Mr_Jaytastic

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I am somewhat upset that the challenge is being taken out of playing a melee character, but I guess most people that pick a melee character are not looking to play on a balanced playing field anyway. Hell, they had the advantage BEFORE the toggle drops were nerfed, now the advantage is so clear even an idiot can't fail to benefit. Which is what the whiners want of course.

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Wow, someone actually put "advantage" and "melee character" in the same paragraph? Amazing, never thought I'd see it.

/sarcasm off

PS carefully in how you use the word "whiny", it could bite you in the keester.

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Says the spine scrapper.

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Welcome to MMO PVP. Whoever screams "WE SUCK" the loudest gets to be next months kings of pvp. It's basically one giant slow-motion ping pong tourney.

-Tsoo

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Heh yup.

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I wonder how come Dominators aren't Kings of PvP then I KNOW we (well, I) whine more than that.

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Issuse 8 FoTM prediction:
Mind/Energy Dom

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It'll be mind/ice dom's. They'll be able to build domination very fast. Kite in, fire your three blasts, kite out, rinse repeat.

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NERF FOCUSED ACCURACY NOW !!!!

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Go. To. Hell.

No, you know what? If you get nerfed in PvP, I really don't care. If you get it nerfed in PvE at the same time, you can take your PvP and shove it where nothing ever shines.

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Well some of us DO care about PvP. You can disagree with him all you want, but be a little more respectful then telling someone to "go to hell" just because you dont agree with him.

If you dont care about PvP, why are you even posting in this thread, telling off someone who does care?

You can add slow resist and -recharge resist to that list as well, as well as very above average energy resist

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Welcome to MMO PVP. Whoever screams "WE SUCK" the loudest gets to be next months kings of pvp. It's basically one giant slow-motion ping pong tourney.

-Tsoo

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Heh yup.

Thanks for posting the list and numbers, _Castle_. It is appreciated.

That said...Holy crap. My Blaster fire sword went from 100% to 5%?!?!1?!?!?one1!!?!?! Talk about a nerf!

We knew the % was going down, but 95%? This is another solid blow to non /em blasters, who dont have the stuns or high bi's in their secondary. Before when taking on the big boys (brutes, tanks, scraps) I knew I could either drop his status protection and hold him OR at least weaken his resistance and/or defense. Now? I have a 1/20 chance of doing this.

I understand the % had to drop, but to such an extreme hurts non /em blasters who dont have stuns, total focus, and power boost to compensate.

Look at my sig. What do you think will happen to that 60% now? All aboard, going DOWN.

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Catch 22 here.
Energy Aura can get away with this because it only needs to run 3 toggles to be successful.
You just proposed not taking Stamina and adding two extra toggles. Good luck with that.
You need 3 basic toggles for your damage resistance/mezz protection. If you want to run the damage aura, that makes 4. CJ and Acro? Now you have 6. Tough? 7.
Keep in mind that you still to actually attack and, if you're one of the desparate folks, use Aid Self as well.
No way would anyone be able to funtion running 6-7 toggles without Stamina, especially in PvP.


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With my /ea stalker I run four in PvE, and five in PvP PLUS flight as my travel power. Out of the list you named, you can always toggle your damage aura off and on, and I dont know if you need tough if you have aid self (like I also do on my stalker).

I have two slots in all my toggles. And if I really want I can take conserve power, but with two end mod and one recharge and hasten (/elec brutes could stack hasten with their other +recharge power to bring up power sink even quicker) I dont have problems in PvE or PvP.

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All of that would be well and good if end drain and -recovery were actually something worth fearing in PvE. Outside of Carnies and Longbow Spec-Ops (which are easily displaced by one Dominator), it's virtually non-existant. Knockback and Immob on the other hand...


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Mu's are devils at end drain too. And I always feal -recharge vs bosses, large mobs, AVs.

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Yay for diversity, eh? [censored]


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Now I do agree with you on this. City of Jumpers has another permanent member.


Another thing that I noticed...you can get incredible energy resistance. From what Ive played, energy is fairly common in CoV...not as common as s/l, but near the same as fire and more then cold. PvP, blappers of course.

I can see the set not being for everyone, sure. And there is no way I would do without combat jumping, and most likely acro too. But the heal...with the end drain powers, you can skip the blues and double-stock on greens. If power sink works like energy drain in the /ea line (where with two end mod SOs I can almost fill my bar from two minions), then I think thats a very powerful addition to /elec.

I think a lot of people will respec out of stamina around lvl 35ish. There's your aid self right there.

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all electricity does defense-wise is resistance, so it needs to be really good at resistance. it's not.


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A lot of sets dont have resist to slow, end drain and recovery debuff, along with tp foe (if you PvP). This set also has powers to let you skip stamina AND hasten, plus an awesome tier 9.

Im guessing its going to be near /da in terms of resist. If you want uber resist, play a invuln.

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I did like chum

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I don't like getting 1,2 shot by blasters or stalkers
I don't like getting stuck in a Tar Patch
I don't like getting detoggled by EM
I don't like the insane damage generated by brutes in melee
I don't like being debuffed by Enervating Field or Radiation Infection.
I don't like being grounded by Air Superiority.
I don't like losing in PvP.

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I don't like being ASed
I don't like being feared
I don't like being taunted by a granite tank
I don't like when an ice tank uses hibernate
I don't like being tpfoe'd up into the air or off a building

so on and so on...There are plenty of powers that are a pain, hurricane was one of them. There are plenty of ways around them. And some people just cant deal with certain powers...a defender is going to have a very tough time taking down a regen scrapper, a stalker is going to have a very tough time ASing an ice tank, a dominator is going to have a tough time dealing with someone that has a lot of bf's, a brute is going to have a tough time building fury in a 1v1 fight. Its the nature of the beast.

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Hurricane was the new Instand Healing. A power that made you untouchable

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Thats hilarious. As someone who has used ih when it was a toggle and hurricane before yesterday...its not even close. Blasters can three-hit me. Em stalkers stun me, then AS me. Scrappers or tanks with fa hit through it plenty. Scrappers with ih also have mez protection, something with most stormies dont have (iw is around 60% of the time for those with it, so its not close to perma either), so a simple hold drops hurricane easy. Ih scrappers are infintely harder to kill.

Save the ridiculous claims.

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I feel they have down a disservice to the defender community. Controllers are not as hard hit by this as defenders are, and this change just put storm controllers even further ahead of storm defenders when it comes to the ability to use storm powers to maximum effect.

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Yeah, thats true. One difference I've noticed between storm controllers and storm defenders...storm controllers run hurricane when its absolutely necessary, but for the most part they dont...their AoE mez powers are the ultimate accuracy debuff. Storm defenders on the other hand, from what I ve noticed, run hurricane from the second they zone into the mission, and they run it continuously.

I think most players are willing to pay the price of higher end cost for a good power



We've seen it plenty of times. Remember when ih cost a bunch? It didnt stop anyone from running it all the time, and no one complained about it. I dont remember saying "ih's cost is way too much for its effect" because it wasnt...ih was uber.

FA...here's another one. Very high end cost. And yet you see it all the time and no one complains because...people are willing to pay that price for its effect.

Hurricane...even with its high end cost and the high end cost of all the other storm powers, people again didnt complain. They made it work, and loved it.

Two of my examples were for scrappers, and I know regen and all the end recovery they get. But every single AT has ways to recover end if you so chose, in their primary, secondary, or APPs. If the end cost really bothers you that much, you can take a power to deal with it, you can slot differently, you can carry a lot of blues, whatever. But we've made it work for quite some time.

So, in the end I think people are more then willing to pay higher end for the great powers, instead of paying less end for a watered-down version.

EDIT:reworded

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Wasn't there actually a post from Statesman that said code existed to easily make powers work differently in each side? PVE/PVP zones?

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I dont know about the "easily" part, but they do have the tech to make things different in PvE and PvP...

1. Controller x3 damage in PvP, x2 in PvE
2. Smoke does an accuracy check in PvP, does not in PvE
3. Superspeed gives no stealth in PvP, gives stealth in PvE

...off the top of my head.

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3 simple things that can disable a stormie


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I think there are more ways then just 3, but that didnt matter to the devs

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It lasts WAY TOO LONG after you've got away from the radius

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I havent tested hurricane today, but I did use ri and I could tell a pretty substantial difference in the amount of damage I was taking. I know a lot of people are saying it will balance out in PvE...but I could care less. PvE can be figured out. The ai is predictable.

PvP is where my beef is. This is going to get me pwned a lot more often.

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There is nothing particularly overpowered about stalker EM.

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You're crazy.

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I second that.

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Lets see....

-PL'ing made harder- CHECK
-Flavor of the month builds screwed with-CHECK
-Stalkers toned down to calm the masses-CHECK

another successful patch...hahaha

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People gloating over other people's toons being nerfed for PvP reasons even though they dont play PvP-CHECK

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In terms of raw kills, Blasters are the better PvP killers, but only if they have Energy Manipulation. Without EM, they are roughly 60% of scrappers numbers.

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More proof that either...

1. /em is overpowered

OR

2. all the other secondaries need a lot of help (elec not as much as the "big crap three")

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Also, adding in my two cents worth. This may be the only thing I've disagreed with _Castle_ so far - blasters do MORE melee damage than scrappers. For instance, check their BI - /elec and /EM blappers get a quick-spam attack that does 5.44 BI of damage, a slightly slower, but still pretty fast attack that does 7.66 BI of damage, and a strong as hell but slow attack that does around 9 BI.

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We're talking about two of the five secondaries here. Overall, blasters do not do more damage then scrappers in melee. Period. I'll bring my /fire blaster, you bring any scrapper and we'll see who comes out on top. Same with /ice, same with /dev.

Everbody knows that /em is overpowered for ALL sets. It remains the same for blasters like it does for everybody else.

And for people nerf-calling Blasters, have you even tried playing one in PvE, especially in the 40s? They are very much a glass cannon and get blown away by scrappers and controllers.

Im sick of people nerf-herding on ATs they have little to no experience with.

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The biggest problem is that many who play melee ATs refuse to alter their tactics from what they use in PvE.

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I think this has a large part to do with it. I know the first couple times I PvPed with my scrapper I would go in with no breakfrees. Why bother when I have mez protection, right? And like other people said, when you hear bu and aim, just back off for ten seconds.

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*/fire has one shotted me with fire sword on my mastermind and stalker. silly uses of hot feet, burn, blazing aura, and fire sword might be able to kill a scrapper.

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Only way Im killing you with hot feet, burn and blazing aura is if I can make you sit still for several minutes and you not kill me. Otherwise, impossible. Dont forget Blazing aura and hot feet can both miss. Fire sword is decent, but its brawl index is less then bonesmasher, so I have a very hard believing you were one-hit by it.

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the bottom line is a blappers with totally wreck a scrapper toe to toe in melee

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3/5 of the secondaries will not wreck a scrapper. The main culprit for this is /em. And being that we see them so much, it feels like more of a problem then it really is. Do we want to nerf all blaster secondaries because of /em? I should hope not.

Scrappers get more hitpoints, criticals that seem to happen to me a lot more then 5%, mez protection (good luck brawling off /sr's), and past lvl 41 they arent going to miss you. I think they have plenty of advantages in melee over blasters.

You know, when the change was coming through, I wasnt worried about PvE. Theyre mindless enough and we're so powerful by lvl 30 that it really isnt a problem. But the thing that DID bother me was PvP. In particular, all the squishies that depend of tohit debuffs to survive.



What about PvP?

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he's taking time out of his stalker advocating to help brutes? wow.....

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This just makes me laugh. Yes, clearly he is "stalker advocating" when stalkers are getting an AS nerf and a placate nerf. Some advocating.