Do you read MA mission text? Clues? Descriptions?
By
Alex_Mars,
Posted on: 2009-05-09 21:50 in Mission Architect
I see the info text as for the player-as-audience. The info isn't for the character, necessarily (although it's up to the player to decide if it's 'appropriate' for their character to find out during the course of an arc).
I mean, by that argument, NO mob should have a description beyond 'he smells of machine oil.'
Good question CrazyCorsaire, and good answer Doc_Wormwood. I definitely don't see mob info as "in-character" knowledge, but it can be extremely beneficial to the story. Most comics, movies, and books give the audience a look at the villains when the protagonists aren't around. As the reader of a comic, I want to have a reason to respond emotionally to the villain, even if he doesn't take the time to explain himself to the hero. Imagine all the cool Darth Vader scenes that'd have to be cut out of the original Star Wars movies just because Luke wasn't there to see them. Lame!
That said, I can appreciate a strictly immersive approach to the game as well ... that's just not as rich for me.
And you'd better only play in first person! Your character has no idea what his butt looks like! 
EDIT: Also, I love BOTH of your descriptions of the Yuki Swordsmen, CC. Seeing either one in game would completely satisfy me ... for totally different reasons, of course!
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I read everything, and I wrote my MA arc for the same type of player. 
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Ditto. (And very well said.)
English is my life. Of course I fill up text boxes and read all the ones I can!
I'm out of signature space! Arcs by Tubbius of Justice are HERE: http://boards.cityofheroes.com/showthread.php?t=218177
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What about "get xpees lol"? Or "a"? What cryptic messages are they trying to convey?
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A desire for a GM to review their arc?
I'm definitely a reader, except for character descriptions, and that's only because my weak machine will lock up if I open those windows about half the time. 
I put in everything I can, but try to keep the main-storylines to the clues.
This thread has given me several "food for thought" moments, though. Many good ideas here.
Dec out.
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While there's technical info going on. . . Is there a way to set the screen settings (in particular opacity) for individual windows vs. universally? Or even get info to output to a channel vs. the popup.
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Not that I am aware of, but my knowledge is hardly comprehensive.
What I'd really love is a way to change the contact dialogue window opacity - syncing it to chat window opacity would be ideal for me. Having to find a dark, blank wall every time I want to read contact chat got old 3 years ago.
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Started thinking about this one... and came up with a way I'm going to start using:
I setup Chat 2 as a dummy chat with just Error text, named it x, and positioned its top to slightly below the top inner border of the contact dialog.
Then I used these two keybinds:
/bind u "window_color 88 0 80 255$$window_show chat2"
/bind i "window_color 88 0 80 128$$window_hide chat2"
The first turns it full opaque and pops up chat2. Have to click on the contact border to bring it back forward (thus the underlapping.)
The second tucks chat2 away and turns the window opacity to 50%.
Note the 88 0 80 are the RGB border colors, so tune as desired.
Never fails in AE, there's a huge contact text and I position it to just readible and Super Goober 1994 steps behind it with a cranked white aura.
I think this thread is giving me a good idea of where we're coming from as a group. Given that only a small percentage of the playerbase uses the forums, we may not be entirely representative, but that's fine. Telling stories for the benefit of other storytellers is motivation enough, hopefully with enough action to please the click-through crowd at least some of the time.
Arc 55669 - Tales of the PPD: One Hell of a Deal (video trailer)
Arc 64511 - The Wrecking Ball
Arc 1745 - The Trouble With Trimbles
Arc 302901 - HappyCorpse
Yes, very useful thread. I've been sticking with immersion as my measuring pole, but now I think "Would it work in a comic book?" is going to be a more effective frame of reference.
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Clues seem to be team unfriendly: they are readable by the clicker, but do not appear for anyone else as far as I know.
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Everyone can read the clues, they just don't get the "Clue Found" pop-up that the team leader gets.
How important is the enemy description text? One or two without descriptions is forgivable, but if I see a big custom group numbering close to a dozen critters or more and not a single one has a description then I'll take off a star as I won't consider the arc to be finished.
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I find that when creating custom characters, I like to give significant characters background info.
However, all the trooper, thug, minion types I don't necessarily give color text to. Why? How many ways can you say "this is a minion" and make it sound interesting? Some I do, because there's something in their purpose that is beyond simple "minionosity" (perhaps advanced tech to be explained), but in other cases it would be just another way of saying "this is an expendable helping the main baddies do their thing."
About the only text I have not read much is the critter info; I'm too busy fighting them to read them. I do go back and read ALL of the popup dialogue that I don't have time to read during the fight. Some authors are really creative.
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And specifically regarding custom and boss descriptions: absolutely. That text is the window into that character's reason for being. Whether he's a fanatical cultist, a paid mercenary, or a terrified slave who's more scared of his master than he is of me, I need to know why I'm fighting these guys, and why they're fighting back. "Because he's standing between you and Point B" is not acceptable for any arc pretending to have a story.
Boss dialogue can definitely illustrate this too, and is equally important, but I still feel a boss is hollow and two-dimensional without at least a cursory narrative description.
Best of all is when a certain character recurs throughout the arc, and the description changes based on intervening events.
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That does, however, provide spoilers if the author is trying to use the story to develop the character, perhaps through multiple mission arcs. In some respects, it's almost like reading the back of the book first -- depending entirely on the type of story being told.
If this is going to be a single mission arc without much room for "real" character development, then yes, we are limited by the medium and tools at hand. Providing at least clues to the character in the bio gives us some outlet for developing the character.
However, if you want the character to be mysterious and want to develop the character through storytelling, including that information in the bio would defeat the purpose.
If I am solo, I will read the contact text and NPC dialogue but often times people get too wordy in their clue descriptions for me. I rarely click on mob descriptions unless their physical descriptions really intrigue me.
If I am teamed I rarely read anything. I will catch the occasional NPC dialogue though.
When I create an arc I try to remember to put something in the text boxes for those that enjoy the story aspect of the game.
Paragonian Knights
Justice Company
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However, all the trooper, thug, minion types I don't necessarily give color text to. Why? How many ways can you say "this is a minion" and make it sound interesting? Some I do, because there's something in their purpose that is beyond simple "minionosity" (perhaps advanced tech to be explained), but in other cases it would be just another way of saying "this is an expendable helping the main baddies do their thing."
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Eh, I'm sorry, but that's pretty weak. Every minion has a reason to be there - otherwise, your arc is not a story but a shooting gallery. Your minion text doesn't have to be Hemingway, but there should be something to say about every mob in the game. Whether they're just amoral roughnecks recruited off the street and hoping to make a quick buck, soulless corpses animated by a necromancer to inconvenience his enemies, ex-military traitors, normal citizens driven insane by some weird space ray, whatever. If you don't identify why they're there, you're just saying, "These are video game characters who popped into existence for no reason at all other than to absorb the bullets of the good guys." Which may be true but it's terrible storytelling.
It doesn't HAVE to be "interesting". But your audience is going to be fighting dozens of these guys. A basic grasp of what they're doing there is the backdrop for your whole arc.
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And specifically regarding custom and boss descriptions: absolutely. That text is the window into that character's reason for being. Whether he's a fanatical cultist, a paid mercenary, or a terrified slave who's more scared of his master than he is of me, I need to know why I'm fighting these guys, and why they're fighting back. "Because he's standing between you and Point B" is not acceptable for any arc pretending to have a story.
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That does, however, provide spoilers if the author is trying to use the story to develop the character, perhaps through multiple mission arcs. In some respects, it's almost like reading the back of the book first -- depending entirely on the type of story being told.
... If you want the character to be mysterious and want to develop the character through storytelling, including that information in the bio would defeat the purpose.
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Completely agreed. Bios shouldn't contain story spoilers any more than clues should ("This is the key to the warehouse where you're going to get a surprise ambush!" - not the best clue!). You shouldn't describe an ally who later betrays you as someone with an evil heart and a penchant for double-crossing. In a case like that you should have a more superficial description, or even outright lies based on what the character is pretending to be like
I haven't done many, and the ones I have done are generally lacking in those locations.
I expect an "average" 3-star mission to be equal to your average IP Family mission. Similar costumes, power sets, minimal story, defeat all/boss at end... Not a high level of expectation there.
However the "Family" missions do have a bit of background, the goal stated, and info on the mobs. Thats part of my minimal 3-star expectation.
The inf I want with custom foes, as I will likely not have seen/heard of them before and I would like the Info to give me some hint what they might do. Or some reason they are there. Heck you could make minions named after gradiations in the visual spectrum and set a poem if you read them in order and that would be novel and interesting, if useless. 8p
I've only got the three stories going, but all have text if you feel like reading it.
But those include info o
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Then I used these two keybinds:
/bind u "window_color 88 0 80 255$$window_show chat2"
/bind i "window_color 88 0 80 128$$window_hide chat2"
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I love you.
I read everything unless the author already lost my interest with a bad story and I'm just continuing because I haven't quite reached "quit" on my "suck-o-meter".
For some reason it really irks me when I see "A lieutenant is stronger than a minion...", especially when it's on otherwise interesting looking creatures.
Infatum on Virtueverse
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Yes, I read everything. I check the clue when I click a glowie, when the mission is completed. I'm a big fan of the story element and every little thing just adds to it.
And like Raging_Bear above, I also click on custom NPCs to see if the creator has given them any interesting descriptions. Sometimes I get the "Lieut is stronger than..." message, other times, a real profile--which I really like reading about.
My Arcs: A Spider on the Column (117024)--updated/fixed bugs/small story modifications
Hub (87439)--updated/fixed
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How important is all the "wordy" stuff to you?
[/ QUOTE ]I read it all, descriptions on characters, clues, mission send off, and still busy dialogue, anything with dialogue. I even incorporated those ideals into my own story arcs, adding a new swing on it, and even putting in easter eggs into the missions.
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Eh, I'm sorry, but that's pretty weak. Every minion has a reason to be there - otherwise, your arc is not a story but a shooting gallery. Your minion text doesn't have to be Hemingway, but there should be something to say about every mob in the game. Whether they're just amoral roughnecks recruited off the street and hoping to make a quick buck, soulless corpses animated by a necromancer to inconvenience his enemies, ex-military traitors, normal citizens driven insane by some weird space ray, whatever. If you don't identify why they're there, you're just saying, "These are video game characters who popped into existence for no reason at all other than to absorb the bullets of the good guys." Which may be true but it's terrible storytelling.
It doesn't HAVE to be "interesting". But your audience is going to be fighting dozens of these guys. A basic grasp of what they're doing there is the backdrop for your whole arc.
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I understand your point; however, when I've got three custom minions and a pair of LTs in a group, finding five different ways of saying that they're all guns for hire can get monotonous, both for the writer and the reader. Can it be done? Sure. But it doesn't really add much of anything to the story.
I can see both sides of it, really. In the one arc I've published, I did include brief minion descriptions. But it's not a priority for me.
The story and text is important enough to me that I feel they ought to improve the experience.
I love reading the text. Even in "bad" stories, I like to read to try to get an idea what they were going for with their attempt. I have read a lot of cool ideas, even if they were not well executed.
Why Blasters? Empathy Sucks.
So, you want to be Mental?
What the hell? Let's buff defenders.
Tactics are for those who do not have a big enough hammer. Wisdom is knowing how big your hammer is.
I'd rather see a "bad" story than no story; sometimes there are glimmers of promise in otherwise limp or uninteresting material. If a mission has no story at all, you're better off playing a radio mission.
Arc 55669 - Tales of the PPD: One Hell of a Deal (video trailer)
Arc 64511 - The Wrecking Ball
Arc 1745 - The Trouble With Trimbles
Arc 302901 - HappyCorpse
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You shouldn't describe an ally who later betrays you as someone with an evil heart and a penchant for double-crossing. In a case like that you should have a more superficial description, or even outright lies based on what the character is pretending to be like
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When you add a description to a Boss/Ally/Hostage detail it overrides the default description, so in such a case there is little excuse to not give the NPC a different description with each of their appearances as the story progresses.
I think I am in the minority here.
The only things I read are: power descriptions when I level, and occasionally mission text if I cannot figure out the objective on my own.
To each their own.
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I think I am in the minority here.
The only things I read are: power descriptions when I level, and occasionally mission text if I cannot figure out the objective on my own.
To each their own.
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Ah "to each their own" possibly the greatest bit of wisdom to be found on this or any other forum.
Writer of In-Game fiction: Just Completed: My Summer Vacation. My older things are now being archived at Fanfiction.net http://www.fanfiction.net/~jwbullfrog until I come up with a better solution.
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And specifically regarding custom and boss descriptions: absolutely. That text is the window into that character's reason for being. Whether he's a fanatical cultist, a paid mercenary, or a terrified slave who's more scared of his master than he is of me, I need to know why I'm fighting these guys, and why they're fighting back. "Because he's standing between you and Point B" is not acceptable for any arc pretending to have a story.
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My hangup here is with immersion. Unless the hero is one of the mental ATs why would this information be available? As I'm writing that. . . maybe it's just that too often that text is On The Nose; telling vs. showing.
Maybe the disconnect is just in writing skill. I would rather see nothing than see "For twelve years the Yuki Swordsmen have been enslaved by the Ba'alkuh. They rail at their captivity and hope for revenge."
But (barring interface issues) I druther see: "He waits for a specific command before attacking, each time with a flash of loathing at the Ba'alkuh Overlord."