Venture

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  1. Quote:
    You guessing he has the most powerful chin ever seen?
    Only because behind Chuck Norris' beard there is no...eh, you've heard that one.
  2. Quote:
    Well, then. That just means CoH is effectively simulating bad super powered comic books.
    Fixed.
  3. Quote:
    The entire WWD storyline is built from the history of the game, including the comics and novels - it's one of the most lore-heavy arcs in the game, and it's shaped by the 7 years of content that came before it.
    The problem is that it was shaped by the worst of the seven years of content that came before it. It's also practically a Random Events Plot with a godmoding Villain Sue. Statesman's death is supposed to be the big thing here despite the fact that he is not a character in the story; he only shows up to die.

    The DA material is garbage, too. It's pretty much a blatant haircut of Blackest Night (which wasn't the most original thing in the world to begin with). It's got a gratuitous side trip to Not-So-Ancient Rome thrown in, because time travel is k3w1 or something. And not only does it fridge the Knives of Artemis, but does so by turning the faction into an expansion pack for a Praetorian faction of dubious merit. The "Knives of Vengeance" compound the sin by resembling nothing more than a novice MA architect's first attempt at custom mobs: their costumes are an explosion in a junk factory and their powers are a random collection of new shiny powersets.
  4. Really, the lore for the Incarnate system is so horribad I haven't even bothered to keep up on the Prometheus updates. It reads like something my friends and I would have been ashamed of writing for our D&D campaigns in 1979.
  5. Quote:
    I'm sure the cutscenes are good. Great even... Maybe. But the thing is, we're not playing Final Fantasy or Heart of Darkness, i.e. we're not watching an interactive movie with gameplay elements serving only to bring us from one cutscene to the next.
    People keep saying "we should have cut scenes in MA!" and I keep saying "no, we shouldn't" and they say "why not?!?!?" and I say "because you would use them".
  6. The Incarnate system got tossed in, but it's no longer necessary. You can unlock your Incarnate slots without ever setting foot in Ouroborus.
  7. Quote:
    At some point you're going to have to decide what's a game mechanic and what's game lore.
    You may as well draw that line around Ouroboros in its entirety, since it only exists to provide the "flashback" mechanic.
  8. Quote:
    If I talk to one of the characters from the Shining Stars or Dr. Graves stories without having participated in them they give me the brush off (one set of dialogue), but if I hop back into the past via the Pillar and hang out with them (via a flashback) when I return to the present they will remember what we did in the past (different dialogue). My time travel has clearly changed the present.
    Has it? Your Contact bars won't have changed.

    Quote:
    It's fairly consistent internally
    It is not, as you have already pointed out yourself.
  9. Blue Steel does not travel through time. Blue Steel remains constant while the universe reconfigures itself into his desired time period.
  10. Quote:
    The timeline is not static. - This should be obvious. The Menders are clearly out to adjust the past based on their observations of the future. If the timeline was static then they would know it's impossible to prevent The Coming Storm and are just doing a pointless Dr. Manhattan impersonation.
    Actually Twilight's Son tells you straight up in the Ouro tutorial that the Menders have never been successful with any of their attempts at temporal intervention.

    That said, trying to make sense of time travel in this setting is pointless. It's used as a plot device with no thought given to its implications. Other eras are treated as Adventure Towns with a healthy dose of Timey Wimey Ball (and, of course, Hitler's Time Travel Exemption Act). Yes, this is poor craftsmanship, standard rant, yadda yadda yadda.

    FWIW, in my own campaigns, I decided there were two basic types of time travel. Some methods, including any I would ever give the players access to, worked within the space-time continuum and were thus limited by the Novokov self-consistency principle; in essence, it is impossible to change history using such methods. Other methods involved exiting the space-time continuum completely and re-entering at the desired time, which (for my purposes, anyway), breaks the traveler's chain of causality and would allow for (e.g.) Grandfather Paradoxes where you could kill the old duffer in his youth and come back to a world where you "don't exist". PCs never had reliable access to such methods; they were reserved for the bad guys.
  11. Quote:
    The biggest derailer of all could be done in Scirocco's second arc (The Hammer of the World.) By simply sitting back and doing nothing to stop Scirocco's ritual you could see the world completely free of villains, effectively ending the game.
    Given the curse Scirocco is under, it's doubtful his plan would have worked. It's more likely to have gone horribly right.
  12. Quote:
    Yeah I hear if you have no clue about that, it's a wicked scary spoiler.
    If you've never seen a western, maybe. "Villain is the hero's father" is one of the oldest gags in the book. Even my sister, who is not a serious fan, figured it out after the first movie.
  13. Quote:
    Given that before his betrayal, Maelstrom was a U.S. Citizen and special forces agent AND THEN COMMITTED HIGH TREASON against his native country, we might have locked him up but I'm pretty sure the CIA's seen to it he's been put back on the payroll.
    Fixed.
  14. Quote:
    Yet the general response is that this was a good plot
    People pay money for Selena Gomez's "music", too.
  15. Quote:
    I don't know, it seems like the easiest way to hand wave finding an ancient Mediterranean MacGuffin under modern America.
    There are any number of ways to do that; none of the good ones require adding time travel into an already convoluted and cliche-ridden plot.
  16. "Neat little touch"? The Cimerora portion of the DA arc was silly and gratuitous.
  17. Love it, even though I ended up on the cutting room floor.

    Correction: On second viewing I did spot Agent Cerulean twice, first one up the ramp in the Dilemma Diabloique section and in one of the subsequent fight scenes. Mea culpa.
  18. Quote:
    Out of curiosity, which one?
    Shooting from the hip, probably referring to Shaggy Dog Story or Shoot the Shaggy Dog.
  19. There's been no pre-release download yet, so I wouldn't expect i22 any time in the immediate future.
  20. Quote:
    It could also be argued that if you were not present things could be much much worse.
    It could also be argued that if you were not present things could be much better. If things were different they wouldn't be the same.</berra>
  21. Quote:
    Falsifiability is a word, a word that means "cannot be proven false by example." Its applicable to any discussion that requires a way of saying "cannot be proven false by example."
    It is a philosophical position with connotations that can't be summed up in six words, your statement is a declaration, not an argument, and I had no idea who that was a picture of until I used Goggles and even now I have no idea what the reference is supposed to mean.
  22. Quote:
    I suppose that's progress. You've been clinging to the claim that Wade hasn't made any mistakes for a long time, and it's heartening to see you move on admitting he hasn't made any real mistakes.
    I don't know where you're getting this from. My position hasn't changed.

    Quote:
    Is this some kind of forum game of which I am unaware? Am I supposed to take a drink every time an entry from tvtropes is misused?
    No, you're supposed to show why you think the trope is being misused. As almost everyone in the thread but you has pointed out, you can't because they're not.

    Quote:
    That's certainly one possible explanation, but you've got a tall burden to clear before you can say that it's the only one that matters.
    No, not really.

    Quote:
    From a meta perspective, it provides foreshadowing. From a game perspective, it's what allows the Midnighters to learn of Wade's involvement:
    In other words, it is ham-fisted exposition, i.e. bad writing. Did the Midnighters actually need to see the artifact stealing known Rularuu groupie to figure out he might have something to do with the Rularuu groupies stealing their artifacts? Does Costco offer bulk pricing on crates of Idiot Balls?

    Quote:
    Clearly you don't believe the SSAs compare favorably to your own work
    I don't believe WWD compares favorably to anyone's work. Ed Wood was inept enough to be funny, at least. "Blight" had better costumes.

    Quote:
    Even the very best comic book stories fail by the standards being applied to these arcs.
    I can think of a fair number of comic stories that were better than this. As for your examples, Batman defeating a weakened Superman is not something I would give a writer a hard time over, and Ozymandias' plan was if anything uncovered too easily (and didn't work in the end in any case).

    Quote:
    It specifically means the person making the assertion has made one that cannot be disproved. The notion that this is because its actually true as you imply is falsifiable.

    More specifically, since there exists no counter-example to a statement that is falsifiable, individual supporting examples cannot be given significant weight.
    Falsifiability is a principle from philosophy of science used to evaluate scientific hypotheses. It has no applicability to literary criticism. Arguing over whether (e.g.) the statement "in Shakespeare's Hamlet the titular character feigns madness to deceive his uncle" is falsifiable is gibberish. Arguing that statements must be falsifiable to have validity is the essence of logical positivism, a school of philosophy that is Deader Than Disco.
  23. Quote:
    The fact that a statement is not falsifiable implies there exists no test that can confirm the statement is true or false, and by extension the claim that the statement is true is generally of limited or no value.
    No, it just means the statement isn't a scientific one. The statement could be an axiom, or a tautology, or a theorem derived through valid rules of inference, etc. This isn't a discussion about science; falsifiability is not a useful metric.
  24. Quote:
    Wow, if I'm disingenuous at best, I'd hate to see what you think I am at worst.
    Not in front of the children.

    Quote:
    It seems like you've defined your thesis to be unfalsifiable.
    Well, that's because it's true, and therefore cannot be false. Certainly whoever wrote WWD could have included meaningful setbacks for Wade but as the vast majority of respondents have already observed, they didn't.

    Quote:
    All sarcasm aside, it really seems like your claims can be reduced to "Leaving aside his mistakes, Wade has not made a single mistake!" and that's technically true, but by that time the argument has been reduced to meaninglessness.
    Again, as others have already demonstrated, Wade hasn't made any real mistakes. The fact that e.g. his summoned pet fails to kill the player is simply not to the point; it's not part of the actual plot and doesn't affect the story in any case. One of the litany of sins WWD commits, and again, numerous people have pointed this out to you, is that it really doesn't matter if the player-character is involved or not. Sometimes you can get away with that. I did in "Why We Fight" (#253990, don't bother, it's broken by the filter), but that is a very different sort of story. "Blowback" (#4643, still works AFAIK) is a better example; while it has had a few detractors over the years not one of them pointed out that the player doesn't really affect the outcome and most of the feedback on the arc has been very positive. WWD doesn't pull it off. Between the Villain Sue and Idiot Balls and the use of one of the most miserable factions in the game (Rularuu) it's more aggrivating than entertaining and ends up drawing the audience's attention towards its weaknesses instead of diverting it from them.

    Quote:
    You gave me a sarcastic non-answer when I said that it was foolish of Wade to show his face to the Midnighters. There are any number of possible explanations for why he did this, but the fact remains that it was done.
    The only explanation that matters is that it is just bad writing. It's done so the writer can have Wade twirl his moustache and rub our noses in the fact that he's a god-moding Villain Sue and there's nothing we can do about it. His appearance serves no other purpose, either in-story or from a meta perspective. It's certainly not "a flaw in his plan" because his plan, both the immediate one in that chapter and the overall one, has gone off without a hitch.

    Quote:
    I'll leave some blank space here so you can post yet another link to a sixty-year essay on writing mysteries, which, as we all know applies equally well to all media and should serve as the perfect roadmap for writing an interactive story in a 2012 online superhero game.
    "The Simple Art of Murder" is not about "writing mysteries", and when you understand why you will gain a slot in Enlightenment. As for its age and applicability, a dead white guy wrote stuff about writing over 2,000 years ago and it's still valid.
  25. Quote:
    I think the idea was that if you go far enough back toward to origins, that there is no distinguishable difference between science and magic.
    If so, then either everything is science or everything is magic. Either option is a fail if the setting was intended to include both.