BuffyASummers

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Gang,

Decided to give Permafrost a protection against Slow instead of Toxic...

And we've tweaked Hibernate so that your toggles won't drop anymore!

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Protection against Slow is in Wet Ice and in Energy Absorption. Why a third power with the same status-effect protection? It does not make Permafrost more attractive at all

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I want to make sure that you guys know that Ice-based powers work on the fires as well. That is why you are able to target the fires with any power.

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Yeah, I put out half a building with Ice Storm, Blizzard, Ice Blast, Ice Bolt, Bitter Ice Blast. It was fun.

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7.5% base * (1+ (6 Enhancements * .2 Enhancement increase)) * 1.15 for +3 Enhancements = 18.975.

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Like others have pointed out, bad math...

The forumla is

7.5 * (1 + (6 * 0.2 * 1.15)) = 17.85%

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Now they have to go back and rebalance everything again

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On the plus side, I'm wondering what the deal is with the raised DEF cap. 2.5% instead of 5%? That'd be pretty sweet, although we'll need like 3 Defenders to reach it consistently.

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Even if it is 4% that is 1 in 25 instead of 1 in 20, which is not bad at all. If 3%, then 1 in 33. If 2.5% then 1 in 40 - I don't think they would go that far... but who knows

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Yeah, I'm not convinced he's right either, but we'll see if he responds more.

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He did. He said 1.5% this time. He is not very good with numbers

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The thing that kills Ice, to me, is the number of powers you have to get. With Invulnerability it's just Unyielding Stance and Invincibility. That's it! That's all I've chosen with my Tanks and they are amazingly good at it.

With Ice you need a whole host of powers to survive.

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In Issue 5, you need Unyielding, Invincibility, Temp Inv and 7 villians in melee range

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Oh - one other change coming soon to the Training Room...

This was an idea taken right from this forum. Since Ice Armor has no Resistance, it's a zero sum sort of power set. In other words, you're hit or your not. Well, someone (I've forgotten who) suggested adding a Damage Debuff to one of the powers - and we did! Chilling Embrace gains the ability to debuff mob damage (though it's Recharge debuff is slightly slower now).

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So, for example, instead of hitting you for 100 pts every 5 seconds, he will now hit you for 90 pts every 4 seconds? In 20 seconds, instead of 400 pts damage, it will now be 450? Thanks. Well, maybe he won't survive that long, hopefully.

I hope Wet Ice gets at least 10% defense, now that it is unenhancable.

Adding Toxic to Perma Frost probably won't get more people to take it. You need to add Smashing and Lethal, too.

I posted, but I was speechless. I said:

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Firstly, thank you for clearing up the confusion.
Secondly,

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Here's the real numbers (that's what I get for doing stuff from memory).

Wet Ice
0.5% base
1.265% Defence from Wet Ice with ++ SO's.

17.71% Max Defence from Energy Absorbtion (not what I had earlier).

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Firstly, thank you for clearing up the confusion.
Secondly,

Ok. Here is where Ice stands in Issue 5 - thanks to Circeus:

Frozen Armor: 15% DEF Smash/Lethal, 30% RES Cold, 10% RES Fire
Wet Ice: negligible DEF, 30% RES Cold
Glacial Armor: 15% DEF Energy/Negative, 30% RES Cold
Energy Absorption: negligible DEF
Permafrost: 20% RES Cold, 10% RES Fire
Hoarfrost: 20% RES Toxic

Max slotted for DEF/RES as appropriate that leaves us at:

33% DEF Smash/Lethal
33% DEF Energy/Negative
134% RES Cold (90% RES Cold w/out Permafrost)
32% RES Fire (10% RES Fire w/out Permafrost)
20% RES Toxic (44% if somebody actually slotted it)

Wet Ice should be at least 10% defense to all but psi - they can lower the cold resist to 10 or 15% to compensate. Why? Because a Super Reflexes Scrapper starts with 12.5% melee defense with Focused Fighting and 12.5% ranged defense with Focused Senses to all types of damage. Ice Tankers get 15% to smashing and lethal damage melee, ranged and AoE.

Energy Absorption should be 2% per mob (4.4 X 14 mobs = 61.6)

Edit: I hate that 14 cap on both EA and Invinc. It just wreaks of herding. I wish the max cap was 6 and the defense raised to compensate

Ah. I see. But, I think I had rather be pretty tough and avoid getting hit, since getting hit causes brain damage
And broken teeth (toothless grin)

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-Starts Petition to move Invulns DEF to Ice-
-Starts Petition to have Invulns RES returned-

Carry on.

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The reason Ice protection is less at 90% resistance is because there is not any defense to supplement it. So, If Invuln became 90% resist to all except psionic and no defense, we would not be able to Tank without a Defender. Right now, with the right number of minions around us, we can still Tank against fire/cold/energy and negative energy because of defense. Replace that defense with 90% resistance and our Tanking ability goes down! Look at the Ice Tankers Ice protection

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Yes, even vs Cold protection.

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My Invulnerability testing showed me that 90% resistance to smashing and lethal was not as safe as the defense Invincibility supplied with just 7 in melee range and 30% resistance to Smashing and Lethal (also had 12 at range - all even level Banished Pantheon minons using only smashing, lethal) .

Therefore, Ice resistance at 90% is not very good protection without defense to supplement.

Edit: hey, just ask Fire Tankers who only had resistances until they got Burn to mitigate. Or, Invulnerable (Tankers/Scrappers) who could not believe the difference in survivability when they got Invincibility.

Resistance alone doesn't cut it as a Tanker. It helps to max resist, but it is not enough.

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Wet Ice - six slotted with Defense SO's - provides about 3% defense.

Energy Absorption similarly slotted provides 3% per target (so a maximum of 42%).

*caveat - I'm doing this stuff from memory, so I'll doublecheck it and repost later if I'm wrong.*

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Wet Ice at 0.5 * 0.2 = 0.1 per SO - 6 SOs would be 0.6 added to 0.5 is 1.1% defense - is not worth slotting.

EA with 0.5 * 0.2 = 0.1 - that is what an SO is worth

6 SOs is 0.6 added to 0.5 is 1.1 * 14 = 15.4% total defense with 14 mobs in melee - not worth it.

The testing shows negligible defense provided by Wet Ice and Energy Absorption. You confirmed it

For a Tanker to protect a team, it must be able to survive. Burn helped mitigate the incoming damage by defeating those villians in melee. Invulnerable Tankers have defense (Invincibility) to mitigate the damage, Stone has healing (Rooted) to mitigate the damage and Ice has, well whatever you all get around to giving them some day.

With the recharge raised and the damage decreased, along with the scattering AI of the villians, Fire Tankers don't have a way to mitigate the damage except to scatter them to force them to switch to range damage, which is still incoming damage. It also makes it easier for scattered mobs to turn their attention elsewhere.

I don't play a Fire Tanker, but I think these changes have made it much more difficult for them to be a Tanker.

A in creativity
C minus in effectiveness
F in meeting the needs of Blasters survival

6-Slot RPD: 27.5% resist to smashing and lethal
1-Slot TI: 39% resist to smashing and lethal
6-Slot Unyielding: all resists - 44% resist to all but psionic
6-Slot Invince: gives ToHit bonus and Defense bonus (melee and ranged) per mob in melee range up to about 6 mobs.

Total: 110.5% to smashing and lethal (you really don't need that 1 resist enhancer in TI. Just an endurance reduction will do. Then your total will be 104%. If you change one of the resists in Unyielding to a endurance reduction, then you lose 4% to all it resists. Total will be 100% to smashing and lethal and 40% to all other types except psionic).

Hi. Thanks for the questions.

If you have slotted past the 90% resistance, you will still take 10% of the damage. There are some villians that can debuff your resistance, so having more than 90% will be useful in those cases.

The 90% resistance is not dependent upon level of foes. A +10 villian hits for far more damage than an even level foe, but you will still resist 90% of that damage.

There is not a max on defense. A Super Reflexes Scrapper can achieve over 200% defense in some cases. Yet, a villian always has a chance to hit you no matter how much defense you have. You can never have too much defense. Defense is good.

I could not find a copy on the day it released, or a couple days afterward. But I did get a copy soon after release and have enjoyed it since. I love this game.

Some information on resistance and defense:

Resistance is how much damage you take when you get hit. If a foe hits you and does 100 pts damage (e.g. Lethal) and you don't have any resistance to the damage type, you take 100 points damage. If you have 20% resistance to that damage type e.g. Lethal), you will only take 80 points damage.

Defense is whether you will get hit or not.

An even level minion villian has a base 50% chance to hit you if you have no defense and no buffs or debuffs from friends or foes and the villian has no 'to hit' bonus and no 'to hit' buffs or debuffs from friends or foes.

An even level leutenant has a base 62.5% chance to hit under the same conditions as above.

An even level boss has a base 75% chance to hit under the same conditions as above.

If you activate a power that supplies you with 5% defense (like Combat Jump, Hover or Hasten), then looking at the base numbers above, an even con minion now has 45% chance to hit you.

If a villian is 1 level above you, then he gets a 6.5% bonus to hit you. If you you are 1 level above the villian, you get a 6.5% bonus to hit the villian.

Note: if you end up with 50% defense from powers and buffs from teammates, even though a minion now has zero (50 - 50) chance to hit, the game does not allow a zero chance to hit and put a cap of 5% on the to hit minimum. So a foe always has a 5% chance to hit you.


Invulnerability power set information for Tankers and Scrappers:

Resist Physical Damage (RPD) is 12.5% resistance to smashing and lethal (9.375% for Scrappers) and each single origin (SO) enhance damage resistance (DamRes) enhancement provides 2.5% more (1.875% for Scrappers)

Resist Elements (REl) is 20% resistance to heat and cold (fire and ice) (15% for Scrappers) and each SO DamRes enhancer provides 4% more (3% for Scrappers)

Resist Energies (REn) is 20% resistance to energy and negative energy (dark) (15% for Scrappers) and each SO DamRes enhancer provides 4% more (3% for Scrappers)

Temporary Invulnerability (TI) provides 32.5% resistance to smashing and lethal (24.375% for Scrappers) and each SO DamRes enhancer provides 6.5% more (4.875% for Scrappers)

Unyielding (Uny) is 20% resistance to all types except psionic (15% for Scrappers) and each SO DamRes enhancer provides 4% more (3% for Scrappers)

Unstoppable (Uns) is 70% resistance to all types except psionic (52.5% for Scrappers) and each SO DamRes enhancer provides 14% more (10.5% for Scrappers)

Tough Hide (TH) is 7.5% defense to all types except psionic (5.625% for Scrappers) and each SO enhance defense buff (DefBuf) enhancer provides 1.5% more (1.125% for Scrappers)

Invincibility (Inv) is *guessing* 5% melee and ranged defense to all types except psionic (3.75% for Scrappers) and *guessing* 5% to hit buff (ToHit) (3.75% for Scrappers) for every foe in melee range. Each SO DefBuf enhancer provides 1% more (0.75% for Scrappers). Each SO ToHit enhancer provides 1.67% more (1.25% for Scrappers)

Tough (Fighting pool) is 20% resistance to smashing and lethal (15% for Scrappers) and each SO DamRes enhancer provides 4% more (3% for Scrappers) Note: Tough uses less endurance than TI

Weave (Fighting pool) is 12.5% melee and ranged defense (9.375% for Scrappers) and each SO DefBuf enhancer provides 2.5% more (1.875% for Scrappers)

Combat Jump, Hover and Hasten each give 5% defense to melee and ranged for all archetypes and each SO DefBuf enhancer provides 1% more.

Stealth and all invisiblity powers provide 7.5% defense to melee and ranged for all archetypes and each SO DefBuf enhancer provides 1.5% more.


Tankers can reach between 80% and 104% resistance (90% is cap) with the following combinations:

Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), TI (1 SO DamRes) - Total 98% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), TI (2 SO DamRes) - Total 89.5% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), Tough (3 SO DamRes) - Total 91% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), Tough (6 SO DamRes) - Total 88% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), Tough (0 SO DamRes) - Total 91.5% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), TI(0 SO DamRes) - Total 104% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), TI (1 SO DamRes) - Total 94% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), TI (3 SO DamRes) - Total 92% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), Tough (4 SO DamRes) - Total 91% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), Tough (6 SO DamRes) - Total 84% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), Tough (1 SO DamRes) - Total 91.5% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), TI(0 SO DamRes) - Total 100% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), Tough (5 SO DamRes) - Total 80% resistance to smashing and lethal

Elemental (fire and ice), and Energies (energy and dark):

Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), REl (6 SO DamRes) and REn (6 SO DamRes) - Total 88% resistance to elemental and energies
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), REl (6 SO DamRes) and REn (6 SO DamRes) - Total 84% resistance to elemental and energies

*Unyielding provides 44% Toxic resistance with 6 SO DamRes and 40% with 5 SO DamRes


Scrappers can reach between 63% and 78% resistance (75% is cap) with the following combinations:

Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), TI (2 SO DamRes) - Total 78.375% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), Tough (6 SO DamRes) - Total 77.25% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), Tough (2 SO DamRes) - Total 74.625% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), TI(0 SO DamRes) - Total 78% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), TI (2 SO DamRes) - Total 78.375% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), Tough (6 SO DamRes) - Total 74.25% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), Tough (3 SO DamRes) - Total 74.625% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), TI(0 SO DamRes) - Total 74% resistance to smashing and lethal

Elemental (fire and ice), and Energies (energy and dark):

Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), REl (6 SO DamRes) and REn (6 SO DamRes) - Total 66% resistance to elemental and energies
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), REl (6 SO DamRes) and REn (6 SO DamRes) - Total 63% resistance to elemental and energies

*Unyielding provides 33% Toxic resistance with 6 SO DamRes and 30% with 5 SO DamRes

Some information on resistance and defense:

Resistance is how much damage you take when you get hit. If a foe hits you and does 100 pts damage (e.g. Lethal) and you don't have any resistance to the damage type, you take 100 points damage. If you have 20% resistance to that damage type e.g. Lethal), you will only take 80 points damage.

Defense is whether you will get hit or not.

An even level minion villian has a base 50% chance to hit you if you have no defense and no buffs or debuffs from friends or foes and the villian has no 'to hit' bonus and no 'to hit' buffs or debuffs from friends or foes.

An even level leutenant has a base 62.5% chance to hit under the same conditions as above.

An even level boss has a base 75% chance to hit under the same conditions as above.

If you activate a power that supplies you with 5% defense (like Combat Jump, Hover or Hasten), then looking at the base numbers above, an even con minion now has 45% chance to hit you.

If a villian is 1 level above you, then he gets a 6.5% bonus to hit you. If you you are 1 level above the villian, you get a 6.5% bonus to hit the villian.

Note: if you end up with 50% defense from powers and buffs from teammates, even though a minion now has zero (50 - 50) chance to hit, the game does not allow a zero chance to hit and put a cap of 5% on the to hit minimum. So a foe always has a 5% chance to hit you.

Invulnerability power set information for Tankers and Scrappers:

Resist Physical Damage (RPD) is 12.5% resistance to smashing and lethal (9.375% for Scrappers) and each single origin (SO) enhance damage resistance (DamRes) enhancement provides 2.5% more (1.875% for Scrappers)

Resist Elements (REl) is 20% resistance to heat and cold (fire and ice) (15% for Scrappers) and each SO DamRes enhancer provides 4% more (3% for Scrappers)

Resist Energies (REn) is 20% resistance to energy and negative energy (dark) (15% for Scrappers) and each SO DamRes enhancer provides 4% more (3% for Scrappers)

Temporary Invulnerability (TI) provides 32.5% resistance to smashing and lethal (24.375% for Scrappers) and each SO DamRes enhancer provides 6.5% more (4.875% for Scrappers)

Unyielding (Uny) is 20% resistance to all types except psionic (15% for Scrappers) and each SO DamRes enhancer provides 4% more (3% for Scrappers)

Unstoppable (Uns) is 70% resistance to all types except psionic (52.5% for Scrappers) and each SO DamRes enhancer provides 14% more (10.5% for Scrappers)

Tough Hide (TH) is 7.5% defense to all types except psionic (5.625% for Scrappers) and each SO enhance defense buff (DefBuf) enhancer provides 1.5% more (1.125% for Scrappers)

Invincibility (Inv) is *guessing* 5% melee and ranged defense to all types except psionic (3.75% for Scrappers) and *guessing* 5% to hit buff (ToHit) (3.75% for Scrappers) for every foe in melee range. Each SO DefBuf enhancer provides 1% more (0.75% for Scrappers). Each SO ToHit enhancer provides 1.67% more (1.25% for Scrappers)

Tough (Fighting pool) is 20% resistance to smashing and lethal (15% for Scrappers) and each SO DamRes enhancer provides 4% more (3% for Scrappers) Note: Tough uses less endurance than TI

Weave (Fighting pool) is 12.5% melee and ranged defense (9.375% for Scrappers) and each SO DefBuf enhancer provides 2.5% more (1.875% for Scrappers)

Combat Jump, Hover and Hasten each give 5% defense to melee and ranged for all archetypes and each SO DefBuf enhancer provides 1% more.

Stealth and all invisiblity powers provide 7.5% defense to melee and ranged for all archetypes and each SO DefBuf enhancer provides 1.5% more.


Tankers can reach between 80% and 104% resistance (90% is cap) with the following combinations:

Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), TI (1 SO DamRes) - Total 98% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), TI (2 SO DamRes) - Total 89.5% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), Tough (3 SO DamRes) - Total 91% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), Tough (6 SO DamRes) - Total 88% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), Tough (0 SO DamRes) - Total 91.5% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), TI(0 SO DamRes) - Total 104% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), TI (1 SO DamRes) - Total 94% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), TI (3 SO DamRes) - Total 92% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), Tough (4 SO DamRes) - Total 91% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), Tough (6 SO DamRes) - Total 84% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), Tough (1 SO DamRes) - Total 91.5% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), TI(0 SO DamRes) - Total 100% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), Tough (5 SO DamRes) - Total 80% resistance to smashing and lethal

Elemental (fire and ice), and Energies (energy and dark):

Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), REl (6 SO DamRes) and REn (6 SO DamRes) - Total 88% resistance to elemental and energies
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), REl (6 SO DamRes) and REn (6 SO DamRes) - Total 84% resistance to elemental and energies

*Unyielding provides 44% Toxic resistance with 6 SO DamRes and 40% with 5 SO DamRes


Scrappers can reach between 63% and 78% resistance (75% is cap) with the following combinations:

Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), TI (2 SO DamRes) - Total 78.375% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), Tough (6 SO DamRes) - Total 77.25% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), Tough (2 SO DamRes) - Total 74.625% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), TI(0 SO DamRes) - Total 78% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), TI (2 SO DamRes) - Total 78.375% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (1 SO DamRes), Tough (6 SO DamRes) - Total 74.25% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), Tough (3 SO DamRes) - Total 74.625% resistance to smashing and lethal
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), RPD (6 SO DamRes), TI(0 SO DamRes) - Total 74% resistance to smashing and lethal

Elemental (fire and ice), and Energies (energy and dark):

Unyielding (6 SO DamRes), REl (6 SO DamRes) and REn (6 SO DamRes) - Total 66% resistance to elemental and energies
Unyielding (5 SO DamRes), REl (6 SO DamRes) and REn (6 SO DamRes) - Total 63% resistance to elemental and energies

*Unyielding provides 33% Toxic resistance with 6 SO DamRes and 30% with 5 SO DamRes

Thank you. As a Software Architect myself, I applaud the quality, creativity of the product and timely patches and content additions. Keep it coming!

The AoE taunt in attack powers (and Taunt changed to AoE) is in Issue #3 on the Test server. The more and more damage was deemed too much, and changed to an overall damage boost, which is also in Issue #3 on the Test server.

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6. I do know that Unyielding Stance and its immobility is an issue. I'm going to be thinking about that a lot in the coming week.

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Just remove the immobility and rename the power to Unyielding Will. It's that simple.

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2. After analysis, Scrappers CAN NOT reach the same levels of resistance as a Tank. Regeneration, though, is a small concern.

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My Scrapper has 90% resist to all but psionic and untyped. I know a Tanker can probably reach 200% resistance, but why would he/she? Regen is not a problem, play one. I know I don't play one, but I play along side of one and he dies more than me. And his build is optimal, not gimped.

I created a new Defender, Force Field/Psychic Blast. I got my new Contact in Kings Row, after hitting level 5. His first mission was to talk to the guy in the Hollows. I went to the guy in the Hollows. Then I immediately went back to Kings Row and took my next mission. I never had to do any missions in the Hollows because I never accepted a mission from the guy there. But the Contact that gave me the mission, has plenty more missions for me to do.