 5 encounter or so, and then its easy to just issue a "defensive follow" command. They are quick to evade area dots like demolitioner's fire grenades.
I renamed everyone soldier 1 to 5, except the medic, that makes it easy to give orders to all the fighters, while leaving the medic on defensive follow at all times, I only need 3 commands to make them shine:
Petcom_name soldier attack aggressive
Petcom_name soldier goto aggressive
Petcom_all follow defensive
Yes. Re-issuing the "defensive follow" command, is maybe the fastest and most effective way to solve a great number of problems.
It maintains cohesion and get them back in line. Pushing this once, and forgetting about it, will not do at all. :-)
A group "goto" command is also nice, to force them into a spot. In fact, three buttons is what I use too. And that will do. ;-)
Ninjas or Mercs?
My secondary is FF so is ninjas better or mercs better?
Or which does the most damage or something to just help me to decide!