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This is my biggest problem with the set. The set has the potential to be a monster when coupled with Katana or BS, but I can't bring it to it's survival limits and have the endurance usage needed for long fights like AVs and such.
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Anything you would need in an AV fight on any Scrapper (particularly those lacking Quick Recovery) plus the (edit) Theft of Essence proc in Dark Regen seems to cover bases very nicely for me.
Blue
American Steele: 50 BS/Inv
Nightfall: 50 DDD
Sable Slayer: 50 DM/Rgn
Fortune's Shadow: 50 Dark/Psi
WinterStrike: 47 Ice/Dev
Quantum Well: 43 Inv/EM
Twilit Destiny: 43 MA/DA
Red
Shadowslip: 50 DDC
Final Rest: 50 MA/Rgn
Abyssal Frost: 50 Ice/Dark
Golden Ember: 50 SM/FA
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You really only take a hard end hit when you use the dmg aura, cloak of fear and/or when you used dark reg poorly. Dump the dmg aura, use OG instead of CoF and only fire off dark regen when you're almost dead (and properly slot it with IO's) and the end use isn't very bad at all.
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The damage aura is a big reason to use the set though. I like Cloak of Fear but once you really pimp out with IOs it can absolutely be discarded.
I personally don't like OG. When I finally got it on my MA/Dark it really didn't seem to increase my survivability as much as I though it might and I really hated the BIG RED EGG.
YMMV
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Having played all the secondaries, however, I do think DA could use some tweaks. One, I'd rework CoF, it costs WAY too much end for what it does, either reduce the end cost or improve/change the effects of the power. And I think the tier nine could use improvement, like making it usable while still alive - when used alive it would deliver a low mag stun and drain end from targets and return it to user.
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I absolutely agree that the Endurance cost and Acc penalty on Cloak of Fear are too big. (I would suggest a hefty end reduction.) However I'd like to point out that the big win on Cloak of Fear isn't the fear, it's the hefty ToHit debuff.
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And for the love of god, please don't make CoD turn the user completely invisible, or at least make it user's choice somehow.
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This.
Moonlighter
50s include MA/SD, MA/SR, DP/Elec, Claw/Inv, Kat/Dark, Kat/Fire, Spine/Regen, Dark/SD
First Arc: Tequila Sunrise, #168563
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You really only take a hard end hit when you use the dmg aura, cloak of fear and/or when you used dark reg poorly. Dump the dmg aura, use OG instead of CoF and only fire off dark regen when you're almost dead (and properly slot it with IO's) and the end use isn't very bad at all.
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The damage aura is a big reason to use the set though. I like Cloak of Fear but once you really pimp out with IOs it can absolutely be discarded.
I personally don't like OG. When I finally got it on my MA/Dark it really didn't seem to increase my survivability as much as I though it might and I really hated the BIG RED EGG.
YMMV
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Having played all the secondaries, however, I do think DA could use some tweaks. One, I'd rework CoF, it costs WAY too much end for what it does, either reduce the end cost or improve/change the effects of the power. And I think the tier nine could use improvement, like making it usable while still alive - when used alive it would deliver a low mag stun and drain end from targets and return it to user.
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I absolutely agree that the Endurance cost and Acc penalty on Cloak of Fear are too big. (I would suggest a hefty end reduction.) However I'd like to point out that the big win on Cloak of Fear isn't the fear, it's the hefty ToHit debuff.
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And for the love of god, please don't make CoD turn the user completely invisible, or at least make it user's choice somehow.
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This.
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I wouldn't say the dmg aura is a 'big' reason to take DA, it's a plus, but as with any plus you pay a penalty, in this case endurance usage. If you want to argue that the endurance usage is too high for what you get, especially when you factor in the ridiculous end costs of CoF and the lack of KB resistance and a rez for a tier 9, then I agree with you, which is why I suggested 'tweaks' to the set.
And talking about the graphic effects of the set, I think a lot of the effects turn some people off which makes the set less attractive. Maybe they could all be toned down, and if players still want them, or want them amped up, maybe they could do it in the costume shops rather than forcing them on everyone. I never used to use CoD, but with my new def build, it's pretty much a necessity, and I hate playing a toon that I can't see, never mind the fact the power is cloak of darkness, and the power provides stealth, not invisibility. I know some people like the generic cloud person effect, and that's fine, but wouldn't it be better to have translucency as an aura option in the costume shops than forcing it on everyone?
I just don't like Dark Armor because it looks like a smokestack puked on my character.
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I just don't like Dark Armor because it looks like a smokestack puked on my character.
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For the most part, Suppressclosefx pretty much negates this issue.
SI Radio has many DJs and listeners whom hold City of Heroes close to their hearts. We will be supporting many efforts to keep CoH ALIVE!!
QR--
I like Dark Armor. It gives solid protection to pretty much anything you might face, really nothing is your kryptonite. Toxic damage hurts, but it's incredibly rare. You're moderately weak to energy damage, but not critically. Things like Carnies that most fear, you eat for breakfast.
I do think Cloak of Fear could use a little buff. The endurance cost is just huge for a power with accuracy that makes controller AoE holds look good, a fear which isn't that long (7 seconds)--and only mag 2, and a 5% resistable ToHit debuff that isn't anything to write home about either. To top it off, it only fires every 5 seconds, with no control on when it fires.
It's a fun power, and it looks good, but I think the end cost is a bit high for a power that has all of those things working against it.
I have a lvl 50 katana/DA scrapper (the first toon I ever rolled), and I love COF. I just slotted it with 4 nightmares, and toggle lotus drops every few seconds when near a group of enemies and I have them leaving little fear puddles everywhere (including crimoreans). 
DA Scrapper's walking down the street
He was walkin' walkin' walkin' walkin' walkin' walkin'
DA scrapper's eating the concrete
No one likes DA
No one likes DA-A!
Nobody likes the DA!
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I'm waiting for someone to step up and show us how good that combo is soon.
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I'm nearly done with my DM/DA build and BS/DA is incidentally my next focus. I'm curious as to what you meant by this comment though.
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I assume it means that he understands just how good BS/DA or Katana/DA could be, but none of us have really gone totally nuts with a build yet. Mine's at 29 now, so it'll be a while for me. Someone will definitely beat me to the punch. I know you're working on one. Powerforge is also working on one, and we know what he can do. I still need to review his build. (Sorry, Powerforge.)
"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
If you put it with the right primary and load it up with IO's its ok otherwise it just doesnt bring enough to the table.
In my humble opinion it only works with spines and even then it takes a large IO investment before it becomes truly powerful. Claws and the swords can work with dark but they would be stronger with almost any other secondary which is a telling point. Spines/dark is not a beginner build either and the journey up can be agonizing at points but once you get into the 30s the combo becomes amazing. It used to be truly unique in this aspect but now I suspect a spines/fire is just as good with more room in the build.
Dark Aura just does not do anything any other secondary could do better. The only unique thing is the control auras and they counteract one another so picking both tends to be a waste. You dont even want to know how bad your tier 9 is, I mean really I waited 38 levels for this? I mean it may just be the worst power in the game.
Another reason I think you don't see a lot of DA's running around is it is horrible in pvp. I know not everyone likes pvp, I haven't even done it since I13. But I really think its in the back of everyones minds when they are leveling up a toon and taking the time to load it up with IO's that it would be at least nice to be competent in pvp.
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If you put it with the right primary and load it up with IO's its ok otherwise it just doesnt bring enough to the table.
In my humble opinion it only works with spines and even then it takes a large IO investment before it becomes truly powerful. Claws and the swords can work with dark but they would be stronger with almost any other secondary which is a telling point.
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Now, I'm only talking about seriously expensive builds here. And I don't have a build I'm satisfied with, but I can tell you what I believe that Katana/Dark and Broad Sword/Dark are capable of. I believe they are capable of soft capping defense, plus having all those nice resists, plus having one of the best heals in the game on a quick recharge, plus being solid builds that give up almost nothing to get there. I think they would have better survivability than most top tier scrappers under most circumstances.
Again, I'm not fully-satisfied with anything I've seen or made yet, but I think there's a build out there waiting to be discovered that will put most everything else to shame.
Or I could be wrong. But even if I'm wrong, the builds I've seen are at least competitive. 
"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
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If you put it with the right primary and load it up with IO's its ok otherwise it just doesnt bring enough to the table.
In my humble opinion it only works with spines and even then it takes a large IO investment before it becomes truly powerful. Claws and the swords can work with dark but they would be stronger with almost any other secondary which is a telling point.
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Now, I'm only talking about seriously expensive builds here. And I don't have a build I'm satisfied with, but I can tell you what I believe that Katana/Dark and Broad Sword/Dark are capable of. I believe they are capable of soft capping defense, plus having all those nice resists, plus having one of the best heals in the game on a quick recharge, plus being solid builds that give up almost nothing to get there. I think they would have better survivability than most top tier scrappers under most circumstances.
Again, I'm not fully-satisfied with anything I've seen or made yet, but I think there's a build out there waiting to be discovered that will put most everything else to shame.
Or I could be wrong. But even if I'm wrong, the builds I've seen are at least competitive.
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I'd agree with most of those assessments Werner with one qualification: it's gonna be hell on your blue bar. You're either going to get a build that has nice, sustainable blue bar, or you're going to get one that blows every other set's survivability out of the water. There isn't really much middle ground on the mega-builds.
My .02 on /DA.
Without Theft of Essence Proc in Dark Regen = Meh, decent.
With Theft of Essence Proc = Awesomesauce.
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I'd agree with most of those assessments Werner with one qualification: it's gonna be hell on your blue bar. You're either going to get a build that has nice, sustainable blue bar, or you're going to get one that blows every other set's survivability out of the water. There isn't really much middle ground on the mega-builds.
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It's going to be difficult, that's for certain. Everything is achievable separately. But doing it all at the same time? Eesh! I really should plan out a build rather than just hoping, but I've been having too much fun with my altitis this year to spend any time planning. Most of the alts I've been playing are upper 30s to upper 40s now, and I've gotten one of them to 50, so maybe some month soon I'll be back to focusing on doing some serious damage with one or two builds.
"That's because Werner can't do maths." - BunnyAnomaly
"Four hours in, and I was no longer making mistakes, no longer detoggling. I was a machine." - Werner
Videos of Other Stupid Scrapper Tricks
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I'd agree with most of those assessments Werner with one qualification: it's gonna be hell on your blue bar. You're either going to get a build that has nice, sustainable blue bar, or you're going to get one that blows every other set's survivability out of the water. There isn't really much middle ground on the mega-builds.
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It's going to be difficult, that's for certain. Everything is achievable separately. But doing it all at the same time? Eesh! I really should plan out a build rather than just hoping, but I've been having too much fun with my altitis this year to spend any time planning. Most of the alts I've been playing are upper 30s to upper 40s now, and I've gotten one of them to 50, so maybe some month soon I'll be back to focusing on doing some serious damage with one or two builds.
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Just hurry it up already... 
I got my Kat/FA to 50 just a couple days ago finally... just waiting for a few more recipes to fall my way and maybe half a bill to go... 
gots a long way i know...
My BS/DA got gutted to get my claws/regen closer to done. When I finally get around to finishing his build I'll put it up for your inspection.
I have survived some ridiculous things just with a basic build, so I'm curious to see what I can do with a pimped-out one.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison See, it's gems like these that make me check Claws' post history every once in a while to make sure I haven't missed anything good lately. |
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I never see posts on Dark Armor or any recommendations for DA. I really love the look of Cloak of Fear, even though it sucks now....so I hear.
Is there a buff incoming for DA or was there one, or just a nerf?
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Dark Armor is perfect the way it is. Most people don't like the "complexities" of the set.
I like the set, it's the graphics I don't like.
I could skip CoD and use the suppresscloseFX command, but the minmaxer in me wouldn't feel right doing this.
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I'm waiting for someone to step up and show us how good that combo is soon.
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I'm nearly done with my DM/DA build and BS/DA is incidentally my next focus. I'm curious as to what you meant by this comment though.
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I assume it means that he understands just how good BS/DA or Katana/DA could be, but none of us have really gone totally nuts with a build yet. Mine's at 29 now, so it'll be a while for me. Someone will definitely beat me to the punch. I know you're working on one. Powerforge is also working on one, and we know what he can do. I still need to review his build. (Sorry, Powerforge.)
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I will correct you on the fact that the "known" scrappers haven't gone nuts on this set. And there is a reason. There is a rule of BS/DA that quite a few of those that are decked out tend to keep. We don't talk about it. Sure you can tweak using MIDs, but that will not compare to learning the set.
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I'm waiting for someone to step up and show us how good that combo is soon.
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I'm nearly done with my DM/DA build and BS/DA is incidentally my next focus. I'm curious as to what you meant by this comment though.
[/ QUOTE ]
I assume it means that he understands just how good BS/DA or Katana/DA could be, but none of us have really gone totally nuts with a build yet. Mine's at 29 now, so it'll be a while for me. Someone will definitely beat me to the punch. I know you're working on one. Powerforge is also working on one, and we know what he can do. I still need to review his build. (Sorry, Powerforge.)
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I will correct you on the fact that the "known" scrappers haven't gone nuts on this set. And there is a reason. There is a rule of BS/DA that quite a few of those that are decked out tend to keep. We don't talk about it. Sure you can tweak using MIDs, but that will not compare to learning the set.
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I'll avoid the "pic's or it didn't happen" argument and go with the "if a tree falls in the woods" argument. What's the point of doing something awsome if nobody knows about it. Share with us ... there's no harm in it.
Besides... I14 gave us at least 2 very benificial IO's to /DA (another +3 defense, and that +endurance proc for dark regen). I13 did a lot for helping sets get more +defense from IOs. Whatever you could do before, you should be able to better now.
I gotta make pain. I gotta make things right. I gotta stop what's comin'. 'Least I gotta try.
You folks just gave me an objective to work on until Issue 15.
Presently, my BS/DA runs CoF and has virtually no enduance concerns, time to beef up the reacharge and survivablity a bit.
SI Radio has many DJs and listeners whom hold City of Heroes close to their hearts. We will be supporting many efforts to keep CoH ALIVE!!
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I'm waiting for someone to step up and show us how good that combo is soon.
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I'm nearly done with my DM/DA build and BS/DA is incidentally my next focus. I'm curious as to what you meant by this comment though.
[/ QUOTE ]
I assume it means that he understands just how good BS/DA or Katana/DA could be, but none of us have really gone totally nuts with a build yet. Mine's at 29 now, so it'll be a while for me. Someone will definitely beat me to the punch. I know you're working on one. Powerforge is also working on one, and we know what he can do. I still need to review his build. (Sorry, Powerforge.)
[/ QUOTE ]
I will correct you on the fact that the "known" scrappers haven't gone nuts on this set. And there is a reason. There is a rule of BS/DA that quite a few of those that are decked out tend to keep. We don't talk about it. Sure you can tweak using MIDs, but that will not compare to learning the set.
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I'll avoid the "pic's or it didn't happen" argument and go with the "if a tree falls in the woods" argument. What's the point of doing something awsome if nobody knows about it. Share with us ... there's no harm in it.
Besides... I14 gave us at least 2 very benificial IO's to /DA (another +3 defense, and that +endurance proc for dark regen). I13 did a lot for helping sets get more +defense from IOs. Whatever you could do before, you should be able to better now.
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I am not concerened with a pics or it didn't happen argument and I don't play for the accolades of others. BS/DA has never been a FOTM and I am happy that way.
I did post a build once before after I did the RWZ challenge. It isn't my final build but it is a pretty strong one.
I will list some things off the top of my head: I run 9 toggles constantly and do not have end issues, 32.5% global recharge. Attack Chain is Headsplitter, hack, parry, disembowl, hack, parry. Def/Resist equates to capped mitigation in nearly all scenarios.
I have a Spines/DA and one thing that surprised me was just how not bad the endurance management was. Compared to my MA/SR scrapper it was a breeze. I didn't get CoF and only used CoD as a stealth power though. I did have Tough and Acrobatics though (was built before IOs). Once I IOed him up endurance was hardly a concern at all.
Having two PBAoE damage auras is really nice too, combined with OG I rarely even have to look at minions.
Dark Regen is borderline overpowered too. The only thing keeping it in check is the animation time. I've died to a lot of alpha strikes just because it has to go through the animation before it puts the points back on.
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I never see posts on Dark Armor or any recommendations for DA. I really love the look of Cloak of Fear, even though it sucks now....so I hear.
Is there a buff incoming for DA or was there one, or just a nerf?
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I can honestly say /dark armor sucks on Stalker. I've tried a lot of secondaries on Stalker and /da is the only set that I have trouble with. It just doesn't mesh well. And even with the mez toggles, it still feels weak on stalker.
Not sure about on scrapper though. The mez toggles don't mess with Hidden so I guess it's better.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
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Dark Armor sacrifices your blue bar on the altar of survivability. But it gives you the survivability.
Admittedly, I played Spine/Dark... I'd love to play Kat/Dark but I already have like 30 unfinished characters. (including a dark/energy tank around 36.)
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You really only take a hard end hit when you use the dmg aura, cloak of fear and/or when you used dark reg poorly. Dump the dmg aura, use OG instead of CoF and only fire off dark regen when you're almost dead (and properly slot it with IO's) and the end use isn't very bad at all.
Having played all the secondaries, however, I do think DA could use some tweaks. One, I'd rework CoF, it costs WAY too much end for what it does, either reduce the end cost or improve/change the effects of the power. And I think the tier nine could use improvement, like making it usable while still alive - when used alive it would deliver a low mag stun and drain end from targets and return it to user.
And for the love of god, please don't make CoD turn the user completely invisible, or at least make it user's choice somehow.