Because people are silly, that's why 
I don't even need to attack to build fury, its called aggro people: Learn to love it. 
I think people orginally started doing this because of the long animation times of some high damage attacks, such as Shadow Maul, which slow down your attack per second. However, this has become "recieved wisdom" and people now tend to leave high damage attacks with short animations out of their chain without understanding the reason in the irst place.
Also, endurance is more of an issue for some builds than others. Dark Armour for instance drains a lot of endurance. Just because you do ok don't assume everyone has plenty of end.
There is absolutly no reason not to use brawl however, it is effectivly a free fury boost.
Relying on mobs for fury doesn't work well if you have MMs on your team (or if they kill you).
I really should do something about this signature.
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Dark Armour for instance drains a lot of endurance. Just because you do ok don't assume everyone has plenty of end.
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Yeah well, my first brute was DM/DA, so i know what youre talking about 
Even played a couple of other brutes to ~20, having endurance problems all the time.. 
But still, even with long animation for SM and endurance issues i rushed through missions using all attacks, having high fury all the time. pre-stamina this made me rest after every 2 groups or so, but from the mid-twenties it was not a big problem, although i could not keep all shields on for long.
this probably depends on playing style as well, i soloed my first brute like 90% of the time, which will probably make fury faster than teaming with lots of others (corr, mms and such).
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Also, endurance is more of an issue for some builds than others. Dark Armour for instance drains a lot of endurance.
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Bingo. I have an EM/DA and I leave the 2 big hitters (TF +ET) out of the attack chain unless there's a spec-ops or equivalent OR I'm pounding on a boss. Only TF is left out for endurance reasons but using that whenever it is available is a fury killer, because I end up having to rest to recover in missions (which realy slows things down). Low end attacks all the way up to the boss, full head of steam and TF + ET = mission complete.
EDIT:- plus at low level, relying on aggro to generate fury also gets you killed repeatedly. I know we're brutes and all, but not in a good way...
Synaesthetix:if your mum wasn't already dead I would go kill her for bringing
you into the world
well, i can honestly say i use aggro to build fury. tbh, by the time i'm ready to use any attacks (i.e. herded into a corner ) i already have a full fury bar, so it makes little odds to me. and yeah.. i die occasionally, but thats half of the fun, being on the edge of causing destruction or being destroyed yourself. or am i getting too into the SMASH concept here?
well, i can honestly say i use aggro to build fury. tbh, by the time i'm ready to use any attacks (i.e. herded into a corner ) i already have a full fury bar, so it makes little odds to me. and yeah.. i die occasionally, but thats half of the fun, being on the edge of causing destruction or being destroyed yourself. or am i getting too into the SMASH concept here?
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well, i can honestly say i use aggro to build fury. tbh,
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Depends. Solo I do use aggro to generate fury. At low levels, on large teams where you're the only melee type ... the only thing moving faster than your fury bar is your health bar...
I'm fine with my own aggro. I can even handle 2 or 3 others aggro for a while if I need to... another 7? not just yet
Synaesthetix:if your mum wasn't already dead I would go kill her for bringing
you into the world
i suppose, yeah but to be honest... i dont team that much cause there arent that many teams where you dont get a corr using a scatter effect or a mm in the team. and i dont team with mm's...
DM has only a few single target attacks in it, and is mostly PbAoe based (as is FA) so often shadow maul is needed to be used as an attack chain early on before fury builds up. i always find once I have full/high fury i hit fiery embrace then soul drain then dark consumption and the mobs mostly dead anyway with BA doing about 50dmg per tick so i just need my big attacks for any bosses left standing
With my fire/inv brute I can currently keep a single-target attack chain with scorch, AS, cremate and incinerate, all fast attacks with one medium- and one high-damage one. However, some sets, such as DM, cant really do that, as the high-damage attacks have long-ish animations, so they need a chain of short attacks to buld fury.
Brawl slots in between all my other attacks very well, I just keep it on auto. If I wasn't DA I'd take flight and have AS in its place.
Once fury is full it only takes one hit from incinerate to kill, then scorch + cremate on the next, then incinerate........... so once fury is full my attack chain changes cause of not needing the gaps filled (as that's me selecting and moving to new target)
"Well, they found my diary today.
They were appropriately appalled
at the discovery of the eight victims
They're now putting it all together.
Women wrapped in silk
with one leg missing
Eight legs, one body, silk,
spider, brilliant!"
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so why do ppl use brawl+low attack only, to build fury, when they can (on the way to get fury) already do more damage, thus defeating enemies faster?
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Because people like big numbers?
Jab is a very quick executing (very close to exactly 1 second execution and activation) and recharges in 2. You could basicly just spin Jab/Punch/Air Superiority all day.
Also, and trust me on this one (or do the math yourselves) Jab has the highest DPS in the entire SuperStrength Set, if you account for activation/recharge and just cycling one attack, that is.
So, what it all comes down to is that we could just go nuts with DPS and try to cycle jab with a filler or two.
However, I can see why people want to build up Fury fast as well. At least for PvP, you want to finish things quickly. Trading blows isn't an option if you're opponent is a superspeeding blaster or a troller slipping and out of phase shifts or PFF. You want to get in there and deal as much damage as you can as quickly as possible. One KO Blow, Rage + Full Fury should take care of that . You don't have much use of a fancy attack chain there.
And I totally agree, one the corner stones of SS is the constant damage output and a solid attack chain is just that. Ignoring that fact would be rather silly. Ignoring Jab as an attack power is silly too . In CoH I prefer:
Jab > AS > Haymaker (> Ko Blow). Occassional Punch to fill things in (not fully managed to get my recharging enhancments sorted, as I probably won't be picking up Hasten after my last respec).
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Also, and trust me on this one (or do the math yourselves) Jab has the highest DPS in the entire SuperStrength Set, if you account for activation/recharge and just cycling one attack, that is.
[/ QUOTE ]While that is theoretically true, you can get much higher DPS by cycling multiple high/medium-damage attacks.
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Also, and trust me on this one (or do the math yourselves) Jab has the highest DPS in the entire SuperStrength Set, if you account for activation/recharge and just cycling one attack, that is.
[/ QUOTE ]While that is theoretically true, you can get much higher DPS by cycling multiple high/medium-damage attacks.
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If you do form an attack chain with just Punch and Haymaker. The only two melee attacks (within SS that has moderate or high, sans Hurl and Foot Stomp) you get less DPS, and a down-time while one of them are recharging. That is if we only do it within the powerset, we should probably mix in Flurry, Boxing or AS (Flurry and Boxing for their slight better DPS than AS, and AS for the -fly) to form a fluid attack-chain. And some rechargers in Haymaker.
To form an attack chain we need to cover for everything, activation time, recharge, damage per endurance, damage per second, damage per animation/activation (where jab stands kind of flat, while KO Blow and HayMaker would be pretty amazing ).
I don't have current numbers or means (or desire) to calculate the most optimal attack chain. If anyone does, be my guest .
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To form an attack chain we need to cover for everything, activation time, recharge, damage per endurance, damage per second, damage per animation/activation (where jab stands kind of flat, while KO Blow and HayMaker would be pretty amazing ).
[/ QUOTE ]Or we could just get all the powerful attacks available and keep using them whenever they're available 
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To form an attack chain we need to cover for everything, activation time, recharge, damage per endurance, damage per second, damage per animation/activation (where jab stands kind of flat, while KO Blow and HayMaker would be pretty amazing ).
[/ QUOTE ]Or we could just get all the powerful attacks available and keep using them whenever they're available
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That would be the lazy man's approach .
Me, I would like to do it the really, manly way. Ya' know, hunting buffalos with toothpicks and wrestling alligators blind-folded.
I remember there being a whole lot of calculations about this on the US forums. Also remember seeing a thread about MA that was nothing short of spectacular, some really interresting readings (and numbers) there about attack chains...
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To form an attack chain we need to cover for everything, activation time, recharge, damage per endurance, damage per second, damage per animation/activation (where jab stands kind of flat, while KO Blow and HayMaker would be pretty amazing ).
[/ QUOTE ]Or we could just get all the powerful attacks available and keep using them whenever they're available
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Doing that is the best way if you have no endurance problems.
However I think the point is that Ko Blow and Haymaker cost lots of endurance and I don't want want to waste them ( on enemies with a sliver of health ). Also I think they may have slightly longer animation times than Jab/Boxing/Brawl and Punch. So I tend to use Jab/Boxing/Punch initially with the odd Haymaker and KO Blow on the nasty enemies. As I get angry I use KO blow as much as possible.
@Unthing ... Mostly on Union.
My main rule of saving endurance is not to use a high damage attack when the foe only has a small amount of health left
"Well, they found my diary today.
They were appropriately appalled
at the discovery of the eight victims
They're now putting it all together.
Women wrapped in silk
with one leg missing
Eight legs, one body, silk,
spider, brilliant!"
True, when health gets low on them, I leave it for the long range to cover that, and my DoT should probably help too.
ppl always say they use e.g. brawl and jab to build fury, then fire big attacks like KB.
as for my current ss/inv, i got 3 toggles, and *never ever* running out of endurance. so i usually hit 1, 2, 3, 4 to cycle all 4 attacks, followed by a brawl. so why wait with the bigger attacks, when you can use them to build fury and do bigger damage at the same time? the more dmg you do, the faster you defeat the enemy. plus your big attacks got specials like knockback and such, which brawl and e.g. jab (only low chance to disorient) dont have.
thats why i personnaly do it like that:
Haymaker (foe probably falls down)
Punch (same)
Jab
Brawl
repat the above, if foe aint already dead.
in larger groups i usually do an additional KB when another foe joins the fight to keep him busy, or, hurl at some marksman sniping me from the distance.
so why do ppl use brawl+low attack only, to build fury, when they can (on the way to get fury) already do more damage, thus defeating enemies faster?