The past updates and the future
By
AdLybOne,
Posted on: 2005-01-19 14:57 in CoH and CoV General Discussions
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Naturally, there are some who will criticize when we don't adhere to even that rough guess.
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True, but I bet they're not software developers.
WK
(ex software developer)
I'll give you an example. I'm a programmer in VFP. I just set a fairly large and significant new aspect of our system into a live test environment at work. It took me a fair few weeks to finish it, test it, re-finish it, re-test it and so on before i was ready to unleash it. I made it available on the 12th of January...Today i'm currently making the finishing touches to the complete overhaul of the logic routes of this new mod, and it's about 3 times more complex than it was originally!
Some things just don't go to plan, one small oversight can lead to a very large dilema and a huge delay in implementation. I can completely sympathise 
thankfully i'm only currently a week overdue. Software is VERY rarely finished on time or within budget, There just so much that cant be comepletely accounted for. The largest software development project in existance, Microsoft Windows has never finished on time or under budget, ever. And every version has been released with countless bugs and critical holes. It happens, we just have to be patient unfortunatly
Originally posted by Statesman:
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Turn that frown upside-down, little fella. 
Oh definately any development can be a fickle thing especially if a great idea on paper doesn't turn out well in testing internally.
I do have one bold question about the skills system if you can or dare to make a few comments on. Originally it was slated for Issue 2 according to CGW but was pushed back and we hoped Issue 3 but now it sounds like Issue 5. I'm just curious to some of the hurdles you are coming across in either development or balancing that is pushing this system back. Will we ever get perhaps a longer teaser giving a more wider scope of what to expect with the skills system and PGCU (the university that was rumored)? Any more info you could give on this would be wonderful.
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Naturally, there are some who will criticize when we don't adhere to even that rough guess.
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ZOMG STATESMAN!11 HOW DAR YOU NOT BE ABLE TO PREDICT TEH FUTARE!!1one TEH DEVS NO EVERYTIHNG!!!
</sarcasm>
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CGW jumped the gun. The Skills system was first mentioned as being in development around the release of I2. The first possible release window for it was I3. Considering past promotion of major features in the forum, it was only a mild surprise that Skills isn't in I4. There's been bupkus on it since late Summer.
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Thus, I try to give general guestimates (though never exact dates). I like to communicate as much as I can with the forums about the status of different issues. Sometimes I do well, sometimes I don't - but I do try.
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Even though I admit to frustration when discussed additions to the game do not materialize or get delayed, I thank you for your continued openess on your teams' plans for the game. Your constant interaction with the community should serve as a model for other companies to steal...errr... emulate.
Now, get back to work on the Arena and don't get the big head. 
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It's a "damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario"...
Some people would like to know what we're working on, even without dates.
Thus, I try to give general guestimates (though never exact dates). I like to communicate as much as I can with the forums about the status of different issues. Sometimes I do well, sometimes I don't - but I do try.
I NEVER give specific dates on anything because game development is a fickle thing. I do try to give at least an Issue #, because that provides a ballpark estimate for you guys.
Naturally, there are some who will criticize when we don't adhere to even that rough guess.
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In a perfect world.... People would FIND something to complain about :P
"You're the sun and the moon to me..."
My Antiquated Earth/Storm Controller Guide!
@KokopelliJoe
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Sorry, just remembered an old Statesman post and I figured I'd get the speculation train rolling.
Remember when he said this?
Now, I was ready to bet my soul that it would be 1. Arena and 2. Skills.
Now we know skills will NOT be in Update 4, so then, what was the other thing?
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We know for a fact that PVP will be in Issue 4
And from and inteview from JIVE, it seems like the other one is...
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Statesman,
I have been hounded to no end by the Icon tailors regarding my out-of-date fashions, but they seem to never have anything new on their shelves. So I was wondering if the great Statesman could shed any light on the apparent shortage of new and hip fashion in Paragon City. Can we expect to see a veritable flood of new and unique costume options in the near future?
Thanks a ton.
- Spider Solitair, Level 46, Server Unknown
Dear Spider -
Im proud to announce theres a whole new line up of costume options coming in the game's next expansion. That way you can have a costume to meet any crime-busting occasion, while doing it in style!
- Statesman
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More costume options!
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I NEVER give specific dates on anything because game development is a fickle thing. I do try to give at least an Issue #, because that provides a ballpark estimate for you guys.
Naturally, there are some who will criticize when we don't adhere to even that rough guess.
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Being a programmer myself, I can understand all too well how a SMOP (Small Matter Of Programming) can suddenly reveal itself to require a major rewrite. Of course, that goes both ways, in that I also look at a change and see that it should only require a tiny tweak to the code, without realizing that the 'tiny tweak' depends on the data structures for the program being set up in the way that _I_ would code them, without knowing how the program actually stores data.
"But in our enthusiasm, we could not resist a radical overhaul of the system, in which all of its major weaknesses have been exposed, analyzed, and replaced with new weaknesses."
-- Bruce Leverett, Register Allocation in Optimizing Compilers
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So in short, could you do us a favor and differentiate between things that are guesses and things that are not when you're posting? I think that most of us like to know what you're working on, even without dates. Just let us know what is set and what isn't.
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No problem. From here on every single thing I mention is just a rough guess. My discussion of features and their potential release are, at best, internal goals.
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Fair enough. I appreciate the time you take to respond to us on here, and I know that you don't even have to do this. It must be hard having thousands of people hanging on your every word all the time.
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So in short, could you do us a favor and differentiate between things that are guesses and things that are not when you're posting? I think that most of us like to know what you're working on, even without dates. Just let us know what is set and what isn't.
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No problem. From here on every single thing I mention is just a rough guess. My discussion of features and their potential release are, at best, internal goals.
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talking to a store manager at EB he told me not many companies release large titles at the same time.NC Soft is releasing guild war could this be the reason city of vilians is delayed so as not to compete against another title?
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talking to a store manager at EB he told me not many companies release large titles at the same time.NC Soft is releasing guild war could this be the reason city of vilians is delayed so as not to compete against another title?
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CoV is not delayed at all. It has never had a set release date.
This thread was original discussing features that were supposedly planned for Updates 2 and 3, and have been pushed back to 4 and beyond.
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No problem. From here on every single thing I mention is just a rough guess.
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Ya know, I guessed he'd say that.
I work for Pitney Bowes in QA/System test. We won't let software out the door without first laying out the test coverage and potential issues with any gaps in the test effort due to time constraints. It is up to the management team to decide if (no joke) risk = reward. There have been cases where entire features were pulled out due to no confidence for commercial release. I understand the delays. I have not gained anything from either issue 1, 2, OR 3 since I always seemed to level past the new stuff (or be well under level 50). The stuff that I got out of the updates were the general "quality of life" items:
Tanker changes - I LOVE these
Scrapper changes - Criticals are, well, critical
Mission changes - Not going to one of the same 5 abandoned office buildings is KEY - even if there are only visual changes
Monsters - Can you say Devilfish badge anyone?
The arena holds nothing for me. Sure I might go toe to toe with one of my buddies just for kicks, but I would rather have the skill system. The thing to remember is that the arena fills a player nitch. For this group, it is all important. The same can be said about the skills system. There will be plenty of people who never use either.
However, with CoV looming on the horizon, the arena can play a great use for the devs. I would expect many, many changes to pvp arena action once it goes live. The amount of AT vs AT data they can get from this will be very useful for CoV.
I understand the decisions made. I don't like them, but hey, I don't work on the project. I am simply hoping that this issue will have something everyone can use. New powersets for example. Or perhaps a new EAT that doesn't require a level 50 character, or completing all TF missions. I want something I can use. Not complaining mind you, just throwing in my 2 cents.
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Yes, you can. Software is organic, not linear, it isn't as straightforward as building a house. You can't set hard deadlines, because you can't deliver hard deadlines.
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Never worked in the building industry as a project manager I'm assuming. Its just as tough as software. Go to a developer and buy a house from them. Choose your floorplan and general lot area, see how high the odds are that you'll get your house on time. LOL!! developers suck!!
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Ever see this joke:
Dear Mr. Architect
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It's a "damned if you do, damned if you don't scenario"...
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Well States, whether you get the timeline right or not, I think the majority of us still appreciate the ammount of communication you and the other Dev's commit to on these forums. It's a real comfort to the playerbase that you listen to us and try let us know when things are "in the pipe."
You can't please all the players all the time... sadly, you'll always be criticised by someone. Still, know that most of us appreciate any little morsel of news that we get from you and the rest of the staff at Cryptic.
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"If it should be banned, so should the #2 pencil, the Lego block, modeling clay, and anything else that gives form to ideas. In Marvel's view of the world, if people play online games with super heroes, they may play only with licensed Marvel characters, and imagination be damned."
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The term Super hero is a licensed copyright of Marvel and DC entertainment. You will no doubt be hearing from their lawyers.
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You can't please everyone, so lets concentrate on me.
I am others would like to hear from a Dev or Statesman on whats their goals for update 4....Content wise...
Nice post. It's right on.
I also want to say I really appriciate Statesmen assuming the community can handle the extra information he gives out. I love to hear what the development team is working on. It's also great knowing that we get to give feedback that is actually listened to and reviewed.
I also agree that the arena is something that's not important to me. I'd rather see the skill system implemented first instead. Having said that, I do agree that getting the arena out the door will help make CoV a much better game.
On a side note, I feel bad for QA people. It may be the one job that is more stressfull and tedious than helpdesk. Regression testing is a nightmare.
You are correct sir. I have very few posts, but I read the boards quite often. It is obvious that you cannot satisfy everyone, so continue to do what you are doing. You could implement changes that everyone on the boards wants, and you would still have people complaining. I think you guys are doing an awesome job with this game! I enjoy the challenges that each issue brings, and look forward to future releases.
Scrapper Slotting Basics
Brute Slotting Basics
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Yes, you can. Software is organic, not linear, it isn't as straightforward as building a house. You can't set hard deadlines, because you can't deliver hard deadlines.
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Never worked in the building industry as a project manager I'm assuming. Its just as tough as software. Go to a developer and buy a house from them. Choose your floorplan and general lot area, see how high the odds are that you'll get your house on time. LOL!! developers suck!!