How to Lead a Team


Altoholic_Monkey

 

Posted

Thanks for all the comments. While playing today it occurred to me; expect the first few battles with a new team to go poorly. Especially at low levels. It takes some time to get adjusted to your team, everyone has to learn how one another's powers work. At higher levels you have a bit more flexibility to adapt to a situation (and people know how most of the powers work), but at low levels you can't really do that. Today I had 2 people in my group die in the first encounter. Second encounter we had a couple close calls. After that noone went below 50% health. So don't get frustrated after just one try.


 

Posted

Great post, with a lot of good info.

I wanted to point out something I've noticed playing my blaster, however. Assist isn't as important as it was in EQ. Most minions, especially yellow or below, die with just a few attacks. So if it's a big mob of minions your group is taking down, assisting somebody is going to WAY overkill the poor mobs. I try to pick out of the way mobs that I know other's aren't attacking because they're out of line of sight or whatever, and get them. Yes, overkill is expected, but shouldn't be encouraged by insisting on Assist.

On the other hand, it is invaluable when taking down those big bosses, especially when there are more than one. It's inefficient when your team is split up, attacking 2 or more at the same time. Drop one quick so he stops hurting your team.

Ok, just my 2 cents.

Gnarly


 

Posted

Very good point, Gnarly. I'm a young-adult tank (lvl 21), and get plagued with overkill quite frequently... since I can't change targets and attack them as quickly as everyone else can (no range, sprint off so I can save end), I typically keep the big damage-dealing mobs (bosses, Lt's) occupied to keep the majority of the damage off the team. A good tanker will ignore the urge to be "everywhere at once" and take his beating like a man, and a bad tanker will hop from minion to minion and complain about the blasters getting credit for the kill. I don't know how many times I've been playing my blaster and watched the tank hop around and fight the minions while the boss walked to each one of us and flung us around like rag dolls.

Once the minions are dealt with, then the team can converge on the tougher mobs that the tanker couldn't take out because of his medium damage ability. Even if a tanker isn't able to do much damage to a boss or archvillian, he should have enough accuracy enhancements on his taunts (a good one will have 2 taunt powers before lvl 20, single target and AE) to keep the attention of any mob up to 5 levels his senior.

Do that at the very least, and there won't be a group unhappy with the way you play... well, won't be as many at least.


 

Posted

Good points. Assist is useful mainly when fighting those orange and higher, especially bosses or higher level lieutenants. There are two reasons to assist though. The obvious one is that you drop the target quicker, but the equally important one is that it prevents blasters from accumulating too much aggro. Usually its smart to have blasters assisting a tank since the tank will almost always generate more aggro than the blaster. I learned (very painfully), however, that scrappers are a very poor substitute in this respect. Teaming with a scrapper, he was unable to out-aggro my storm defender. Generally, if your team is killing quickly, don't bother assisting, but if you're having a really rough time, assist can really help things move along a little faster (and safer).

I'll have to put out the 1.1 manual soon at this rate.


 

Posted

There is one thing that I have always had an issue with in the leadership column, and that is that when you become the default leader simply because you are next in line. I don't mind being a leader, and when I create a group myself, I am fully prepared to fill the role and act accordingly, but some days I really just like to be the 'little scrapper that could' and follow the team to the next group of baddies.

This happened to me last night and I asked the group if someone else would please lead or at least take point, because I was kind of tired and really just trying to level up (we all have those days) which is not to say that I wasn't willing to support my team, I just didn't want the job of conning everything and typing out long decisions (when I am tired my typing starts to look like me was Englished very goodly if you know what I mean).

Anyway, long story short, yes I led, and we had no deaths, but there was no joy in it.

My long and drawn out point is, If you want to be a leader and you are in a group suggest that you would like to take the role for a try, I guarantee that unless you are completely spastic someone will give you the oppurtunity to prove your mettle.


 

Posted

Aw, come on people!

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Also, the person has friends, so the likelyhood they are a well adjusted human is better.

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That was PURE GOLD! LOL


 

Posted

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I love my blasters, but your most powerful AoE isn't going to drop big groups of even-con mobs fast enough for all of them NOT to at least get a shot or two off at you before a

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Not true all the time actually. 30+ can definitely take out group of whites instantly before they can respond. Yellows a couple will get to counter but not all. Oranges get a full round of ranged before they all die. Group of reds the blaster on average (depends on the mob) needs a good targeted heal after the inital barrage or they'll die in the second wave of attacks however with the heal they can kill the remaining mobs next wave if they are patched up. Its high hp (or resistant) reds and purple that it's an issue.

Mind you only some ARs and Fire have the aoe's to do this sort of thing with. You have to craft the tactics around what kind of blaster you have, not all blasters play the same. While damage doing is their role and purpose in life how they do it varies just like defender's vary in how they help the group.


 

Posted

Excellent post for sure, just want to highlight a few ideas as well:

1) You hit it right on the head about being patient with some close calls/deaths right off the bat, I have been in MANY teams since mid-beta and have had that happen many times to move on and find the group do so awesome at the end of the night everyone is saying "Sweet job! What a great group!" forgetting that we looked pretty sad the first couple tries. So be patient and be brave! We're heroes remember!

2) I like to lead a lot just because I'm an impatient person in RL and found that many ppl also just want to get some good 'ol exp and action and not always terribly interested in hearing about how someone's day went. So I find that if I'm not sure who's mission is best to do next, if I can JUST KEEP THE GROUP MOVING, we do much better as a whole. So just keep everyone focused and most will be happy.

Anyway, have fun!


 

Posted

Since this is now listed in the guide to guides, I'll update it soon, but I wanted to say for now that /findmember appears to no longer work. However, the addition of the /makeleader command is a huge help.


 

Posted

Valdis, I posted a guide to the new team seek window a few days ago, and I too mentioned my displeasure at /findmember going error.

Luckily, a helpful fellow hero quickly jumped in to tell me that /search is the new command.


 

Posted

Great guide! I was going to write one on this same subject myself, but you have done a better job than I could have. I would like to mention a few things that have helped me in the past while leading teams though -

1 - I cant stress enough the importance of recruiting a balanced team. I try to recruit within two levels of myself up or down. I also attempt to find one of each archetype. This may not be completely necesary, but it has never hurt me. Besides I feel bad for Tanks, so I like to make sure I always have at least one.

2 - If you find that you are leading teams more than you are joining, then I would suggest rolling up a toon for the sole purpose of leading. I rolled up a Kin/Rad Defender. Not only am I a buff machine, but everytime I hit with a RAD power, I'm taking down an enemy's defense. Add leadership abilities to this and you are going to be a huge asset to your team.

3 - Keep moving! Not only should you have a plan before you begin recruiting, you have got to keep your team moving. I personaly feel as if it is easier to keep a team moving if you are just hunting instead of doing door missions, but thats just my personal taste. The main reason to keep a team moving though is so that it stays together. Once your team is split up or standing still it will quickly begin to dissolve.


 

Posted

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3 - Keep moving! Not only should you have a plan before you begin recruiting, you have got to keep your team moving. I personaly feel as if it is easier to keep a team moving if you are just hunting instead of doing door missions, but thats just my personal taste. The main reason to keep a team moving though is so that it stays together. Once your team is split up or standing still it will quickly begin to dissolve.

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Isn't that they trueth, the ever popular "I gotta go" bug will begin to spread.. and it spreads faster than ebola.


Very nice thread here.. I wish more people would read it and follow it.. I my self and an order junkie (order as in no chaos). There are some good ideas here.


 

Posted

The thread is old but remains true. Rule/game changes don't change the fundamentals of leadership.

I enjoy being the leader, and it's easiest to do it as the tanker. By managing aggro and leading into battle, you can seamlessly merge "team" leadership with "tactical" leadership. My Stone/SS tanker is great fun and since I'm not always spamming attacks/buffs/etc. I'm usually able to "quarterback" the team.

Leading takes a light touch. I find a sense of humor goes a long way, especially when times are tough. Success is also good for the team. I've changed missions for the team simply to get some "wins" under our belt and learn how we operate, even if the mission was not optimal xp-wise. Once you've succeeded together, the tough times are easier.

RE: playcalling, I try to limit it to picking which group of mobs to go after or identifying specific targets (quantums, etc.). There's a fine line between good playcalling and bossing around your team.

Tanking as the leader has the added bonus of being the "fulcrum" of the group ... and so the defenders will pay attention to your health bar. I'm amazed at how well they keep me "topped off" when I'm leader.

As far as team composition, my ideal team of 8 would be:

Me -- Tanker
Scrapper or Blapper
Empathy Defender
Kinetic Defender
Force Field Defender
Controller (any)
Blaster/Kheldian
Blaster/Kheldian

That team is defender heavy, but with all the buffs, aggro management and holds the blasters/khelds will be in heaven. Having both FF and Empathy allows the defenders to be more offensive during play.

I find two tankers to be unnecessary -- the team would be better off with a different AT.


 

Posted

Old but good thread. I have lead many teams, some of them have been bad, some of them have been much worse, but many have been great.

Here are some tips:
1. Team should have fun. This is not army, you are not general. Sometimes big chaotic fight is good for team spirit.

2. Learn patience, stay calm, be fair, be merciful, stay logical and stay firm. Leading MMORPG team is one of most stressful things that you can do. You have allkind immature kids, morons, power players, casual players, geeks, sexy females, drooling guys and people playing from diffent kind countries and cultures, mixed to chaotic team that is trying to have fun.

3. Communicate. Discuss, tell jokes and plan what is team going to do next.

4. When team is about to starting its first mission or new player has joined to team, go through rules/guidelines:
- No scouting, unless asked. There is definately need for scouting in some missions, but scout who is running around 3 floor when team is fighting in first floor is not helpful.
- If there is tanker, then he is allways going frontman and others are following. If there is no tank, then the team leader assigns frontman.
- Frontman decides which group to attack first and what is tactic: charge, pull or herding.
- When groups are packed, one group is pulled nearer to team. Team should avoid contact with other groups.
- All players should avoid extra agro from other groups, when team is fighting against another group.
- Players that are misbehaving, arguing and/or constantantly breaking of rules are kicked out from team after warning or instantly. If two players argue with each other, then both are kicked out from team.

5. If someone is breaking rules, explain rules again and give them warning. Sending private tells for bad players is also pretty effective. However, there are also situations when you should forgive mistakes (we are humans after all - and we should have fun). There are also extreme situations when you need to kick players out from your team without warning. You are dictator in your team - break your own rules when needed. It is YOUR team.

6. KICK players. Learn to use kick - don't afraid to kick bad players from your team. It is your responsibility to kick bad players.

7. Don't create full 8 player blaster/scrapper teams. They need at least 2-3 defender/controller. Smaller size teams 2-4 are normally allways working. Use sidekicks, but remember that hazard zones have level requirements. Also try avoid teams where all potential mentors have sidekick (when mentor leaves, your team is forced to stop, because you need to find new mentor).

8. Try to find instantly or just after missions, replacements for players who have been kicked or left.

9. Keep team running. Don't wait forever some player who is in another zone. Most of players don't have patience to stand outside missions and do nothing. Maximize time used in action, minimize time used to travelling, waiting and planning.

10. Don't select too hard missions. They are either too slow or your team is dying too many times. Normally best missions are 3 levels above your team average level. Start from easy missions and move toward harder missions, if they are too easy.


 

Posted

One thing I've noticed that often needs to be explained at lower levels is what a void/quantum is and why they should be taken out first. Of course this is only really applicable when there's a PB or WS on the team, but they do considerable hurt to other ATs also.

Many new players are unaware of what quantums/voids are and how much they can damage a PB or a WS.


 

Posted

Never forget the all-important
"Don't be a dumbace" clause.
That one gets lots of people.


"It's your money or your life madam. Oh wait! Today's Thursday! It's both."

 

Posted

I would also like to add that it is OK for the leader to relenquish his role (temporarily or permanently) if the situation calls for it. If someone is more comfortable leading a group and you see that, take queues from them.

Also it is important for all leaders to understand that there are no bad ideas (when communicating to team members) only other ideas. If a (insert AT) asks "hey why don't i fireball the ruin mage?" Don't just say how bad their idea is, suggest an alternative instead.

With that said... keep plans simple. Complex plans that involve pincer manuevers and a bombing run, while circling the target group won't do anything but encourage everyone to spread out.

(Just to note... I've been on teams where plans like this were suggested and the team actually tried to do it. Boy were we all dead when everything was aggro'd.)


 

Posted

There are shorter shortcuts commands:

/search -- brings up the search window/find window (anyone a team can use the /search command to find other teammates.

/i playername -- invites someone to a team




 

Posted

[ QUOTE ]
One thing I've noticed that often needs to be explained at lower levels is what a void/quantum is and why they should be taken out first. Of course this is only really applicable when there's a PB or WS on the team, but they do considerable hurt to other ATs also.

Many new players are unaware of what quantums/voids are and how much they can damage a PB or a WS.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well then, this is definitely the place to explain that.


 

Posted

I tend to disagree with the people who don't allow leveling between missions. Granted, it delays the start of the next mission depending on how far they have to go and how fast they travel (if you need to leave the zone to level up, don't do it!) There is usually someone in the group who can TP them back. Picking up a new power it is often worth it. At odd levels, where you just get slots, definitely wait until Yoko breaks up the band. In rare (and wonderful) occasions, you're on a great team and level up twice. Is it really so unreasonable to let them take care of business and hurry back?

As for leader ettiquette, my pet peeve is the leader who passes you the star, tells you to find people and then demands the star back after you do the dirty work. I usually only stick with them for one mission unless the rest of the team works well [the team I recruited lol]. I think it's perfectly reasonable to ask people to check their friends list or SG partners for recruits, but the leader should ultimately take responsibility for filling out the team.


 

Posted

<tl-dr-qr>

How extremely onesided this guide is....


 

Posted

How so? It looks like a list of things to do and not do, which seems fairly balanced. Depending on your style some of the advice will work well and some should be disregarded.


 

Posted



[/ QUOTE ] I think one thing should be added to the list of leading a team. If someone does not have their "Seek Team" toggled, DO NOT invite them to be on a team without asking. Nothing aggro's me more than to be bombarded with invites when i was trying to solo. Not everyone wants to be on a team all the time.

Just my $.02

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More people do not toggle there “seek team” on when they would not mind a team. That is why they have a NOT seeking team were your name is red name. I have picked up some of my best PUG’s by just doing what I wanted and they saying what the heck I will join you.
If I am busy a nice response back saying not interested now but maybe later have a good day goes to good relations with toons later. If my name is Red I don’t get any responces since they can not invite me.



[/ QUOTE ] 1 - I cant stress enough the importance of recruiting a balanced team. I try to recruit within two levels of myself up or down. I also attempt to find one of each archetype. This may not be completely necesary, but it has never hurt me. Besides I feel bad for Tanks, so I like to make sure I always have at least one.

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You can not always have a balanced team in an ideal world yes that is what you want. A good leader is forgiving of team mistakes. Analysis’s the situation and makes tactical adjustments in how we are going to tackle this mission.

I also like to look at each individual build…
MOBS will react different to a fire tank then how they will react to stone and an inv
FF, Dark, Kin, and Emp are all different play styles
Fire Blasters play different then Ice Blaster.

Know the Mobs you are fighting.
Freaks bunch well…
COT uses lots of holds a /dark scrapper can tank them well because of there natural negative energy defense.
Nemisis snipers don’t pull well.
Council war wolves hit squishes really really hard
Ect.




Know your terrain
What can you use to break LOS
Approaching Spawns from over here give’s me this advantage
What direction are the mobs facing, what mobs are intertwined agro and which is separate.

See how your team plays after the first wipe figure out what caused that was it a wayward blaster, a tank that couldn’t hold agro or take that agro (I.E. no defensive toggles on)
Does the troller lay down there AOE before battle. People don’t always know certain game mechanics. (to be honest I don’t think I know all the game mechanics at times.)

If you can work through it let it ride but if it is an extreme detriment let them know what is happening on the team have them make some team adjustments.

An assessment is needed after the addition and subtraction of each player.
Simple commands can work
Target through me --- pulling
All behind *****
Ect ect…

Well not tank so agro management will be difficult might have to ensure mass hypnotis is up to pose pone the alpha strike. Only blasters available better make sure I can buff there defense some. Well we are going to have to pull this because the level is too high for this PUG (next mission I will lower it some.) Dang no healers/buffers/debuffers available out there going to have to wait between groups a little

A good leader can make a bad pug into a survivable one. (might be slow and painful)

All else fails grab one of the 50’s exemp down and assist in steam rolling through the mish.

There is so many more things I could go on. These are just some of things that go through my head.


Triumph
Gavalin Kingsbury LVL 50 INV/SS Tank and 26 other LVL 50 heroes and villians (all Triumph)
Heroes of Justice and Liberty/Loved or Loathed
"NCSOFT doesn't fork for anyone but they might spoon you if they like you"

 

Posted

a few issues with this guide (which lies).

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You need meleers. Two scrappers work well, or a single tank. If you can't find meleers you'll need 3-4 controllers/defenders to keep the enemies debuffed and held.

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eh! wrong!

you dont need a tank or a scrapper and they are problematic if you only have one in a fully ranged team. a well well buffed defender can absorb the alpha easily, and a good troller can completely eliminate it.

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- You need one blaster or two scrappers at least. Ever seen a team of 6 without any damage dealers? Too slow, the controllers could probably solo faster.

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eh! wrong!
a team of 6 rads without any damage dealers will eat through any spawn faster than 6 blasters.
same applies to sonics, darks, TAs and kins (as long as there's kin trollers involved).

[ QUOTE ]

- Multiples are not good in some cases. Two of the same blaster, scrapper, or tank is ok. Two of the same controller or defender is less so. Having two different controllers or defenders is much more powerful than two of the same kind. Its really a huge difference.

[/ QUOTE ]

eh! wrong!
"damage dealers" are not force multipliers. you wanna have a numbers fight with me?




just because of these stupid comments, i completely disapprove of your guide.

and a good day to ya!


 

Posted

Team make up is only a small part of being a leader.
It is how you run your tactics with the team you got. How the personalities mesh and play styles mesh.

Defender/controller debuff/buffs stack
Double SB/Double FS
2 TB's running
12 imps killing the board (might be bad. When good pets go wild.)

To say I can not have another tank because I have 3 of them already is crazy talk about crazy damage mitigation. blasters, scrappers, trollers, and defenders have no problem doing there jobs.

ohh I have a Rad can't get another one. ohh don't want double bubbles my blasters might hate that.

ohh have 4 scrappers have to find a kin or emp can't get me a TA or FF.

I am on a team of blasters a kin is useless.

These are all myths.

Been on many teams that look like dang how do they complete missions nothing matches to many blasters, not enough healing/buffing. No agro management. We have steam rolled through missions.

Been on team that are "optimized" and got wiped because someone doesn't want to help, or only thinks there job is a little part of what they can do. Or they don't even do there part a blaster who sits and watches the battle.

Someone who says I have a PVP tank so I don't hold agro and I don't care if the team dies I won't.

This is what makes bad teams the players who play the toons not so much the toon make up. 70% Player 30% team make up.

Now this is a moot point when on a team of 6-8 is fight spawns on INV and the person taking the missions is +5 levels higher then the next level. Unless that toon can solo that mish Make up will not matter. No matter how good a player you are you are going to get squished everytime a small mistake happens.

Someone who can analyze the situation, see who is on my team, know who you are fighting, and what tactics need to change because of the map can lead a team effectively.

A 9 year old can run a team that is an "optimized" team, we let my friends 9 year old do it too. (was an all SG been playing with each other for 6 months.) But he was calling the shots. Did what he wanted, pull or rush ect.


Triumph
Gavalin Kingsbury LVL 50 INV/SS Tank and 26 other LVL 50 heroes and villians (all Triumph)
Heroes of Justice and Liberty/Loved or Loathed
"NCSOFT doesn't fork for anyone but they might spoon you if they like you"