Nightchill_EU

Powers matter, tho a LOT of powers are accessibles to many ATs (or are clones).
My presentation probaly sucks but what if random people that reads that assume its not damage scale but "the damage that an attack does" how wrong would it be? At some point in the whole bucket of powers, pools and patrons the damage scale number pretty much summarise the damage potential of an AT.

As for special AT abilities, 10% do deal double damage is, in the long run, 10% damage increase. The scourge curve leans towerd 17%. The calculation on Defiance have to be calculated for every single possible (or optimal) ST cycle for every set but looking at the way it works I would be extremely surprise if its overall far from 10%.

As for the numbers (and the staments) I'd be more than happy if you can prove me wrong. And I am, unfortunatly, dead serious.




PS: The human spec Kheld part is maybe trollish I have to admit.

Just to enlight people asking about damage and to close some commun misconceptions:



Blaster:
Base 125 - Max 562,5 (Defiance is hard to quatifie but its somewhere close to 10%)

Scrapper:
Base 125 - Max 562,5 (Almost 10% more with criticals because minions doesnt matter)

Corruptor:
Base 75 - Max 375 (Close to 17% overall on big targets)

Controller:
Base 55 - Max 220 (Double if Containment)

Defender:
Base 65 - Max 260

Mastermind:
Base 55 - Max 220
(Melee Pet is 100 base to 400 Max but this only applies to tier 8 pet. Other pets gets very lower damage scale due to lower level)

Tanker:
Base 80 - Max 320

Brute:
Base 75 - Max 581,25

Dominator:
Base 105 - Max 420 (Melee attack is very slightly lower, Domination doesnt affect damage anymore)

Kheldian:
Human Base 85 - Max 340
Nova Base 120 - Max 480
Dwarf Base 100 - Max 400

VEAT:
Base 100 - Max 400

Stalker:
Base 100 - Max 500 (Roughly 10% more with critical, 30ish in a full team with noone ******* around. AS doesnt affect overall damage in any meaningfull way)




Misconceptions:
- VEATs are damage dealer. Tanks arent.
VEATs have some team utility but de res debuff on tank's T1 attack compensate widely the damage difference.

- Human-only speced Kheldians are good.
Nope.

- VEATs are better than Kheldians because they have team buffs can do as much damage.
They dont do as much damage.

- Scrappers and Blasters are damage dealers. Brutes arent.
Its pretty close actually. Without any kind of buff the Hero damage dealers will do more but with a good Kin all 3 are about the same DPS.

- Defenders can deal damage.
Not really. Secondary on defender should be oriented toward debuffing on a team build. Debuff effects on defender attacks is considerably higher than the Blasters or Corr vertions.

- Dom arent damage dealers but Corruptors are.
Actually Dom are above Corrs. But both should be considered as true damage dealers.

- MM just lag me and are useless.
Its pretty hard to quantifie MM damage. They are most definately a support AT. If pets never die and are pro-controlled the damage is somewhere close to Corrs but the fact IA uses stupid damage cycles and insert AoE/Cones when is not needed drops draticly pet's utility.

- Stalkers suck.
On an 8 man team Stalkers are the ultimate damage dealer, regardless of AS usage. The fact they get gimped vertion of Scrapper primary and secondary sets (BU vs Soul Drain, Hide vs Quick Recovery, and more...), the lack of team utility like threat auras or lower survivability give them generally a bad reputation but, still, they are the ultimate Damage AT.

Yeah well you can wait for fresh Barrier and/or accolade and/or insp whenever face a tough pack. Its not my angle.
As for Alpha strike you can pretty much negate its effect with smart herding (for which Darkest Night is definately a golden tool).

Let me remind you our desagreement.
You think caping S/L is the way to go.
I think its better to go 30%ish Melee/Ranged and throw 15% psy resist.

Also I must add again I am not talking about solo/farm but about x4+8 teaming, trials (iTrials are actually trivialised with incarnate level shift) and MO TF.

My point:
1- Def buffs are extremely common in teams. Resist buffs are very rare, Psy resist extremely rare (Dark Miasma and Mind Link).
2- A lot of mobs can negate you defense. Not just with defense debuffs but also with autohit powers, tohit buffs (Quartz, Fort Leadership, Targeting Drones, Fortitude...).
3- Psy attacks are very generally pure Psy damage (actually only Subdue and TK Blast arent). They also have horribly bothering side effects. Terrorise and Slow (slow is bad for Healing Flames sir) are the one you may fear the most, but you also have Psy def debuff (Arachnos Boss Psy Tarentulas, these with human faces).

Yet Fiery Aura is weak versus Psy. 0 defense, 0 resist. IF you take the chance of diying it means you take the chance to eventually wipeout your team (if you are tank) or to fail MO.
I am very generally the advocate of the "damage will fix it" way. Tho, I must say damage doesnt always fix it.

Now that being said, caping S/L works better for SOLO mission life and easy settings.

To all your builds:

Aiming for S/L cap is in my opinion a mistake for a jack-of-all-trade build. FA is weak vs Psy and ONLY vs Psy (Tox goes to the roof staking Healing Flames). Caping S/L basicly enhence the toughness versus something you are already strong against (is that even english?).
I build my SS/FA for maximum Psy res unique and I try to go for Ranged/Melee defense.

Some of you dont take Darkest Night and Dark Oblit (some dont take Gloom but it cannot help them anymore): its a MISTAKE.
Dark Oblit is -5% to hit AoE, even if you slot for damage, and its a good AoE. Darkest night is a whooping -15% to-hit and -20% damage. Seriouly would any of you pass over 15% def and 20% res?

As for end usage Ageless rk3 make Endurance a non-issue and gives recharge. Barrier looks pretty but even rk4 is only steady 5% defense.

Sonic.





Tho I find Illusion controller an easier Healer. Numbers are abit lower but numbers matters less on Empath than on Sonic/ FF/ Cold/ etc... Group Invis gives defense, and if you are a pure teamplayer you will find Recall Friend with Invis/Resurect VERY usefull. It also drops your aggro generation drasticly. Picking "only" Blind, Decieve, PA, Group Invis (potentially Sup Invis too for the extra def and LotG), Spectral Terror and Phantasm; it gives you the tools to drop buffs and pets and concentrate on your healing.
Deceive (confuse) is an incredible tool to get out of tricky situation using very nasty enemies as a strengh. Confused Sky Raider's FF Gens, Rikti Guardians, DE's Quartz and Cairns or CoT Mages can completely turn the outcome of a fight. Did you know that if you pre-confuse Carnie's Master Illusionist they will summon ALLY Phastasm, 2 illusionist and Dark Servant?
PA is also incredibly powerfull to "MezTank" badass targets like 4pylons LR on STF or other tanker-eating AVs.

Not to mention that both sets are hungry for recharge so its easy to find the way to IO up.

Defenders have about 20%ish more on every effects of the set. If you want to be a "Time Manipulator" go with fender (preferably melee/PBAoE oriented secondary).

Trollers, MM and Corrs will have roughly the same numbers.

Time has recharge buff and Melee range auras, these are the best for (most) controlers.
Time has AoE Heal and Def buff, which fitts to MM but recharge buff doesnt affect pets.
Time is mostly melee, doesnt have damage buffs, is quite active (no buff and play style like FF, Sonic, Thermal or Cold) so doesnt really fit to Corruptors imo.


So Id say:
1- Troller
2- For the sheer numbers, Fender
3- MM
4- Corr

Of course thats considering there are better secondary for MM (DM, Traps, Thermal) and Corrs (Kin, Rad, DM) but it doesnt mean your character will suck if you pick these AT.

There is a real diference between farming SS/FA and regular play SS/FA (not to mention PvP SS/FA), you have to be more specific (and yeah, if farm you have hundred of threats).

Fire/Kin is the best damager, Plant/Kin is imo overall very slightly better because you trade some damage for more safety, and Kin is pretty squishy and tend to draw some aggro.

Illu/Kin doesnt have amazing synergy but both sets are extremely strong. Phamtom Army cant be buffed but you can, Phatasm can, your team can, Patron Pets can, Lore Pets can... And Srain Speed let you reach perma PA very faster than other sets.

Earth/Kin is my favorite team Kin. It has incredibly AoE control, way beyond any other because multiple pseudo pets can affect groups over AoE target limit. Of course it tends to attract a lot of attention but your team is suppose to support you!

Mind/Kin is imo quite inferior because mind demands a lot of attention, so does Kinetics. It has no pets, doesnt have much AoE containment option (so its not amazing to buff yourself). I rather have 4 minutes buff sets types on Mind troller (or actually play Dom for mind).


Trollers will hate me for this but I also find Corruptors arguably better than trollers for Kin, Fire/Kin and Sonic/Kin corrs are very impressive.

thanks a lot.

trying to build 2 nin stalkers for zone PvP (KM and Spines) tell me how wrong I am

/ice really have subpar AoE exept blizzard. AR, Archery or Rad does considerably better if you are solo. /fire would definately be the best.
If you want to be able to wipe 0/8 spawwns solo and be descent team contributor you may also want to look at corruptor AT.

Storm has AoE? Where? None with meaningfull damage at least.
Have you considered Kin/Son? Its very probably the best support toon you can find. The very highest indirect dps in game.

I wouldnt see any balance issue to remove the crash on either nukes (being plainly worste than Judgements now) or t9 defensive powers (which are arguably less powerfull than barrier). Crash doesnt add anything to gameplay, its just boring and a waste of time (having to re-toggle) and most of these powers are already balanced around thier long recharge or/and innability to recude recharge pr/and their specific place is the powerset (Blizzard for instence is "too" good but is in a set with very weak AoE and average/bad utility).

Id go Dark Miasma for solo on a Corr anytime (at least if you want to be able to solo before you get soft caped SLranged). If you have to chose between Pain and Therm Id probably go Pain but yeah, both are impressive team sets are rather weak soloer.

/FA brute we r talking less than ten hours play to 50. No MM gets anywhere close .

As for troller. I wouldnt say IllRad xps slower than FireRad. Endurance is a pain in the butt on FireRad and Phatom army comes earlier than imps. Confuse is also incredibly powerfull to manage tricky packs or sucky teams. Tho I d say its close but considering how easy IllRad solos AVs whenever PA and AR goes perma i really would pick IllRad for solo toon.

SS/FA and Claw/FA brutes are the fastest to lvl but they dont make amazing soloers overall. Invul or WP melee with AoE heavy sets (kat, claw, SS, fire...) are good soloers.

Some MM and trollers are also pretty impressive (bot/traps and ill/Rad coming first)

Damagewise scrapper will always be more dps, always. I you are solo or weakly buffed scrapper will do a LOT more, if you are strongly buffed by a good kin both will be close.

On the defensive side the will be roughtly equivalent when solo but brute will be incredibly tougher with heavy buffing.

As for aggro raise to the callenge is pretty weak anyways.

Ageless makes endo a non issue, since sonic doesnt really need clarion.