Carnifax

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So, what have we learned kids?

On the technicality of it all, yes, you're right. Duels are at risk in PVP. Badge hunting in PVP is at risk, and yes, you're right, it's free for all PVP goody ness.

Yes um. Technically.

Instead of spouting the rules over and over, just remember that sometimes it's good to respect other players. I've asked other players if they're AFK, stopping myself just after a Build-Up and ready to attack.

From a hero standpoint - should you really be so ruthless? From a villian sideview - aren't you being cowardly? Duels in PVP zones are in the moment things, I don't mind others jumping in if they aren't aware, but not intentionally.

Showing respect to other players and 'manners' (wouldn't call it that really - it's still resulting in fights) isn't wrong.

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Sportsmanship rather than manners maybe?

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Havnt chosen my lvl24 power yet so im gonna get repel to help out in the reactor.

No ones getting near that reactor with me running round it like a loon!

Its 10-skyraider-bowling.. with me as the ball hehehehe

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Had lots of fun doing this before with Carnifax running Hurricane

If its as XP rich as I think its going to be I may be able to have gotten Bonfire by the time we get to the reactor...

Yep a Spines scrapper would be nice to compliment the team with some AOE mayhem...

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Everyone ok with a lvl50 coming? would be fun with all that xp


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Yep of course. The amount of debuffing being done means we should be alright hitting the mobs and surviving em. What levels will they end up being? 29s or something? Come get some

Yep. If your going Kinetics do what I did and bind the number pad keys to Select Teamies and cast the buffs and heals (num0 for SB, num. for ID, num-Enter for Aid Other and num+ for the Kinetics heal).

At least then you can buff everyone with one hand (oo-er)

Personally I think Dark Miasma is probably the most varied primary. Ok you specialise in lowering accuracy but you get a disorientate, fear cone (such a great power) and hold too.

Storm is a great set too. I'd go Storm / Dark for the Immob & Freezing Rain combo. AFAIK Tenebrous Tentacles don't prevent knockback so there's great synergy there.

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Looks like im spamming crushing field, single target hold, and aoe holds like mad lol. Plus SB and ID

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Mmmm. Containment, Speed Boost, AMs & Hotfeet . Plus with a Dark and Rad defender and my Rad secondary even I can't die too much...

Mals AOE damage output is way higher than Sols (Elec secondary ) and we don't have many meleers to benefit from another Kinetics.

Hmmm. Looks like Maloth would be more useful in that team make-up. No real need for another Defender, especially not a Kinetics with Magnetosphere packing Kinetics too.

More AOE Control would be better to set up Containment for us both I think. Poor mobs are going to be debuffed to high heaven too if we can all make it (still crossing my fingers. I so miss CoX).

17 I think.

If I get my Broadband sorted during the week I'd love to celebrate by clobbering some Sky Raiders and getting the respec. If you'd pencil me in for the mo. But if you get more definates beforehand thats cool. I'll definately confirm Yay or Nay before Friday anyway (come on Smart Telecom!)

Level 24 Fire / Rad Controller or level 25 Kinetics / Elec Defender, whichever you need.

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What about a house of kheladins?

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"House of Floating Squidies" surely?
or
"House of Grumpy Lobsters" depending on build.

I'd go with the majority here. Illusion/Fire + Rad for a powerful early / mid build. You can spend your teens cleaning out masses of mobs in Boomtown and the like. With Fire I'd be harvesting masses of Blue/Green minions, with Illusion maybe avoid Hazard Zones and take on smaller groups of Yellows/Oranges, esp Lieuts and bosses.

Post 38 Kinetics is the Damage king, but you've to get to 38 first . Also as I've said before soloing kinetics seems like such a waste thanks to Speed Boosts. The SB love really should be spread around.

This really is a "how long is a bit of string" question isn't it? Still goes to show how well balanced the Controller primaries are really if no-one can decide a clear winner.

Even saying "on a team" makes it a difficult choice. Illusion is great for absorbing the Alpha strike. PAs are easily the best level 18 controller power going (sorry Ice Patch). However the PAs and the Phant can annoy some people (esp the Phants AOE knockback). Illusionists work pretty well with other Controllers on the team too.

However I love the knockdown of Earth & Ice and the AOE control of Fire and Mind. And seeing enemies float into the air helpless before being smashed in the head by a forklift courtesy of Grav never gets old.

As for the damage issue Fire outstrips Illusion if faced with a lot of lesser baddies, Illusion is better for only a few stronger guys thanks to the Phantom Armys attention deficit disorder. I reckon Grav would be pretty useful damage-wise against a few enemies too.

So in answer to the OP : Dunno, they all rock in their own way. I'll go with Illusion & Fire because they're the two I've played (very scientific eh?) but honestly the Primary never really matters too much to me. Controllers just rock.

I'm a happy member of the Forgotten Warriors (assuming they haven't kicked me in the last week I've been offline ) but I love the idea of trying an All controller 8-man team sometime or a 8-man Rad team.

8 man controller team as preference for the variety of powers we'd be throwing out, even though I know 8 Rads would probably be more unstoppable.

Spare Time? whats that? I've so many little heroes & villains going I don't have spare time, one of them is always calling for a little attention.

C&C Generals Zero Hour is a great tonic for when I need a CoX break though

AFAIK all AOE hard controls are 70% of normal accuracy.

50% chance of hitting an even levelled mob once there's no modifiers in other words.

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To try and answer the OPs question instead of turning this into another /storm PvP thread, here goes.

Hurricane is a must, herding/panicbutton/controlpower/debuff all in one...take it, get used to it and love it

Thunder Clap, it has its uses but I would personally vote against it. The animation is too long + it being PbAoE can get u killed...oh and a lousy accuracy on it.

Tornado...man I love this power. AoE immob to keep mobs in the spot, unleash Tornado for some nice dmg + def debuff + it's really good for AVs. People tend to hate tornado but you simply need to learn how to use and believe me you will love it

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I'd agree with Archy here. Tornado is useful for any primary with an AOE immob. But it is situational and you need to watch when your firing it. It can be a right pain watching a rogue Tornado speed off down a tunnel into a massive group of Banished Totems... Its crazier than Fire Imps or Phantam Army

Note that with Fire / Kin you will indeed have massive damage output but that output won't really come until level 38+ when Fulcrum Shift and the epic pools open up. Speed boosted Fire munkies sound like an awful amount of fun though. Especially when you can fire a FS at em too.

Fire / Rad is a much earlier developer and it a bit safer. The debuffs will let you solo happily almost from the start. By 38 you'll have 3 effective aoe holds (Flashfire & Fire Cages combined to act as a hold, Cinders and EMP). You could also have Choking Cloud.

Fire / Storm would be like Fire / Rad with less debuff and more soft controls. Basically you could slow and herd the mob, immobilse and Freezing Rain them as the Fire munkies swarm em.

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what happens when immob meets ice slik? they randomly slide off?

[/ QUOTE ]Most immobs (tentacles is only one I can think of that doesn't) make the target immone to knockback/up/down, so they just stand immobilized on the slick.

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Don't think the Grav one has a -knockback/up/down either. All the others do. I always move the Fire Cages button out of the way if I've an Ice or Earth Controller on the team too, so my random keyboard mashings don't set it off.

Nice post kingmouse.

Don't agree 100% (of course, me being me ) but I'll agree to disagree.

The point about different builds and points of view is a good un!

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Anyway, don't shoot the messenger

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Sorry didn't mean to sound like that

As i said in a way earlier post, if the targets can be pulled but the corruptor is just lazy i feel no need to sacrifice my pets, if there's a chance my team can get killed by the npc spawn - i'll send henchies but i've often found in groups they prefer me to send pets instantly after the brute gets aggro so they can max out their damage.

One thing : i'm very fond of my henchies , so i tend to group mostly with friends that know better than to ask me to sacrifice my pets *evilgrin*

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Good point actually. Pulling around a corner into a mob of pets (or henchies...) is a great tactic. Pulling successfully in a team (in other words getting them to actually stand around the corner out of LOS) can be ridiculously painful though. Brutes and Doms probably won't like the wait either.

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Tanking: preventing the mobs from attacking the team by providing an alternative target.

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Actually that's taunting.

Tanking : being able to soak damage and not die. - uhmm...i don't think henchies are really good at that.


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In CoX Tanking is more being able to hold a groups attention and not die as oppose to soaking damage and not die. Lets not start a pointless symantecs argument though


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Sorry, but you are completly wrong there. The design of CoV intends for MM pets to be used as tanks. Brutes are intended as boss killers (the Scrapper role in CoH) NOT TANKS.

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So what are stalkers then, if brutes are the boss killers ?
Also why don't MM pets get a taunt if they are supposed to get the aggro from npcs?


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I think they are in I7 (well so goes the rumour). Don't agree that CoV expects Brutes to be boss killers and MMs to be Tanks. In CoV the roles are deliberately blurred. I would say that Tier 1 minion assult is one of the handiest ways to open combat. Once opened and going Brutes will probably end up handling most of the aggro. By then it should be severely weakened aggro though (debuffs & casualties).

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MM's are like summoners in other mmorpgs - you'll never see the summoner's pet go and tank, that's why we have classes that can use heavy armor and shields ( in this case a defense oriented secondary and a taunt in primary ).

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As I said CoV has blurrier roles really.

Playing my Necro/Dark MM I'd expect the meatbags to always go in first, being wiped if necessary to protect the team. I'd expect any MM I team with to send his tier 1s in first too, unless a teamie such as a Brute wanted to start proceedings.

If a MM had decided his henchies were delicate little flowers and shouldn't be opening combat I'd be reluctant to team with them again to be honest. Lots of MMs out there to choose from after all and I want one who puts team before some CPU minions that can be resummoned if they do collapse anyway.

Theres only one thing worse than a MM who leaves his minions skulking and sniping around in the background while other players take the risks and thats the MM who has the little blighters on Aggressive all the time and aggros half the map.

*Edit : What I'm describing here is alpha strike absorbion, not tanking. Henchies can't really tank well. They soak up damage pretty well though.

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Yes theres /nrg stalkers and yes entropy shield in the /nrg set has KB protection and a big fat NO to hurricane unhiding stalkers .. all it does is KB's so a stalker with KB protection and good ACC can take out someone with hurricane on.

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Shows how much attention I've been paying PvP & Stalkers doesn't it

But anyway Hurricane != Immune in PvE or PvP. Still a lovely power though.

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From my experiences playing a Mind controller, you definately appreciate hard controls when you can get them but knockdown is often more effective as it seems to hit more often (something like Ice Patch or that odd volcano thing Earth controllers get).

Other than that, decide early on whether you're a solo or support charcter build. I've built my controller as a support build, so I've got a lot of team buffs and my AoE controls are primary. A soloist would focus more on their self-enhacing powers and damaging attacks,

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AFAIK Knockdown is considered overpowered at the moment thanks to the introduction of Rag Doll physics. The devs were going to reduce the amount of time it takes to recover from knockdown a few patches ago but we whined too much Go democracy.

I'd imagine its not forgotten though. Knockdown is lethal at the moment and I'd guess I7 might reintroduce that fix.

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...I'd suggest maybe getting Blind and Flash for the earlier levels, but try to get rid of them later on. Illusion isn't a proper Controller sense. It's more like a MasterMind -> It uses distractions. I think... get al of the Illusion powers, maybe leaving Superior Invis, Blind, and Flash....


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You'd be mad to drop Blind. You're a Controller! Personally I'd never drop Flash either although it is a shadow of its former self. Blind is a must as a offensive & defensive (Blind the +2 lieut that is kicking your head in) power.

Spectral Terror is a must though. This is your main Control power thanks to the quick recharge.

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...if they aren't all dead after that SI will keep you alive if that +2 boss tries to stomp on your head. The defense boost you gain using SI is significant and has kept me alive many times...


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I think its 12.5% to everything (or used to be anyway). Its the same as Group Invis. The only difference between the workings of the two powers is that SI gives a better Stealth figure I think. So you're less likely to be noticed when it is running. Once you are noticed (due to being spotted or attacking) the two work the same way.

Oh, and remember Fulcrum Shift won't affect PAs but will affect the Phantasm. Not even the changes coming in I7 should affect that (as PAs are powerful enough already).

No to Tornado, in PvE anyway. I know people like it for PvP.

Hurricane is great for both though. And O2 Boost is indeed a low powered heal but its very quick to recharge and it unsleeps & unstuns. Very useful against Knives of Artimus or for emergency heals. Personally I got it at 35.

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I fail too see how a stalker can walk up to a player with such a power on. It will break his hide and he will be flung away. I must admit I just started stalking though..


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I assume they meant a /nrg Brute? nrg stalkers don't exist do they? The Brutes NRG set has knockback protection. They will just stroll thru Hurricane and smack you upside the head. They will experience the -accuracy debuff though I think.

A Stalker would probably just Impale you from afar instead I'd guess.