Leo_G

Well, you get no sympathy from me with regards to AoEs in MA or EM (really, those sets are mediocre to poor for AoE for *any* AT...and for DM, well, Soul Drain is indeed a loss, but Dark Consumption isn't much to cry about for AoE or utility....claws is another story, but yeah, you want AoE then pick an AoE set) but the quoted part...that might need some addressing.

Regardless of how awesome they make AS with this change, it should be noted that...AS *isn't* an inherent power. You have to *choose* and *slot* the power...so wrapping up additional AT functionality into it (hidden critical isn't wholly attractive due to its situationalism, and demoralize is nearly as situational) may be a problem.

Since we have the option to not choose Assassin's Strike, then this Assassin's Focus should have some other type of utility for your other powers...something tied into the basic function (or a power we're forced to take) of the AT.

Perhaps, when (or maybe even before) testing starts, changing this Assassin's Focus to affect Hide instead of Assassin's Strike? Make it so, when you have 'Assassin's Focus' built up, Hide starts to randomly unsuppress? And when fully built up, changes the Hide status to refresh in [X] seconds vs 8 seconds? That way, as you're meleeing, you're increasing crit chances for all your attacks as well as opening the chance for Assassinations.

Just an idea, really. Could simply be Assassin's Focus point substitutes as a teammate in melee range (but does not stack higher than what we can now) while still offering that improved crit chance on AS? But it can't just be focused on AS since it's not a required power...

I'd say my suggestion would be a better place to start. The blapper one is basically pre-gimped anyway and doesn't quite fill the criteria of not being a redundant play experience.

Not only is mine perfectly feasible to implement (the whole executing attacks on foes within a certain range giving you a buff may not be), but it also fulfills a team roll that really is only delegated by 3 other ATs; Tankers, Brutes and Masterminds. That Blapper is basically a 5th (6th if you want to count Doms, 7th if you want to count EATs) DPS role and can do nothing else.

The Artillery (that's what I'd name my AT, I guess), would provide the role of aggro control by being the first to engage from range while teammates charge or move away from the Artillery guy so as not to be caught up in AoE. The name of their game (rather than herd as many foes as close together to keep aggro like on Tanker, or keep pets close and alive like on MMs) is to pick a safe spot (somewhere where they can get off as many shots before the foe can reach them) near the ground and let lose, taking out the ones that lead their bunch first so as to keep your range. In the case you or teammates cannot keep foes at bay, you'd have to either reposition (and unbrace yourself which would lose you some damage/range) or just engage close-range (and not move).

I think it'd be a new and interesting dynamic, something that I often use now on my Storm corruptor; that is, finding a spot that hinders the foes advances like obstacles that force them to line up, or screw with their AI as they have to find a way around things all the while, my powers are debuffing them and knocking them back to square one. Not only that, but it puts an interesting emphasis on snipes so that they have a purpose.

Yeah, my ideas bettah'

Dominators got tweeked at least twice before as well. The recharge time on Domination was lowered (I think it used to be twice the recharge it was now, originally) as well as their damage mods (ranged and melee) rebalanced so melee hit harder than ranged. Then mez protection was added to domination as well as the ability to activate it while mezzed and an endurance refill some time after that. It was only after IOs and the ability to make domination perma without assistance did the duality of the AT get axed and the extra damage granted by domination was added to the base damage of the AT as increased damage scale (an overall buff as it left all that room for other buffs to get them to damage cap) and a rebalance of assault powers to do more damage but recharge slower (and the Psi Shockwave nerf)...

I'd say Doms have probably been the most tweeked villain AT since launch, IMO. With these new changes, Stalkers will be getting up there. Personally, I'd love a rebalancing of Stalker melee attacks to recharge slower but do bigger damage. It'd give Stalkers a reason to put AS in their attack chain as well since the lower tiers would recharge slower too.

You can't be a stone armor claws brute either.

Stone Armor is just full of disappointments, really...

Don't you just love how those people with ESP, able to tell exactly what you're thinking or what they want. I bet you're a hit with the ladies (or guys, however you swing ), able to give 'em just what they're looking for every time...

I swear I didn't make a 2nd account, make 40 posts then posted this here.

I've been saying the exact above statements *every* time people mention Stalker AoE and I still stand by that.

You want solid AoE dmg? Then don't pick Dark Melee or Energy Melee, Mr. Brute!

Oh, you're a Stalker? Then don't pick Dark Melee or Energy Melee, Mr. Stalker!

No, you're still going to want to use placate, even in teams. It's just now it decouples itself from AS in general combat. But then perhaps I'm still not sure on what these changes entail...like will this Assassin's Focus allow just an AS crit or an Assassination bonus dmg crit? Will demoralize still go off with just Assassin's Focus? What does Assassin's Focus do if you use Placate first?

Solo or teamed, a placate > tier 9 or something is still good but is just seems to devalue placate > AS where it wasn't most attractive to begin with if you can get nice damage by just building AF.

Now...if AF somehow accumulated and helped AS after a placate as well as without that placate, then that's a different story...or if placate didn't revert AS to the wind-up cast time...then nothing is devalued and placate > AS would be just as attractive as duking it out and building AF...it'd depend on circumstances. Do you need that damage now? Are you already meleeing within an encounter? And how much extra damage do you need to take down your target?

How do think so? Did he suggest this or something?

Still reading the thread but...I think you missed the main idea of the 'question' (lol from how the asker described it, it sounded like a speech).

Although, to come up with an example to take seriously, one kinda has to believe in it, but in all honesty, I don't think Turgenev is telling the devs "oh, you need to implement this to make PvP better" or even "this idea is so awesome!!! put it in the game NAO!!". The general gist I get from his speech is that, PvP is made a subset of the game that people ignore and scoff at *because* it's in a little sandbox. Degenerates have made the experience unpleasant by the way they broadcast or single out players *because* that part of the game is ignored and no one bothers to moderate.

But put it out where people can see it, and people might start to care. Crude language might be moderated a bit harsher if the participants aren't the only ones that care. The idea was just an example or placeholder to get the thought process going to expand PvP into something more natural to the game. Of course, put measures into the game so as not to directly affect players not interested, but it's hardly inconsiderate to tell someone to ignore a part of the game that they already ignore. That it is acceptable to enjoy the game in a different way and be told no because others don't even want to *look* at it...Tolerance is a necessary trait in everyday life. Maybe the game should help us realize this?

My opinion on PvP is, well I'm just not interested in it. I used to when my friends played the game, and drag me to Sirens or something. But now, since I mostly solo and PuG, I don't see a purpose for it. Would I like a reason to go into it? Sure, so long as it's not something I have to stop and devote a whole night of playing to get any meaning behind it.

A zone event that allows a few villains and heroes to duke it out across the city while completing objectives? Or maybe specific lines of missions that are open so that villains/heroes can jump into my instances? Or stuff that generally feels like hero vs villain? I think I could get into stuff like that...

That's kinda what I fear might happen. It really designates placate as an optional bit of flare vs a serious tool like it has been. Not to mention, by the sounds of it, using Placate > AS might revert the cast time from the new quickness to the slower interruptible wind up, which comes with it's own pratfalls.

It's still kinda early in the morning and it was a long night so I can't think properly

How would it affect Dual Blades who has a combo linked to AS? I figure, sets like Kinetic Melee or Electric Melee won't have any problems with this new mechanic as KM will simply use placate with Concentrated Strike, and EM will use placate with an AoE like Thunderstrike or for ST use AS...

Quite contrary to what recent dev discussions have told. I believe one dev is interested in a type of melee/(de)buff type AT mix and the fact that ATs can be sold on the market, it only increases possible merchandise as well as the usability of any new sets created.

Again, you can believe whatever you want to believe, but I state outright that I wouldn't even bother using such an AT in my second post in this thread primarily because I have no concepts for such characters and all my concepts that *are* ranged hinge on being squishy.

You don't know me or my posting habits so don't pretend like you know what my motivations are.

If anything, I'm supporting such an AT because, not only has it been proved that it isn't overpowered, but because it gives the devs opportunity to build a free-concept AT from scratch which has never been done. It won't be bogged down by faulty balance mechanics, forced themes, or legacy expectations that hinder the balancing of the old ATs. It'd be an opportunity for the devs to make something fun and unique with the new tech they have developed thus far.

Beyond that, I believe this game is far too imaginative and flexible to be held back by the likes of you and those who oppose the idea of new ATs. That is the main reason I'm even posting in this thread.

You think it's impossible to create an AT because of time/resources constraints, would be redundant, have to be pre-nerfed, need to suck and be unfun? No, impossible is to swan dive into a volcano and come out of a sea of lava with *more* meat on your bones vs a dissolved skeleton. Making a new AT that is fun and balanced work in CoX is far from impossible and I can attempt to defend that claim with suggestions that can work. The only means you have made thus far to counter my posts are unsupported claims and talking down of player concepts.

Now put a shield in the hands of that Defender/Corruptor...or cover them in ice or fire or rock.

All I'm saying is theme, style and playstyle go a lot deeper than set bonuses and mitigation numbers. And you can pretend a lot of stuff in this game, doesn't quite validate your point, however. We could all pretend to have dual pistol blast back when Thugs masterminds were introduced, didn't mean a comprehensive set shouldn't have been made.

You'll probably never know what anyone really wants, just delude yourself into thinking you're some type of Sherlock Holmes or something...

Or maybe you just like making argumentative quips on message boards that you think are clever?

...but no, I'm not looking to be an overpowered purely ranged character with scrapper survivability...hell, if you were listening to anything I said, you'd know exactly this because I *said* it out loud...to your face and in plain words, even...

How much do you know about Marketing or Sales?

Loyal Rewards programs are everywhere, from grocery stores to gas stations. They get you to purchase more or keep buying by offering points that you can redeem for rewards. And most likely, these rewards are not cash prizes. It isn't in this case either.

And just because you're getting server transfer tokens doesn't mean you're getting back money either. Or do you not remember the limited periods where the devs offered infinite server transfers for free? OMG, better cash in on that and we could all become millionaires! Or bank on it giving us unlimited months of subscriptions somehow!!

No, no one's paying you to play the game. A service has just changed distribution methods and now you spend less on that particular service. Even if that saved revenue isn't countered by your increased spending on other new things in the market and you keep more money in your pocket, the same result occurs when you just budget your money better.

Basically, you were just spending a ridiculous amount before...too much, in fact. Anything you're saving now most likely just counters that overspending.

Lol this is the most nonsensical, logic-less post I have ever read.

Kudos.

Well, when $16 bucks pops back up on my account after I pay my monthly subscription, maybe then posters won't be laughing in your face.

Frankly, for the past 2 months, I probably clock in around 2-4 hours of playtime a week but I use the forums far more. Reward tokens? Server Transfers? They mean exactly *zero* to me (I'd prefer name change tokens, honestly)...And since you cannot trade unneeded services for a desired service (reward tokens for a month's subscription, server transfers for name changes, etc.) you cannot equate *freebies* to money.

Like...in todays paper, there's a coupon for 2 free ice-cream sandwiches from a certain store in town. It's advertised as "It's like getting the newspaper for free!" Well, yeah...if I were going to that specific store and wanted ice-cream sandwiches. For me, it's like getting the newspaper which comes with 2 ice-cream sandwiches for my nephew...for the price of wasting my damn gas driving to that store >_>.

Right. Now explain to me why anyone even bothers making Super Reflexes characters if it can be so easily emulated by IO bonuses. Or why even play armored ATs when you can just make the correct build to emulate an armor set.

I'll answer that for you. Because IOs, bonuses, incarnate powers and the proper build *do not* emulate an armor set.

It's as simple as that.

It is different. My posted idea specifically aims to provide a team support through tanking experience that can enjoy the concept of the ranged powersets and utilize distance tactics deployed by other support team members.

If you think you can make something different, please do post an idea because all the bases are covered (that is, there is crowd control, there is debuffers, there is buffers, there is tankers and there is DPS...not really anything 'different' you can make of anything except various combinations of these). And no, that isn't saying nothing else could ever be added. It's the style and playstyle that varies with ATs, not specifically the role.

Actually, I came up with it on the fly. I had no idea what bonus it could obtain from firing at range, so I just made up one in a static damage proc. But the core goal of the idea is, yes it's basically a ranged Tanker but the AT wouldn't have the luxury of firing at max range whenever. Nearby foes intercept your firing range, so you have to deal with close foes first, and your only dependable long range powers would be a ST taunt and a snipe. But the limitation is you have to stay still to line up your shots at range.

I still wouldn't know what to do with the nukes. It probably wouldn't be right having 2 crash powers on one AT (the godmode armor and the nuke)...was actually thinking a downgraded no-crash mini-nuke for every blast set with an interruptible cast (that is eliminated if you brace yourself) might replace them but honestly, most people don't like snipes and stuff...

Exactly the point, really.

I still find my Draconic Necromancer build pretty unique and fun. Not optimized, but still fun. He's a Fire Melee/SD/Levi Brute. His Dragoon magic comes primarily from his ability to change what stuff he breaths out, from fire to ice to toxic blasts, while his necromancy comes from forming a dragon's bane sword out of the soul of vanquished dragons as well as summon their bones to wield as armor.

I wouldn't have been able to really fill out that build without the Leviathan pool and the addition of Arctic Breath. Without Arctic Breath, the concept is just too bland...but that one addition went a long way.

Now think about adding some other combos into the mix and way more concepts too bland or finicky to work properly suddenly are more enjoyable. Optimal or not.

Because you're not thinking outside the box?

Honestly, I'd suggest thinking of the general concept of the AT (a sturdy ranged fighter) and start building the AT from there, starting with perhaps the limits of what you think the AT should be able to do...

First, I look at the AT of Tankers. I like Tankers. No one seems to think they're overpowered. They're the most upfront survivable AT there is and the damage they are capable of isn't bad at all. They may not outstrip other ATs but considering half the time they are in no danger, it more than balances out. Conversely, look at Masterminds. Probably more survivable than Tankers but can do more damage + buff the team some with the downfall of requiring the management of a bunch of pets.

So, the way I see it, you've got two flavors of 'Tanking'. The straight-forwardness of Tankers or the more complicated yet more diverse Mastermind.

Why not add a new flavor of 'Tanking' that differs from the 2 we have? I mean, we practically have 3 flavors of 'melee' and 3 flavors of 'blasting', this suggested AT can have capabilities lined up with what a Tanker can do but still not overtake what a MM can do with its variety...think, if Tankers can do their thing but with the option of being at range, is it somehow unfair to be able to do that when you've got Scrappers and Brutes able to survive similar levels of punishment but do so much more damage?

Same justification for this hypothetical AT. A ranged Tanker, so to speak. With the same general offensive capabilities of a Tanker with the added utility of range.

So then why play another melee over this AT? Specifically Tankers? Well, Brutes and Scrappers can still output more damage than a Tanker period. That is why you'd play a Brute/Scrapper in that instance, because they do more overall damage. Why play a Tanker over this new tanker type? Easy, because the main advantages of a Tanker (taunting) would come from being close while this new AT could have advantages by being far. It adds a layer of complexity over a Tanker that makes room for the new utility but puts its tactics at odds with itself in some scenarios. Not only that, but consider that buff and damage auras in armor sets only provide their effects with foes nearby...

Inherent power can be something like 'Brace for Fire' or some such where one needs to be planted in place for a time (near the ground) for 'some benefit'....Hmm...

Archtype: [Insert Name]
Primary: Armor
Secondary: Blasts
Epics: Some control and melee attacks
Inherent: Buster Shot, a passive that boosts range and attack strength while 'Brace for Fire' is unsuppressed. Adds a massive taunt to sniper attacks and makes them uninterruptible.

Primary Armor would be straight forward and on level with Brute but with HP of Scrapper.

Epics would basically be a version of the melee pools but with the ranged powers replaced by melee powers.

The secondary...would be different. On par with a Tanker's melee attacks. The control power (the stun/hold/etc) of each set would be replaced by Confront, a ST auto-hit taunt that has longer range. The Snipe would be upgraded to do heftier damage, taunt in a wide range when used from ranged and be uninterruptible when one has 'braced themselves' for the shot.

Sets without snipes will have a power altered into one (Ice Blast and Sonic would probably lose control powers for it).

Aim is replaced by 'Brace for Fire', a unique taunt aura toggle that works similar to Fury in that, when you turn it on and *stay still* for a time (the bar will fill up when you stop moving near the ground), the toggle will grant you extra range on your attacks and add 'Buster Shot' damage (a static amount of extra damage, like a proc) to all your ranged attacks. However, once a foe get within melee range (15ish feet) your aura will catch them and the majority of your range is suppressed except your snipe, which will be unable to be interrupted if you have braced yourself.

So a hypothetical blast set would be....

Radiation Blast:
1. Neutrino Bolt (ranged minor energy dmg, -def, *special* +range, Buster Shot proc)the range of pretty much all the attacks, with a foe in melee range is 30-45ft. with no foes nearby, it is regular distance
2. X-ray Beam Eyes (ranged moderate energy dmg, -def, *special +range, Buster Shot proc)
3. Irradiate (PBAoE moderate energy dmg, -def, *special* Buster Shot proc)
4. Electron Haze (Cone energy dmg, -def, knockback, *special* +range, Buster Shot proc)
5. Confront (ST long ranged taunt)
6. Brace for Fire [replaces Aim](self toggle, +ToHit, improves Buster Shot proc, PBAoE taunt)
before one gets this power, the AT will have very short range all the time and the Buster Shot proc will fire randomly and at a lower frequency. With this power, a 'fury bar' fills up when you stop moving until full, then a 'Braced to Fire' status is gained which boosts range when no foes are nearby, Buster Shot improves in frequency and snipes become uninterruptible. If you move from the first location you braced yourself at, the bar goes down relative to the distance. Nudge yourself left, right or forward a dozen feet and the bar only goes down a little and will quickly refill the instant you stop moving. Bust out into a full Super Speed sprint or TP 200+ ft to another spot and the bar bottoms out.

you could actually skip this power if you were fine with the shorter range, didn't feel like dealing with the 'have to stand still a moment' mechanic or don't like using snipes.
7. Proton Volley (Sniper, Extreme energy damage, -def, AoE taunt, *special* +range, Buster Shot proc)
8. Neutron Bomb (Ranged TAoE, moderate energy dmg, -def, *special* +range, Buster Shot proc)
9. ???

Firstly, ATs and powersets are created/balanced with SOs in mind, not what it can be made to do with IOs. Secondly, if VEATs were the answer, tell me how I make one with dual pistols or a bow and arrow. Thirdly, making a character survivable doesn't equate to an armor set because armor sets provide a different experience from not only armor set to armor set but from AT to AT...but you wouldn't know that would you? Because you only ever IO to softcap and play with high-end IOed bonuses piled on top. Newsflash, practically everyone plays the same because practically everyone can softcap. Just because one does that when they play doesn't everyone does and just goes to show you've lost the experience of playing the Armor sets themselves.

All this is is made up assumptions and conjecture. Not only that, but this argument, *on it's face*, is contradicted by yours and other's arguments made against the idea.

A Blast/Armor AT is overpowered? Is a Tankmage? Is redundant?

-IO builds were pointed out with high-end defense/regen bonuses.

To achieve high survival isn't some new trick to this game. If it's overpowered, then IOs are overpowered. If achieving high amounts of survival while shooting at range were beyond the balanced limits, then the argument falls flat because *everyone* can do this. This doesn't mean armor sets are replaced by this, or claimed redundant. Because, if it were, no one would make scrappers or brutes anymore. They'd all make corruptors and controllers or trap MMs.

If you want to continue to imply the proposed AT is overpowered, all you have to do is explain why people still play Brutes, Tankers, Stalkers and Scrappers *AT LARGE* vs other ATs. If IOs do not substitute armor sets for the other ATs it does not for the suggested one either.

-Tankmage is what this idea is?

First of all, the 'definition' of tankmage is a character who is very survivable and can shoot at people from range. That definition is useless and can be tossed in the trash (see above counter + the fact that MMs are exactly the same out of the box).

The abridged definition of Tankmage is a character that can do multiple aspects of gameplay (or all types) very well, basically replacing a 'mage' and a 'tank' at the same time. I can tell you right now, a damage capped Tanker does not replace a controller, blaster or defender/corruptor nor does a defense/resist capped Blaster. The *only* capabilities an Blast/Armor AT can achieve is high survival and killing foes without needing to be in close range...which isn't functionally different from what a Tanker or Brute can do: survive and kill things.

So, no, the AT isn't really a Tankmage because it has no high amounts of controls or debuffs or pets or team buffs (i.e. it can't do a whole bunch of other ATs' jobs). And no, the other definition of tankmage is pointless and invalidated by your own stance (if you decide to bring up IOs or VEATs).

-This idea is redundant because it can already be done with various ATs and power combos?


Okay, as long as you admit that, the only real counter to the idea can stand without being knocked over by a silent fart.

So I can make a Traps character or a Time Manipulation character or a VEAT or HEAT to simulate various armor type characters that also shoot at range? Great. If that can be considered balanced, then the statements of the idea being a Tankmage or overpowered is completely tossed out the window.

The only problem with the suggested work-arounds is concept. I can 'simulate' regen or super reflexes with Time Manipulation or Traps, but what about Invulnerability? Or Stone Armor? Or hell, Ninjutsu? Shield Defense? So on and so forth. Not only that, but the actual character concepts too. Just because I can make a defender with only melee attacks (from pools and epics), doesn't mean it'll be a very good stand-in and should be skipped. Many players have concepts for characters that use armor and shoot and your stand-ins are only half-*****.

You have no idea what you're talking about.

Some people want a viable self-contained Super Reflexes character who uses two pistols or a power armor character that shoot beams out of their hands. Some try with the work-arounds, like making a melee with the power mastery pool or high-end blaster builds or whatever, but if the idea keeps cropping up, apparently those work-arounds indeed are half-***** and do not successfully fulfill the theme correctly.

Either you're too full of yourself to realize this or you have no imagination. That said, although I support the idea for such an AT because it can provide new and unique tactics/playstyles, it wouldn't be something I'd personally play. I'm still seeking my melee/(de)buff character concept. There are so many ways you can make such a combination work well and the ranged/armor AT really is no different.

You, and others suggesting work arounds, are being intentionally obtuse.

Okay, so what if someone wants to make a character that uses 2 pistols, can regenerate super fast and cannot be 'killed'? You know what experience matches that to a T? Dual Pistols/Regeneration or Willpower. Want to know what is just a cheap substitute? DP/Energy blast with +regen IO bonuses and Rise of the Phoenix from epic pools. Or Empathy/Pain Domination + Dual Pistols and Soul Transfer.

What if someone wants a character that shoots ice powers but also covers their body in stone/granite? Or a character that shoots fire and carries a shield? Or fires arrows and covered in flames?

It's nice to build work-arounds to fulfill a concept that is otherwise impossible, but that's not what this thread is for, now is it?

I find it rather interesting that against my proposition of making the game more meaningful and 'game-like' the word 'grind' is used.

Are the trials not fun enough that it has to be viewed as 'work'? What does one do these trials for anyway? To get power by blasting hoards of foes to kingdom come? Then what do you do with that power? Blast more hoards to kingdom come? Am I missing something or is this circular logic contradicting someone?

Even if it took 10,000 iTrial runs to unlock max tiers with a character, how is it any different from playing any other part of the game, with or without the shiny new powers?...I guess I'm just failing to see how one could consider it grinding for these powers when all the powers do is let you grind more. Grind is grind, no matter what flavor you sprinkle on it. One just trivializes more content faster than the other. *shrugs*

But I think UberGuy gets what I'm saying even if he doesn't agree with it. The way I see it: Incarnates trivialize content (to what extent depends on who you ask) and it is because Incarnates are so common. It doesn't take a genius to figure out why they are common and a sought after tactic. All I'm saying is if the devs took measures in the first place to moderate incarnate progression (and limit choices) then the problem of trivialized content wouldn't be so common or at least had the time to bleed through the game like IOs and slowly alter the player standards.

But that's all in the past. What could be done to fix the issue know I don't know nor do I care.

What about the thought makes it 'better'? Well, it might not be a QoL improvement to make the game 'better' or 'more desired' but the idea would make the game more 'game-like' and leave the player feeling accomplished or keeping goals/aspirations open to achieve vs what you get now.

You see, the customer *thinks* they know what they want but ultimately, on average, the customer is clueless. I bet you simply love to get all them shinies in your pocket as quickly as you can just as much as you'd love the inevitable wait required for more shines to be pumped out for you to grab. Right, that's the part you forget....that wait you had to do to finally get that lvl cap raise to 50...that wait to get *any* new content for that range...that wait for the incarnate stuff to debut and that wait for each part to be added to.

But then the direction of the game itself isn't particularly in line with my desires (but then that's to be expected). It's no surprise really. Things just get easier, requires less thinking/planning, requires fewer choices, more is simply handed to you and to get any sort of real challenge from the game I'm expected to either gimp myself or just increase the number of foes.

The game doesn't make me feel much more super, just the foes more incompetent as they are mowed down by steamroller teams...which is all right. It honestly started weening me off the game for its creative freedom...I love the character creator and the powers, but I can design my own characters in my head and on paper now and make even *better* powers for them. And since they are usually in conflict with each other (in stories I write) their foes will never feel incompetent.

That kind of presents another interesting idea for a wrinkle in the game...a good wrinkle, hopefully.

Where you have the alignment track we have now (Hero/Vigilante/Villain/Rogue) but also a level of 'code' or 'moral' (Lawful<>Zealot/Neutral<>Unlawful).

What your 'moral code' would change in-game? I haven't the slightest

But it should be hard to change this...maybe only something you can change through completing *real* story arcs and making choices.

Maybe it could affect NPC dialog and dialog choices would be a no-brainer (your lawful guys are going to be focused on retaining a balance while zealots will be focused on upholding their ideals, neutrals won't care and do what they do while unlawfuls will disrupt balance even if it foils themselves)...maybe change your character name/title color? But it should be possible to be a Lawful Villain (so you're working for corrupt organization...you retain your place and don't rock the boat) or an Unlawful Hero (*kicks pebble over cliff which escalates into a landslide* NEVER FEAR! I'LL SAVE YOU, HAPLESS CITIZEN!). It'd be interesting if it even affected the missions but that's most likely too advanced for our greying comic game.

For those still not wrapping your head around the OP, I think he's suggesting a means of side-stepping the 'end' alignments...like instead of going Hero > Vigilante > Villain > Rogue, he's implying jumping right from Hero to Rogue by becoming a Zealot (or that Zealot would technically be a Rogue). I dunno, still a bit confused...

Agreed.

All this talk about inherent power mess...it's just that, messy. And it just homogenizes builds even more. For most of my characters, I always try to take different pool powers in conjunction with different primary/secondary combinations. Well that ended long ago. So I had to move on to different *combos* of pools...leadership + medicine here, teleport + fighting there...I'm probably close to running out of combos...(and when I say combos of power pools, taking just 1 of a pool doesn't count. Usually 3+ counts as 'getting the pool').

We don't need more inherent powers. We need more power pool choices.

I'd go the other way with that suggestion:

First: 'Take back' inherent Fitness. Wait a minute, hear me out...You have to keep reading...

Second: At character creation/respec, you can choose any of the pools as an inherent pool, including Fitness. So that means, there's no reason to respect your already-respected-into-inherent-fitness toons unless you don't want inherent fitness. But now you get the choice to have something 'thematic' as your inherent ability and pick and choose from the remaining pools later...

Thirdly: Give the choosen inherent pool *bonus* effects/capabilities. So that, whichever you choose, it wouldn't need as many slots to be effective and/or could be your builds focus to sink more slots into if you so wish to emphasize that above what current pool options provide.

Inherent Teleportation may have faster activating Recall/TP foe without the interrupt and higher mag tp. Inherent Super Speed might have Hasten grant a minor PBAoE +rech buff to allies, make flurry into a cone and cheaper Burnout. Inherent Presence might have longer duration/higher mag fear and auto-hit taunts. Inherent Leadership might cost less endurance and have increased debuff/mez resist numbers + wider range. So on and so forth.

You should really have to *think* about what route you wanted to go, be able to sacrifice some aspect of a build for bonuses elsewhere, differentiate your build from others. I should have to think long and hard if I want my Spines/DA stalker to have better teleports inherently and make due with the ST fear in presence, or grab all those juicy stacked fears and settle with recall friend/teleport (and for everyone else, having your freebie fitness or dumping that for inherent flight or something).

Then the question should really be 'Why not be a Stalker?'

Because, then, we can actually give you the answers you're looking for...

You don't like the Hide mechanic? Okay, then Stalkers may not be for you although I hear some players downplay that part of the AT and simply use it for the free crit at the start and view it as a bonus.

You don't like AS? It's an acquired tasted. All my Stalkers use AS, some more than others and most of them in alternate action order. Some skip AS completely. It's only really gimping yourself if you have a use for an initial burst of damage that you have no trouble timing or aren't particularly attuned with sustained DPS.

They lack AoE? There are sets that do not and work arounds to get more AoE. Elec Melee, Kinetic Melee, Dual Blades, Spines, SJ has some, Spring attack, epic pools, judgement. Yes, some sets lack any AoE and others are deficient, but that's just those sets, not the AT itself.

Low survival? If a blaster can be made survivable, so can a stalker. Some sets are less reliant on outside bonuses to achieve comfortable survival, but the AT in general encompasses planning so that you don't *need* to be able to survive a lot of damage. Just seek means to kill foes before they can even react. And it may seem blasphemous but, in a situation where a Scrapper would jump in and have a 50% chance of coming out dead, a Stalker can decide to lower that chance through hit-and-run. That is, you're only in as much danger as you let yourself be put in...

Low DPS? Again, some sets just aren't great for this. Elec, Spines, sets like these are generally slow and lack high-end DPS but that doesn't exclude sets like MA, DM, SJ, Kat...just like Brutes and Scrappers, some sets are just going to shine differently than others. It's up to you to play up the sets' strengths or cover over the sets' weaknesses.

The only other reasons I could think of to not be a Stalker is some sort of inferiority complex. When you stand next to a Tanker, you'll feel squishier. When you stand next to a Brute, you'll feel like you lack AoE. When you stand next to a Corruptor, you'll feel your team contributions are crud.

But all that is 'feelings' and just superficial. It doesn't tell the whole story and it's uninformed but it seems to be the only point of interest you want to hit on. Wasting your time? How can you be 'wasting your time' anymore than you are sitting at a computer playing a video game? You could be at the gym, studying, feeding the hungry or curing cancer. By default, you're wasting your time. And you're wasting even more of your time asking us if playing a stalker is wasting your time. You could have already leveled it to 50 and found out yourself in the time it'd take you to get the answers you seek.