My new Water Marker style... yay or nay?
By
Dandy1,
Posted on: 2007-11-18 23:56 in Multi-Media Fan Creations
I don't really care for the style, but I think you execute it well if that counts 
What don't you like about it, I'd like to polish it if I can, or is that you just prefer that traditional rendered comic look, or are the colors to pale for your tastes? Cause I paint these with 50% opacity to give it that pale look on purpose, well except for the Conan Piece...
they look great i say yay.
I liked that style on war patriot, but the others were done differently (not as filled in i think). Maybe do it with an airbrush? I found its pretty easy to color with those and you can just go over the previous color with white airbrush to undo what you did (unless your doing layers hehe).
Or do watercolors? I really like the look of those how they bleed everywhere (if you have corel painter though, dont think photoshop has that?)
Or maybe blend the style you use now some more? Smudge maybe? Not sure how that would look...but worth a shot! maybe combine all the color layers at the end and just blend in the problem parts real quick?
Mew
It's the same style through out Temp, except the last 2, (tundara and conan), those were colored at full 100% opacity. The suggestions your talking about are for Photoshop, I am using Illustrator for these, these are actually vector drawings.
I use Painter for my other watercolor look, similar to the layering of light to dark, but Painter blends much better. I'm not going after a watercolor look per say... it's just these are drawn with a very thin line, that is thickened and emphasized by a thicker line, then those black areas are placed on the top layer, below it on 1 layer is all the color at 50% opacity.
It's just once you cross a section over another, the overlapped part becomes darker, so it is the same color in most areas, just several passes over the same spot. Much like a watercolor would do if you worked from light to dark, which is how these colors are laid down.
I'm not looking to combine coloring styles though. I already use Illustrator for all my inking and most of my drawing. But I guess what I'm asking is, if people like the way I color with it as well, I will offer this in addition to the Photoshop coloring. This style will of course be considerably cheaper... as it takes less time and effort for me to do.
Here's an example of the process: some eyes
The top left is the first pass of all the starting colors, the more I go over it, with different colors, the darker it gets... and this only took 10 minutes.
LJ
I think I've already said I like it, but I think it is better on some characters than others---for example, If I had a Golden Age character like Crime Hawk I think it would look really interesting, but for most SA or later designs until you reach the Modern Age (which is in many ways a call back to GA or Pulp style costumes) I wouldn't think it suitable. In terms of business I don't think one can offer too many options--especially if this is more of a bargain since it is a faster bit of work for you--and that this will appeal to many.
I hope that wasn't too confusing.
It's not a bad style, but I don't think it's quite "prime-time ready", yet. I think the thing that sticks out most in my mind is that you need to work a larger canvas, and take advantage of the opacity to build up more tonal variation by layering the strokes(and colors) further. As it stands, it's still looking very flat, and while simplicity is often a virtue in these loose-looking styles, I don't think it's quite working in this case and would benefit from a little more complexity.
There is something about it that I just can't put my finger on...while it is a different style, its just not sitting right in my brain.
I am sorry I cant be more specific since you are asking for feedback and opinion here.
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It's okay not to like it, I'm not looking for approval, in fact I'm looking to see what's good AND bad about this... while I can't convey any prices here, since to me this is a particular style someone will ask for over another, I plan to offer this at my lowest rate.
Su-Lin: I totally understand your input, but for me to spend that much time on it, would take away the spontaneity of these. The semi translucent look I think is what's best about these, it's NOT cell shading I know. The color isn't meant to be vibrant, also I found when I applied too much like the Mr. Majesty piece, it had an overworked feeling to me.
I will try one with more detail, but it won't be the same in the end. Still I'm curious to apply what you suggested, thanks for your advice.
Oh I think it looks fine, its just not a style I would choose I like my (commissioned) art to feel 'clean' and the bleed plus the type of shading with the non saturation make it feel unfinished to me
Not a probelm Kai, these look unfinished to me too... I don't think if they looked finished, that they would look like these... but that would change the one thing I do like about coloring this way. I use this mostly for studies, like the War Patriot piece. He liked the pose, and the color was enough to suggest the final...
Btw WP, I gots a trick up my sleeve for yours, a little thing I likes to call texture. I'll send you a new sketch as soon as I can...
LJ
Chiming in since you asked...
IMO, they look unfinished. That's fine if that's your intent, but I get the impression they're just a first pass towards a deeper treatment.
Also (and this is a highly technical nitpick), Photoshop doesn't simulate marker very well - even through light applications of color overlayed. If you want to try to capture the marker feel, I'd recommend using Painter since their many brushes are specifically made to replicate drawing medums.
Thanks for chiming in Doug, and hey feel free anytime, it's like finding a pearl in my soup! Okay well maybe not that gross. But I wouldn't know where to begin... Painter has always been an enigma to me, I only this year got it to work without stalling (more RAM) and finally got to a watercolor style with I enjoy.
The other thing is, I think I've forgotten how to draw with markers it's been so long. So any tutes or suggestions with that style would be a dream come true.
As for unfinished, yup, it's intentional... I think if I wanted finished for me that is, I wouldn't even attempt this style. But I appreciate those who enjoy what little charms it may offer. Eye of the beholder thing...
Thanks again for your input, btw how are we doing on those adoption papers, can I come home yet?
LJ
Okay last I'll say on it, I made a folder gallery for them on my DA account. You can see the stages of evolution in this style, if any... okay look really close, okay hire a midget with a magnifying glass...
I was thinking though, what if I splapped the color on first, then drew black line over it... Someone wanna be my guinea pig? First one gets the worm, uh art worm.
LJ
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Not exactly COH, and the chest piece is bare for a reason on the first example... however that's not why I'm posting this. Was wondering what you guys think of this new coloring style in addition to my older styles, which I'll still be using.
Just recently I was happy to get a request for this look, and I thought should I add this to my list of offers, I mean would anyone order this if I did... you don't have to physically order one, just asking if it appealed enough to be order worthy.
Anyway here are some examples in order of creation:
Plasmastream
Redwing Blackbird
The Gypsy
Mr. Majesty 2007
War Patriot
US Atom
Patriette
Conan vs Cobra Commander
Lady Jade
Gamma Girl
Tundara
I should further explain, that these are pretty fast to do, about 2 hours well for the top one. The reason being is that they are drawn, inked, and colored digitally in just one program (Illustrator).
As suppose to doing a pencil sketch, scanning it, inking it in Illustrator and coloring it in Photoshop... That's the way I usually work, but sometimes I try this look as a preliminary coloring to a finish inked drawing.
Well that's alls I gots to say about it, except, thanks for looking too!
LJ
EDIT: add some more pieces that I forgot I did...
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I likes a lot, different take and a different style. Also, consider this... Would it be possible for you to use water color as an element for an overall piece? Like use the watercolors for the background and the digitized or pen and ink the main element/component? 
Um yeah I could but that would defeat the purpose of this... If I was using watercolors, I'd just stick to their traditional properties and full on paint everything with it. I WILL be offering that soon, probably after December. Look out for BAS Christmas gift!
Hey LJ!
I see what you're trying to do with the style. If you're trying to do marker, watercolor, either any/all... Just remember that the shape of what color you set down should describe the form or mass.
I think one of the problems on the Plasmastream piece (while drawing is very nicely done) is that the color application looks a lil sloppy in comparison with how you handle your other pieces.
Try this:
Under brushes, try turning on minimum diameter to about 25-35% so that you get some nice pressure sensitivity. I've also found a lot of fun out of playing with the shape dynamics on the brushes and angling them, it should give you some fun results with this kind of style.
The other thing you is set another layer on top of your flat colors (no, your color's aren't flat, I meant the first layer of color XD) to do a universal shadow in say, a rich purple then play with the opacity of the layer and layer types. You'll find a lot of ways to get the same look, but a lot faster
LJ, This is a really fun style for what you seem to be using it for. Drafting and getting a free hand feel for your characters. Or Just something quick when your in that giving away mood. I'm not so sure it's a "Marker" feel but it's definatly something that id different. I know I was really impressed with the US Atom and Plasma Stream Mock ups that you did. If you did it with layers and then went back and cut your lines layer out so it looks more like a strait watercolor painting would be a truely unique effect. again just my thinking though.
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These seem to be much quicker to do - sort of like convention sketches. Interesting style....looking forward to more.
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OOooo those are digital? They look great!
Your faces have really improved by leaps and bounds since you started posting! I'm very impressed! 
[ QUOTE ]
Try this:
Under brushes, try turning on minimum diameter to about 25-35% so that you get some nice pressure sensitivity. I've also found a lot of fun out of playing with the shape dynamics on the brushes and angling them, it should give you some fun results with this kind of style.
The other thing you is set another layer on top of your flat colors (no, your color's aren't flat, I meant the first layer of color XD) to do a universal shadow in say, a rich purple then play with the opacity of the layer and layer types. You'll find a lot of ways to get the same look, but a lot faster
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As far as I know I can't set brush diameters in Illustrator, I can create or adjust the size from 100% on down, but this only serves to make the line proportionally smaller, as a drawing element. As a coloring element, there are 2 ways to use the color, either the sloppy way you see, hoping the brush ends inside your black line edges. or to mimic the shape of what you are coloring with the pen tool creating a closed shaped.
Something I hate to do in Illustrator, because coloring in closed shapes just seems alien to me. I can do it, but it's worse than flatting. Also the purple layer you describe adds a nice airy quality when the opacity of it is under 50%, but the reverse action of raising it to say 85% only creates too opaque a shape of color, that covers all the hard work you did before making this layer.
Forgive me for saying so, but I don't think you understand the program. I can do marker flat, and soft cell shading in Photoshop, as well as in Painter, though I'd prefer not to there.
Here's my TEST SHEET of these different looks:
The upper left is all Illustrator CS2, where the original line drawing was done in 5 minutes, then very minimal 50% opacity color is placed on a layer underneath the black line.
The upper right is Photoshop CS3, the linework is set to multiply, the colors are flatted, then the highlights and darks are rendered in. I also added your purple layer for effect...
The lower left is Painter X, the color is set above the linework, and I used digital watercolor layers, about 3 to increase the darkness of the same light colors, a pseudo light to dark approach. I also added a grey overtone layer, and used a glow and neon pen brush for the bright areas.
The last, lower right is an amalgamation of brushes in Painter X, trying to just go for a metallic feel.
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But here's the thing Photoshop takes the longest, the Watercolor Painter effect isnt bad, but much longer than just trying to make it look metallic in Painter. And while I know the Illustrator is very unfinished, I like the look and it's simplicity, and it was the fastest to do.
I purposefully put less color, yes I could have spent more time on it, but it would cease to look like that, and instead be muddy.
Ah no, the brush stuff was for Photoshop, not Illustrator, my bad for not clarifying.
Hmm and yes you should be able to set brush diameter foo... just differently. I'll get back to you on that. So the Plasmastream piece on the other thread was entirely CS2?
I dig the examples LJ. Painter can be fast, if you know how to set up, but the setup takes forever. I did a whole semester of life drawing in Painter, it took us at least 45 minutes to get our palettes set up, and our brushes adjusted. But after that it was pretty darn fast. I like it more for oil type painting.
Not exactly COH, and the chest piece is bare for a reason on the first example... however that's not why I'm posting this. Was wondering what you guys think of this new coloring style in addition to my older styles, which I'll still be using.
Just recently I was happy to get a request for this look, and I thought should I add this to my list of offers, I mean would anyone order this if I did... you don't have to physically order one, just asking if it appealed enough to be order worthy.
Anyway here are some examples in order of creation:
Plasmastream
Redwing Blackbird
The Gypsy
Mr. Majesty 2007
War Patriot
US Atom
Patriette
Conan vs Cobra Commander
Lady Jade
Gamma Girl
Tundara
I should further explain, that these are pretty fast to do, about 2 hours well for the top one. The reason being is that they are drawn, inked, and colored digitally in just one program (Illustrator).
As suppose to doing a pencil sketch, scanning it, inking it in Illustrator and coloring it in Photoshop... That's the way I usually work, but sometimes I try this look as a preliminary coloring to a finish inked drawing.
Well that's alls I gots to say about it, except, thanks for looking too!
LJ
EDIT: add some more pieces that I forgot I did...