Dechs Kaison
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Quote:Would you like to offer specific counter points and try a respectable debate, then?Originally Posted by Grae Knight
Don't completely agree with the quote you posted. -
Still no. Also, suggestion forums are that-a-way, where you will find hundreds of copies of this suggestion.
Quote:Originally Posted by Memphis_Bill
Why a full respec is not a good idea for COH.
So, you've played your Apathy/Dual Wet Noodle Tank to 50 and decided you don't like him. You've come to the forums and said "Why not let me completely respec the character!"
Well, people consider a "full respec" to be different things. I'm going to cover a complete and total character respec. If some of them don't apply, well, this comes up enough for this to be a copy and paste reply.
There are four things that the developers and game see as defining your character:
1. Archetype
2. Origin
3. Primary powerset
4. Secondary powerset
When people talk about a full respec, they're either talking about the powersets or the whole enchilada.
A Respec is short for respecification - altering what your character can do. This can be through reordering the levels you took powers, reassigning slots, and/or changing power pools. You'll note that none of this touches on changing the four listed items. The reason being that if any of those change, it's not the same character. A respec is not recreation or reimagining. It's tweaking your character a bit.
Now, let's go through some of these "full respecs."
Primary/Secondary
You're sure to hear this repeated a good bit - Just because you've played one set, doesn't mean you know how to play them all.
For instance, my namesake tank is a Fire/Superstrength tank. I know how he plays. The most similar powerset to him at the time of writing is Dark Armor. It's resistance based, it has no knockback protection, it has a damage aura, a self heal that does damage - it even has a self rez as its tier9.
They don't play anything alike. (I can say this, because I also have a version that's DA/SS.) Fire has no Psi protection. It has no stealth. Burn has a far different effect than Oppressive Gloom, and nothing similar to Cloak of Fear. It calls for a thoroughly different style of play. With Fire, I can leave my toggles on and go to town. With Dark Armor, I have to be selective, or the times I have to herd stragglers (for instance) won't work exceptionally well. Dark Armor also does not have anything like Consume to help out with Endurance - that's in Dark Melee.
With "similar" sets being that different - try Fire vs Stone. Or Invulnerability. You now have a set at or near 50 (when most people seem to mention wanting this - "I have a 50 that...") that you don't know how to slot effectively (which means you'll be doing *at least* one more respec) and don't know how to play effectively.
That's just changing *one* side of the equation. Now add in, say, going from Stone Melee to Dark Melee. Different effects, with *very* different affects on your survivability. And you won't know how to slot that, either, or how well they synergize.
Similarly, a Stormie plays vastly differently from an Empath, or a Dark, or a Rad. Earth Control is nothing like Illusion. Combo-chasing with Dual Blades won't help you with Martial Arts.
How do I know that this ends up being a mess?
Beta testing. The devs have, on rare occasion, bumped up characters to specific levels. The most notable was when Recluse's Victory came out for testing. Everyone was made level 40 - and it was a *mess.* Sure, people made copies of their own characters, and those worked out. Then there were those (many, many of those) who said "Hey, I've never had a X/Y before, I'll make one of those!"
Like I said, it was a mess. You could very easily tell who had done that versus making copies of characters they knew.
Now, yes, over time you'll learn your powerset - but in the meantime, you're not going to be very effective, or very happy.
Archetype
Now, given what I just said about powersets, imagine a *whole different AT.* Your tank is now an Empath? Really? You know how to survive as a Blaster because you played a Scrapper? And don't even get me started on epics.
If *sets* are that different, Archetype is that times ten.
Impact on enhancements
IOs are a big part of the game right now. Think about IO'ing out your character. You get your KB protection, sets and the like, potentially spending millions (or more) on finishing up these sets, or working on merits or whatnot.
Now, you change your primary - again, we'll take a tank - from a resistance based one to a defense based one.
Guess what is now useless to you. You *may* have a power to stick that resist set in, somewhere, but now you're defense based - and those resist sets dont' work for you any more. That Knockback set isn't taken any more. It's even worse when you say you want to switch AT - what is a Blaster going to do with a resist set? What is a Scrapper going to do with Sting of the Manticore or Malaise's Illusions?
This isn't even touching on the fact that *you could only retain ten enhancements.* That's 1 2/3 six-slotted powers.
And you'd have nobody to blame for all that lost time and INF but yourself...
Origin
Origin holds a strange place in this list. I'm just going to touch on it briefly.
Origin used to matter *vastly,* back in pre-beta. It determined how many powers you could learn and how skilled you could get with them. The system was scrapped, and for a long time it was mostly an RP item, as well as determining which enhancements you could use.
It now has *some* impact in the game with some temp powers - the "helper" power you get at level 1 (throwing knives, taser, mutagen, etc.) as well as some of the vet powers. The main impact, though, would be if you'd equipped with DOs or SOs, with the lost INF. That said, you would be able to get some of it back. Origin's probably the least of the problems with a full respec. Though some would, of course, complain that they no longer get a damage bonus or what have you - and who knows what the devs may do with this in the future.
Gameplay
There are also three other things to consider.
1. The game is designed around alts.
Seriously. If this were Guild Wars, for instance, with severely limited slots, I could see wanting to do a complete respec. But by default, you can make over 100 characters before feeling a pinch - and can purchase up to 24 additional slots per server, if you so choose. Don't like one set, make some others and try them out.
2. It's just not that hard to level.
Seriously... it's not. With half debt inside missions, patrol XP, double XP weekends, XP smoothing, XP adjustments (typically up,) debt reduction everywhere... it just *isnt'* hard to level. And levelling "honestly" means you're learning your powersets, how they work with each other and others and hopefully how to use them best - which will only make you a stronger player.
3. The devs say "no."
The devs have said no. They devs will continue to say no. The most recent "no" being the 4/2010 Q&A. So this is not just player opinion.
In closing, let me just say "No. Roll an alt." -
I think you should do Stone Armor, despite the penalties, because it's the one you don't have. You also haven't done Dark Melee, which will likely result in the ultimate survival combination.
It'll also allow you to build for pretty ridiculous things. You can go whole hog for +recharge, eliminating the Granite penalty, and not worry about endurance recovery because you'll have Dark Consumption. Damage won't be as much of an issue either, as you'll have Soul Drain. Dark Melee is heavy on the single target damage, but SD with Mud Pots will let you cook the minions while you kill bosses with your attacks. You can always build for damage bonuses too.
Just pick up Teleport, for the love of $deity. -
Quote:Thanks, Zwillinger. It's good to hear you guys appreciate what we've got here. Our community truly is an anomaly in the market. I can't say for sure why that is, but my theory is that a superhero game attracts a sort of person that wishes to be a hero. Those kind of people will be helpful by nature.Originally Posted by Zwillinger
Dechs, I really have nothing more that I could add to this post...
I've been saying it since we started preparing for this announcement, the Community of City of Heroes is our strongest selling point. For the past 7 years you've continually supported us and each other in a way that I can only refer to as inspiring. I have no doubt that we're going to be successful in pulling new players in, and the utmost confidence that the reason they're going to stick around is you guys, the awesome Community...
Look at the things this community has done, things that were started by players. A Real World Hero, our charity drive, which gained the support of the official community and development teams. The Mentor Project, which has over 150 dedicated mentors willing to give advice to anyone who comes asking. This is the kind of strong community this game has.
Indeed there is, and I don't want to downplay that at all. Let's face it, if the game wasn't fun, no amount of community would be here to form. So my hat's off and sincere thanks to the Devs for putting more than the industry standard's worth of work and love into this game. The game itself is nothing short of phenomenal.Quote:Originally Posted by Zwillinger
oh yeah and there's a bunch of other cool stuff too...
.
I cannot stress enough, though, that I would not continue to play and pay for access to this game were it not for my friends and the community. I have played games that were obscenely fun mechanically, visually stunning, but ultimately, the respective communities drove me away.
So, again, I'd like to express my thanks to everyone involved here. From development team, to community team, to the fabulous players, all of you reading this today. Thank you. You've made the past years I've spent playing this game something special. -
Quote:Faster recharging attacks like Jab do well to be slotted up with one accuracy and then all kinds of procs. The procs essentially give you more damage than damage enhancement would. Te best part is it already recharges so bloody fast you won't notice the lack of recharge.Originally Posted by BigBoss Eyepatch
I only leave my tier 1 on my tanks with one slot for an accuracy common IO. I tried 6 slotting jab, and found even 6 slotted it was most underwhelming. Had a full set of Mako's Bite in it too.
Just sayin'. -
Quote:Oh shi-Originally Posted by Microcosm
Well kudos on an interesting find. Using these actually makes it possible to cap your resists with 4 enemies instead of the standard 5.
Well, time to update the guide. -
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SONOFA... That's one MORE version of my evil sand brute I'll have to create.
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Quote:Perhaps I should have included an "Over nine THOUSAAAAAND?!" as well?Originally Posted by Mega_Jamie
You forgot the "This is Spartaaaa!" at the end.
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Quote:You know what? Maybe you're right. Maybe Dark Armor could use a buff.Originally Posted by Deus_Otiosus
And while you can claim that everyone else sucks, the truth is if it was straightforward and amazing out of the box more people would most definitely be playing it. They are not.
How about halving the endurance cost of the toggles (again) and halving the endurance cost of Dark Regeneration. That would take care of the vast majority of endurance complaints. But that's certainly not the only problem, since people complain about dying over and over with Dark Armor.
So first let's fill the knockback hole. And throw a bone to Fiery Aura as well.* It's just not right for everyone else to not worry about knockback.
Then we should boost the resistances to S/L and Negative. I mean, why does Dark Armor not have capped negative resistance anyway?
Either that or buff the defense values of Cloak of Darkness. Who cares that it already costs less endurance than weave for the same benefit plus increased perception and stealth? Dark Armor Sucks, remember? It needs the buff.
Finally, can we just boost the control auras to mag 5 or something? I mean, only effecting minions is pretty lame. I want bosses to cringe in fear.
Speaking of Fear, Cloak of Fear could really use a buff. How about a non-penalizing accuracy modifier and not a prohibitively high endurance cost?*
Death Shroud is also an anomaly. Blazing Aura does more damage, Electric Field does the same damage but has -endurance. Shouldn't this have a secondary effect? Say... a thematic -tohit perhaps?*
My tank and brute aren't powerful enough, I demand these buffs!
*Items marked this way are the only items I actually endorse. -
I'm glad to see a good deal of you feel the same way I do about this. Thank you for the kind words, and thank you dearly for how I know you will act in the future towards our new freeps. I know you guys won't let me down.
Even you, Sam.
Quote:This is already far and away better than most people treat each other in online communities, and it's really all I'm asking. So allow me to thank you, too, Sam.Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Those who ask for help will receive it, those who end up on teams I'm on will be treated fairly. ...
I team for the company, so it makes sense to treat every other player with respect. More than that I can't promise.
Thanks. I did send Zwill a PM about this... I mean, I know I've already "sold" one subscription to someone just because he read the guide and thought a Warshade would be that much fun.Quote:Originally Posted by reiella
I also suggest Paragon use your Warshade guide as marketing material to sell the AT in the store
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Soul Drain + Burn will be brutal, indeed, but I think you'll actually get a lot more damage out of simply pairing Soul Drain and Blazing Aura. That damage buff lasts a long time, allowing for many ticks of aura damage on ten targets.
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Quote:To be fair, Spin is stupid good.Originally Posted by Clave_Dark_5
Here's another vote for a Claws brute. I rarely play brutes and my Claws/(can't remember) one if only at something like level 8 right now, but he's impressing me already. At level 8.
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Quote:It boils down to about 50 posts per month. In my opinion: No.Originally Posted by Eiko-chan
Is my post count small enough to claim I'm not here for the community?
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Yeah, at this point I'm getting the feeling that incarnate content isn't considered part of Going Rogue, thus why it won't be included in free or for premium players that haven't specifically paid for it.
Going Rogue was simply a prerequisite for incarnate abilities to be earned.
Going Rogue was not sold with any Incarnate content. -
Quote:Your memory isn't bad, but I guess where my assumption is coming from is that all incarnate content currently requires Going Rogue.Originally Posted by Aura_Familia
uhhh is my memory that bad?
I could have sworn that there was NO incarnate content when GR launched.
Wasn't the alpha slot pushed BACK from out of GR and into the next issue? -
Quote:For more information on the soft cap, I encourage you to read the guide linked in my signature.Originally Posted by Scorcharina
And the 45% soft cap was the number I was looking for.
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Quote:Know what I want to see? An all Necro/Storm BAF.Originally Posted by Neogumbercules
So badly wanna start an all MM teaming project now.
24 Hurricanes.
48 Tornadoes.
72 Zombies!
3 frames per second... -
Quote:VIP is paying subscription.Originally Posted by Zubenelgenubi
I'm sorry, but what is the difference between Premium and VIP?
It's all still a bit muddled in my mind...
Premium means you're not paying subscription, but you have paid for something at some point, to include being a previous subscriber. -
I'm guessing the current incarnate content is considered purchasable via Going Rogue, any future incarnate content will be premium purchases, and Clockwork O1 was simply mistaken.
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Quote:I totally ninja-edited that in my post before you made yours. Sorry.Originally Posted by Katze
Specifically, the wiki page on Limits lists the all the cap values by AT: http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Limits
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http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Limits has everything you need.
Defense hard caps somewhere around 200%, and varies by AT. That doesn't matter because anything over 45% is mostly useless (that's the soft cap)
Resistance has no soft cap. The hard cap is 90% for tankers and brutes, 85% for Epic ATs, 75% for everyone else. -
Quote:It will be much more feasible now than it ever has been.Originally Posted by Calibre
With the onset of Freedom and, apparently, new ways of developing the game, is any of this now feasible?
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Quote:Sam, like BillZ just said, I have no idea how you could claim you aren't here for the community with over thirty thousand posts on a social forum.Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Or they can be like me and come for the game, then stay for the game.
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Quote:I used to say all the time that my Dark Armor Tank had Soul Transfer on auto, but that implied way more than it meant. It's just there so that I never stay dead long enough to lose aggro if something from the apocalypse does kill my tank.Originally Posted by Doctor_Xaxan
Soul Transfer, obviously. Since /DA characters die constantly.
JUST KIDDNG.
Understandable. Actually, you might be surprised how often this mistake gets made. I think it's because DA and DM get paired so often, people think of them as the same sets.Quote:Originally Posted by Doctor_Xaxan
I actually got confused with DM. Home from work today because I didn't sleep last night. Don't judge me. Edited my post, thanks for the correction.
Just think, though, if DA came with Dark Consumption, you'd never hear people complain about endurance. Well, you probably would, because some idiot would skip the power. But that's not the point.
I don't know what the point is now.
Oh yeah. DA has one click power. And Hasten if you're like my Claws/Dark brute. To be honest I hardly notice the redraw. Then again, I don't use Dark Regen all that often since I have some great defense values. Claws redraw is also very quick.