Hydrophidian
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Posts
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Quote:AH - HAHAHAHAHAHA!
This mission gives you access to the power level of the games signature hero and villain.
Yah. That'll happen.
NOT!
But it's not.Quote:It's quite literally a path to godhood. It should be harder.
And I think you're VASTLY over-estimating what we'll get out of these slots.
I mean, you're talking about effectively a whole new game being built atop this one.
I really doubt we're headed that way.
But it doesn't. Why is that, you think? It's not just to vex you, I'm pretty sure.Quote:It should require you to do every mission instead of being able to auto-complete.
You would've made it that way. Honestly, I would've made it that way. But it's not that way, and there's a reason for that.
We are not the measure.
Whoah, Nelly. Stop. Go back. Read again.Quote:But in any event, it shouldn't see any changes to make it even slightly easier or as you would call it "less cheap."
I've not stated that it should be made easier, slightly or otherwise.
I've stated that I didn't find it particularly challenging, and the one part of it that could be called "difficult" was 1. easily dealt with by taking standard steps, 2. was an uninspired stunt we've seen 100 times before. I.E.: cheap.
So:
If it was supposed to be just an introductory arc, very personal, warning you of what's to come... soloable by anyone not in a coma... that's what it should've been.
If it was supposed to be an EXTREME CHALLENGE that curled the shorthairs of even the most grizzled 6 yr. vet... that's what it should've been.
As it stands now, it is neither. Maybe it's trying to be both, and failing. Or maybe it was just a slapdash job, thrown together at the last minute. I think that's more likely, actually.
In any case, I don't think it measures up. It does not *sell* the system at all.
It's just... there.
Which I think is bad, as this system is supposed to be all that and a bag of chips for the foreseeable future. Let's face it. A lot of players just aren't being engaged by this. That's a problem. And this arc... it ain't helping.
Then it seems, based on your own apparent preferences, the arc's a failure... right?Quote:It's doable by any build with SOs. -
Quote:I don't really care what you've done it with. That's you. You've been playing this game forever, much as I have. I doubt either of us are representative of the majority of the players on this game.Originally Posted by EvilGeko
I've done it with
There are perfectly acceptable builds that have--and will continue to have--issues with those EBs. The question I ask is: why are those mobs there? Nothing else in the arc presents that sort of issue. They stick out like a sore thumb.
If the "challenge" level were consistent throughout the arc, that'd be a different story. But it's not. The rest of the arc is pretty much standard fare. A little bit too standard, if you ask me.
I mean, Council are a "challenge"? Seriously?
1. That has nothing to do with what makes it cheap. At least, not in my estimation. What makes it cheap is that it's a tired stunt that's being passed off as a "challenge". Anybody who's been playing this game long enough isn't "challenged" by a fat bag of hitpoints. They just take longer to put down. That's not "challenge", that's "tedium".Quote:Just because it didn't immediately roll over like 99% of the rest of the content in the game doesn't make it cheap.
I mean, hey, if you're doing it with an SOed Emp/Rad or whatever, how "challenging" can it be, really?
2. The whole arc can most certainly be "rolled over like 99% of the game", because it's just like "99% of the game." That's one of my criticisms about it. As far as I can see, there is one scenario in one mission that is the possible exception for some builds/players. That's an inconsistency that doesn't look "challenging" to me, it just looks lazy.
3. The mission in question has what I'd call a serious design flaw that will hose people just because of the system they're using.
I understand that there are super-uber-players that can complete this mission with training enhancements and Boxing. Good for them, congratulations, we're all very impressed.
However, it's irrelevant, because I don't think those of us who know the game inside and out are the measure by which this, or any, content should be weighed. -
Quote:Howabout: not all squishies are created equal?Originally Posted by DarkGob
Clearly you're not "forced" to team as a squishy since many squishies have completed the mission on their own. What conclusion do you suppose one should draw from this?
I can see some squishy set combos having a real hard--perhaps insurmountable--time with Honoree and possibly Holtz.
See, here's one of the problems. Some ATs don't dish out all that much damage.Quote:The way I finally ended up defeating the Honoree (once I had killed everything else in the room) was to dogfight him in the air with Hover, keeping my distance as much as I could. This meant that I couldn't use some of my most damaging attacks, but it also kept him from doing very much damage -- he certainly couldn't hit me with Total Focus.
I could've approached Honoree the way you did. But it would've taken forever. No fun. Holtz was no threat to me at all... but whittling her down got old real fast. I did not relish the thought of having to repeat that with Honoree (who was more dangerous to me on top of it). Plinking him a few times was enough to indicate how much of a footslog it'd be 'dogfighting' him.
My solution? I just went and got a Vanguard Heavy. Problem solved.
You don't have to involve the portals at all, really. The EBs pull just fine.Quote:Hit the portals first so you aren't swarmed by Rikti
No, it's just a drag.Quote:Fortunately death is not the end in this game
The most fun I had with this mission was, after dealing with the EBs, I waded into the ocean of Rikti with the Heavy. Cleared the whole thing.
Second time in, me and the person I was teamed with stacked Confuse on Holtz. She then did all the work. Blew up the portals, most of the RIkti, and wrecked Honoree.
That was amusing.
But not a particularly new tactic for a scenario that also wasn't all that new. -
I see "challenging" and "difficult" being thrown around about this arc.
I didn't find it challenging. I didn't find it difficult. I found it tedious, a bit frustrating, heavy-handed, and poorly designed.
Mission 1: cute, novel, will be "stealthed" by most people after their first or second pass, I bet. Nice map. Eye candy, basically.
Mission 2: Two ways to "solve" it, that I came up with. What should've been the neat solution turned out to be a tedious, aggravating experience, which I blame on design. The boring solution worked well enough, but was, well... boring. The entire map can be bypassed with stealth.
Mission 3: Nothing challenging here. One opponent, in terms of power level, was simply way outside the scope of the rest of the arc. Again, that's not "difficult". It's just lazy design, uninteresting, and easily countered with a temp power and/or a serious inspiration load-out... which I'd rather not resort to, but there it is. Point is, that's not really a challenge.
One particularly bad thing about this mission is the portals. They don't appear to stop spewing mobs. That's something that can choke lesser systems, and cause game-affecting lag in better ones. Again, poor design. Real poor. Personally, I didn't notice too much of a drop in performance, but my system's fairly new and spiffy. When I helped a friend, though, their game was reduced to a slide show. And yes, that was while being well outside the room. "Lots" of mobs would've gotten the message across well enough. Making them endless was unnecessary, thoughtless and, dare I say it, amateurish. This really should be fixed.
Mission 4: Nothing challenging here, particularly the fella at the end, so it was quite anti-climactic. Pretty effect on the last room, though.
I went into this arc expecting something interesting. What I got was radio mission drudgery peppered with a few cheap stunts. In my opinion, this arc doesn't hold a candle to the Praetorian content... or much of anything else that's come out since Ernesto Hess. Not in terms of quality and certainly not in terms of challenge.
I mean, c'mon. A big, fat, overpowered mob you have to pull out all the stops to put down? Yah, we haven't seen that a hundred times before.
And this is a glimpse into the future of CoH? Really?
Also, this arc has a very personal delivery. I can't blame anyone for expecting to be able to solo it, because it's implicit in the presentation that it's a solo adventure. Frankly, given the impact on the character, it should be a solo adventure. And the sad thing is, it pretty much can be... except for this one odd spike in "difficulty" embodied by one single opponent, who's apparently only in there to make the arc "a challenge".
Off the top of my head, I can think of a half dozen ways in which this arc could've been made genuinely challenging. As just one example, with the use of 'echoes', very scary mob combinations could've been devised. We all know which enemy types cause the most problems. Why not put them in one group?
It also would've been nice if there had been something in the 3rd mission that could've been used to weaken the Big Bad. Something that, if you wanted to employ it, you had to lead him to it. That would've been a tricky thing, but probably fun. And it would've given the non-damage oriented characters a different option from the same ol' same old ('get a team', 'get inspirations', 'get a temp power').
Anyways, I'm sorry, but I have to agree with the OP's chosen word for this arc: Awful. And a lot of the excuses getting rolled out to defend it aren't cuttin' it with me. It's just bad... and so below the bar when compared to anything in GR.
I think this arc is a very, very poor introduction to a system that's allegedly going to command a lot of developer attention in the coming months. Sadly, seeing as it took six years to revamp the Positron TF, I assume we're stuck with this embarrassment... but I believe it'd be a good idea to retool it ASAP if at all possible.
Ultimately, though, I'd say the same thing about the whole of the Incarnate system, so I guess it doesn't matter.
Mood: disappointed. -
Quote:The suggestions you've made, Infernus, aren't all that different from ones I made for the Arena, back before MA came about. You take it further than I ever did, but the basic idea is the same.Originally Posted by Infernus_Hades
I will go a step farther.
Let's say the Devs had made the AE instead of a farm implement as it became - a PvP map inventor and with customizable bots and the ability to limit or change how powers act?
With the Bots you still would have PvE play possible.
I saw AE and the first thing I said to myself was what if we had this for PvP? I love this game and after 6+ years I am still passionate for it to reach the promise of what it could become.
What if we didn't nerf scrappers? I mean in many FPS games you have heavy hitters - Chaingun guy in TFC. Guess what? If I can change how the powers interact in PvP made maps - I make scrappers weak against elemental damage. Fire/Ice/Earth/Gravity/Storm and now he has a hole in his armor. So just like every FPS game out there a balance occurs.
Ever play left for dead? Multiplayer where one side is Zombie specials and the other side is survivors - all have serious advantages if played well and disadvantages if your opponent reacts quickly. You pawn as the huge tank guy - well bullets don't hurt you much - but fire does
I firmly believe the only resources the Devs need expend is to give US the tools.
I think it'd work. It'd effectively be a separate game, an experience distinct from everything else, and I've come to believe that's an essential for success. It'd also allow for people to do their own thing, which I think is critical.
I've played (and play) many of the game you've mentioned. But an important difference between you and I is that I'm not "hardcore" about PVP, never have been, and likely never will be. I do enjoy it though, and the whole modding thing is a serious, serious temptation for me (one I've managed to resist so far... oh, the time I could waste).
If there was anything like you've described in this game, I'd be active in the PVP community. Would I be involved in the whole ladder thing and all that? No. That holds no appeal for me. But I'd be making maps and such. I'd also be PVPing casually with like-minded folks, just like I do now with a couple of those aforementioned games.
If players are empowered to do their own thing, it promotes sub-communities, which can't help but expand the community as a whole. As I see it, part of the problem with PVP in this game (and in other MMOs) is that its focus is too narrow, the requirements for involvement too specific. I think they tried to address that in I13, but the approach didn't work.
Anywho, I'm rambling now. Bottom line, I'd say the type of stuff you're bringing up is what they should be looking at for the future. I doubt we'll see anything like it in the present incarnation of the game. It'd be a massive undertaking, and who knows if the engine they have would even support it. But I like to think there'll be a CoH2 someday, and I hope lessons learned here will be applied to its fundamental design.
PVP doesn't need to be integrated into the larger game. It can be separate. It probably should be separate. I don't think anyone's tried that yet. Maybe Paragon Studios should be the first to do so. -
Quote:I think something radical like this would have to be done for PVP to actually thrive in an MMO environment.Originally Posted by Infernus_Hades
I would rather have the Arena like the AE where WE get to set the power-style, create the maps and basically let us PvP how we would like to.
That would be a HUGE addition. Have you ever seen how many player made maps you get in Halflife, Left for dead, Soldier of Fortune and every single FPS out there!
Let us do PvP for you Devs. Only spend the money necessary to give us the tools and let us craft the maps and game play.
From a design perspective, I find the whole PVP problem pretty interesting.
I've come to believe that MMO and PVP aren't all that compatible. In several ways, they work at cross purposes. As just one example:
PVP: typically no investment in your character
MMO: typically built around (and dependent on) investment in your character
There have been successes in combining the design goals, but, from what I've seen so far, only at the serious expense of one set of them. To my knowledge, a happy balance has yet to be achieved.
CoH is, at its heart, not a PVP game. I'm inclined to say that trying to shoehorn PVP into it may have been the big, and unresolvable, mistake. If PVP is to be a part of CoH, should it stand apart as its own thing, maybe as a separate, but connected, game? I don't know.
But the above suggestion seems like it'd approximate that dynamic. -
Fantasy Faire is today!
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This would be great news, were it not for the fact that, for me and many others, the new UI has made the market unbearable to use.
Still, even if I'm effectively shut out of this aspect of the game (one I used to enjoy, sadly), I think it's a step in the right direction. -
This is absurd.
I can't even use the market casually now. I am routinely running into a situation where I can't post anything.
And judging by shrinking supplies, I'm guessing I'm not the only one experiencing this.
This thing needs to burn in fire. -
So, is anyone starting to see a negative impact on the markets yet?
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"WE MAKE HOLES IN TEETH!"
If I am a winner, I permit NC Interactive, Inc. and NCsoft Europe Limited to use my name, likeness, photograph, hometown, and any comments that I may make about myself or this contest that I provide for advertising and promotional activities. I also certify that I am at least 13 years of age and am eligible to participate in this contest. -
I said it when I first encountered the UI in beta, and I'll say it again now:
My impression is, the market UI was redesigned by someone who had no actual experience with the feature they were redesigning.
This is not the first time I've had this impression (I'm actually starting to think it's a serious flaw in the development process), but it's the worst example of it so far.
This UI effectively removes what had become a major draw of the game for me. I want nothing to do with it.
The developers did try to accommodate many player suggestions in beta, and I appreciate that, but there was only so much lipstick you could put on that pig.
I still believe the new UI needs to be scrapped. It's a failure. Roll back to the old one and try again.
And no, before someone implies it, this has nothing to do with fear of change or anything like that. It has everything to do with disliking poor design and actually losing functionality with this new version. -
Savage event starts today, 4PM EST! Tune in!
On our forums: the final round of Clash of the Catgirls! Black Cat (Marvel Comics) vs. Henrietta Pussycat (Mister Rogers)!
Who shall prevail?! Poll ends tonight! -
Last call for arcs here (event's tomorrow).
Thank to those who replied! -
After some thought about it, I think this was a good idea.
I may not have gone as low as 20... but I wouldn't have gone any higher than 32, and probably would've favored 25.
Thing is, these ATs are a draw, and the name of the game these days is: retention. If making these ATs more accessible keeps more people playing, then that's great. I can personally attest to the allure of the VEATs. I love playing mine. A lot. More people getting to experience these ATs will no doubt be a positive influence on activity levels.
And it's a good point that making them more widely available might up the priority of them getting some dev attention. I think the HEATs could use some.
The achievement factor of unlocking these Archetypes isn't something to casually disregard. This is a game, after all, so achievement and reward are part of the draw.
But we now have IOs and the upcoming end game content and incarnate levels, which, to me, are (and will be) far more significant than unlocking a prestige AT (which really isn't that hard to do these days).
So, in the end, as far as I can see, this is a net plus. -
Quote:It was much worse in beta. They did a lot to improve it.Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
To be honest, the Market interface is now a lot more fat, and I regret not working with it in Beta now. Guess that goes to show why I don't get invited to regular Betas.
But I find its fundamental design to be poor, so, from my perspective, there was only so much lipstick they could slap on that pig.
While I'll still use the market, my marketeer days are over. With the introduction of this UI, the market aspect of the game has ceased being a draw for me.
Which is a shame, 'cuz it was a rather significant draw. -
Quote:For me, sound is a very important part of the experience. But so far, I've found the audio changes to be a mixed bag. While I love the new ambient aural effects, I think they're laid on a little too thick (for example, the constant beeping of a car horn when I'm in Wentworth's is totally immersive in that it gets just as grating as it would IRLOriginally Posted by bAss_ackwards
Ah ha! We finally get a name to attach to "The Sound Guy"! Tell that man he is doing an excellent job and I really appreciate the work he put into making the world that much more immersive! That, and he should get a raise.
).
I don't care for the new Fly sound. I find it too intrusive and distracting. The 'hup' sound my characters make when they jump is now sometimes distorted. Many of the footfalls sound a bit off (and aren't in synch with my character's running anymore)... all of this pulls me out of the experience rather than drawing me in, and is a step back rather than a step forward.
However, I do think the general development direction is the right one. I just hope there's some refinement coming (and some old issues addressed... like the fact that, in Cimerora, when walking on the "sidewalks", it still sounds like you're walking on a wooden surface rather than stone).
On a related note (and getting back on topic), my favorite part of this issue has to be the new power sets (even though I've already had DP for a little bit). Specifically, their visual and audio design. Truly inspired.
Anyways, please forgive the rambling, but if you glance at my sig, it might become clear why audio is something I'm particularly vested in.
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The Cape Radio, an online, player-run radio station dedicated to the Virtue server, is holding an event on the 1st of May called: SAVAGE.
Event Thread
We'd like to have some appropriately-styled AE arcs to point our listeners to for the event. If you have any recommendations, please post them here!
Also, if you'd like to be around during the event to host runs thru one of your own arcs, please let me know!
Thanks! -
Freshly added to the Savage event forum:
Costume Design Contest: Your Character's Spirit Animal
and...
The Savage Haiku Contest
Also added: the first round of the Clash of the Catgirls polls!
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Quote:It's actually not that easily avoided. Though that has more to do with a lousy search system than anything else.Originally Posted by Captain_Freak
So your friend rage-quit over something thats easily avoided?
"Rage-quit" is an (unflattering) assumption.
Sadly, the friend in question is probably just going to have to cancel her account again, because the farming isn't going anywhere (like it didn't go anywhere after the critter nerfs).
As far as I can see, this "fix" is more about a culling of the farmer pool. It's not about stopping the farming, it's about making it more difficult to accomplish, thereby eliminating "casual" farmers from the equation.
Hardcore farmers won't be fazed by it at all. -
Quote:The MA system was "truly designed" to be part of the game experience, a leveling alternative, a source of content. That was the design intent, and the entire model is informed by that intent.Originally Posted by Beef_Cake
Eliminate the XP and the farmers will leave the AE system and do other things, like farming regular missions again. That way all the RPers and such can enjoy the AE system for what it was truly designed for.
If XP is eliminated, it will no longer be what it was designed for. If XP is eliminated, the whole thing should be redesigned, because that's a different model with different priorities.
And it would not be, I might add, a model that caters to roleplayers. It would only be catering to a very small subset who (mistakenly) believe that game is somehow directly opposed to roleplay/story. That's a terribly small demographic for such a large investment. -
Quote:I've been more than patient.Originally Posted by Clave_Dark_5
Just be patient
When/if the system ever actually meets its design criteria, I'll come back to it. -
I stopped making arcs for general audiences after the critter nerfs in I16.
I will now stop using the MA system entirely, except as an occasional storytelling tool or if I need a few tickets for a piece of salvage.
AE has been dropped as a viable option for SG nights, even for the 50s.
My one published arc will get pulled sometime after the weekend. When factoring in all the nerfs, I can't imagine it gives much reward at all.
I've lost all hope for MA. What really should be my favorite feature of the game is now something I'm barely going to touch. I think the development team has grossly, grossly mishandled it. I'm very disappointed and sad. -
Quote:We had a lot of fun with it, WN, thanks for creating it. It was pretty much spot on in terms of what we were looking for.Originally Posted by Wrong_Number
I wanted to thank your team for playing The Golden Age Secret of the Paragon Society. I appreciate the feedback and was very happy that you all enjoyed it.
Sadly, however, due to the latest "fix" to MA, it's very unlikely we'll be playing any more arcs. If we're going to get next to nothing for the effort, we might as well stick to the arcs we make for ourselves, designed specifically for our own characters and SGs (and the rare event).
Sorry, folks.
I'll still poke in this forum for appropriately-themed arcs when The Cape has an event going on (we got one coming up soon), but as far as general play goes, I'm completely done with AE. -
Quote:I mean stuff like...Originally Posted by Mirror_Man
- Stuff the "A List" heroes might consider "beneath their pay grade" I'm... not entirely sure what you mean by this. If you mean high-level heroes stopping muggings in the street, rescuing cats from trees, etc., there's really none of that in these arcs. I supposed you could say "investigating one of the many dimensions the A-List Heroes don't have the time to investigate themselves", though
"Well, we tried to get Ms. Liberty to round up the Gutter Gang, but she got called away all a'sudden. So, we went to Mynx, and she said she had a family emergency--Grandma trippin' on acid or somethin'--but... she saw fit to mention you before high-tailin' it. Heh heh. See what I did there? Yeah.
Anyway, I figure we start with The Sludge, because we got a lead on his location. Assuming that pans out--didjya catch that? I did it again, heh heh--we can then go after Drainpipe and Doctor Septic...
...Hey, you got appropriate protective gear, right? Because I didn't requisition any..."
Or...
Are you the hero person I've been asking for? Oh, I do hope so. I do, I do! I've been calling those FBSA offices for days! Oh, thank heavens you're here, dear. You see...
*whisper* There are monsters in my attic. *whisper*
Oh, yes, I've had the police over. But they never find anything! So, clearly, the creatures can turn invisible! Oh, they have my poor Miss Muffincakes in such a state! Oh! Come out, Muffywuffy and meet the nice hero people!
...
You see? She won't come out! She's so afraid! It's dreadful!
You'll get rid of those creatures for us, won't you? Oh, of course you will! I'll put the kettle on for tea...
...stuff like that. And then if such dubious beginnings lead into genuinely serious threats, all the better.