Improving the reputation of */TA


5th_Player

 

Posted

I know I'm focusing on a secondary power that is also a Defender primary but I've noticed that very few Controllers are taking Trick Arrow as a secondary. In my experience, it is one of the most powerful and synergistic secondaries for most if not all Controllers.

I think we all know that being */kin can get you on just about any team especially if you're willing to spam speed boost and fulcrum shift. However, one of the things that can affect a person's decision on whether or not to take a certain powerset is their speculation on how desireable they would be on a team. Here are a few reasons I think people should feel good about creating and recruiting Controllers with Trick Arrow secondaries.

1. Extra controls: TA in and of itself almost plays like a Controller primary. Actually, I'm shocked it's availabe for Controllers. Glue, Oil Slick and even Flash are nice soft controls while Ice stacks up nicely on Bosses with your single target primary. EMP is a great AoE hard control that can be alternated between the primary AoE hold and sets up containment.

2. DeBuffs. People love Fulcrum Shift because it increases damage (allowing the team to "arrest" faster) but TA offers two powers that decrease resistance. They both recharge quickly and are offered earlier than FS. Also, the whole team benefits as opposed to only those who are in FS range at the time of the application.

3. Oil Slick Arrow. As mentioned above, it's a great soft control but what better way to take advantage of immobilize, slow or fear powers than to also apply DoT?

These are just a handful of reasons to be on the look out for our point-sticked friends. On those occassions where I'm not the team lead I almost always get the leader who refuses to advance the group until he finds a "healer" or kin. Ultimately, my wish is that the stigma on */TA can be diminished similar to the persecution of Dark/Dark defenders in the earlier issues.

If anyone has any builds, tips, experiences or anecdotes they'd like to share regarding */TA Controllers, feel free. Think of it as a therapy group.


 

Posted

A while ago, I decided I wanted to try out the Trick Arrow Secondary. I had already taken my Ill/Rad to 50, loved Illusion, and thought that the two would synergize well together. I was right.

TA fills a lot of Illusion's holes. Illusion lacks an Immobilize, TA has one. Illusion lacks a slow, TA has one. Illusion lacks a sleep, TA has one. Illusion lacks an AoE knockdown and AoE damage, and TA fills that hole too. Illusion's AoE hold is PB AoE, and TA adds a ranged AoE hold.

Most importantly, Illusion needs debuffs to make Phantom Army better, and that's what TA has. Illusion can be entirely played at range, except for Flash. TA works best from range. TA needs a little time to set up the debuffs, and Illusion gives TA that time by sending in Phantom Army to draw aggro.

I specifically tried to take as many of the TA powers as I could. I chose Hasten/Super Speed for travel just so I could fit in one more TA power. I only skipped Group Invis and Flash from Illusion, and only skipped Flash Arrow from TA -- not needed as much when you can be invisible. I went with the Fire APP to give me two additional ways to light my Oil Slick. In place of the last two APP powers, I picked up the medicine pool just to shorten down time.

After playing the TA set, I feel I made a good choice. Illusion is probably the best primary to pair with TA as Illusion can really make use of all of TA's tricks.


LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control

 

Posted

I also love Trick Arrow as a secondary. It's the only secondary until now I have been able to pair with Gravity and enjoy.

Gravity also lacks in certain areas as a primary, but the synergy with Trick Arrow is wonderful. I can hover at range above the fray and keep everything locked down.

I still haven't had the chance to try the level 35 and 38 powers, but I've heard good things and expect them to be good along with Gravity's other late blooming area control.


 

Posted

I've got a lowbie plant/TA that I'm really enjoying at the moment. The synergy between the two is pretty respectable, can't wait till I get the higher level powers.


 

Posted

Fire/TA is also a very overlooked combination. Flash Arrow + Smoke + Ice/Stone epic shields allows the squishy controller to bounce most of the Alpha that occurs with that opening mez.


-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson

 

Posted

My Plant/Trick Arrow Controller is awesome. I hold bosses, confuse the rest, and then keep them where I want them with Roots and Carrion Creepers while I hit them with -Res debuffs and then an Oil Slick Arrow ignited with Fireball.

That's Seeds of Confusion+Strangler+Ice Arrow+Roots+Carrion Creepers+Acid Arrow+Disruption Arrow+Oil Slick Arrow+Fireball.

And I still have Vines, EMP Arrow, Poison Gas Arrow, Flash Arrow, and Glue Arrow for the next group. Cool, huh?

TA is a great secondary for building up your control and debuffing. I think that it's actually better for a controller than for a defender, since it fills in all the cracks in most controller sets. I attribute its lack of popularity to other players. I had a lot of trouble finding a team because I didn't have a heal or a direct buff.


Too many alts to list.

 

Posted

A Plant/TA/Fire doesn't need a team.


-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson

 

Posted

I know it doesn't NEED a team, but you can't affect huge groups of enemies when you're solo.


Too many alts to list.

 

Posted

TA's only problem is that many players have decided to stay in a distant little corner of gameplay, running only a tiny subset of missions and accepting only a tiny subset of buff/debuff sets for very narrow purposes.

Among players who experience the game to the fullest, TA's reputation is quite good, I can assure you.


 

Posted

I have one of those infamous earth/TAs. I think TA is not a good pairing with earth unless one is really aiming to be 'king of controls'. Earth already has so much control, so good primaries to pair with TA would be something damaging (Illusion, Fire), or to use TA to back up a weak primary (Gravity).

TA is rather like rad, but gives up some rad powers in exchange for some cc/damage powers. The main reason why TA falls behind in the debuffing game is that it takes many powers, many clicks (and hence time) to do what rad does, which is throw some toggles. When fighting spawns, this is an advantage in that there are no pesky toggles, small radius effects to take care of. When fighting an AV or GM, this becomes a clickfest which takes time away from doing other things.

Then the fact that TA lacks a heal. No -- wait -- the TA controller lacks the means to heal themself without going into the medicine pool. TA draws a good amount of aggro. This is more a problem for defenders than controllers since controllers have a primary that helps it out, but having self-heals is always a big-pro.


"Honesty is for the most part less profitable than dishonesty." -- Plato

Playing Gods (51106) - Heroic Lvl 5-20
What Rough Beast (255143) - Villainous Lvl 40-50

 

Posted

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I know it doesn't NEED a team, but you can't affect huge groups of enemies when you're solo.

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Try hazzard zones. That's where I take my Plant/TA/Fire when there isn't much teaming going on.


-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson

 

Posted

Ive never rolled a Trick Arrow Controller, or even considered rolling one, because its probably the hardest set to come up with a concept for.

Or to put it another way, the most visually obtrusive secondary.

Rad Emission, for example, looks like you're, well, doing something. Could be light control, could be magical, or probablity control or whatever. The glowing effects could be no more real than the way your head glows different colours when you experience a moment of Inspiration.
The same can be said for Sonic Resonance or Kinetics.

But Trick Arrow you're unquestionably pulling out a bow and firing off an arrow with a gadget on the end. And never firing a normal pointy arrow.

I've always found that a bit hard to reconcile - if you can control the very earth or flame, or gravity, why are you carrying some gimmicks-on-a-stick around?

I have seen a few good bio's: Like a stage magician's assistant with Illusion/TA powers, but they're few and far between.


 

Posted

It's not all that hard to come up with. My Earth/TA is a primal huntress even based loosely in Germanic mythology. She's the patron hunter gatherer. Her Earth powers come from the growing plants/gathering side and she uses enchanted arrows to take prey alive.

My Plant/TA is one of the Tuatha De Dannon Druidesses. The arrows do special things because she was supposed to fool and delay the attacking Fir Bolg since their forces were so much larger. She does this by deceit with trick arrows and then bidding the plants to destroy her enemies.

My Fire/TA is all about gadgets. The primary is all created through machinery that is built into his super suit. He ran out of room in the suit because he's currently underwhelmed by the tech level. He was on the archery team in High School and College, he needed an accurate way to deliver a few more long range tricks since they wouldn't fit up his sleeves, so he combined his old hobby with his new avocation and the extra tricks are in his quiver since the sleeves are all ready packed full.


-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
Ive never rolled a Trick Arrow Controller, or even considered rolling one, because its probably the hardest set to come up with a concept for.

Or to put it another way, the most visually obtrusive secondary.

Rad Emission, for example, looks like you're, well, doing something. Could be light control, could be magical, or probablity control or whatever. The glowing effects could be no more real than the way your head glows different colours when you experience a moment of Inspiration.
The same can be said for Sonic Resonance or Kinetics.

But Trick Arrow you're unquestionably pulling out a bow and firing off an arrow with a gadget on the end. And never firing a normal pointy arrow.

I've always found that a bit hard to reconcile - if you can control the very earth or flame, or gravity, why are you carrying some gimmicks-on-a-stick around?

I have seen a few good bio's: Like a stage magician's assistant with Illusion/TA powers, but they're few and far between.

[/ QUOTE ]

Illusion/TA actually is fairly easy to come up with a story for. I wanted a combination of an entertainer (Illusion) with something for Bow and Arrow . . .

So my character became the official entertainer for the French Foreign Legion, named "Beau Jester" (Some of you youngsters may have never heard of "Beau Geste" . . . read a book or two!)


LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control

 

Posted

For my TA/Dark. The story is that she wasn't good at controlling Dark Magic and summoned a Magical Cursed Rune Bow to fill in the gaps that other Dark/Dark sorceresses could do.


 

Posted

I was never under the impression that TA had a poor reputation in the first place. It's not popular, to be sure, but those of us who know, know.

If the OP's is merely trying to spread the word, more power to you, sir.


An Offensive Guide to Ice Melee

 

Posted

Shhhhh keep this to ourselves. If trick arrow gets discovered it will be mass produced. I like being the rare bird on a tf.

My mind/trick arrow is flat out fantastic. My earth/trick arrow is still in the fledgling stage but should be an absolute tf monster.

I just don't want people who don't like the set trying it. Then blaming the set for their poor play ability with it.

I feel bad for Trick Arrow defenders. They get shunned so many times. Every time I invite one to a TF, i always get a reply a kin to "I don't have a healing arrow". To which I always reply, I know and don't care, just get in here.

So for my fellow Trick Arrow players.

KEEP IT UNDER YOUR HATS!! hehehehe When one finds the Fountain of Gold, one does not tell the whole planet where that fountain is!!

Seriously tho, spread the word through the underground.


 

Posted

Talionis, Milady's Knight, and Local Man - those are cool backstories.

However, if I may ask, did you come up with the backstories first, or decide that you wanted to create a Trick Archer of a certain kind and then fit the backstory to it?

I'm not trying to knock this powerset in anyway, just pointing out one of the reasons people may not play it. If anyone comes to the game with a pre-existing character idea that they want to fit into the game as closely as possible, chances are Trick Arrow wont be it.
My first Controller, for example, Anemone, was a superstrong telepathic mermaid from a Freedom Force game mod I made. She ended up being Mind Control/Kinetics because it didn't burst my bubble much to see blue and green waves emanating from her as she gestured every now and then, whereas carrying a bow would have looked out of place.
Same for every other Aquaman/Jean Grey/Magneto/Doc Strange/Jonn Jonn'z wannabe or analogue out there.

Nothing wrong with making a character either way, backstory first or powerset first, but this particular set will be a turn-off to the backstory first crowd.


 

Posted

"Beau Jester" was a name I came up with specifically for an Illusion/TA. I decided I wanted to try out the TA set, thought it would pair well with Illusion (which I already liked), and then brainstormed to come up with the name.

I would say that my names are about 50/50 -- half I come up with the name first and then pick a powerset to match, and half I pick the powerset I want to play and then come up with a name. Most of my names are jokes, puns or some kind of personal reference that amuses me.


LOCAL MAN! The most famous hero of all. There are more newspaper stories about me than anyone else. "Local Man wins Medal of Honor." "Local Man opens Animal Shelter." "Local Man Charged with..." (Um, forget about that one.)
Guide Links: Earth/Rad Guide, Illusion/Rad Guide, Electric Control

 

Posted

The back story for my Earth/TA Nerthus Matres came first.

The back story for my Plant/TA Becuille DeDannon ( Bé Chuille & Dianann ) also came first.

My Fire/TA A shot in the light had character creation done first and back story done after.

My TA/A defender Lost Loon, that I didn't mention previously, is homage to a Native American Scout, Paper and Pencil game character, that my best friend ran in my game world for a good 3 years prior to him passing away. That back story even pre-dates CoH.


-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson

 

Posted

Cool! I especially like tying in a character to Irish mythology since we actually have Tuatha De Dannan and so on in game.

Is it fair to say you're something of a mythology buff, Milady's Knight?


 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
Cool! I especially like tying in a character to Irish mythology since we actually have Tuatha De Dannan and so on in game.

Is it fair to say you're something of a mythology buff, Milady's Knight?

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Lol very fair. Virtue is my Egyptian server, Freedom my Nordic, and Justice is my Celtic. I don't do Roman or Greek since I always thought they were a bit over done when I was studying and perusing and CoX has gone overboard with them anyway.


-Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. - Albert Einstein.
-I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. - Galileo Galilei
-When injustice becomes law, resistance becomes duty. - Thomas Jefferson

 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
Talionis, Milady's Knight, and Local Man - those are cool backstories.

However, if I may ask, did you come up with the backstories first, or decide that you wanted to create a Trick Archer of a certain kind and then fit the backstory to it?

I'm not trying to knock this powerset in anyway, just pointing out one of the reasons people may not play it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Prehistory, ancient history, medieval history, Native American history and comic history all have extremely fertile ground for TA character conceptualization. I have two ancient Grecian characters, one ancient Egyptian, two Native American, two classic comic book...

[ QUOTE ]
If anyone comes to the game with a pre-existing character idea that they want to fit into the game as closely as possible, chances are Trick Arrow wont be it.

[/ QUOTE ]

The same could be said about every powerset. That's one of the things that makes this game so fantastic, there are actually options for almost anything anyone can imagine. Including bows and arrows.


 

Posted

I'd disagree that the same can be said for every powerset, Luminara.

Trick Archery looks like you are unequivocally using a Bow and Arrow to fire arrows with unusual devices attached.

For the record, Storm is also pretty unequivocably weather manipulation, and Force Fields are Force Fields.

If you sat down someone who'd never played the game to watch you use any of these three sets, they'd probably describe pretty accuractely what you were doing.

"You're shooting an arrow with a net on the end"
"You're creating a tornado and a Lightning Storm!"
"You just put a Force Field round that guy!"

But Radiation Emission, Sonic Resonance, Kinetics and Empathy are all much vaguer to watch.
The non-player watching would describe that you're just gesturing and making some enemies or allies (or parts thereof) glow a different colour, and making your side win more easily.
Its not visually apparent how, and this does make it easier to kind of stretch these powersets around any concept.

Same can be said of, say, Tanker Armors. Ice Armor is pretty hard to pretend you're anything other than covered in ice. Or crystal at a pinch.
Invulnerability or Willpower, though, could stand in for a metal body, a stone body, Superman style classic Invulnerability, being a big tough lug like Marv from Sin City, having a personal force field like Captain Britain or tech armour like Iron Man.
Ice Armour is therfore more narrow in terms of the concepts it supports. Not a worse set in any way, but narrower in the concepts it supports.

I'm not bagging Trick Arrow in any way. Its no worse mechanically than other sets, but it does have a tighter range of visual definitions than some other debuff/buff sets.


 

Posted

I can see it. You can get away with calling almost every one of the Controller secondaries whatever you want from magic auras to fancy mutant powers to...whatever, but Trick Arrow is just a person with a bow who shoots out arrows that are either scientific gadgets or enchanted or something. Makes the concept hard to figure out.

I made my Plant/TA based on the story of the blind Norse god Hud being tricked into killing his brother Baldur with an arrow made from mistletoe by Locke (google Mistletoe, Locke, and Baldur if you're confused and actually care enough to look it up). My character supposedly wears a bracelet made from the mistletoe that killed a god and the bow that fired the arrow, giving his magic arrows and plant manipulation. It was a stretch, but I hate leaving the description blank.


Too many alts to list.