Blue_Note

SB: 1 end mod suffices in almost all cases. 2 is very nice. 3 is overdone

Sounds good. I can bring my lvl 41 dark def. Gimme a shout on global when wanted.

[/ QUOTE ]Super Speed - it really helps in rough moments, since ice attacks are fairly slow-loading, plus it means you can quickly fire heals off when your team needs it. I've not added any slots to Hasten, as I have too many other powers that need them, but it's still a very handy panic button when it's available.

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Hasten; slot it with 3 recharge without a doubt. Hasten is good stuff, and when you take it you want it up as much as possible. SS is great too as it stacks with shadow fall to invis, which means you can REALLY stealth.



[/ QUOTE ]I believe Tar Patch stacks, so throw recharges in it if you can find the slots. You can also put slow enhancers in it, but looking at my build, I know I'm never going to have enough spare slots for that!

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Also here make room for a few recharge (prefferably 3) its another brilliant power from DM, and again you want it up as much as possible. Since ED it only stacks when hasten is up, and only then for a short period. A slow is not needed, but if you have a slot to spare it keeps the mobs longer in the patch and away from you.



[/ QUOTE ]Darkest Night is an excellent debuff, and aside from endurance reductions, you may well want to put tohit debuffs in it.

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DN imho is the best power of DM. (well fluffy is a pet so different category) Anything less then 3 slotted tohit debuff is a waist of this extremely gorgeous toggle. An end reducer is worthwile too.

Flasharrow is an excellent opening move. It lets the whole team get in closer range and take better position.
Another good use is to spam it on other groups of mobs if they're too close so you can keep those out of the fight by staying out of their perception range. Thirdly it provides an -admittedly a bit crappy- way to stealth mishes and groups.
I have used it to lvl 40 now so far, and although many dont hink highly of it, for me its for keeps for sure. When used well its an very nice power. And i havent even yet talked about the (small) accu debuff on it... Yummie!

Indeed, little error there from my side. ID has smash/nrg resist indeed
Siphon speed is truly unsuppressed, but what you maybe mean is that you're rooted for a sec or two after spamming siphon speed or that you're rooted while attacking.
Once its running no attack supresses your movement (travel) powers like fly/ss/sj, both pvp and pve. This doesnt mean that movement is unsupressed, you still get rooted as you originally do, but the specific travelpower you're running is unsupressed.

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From the primary i'd say you can skip Superior Invisibility and go for Group(with 3 recharge SO it is perma and the Group doesn't need endurance to stay active), I dropped Syphon Speed because it looks like little use IMO, pick Flash ASAP, don't wait a single second and pick Spectral Terror ASAP aswell because it's a good control tool and Deceive is of very little use, plus it may make you lose XP!

From the kinetics i skipped Increase Density(too little duration, can be useful but very situational and only if teamed), Repel because it sux badly and Syphon Speed because it's no real use, even stacked twice...

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He Jiaozy, please dont get all upset again. Were just both trying to make some points.
Here i'll explain mine in detail even with the differerences between PvE and PvP considered:

-siphon speed: is brillaint in pvp, but is also a very lovable (de)buff of recharge in pve. And the speed (de)buff is nice too. Remember its unsupressed speed... also for hover/fly

-increase density: -which you're right has unfortunately too short duration, but forms an excellent buff that frees from all mezzes except the not so common sleep. With the many status effects the mobs dish out till lvl 50 kinetics with emps and (the rare) sonics are the only ones who can free people from this. It also provides a resistance of 24% to S/L with just the one basic resist SO enhance slotted AND protects from knockback. Evidently super stuff for teaming, but not solo you say? You dont love your Phant enough to slap this ALL IN ONE buff on him? I must admit that it might not fit the pure controller role, but its brillaint support for the team and certainly adds to your versatility.

-flash: I like it a lot, some people dont like its PBAoE and skip it, but i wouldnt wanna play without it. Like you said its a good control tool. But you also say take asap... Its available at lvl 6. As if you have the slot at those early lvls to make it decent use. Untill u have the slots to make it really worthwile you better use those to make your blind/transfusion/sw and what else you have workable. Untill enough slots with DO's or even SO's it misses too much (and seeing its PBAoE high chance to get creamed) and has soooo long recharge, so i would recommend postphoning that great AoE hold a bit.

-deceive: makes u loss xp? well theres debate about it, but extensive testing (if interested take a look at this easy maths xp with confusion ) Im on the camp that believes confuse does help xp/time or at least it doesnt make you loose it. Besides the effects are too brilliant to pass: tsoo sorcerers/rikti guardians/skyraiders generators/CoT mages/sappers/fake nem bubbling the team/any boss or pesky foe helpin and not hurtin the team... Its not just show, its great for the survival (of your team) and the pace with which you rip through mobs! And when solo its obviously a true safeguard.

-invisibility: ofcourse for teaming group invis is preffered over sup invis.

-spectral terror: must have without further words

Hope this makes things a bit clearer. Dont be offended, i didnt mean to pass judgement on your build, everyone his one, but thought id provoke you a bit Talkin about the gimp was my way of sayin you overlooked things and this post should explain why that is.
Above all fun is the prime objective, bein a succes comes in second.

Oeps jiaozy, you got ur ill troller all gimped according to what you're sayin in this thread...

Never told you i like the name though

Thnx beet, appreciate it

Ooooh, 22nd is coming close. And we all have jinglejets FTW!

If i can hire a wheelchair and roll out blue out of the oldies home to leave some fake teethmark on some defiants; im in

Count Duskie in if needed, lvl 29 darkdef. maybe shes 30 by thursday. send me tell when u gettin to set of

[quotehasten, ...its dark miasma all over again

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What do u mean by this?

I have it as sec on my earthtroller. Thought it was pretty bad in the beginning and almost deleted the toon in his 20's. Glad that i didnt now.
True, recharge times of most powers is way too long but i just took selective picks; no way im gonna wait 120 sec (base) on a -i must admit pretty likeable- glue arrow. Being able to skip powers from the set without regrets gives u more space to pick some extra primaries or powerpools.
Its endusage is low and the set can be pretty controllerish. And if u learn how to use flash arrow well and slot it with 3 accu debuff and at least 2 accu's (i have 3, and you will figure out why once u got the power and really wanna make good of use it), is a godsend
!! (Its the equivalent of smoke from the firetrollerset and I really wonder why i see so many firetrollers without it...)
Oilslicks knockup is a bit dissappointing- see the power as a weaker version of freezing rain- and its fun if it is set alight, its another pretty controlpower. Unfortunately long recharge :/ They should really make it like freezing rain to make TA more saucy, but still worth taking.
The emp arrow is alright, really need heavy slotting to be usefull though. Funny enough its actually a dissorrient combined with an immo instead of the said so hold! I wonder if it drops toggles now i come to think of it, gonna test that soon in warburg....
The power i was really dissappointed in was poison gas arrow, it should hold mobs, never ever have even seen one baddie held, not even -3... Not surprisingly i got rid of it with the first respec i got.
Overall TA fits my style, nor does it give me hard times or regrets over choosing wich to powers to take and which not(except that *[censored]* poison gas arrow ofcourse because some powers are just not even worth deliberating (i havent mentioned all here, but you will find out for yourself).
Im having a good time with him, probably he might even be one i take to 50 again soon at the cost of playin cov
Finally i suspect that on the other hand TA as a def primary is the worst you can get though. Never tried it and no wishes at all to do so either

Ofcos id love to be on your side DK. For the record:
Ill/kin troller, with blind and flash
Maybe -very maybe, provided i get him up from 39-, if its not within the next 3 weeks i can roll out a Mind/kin - with (total)domination and TK

U maybe dont NEED stamina, but it plays a lot nicer and ur team WANTS u to... Maybe u can live without it if u have a kin giving u sb all the time, or an emp feeding u. (thereby distracting them from other teammembers)
Sure u talk about attackchain and cycle. Hahaha, when only using 3, 4 attacks and maybe one toggle ur not helpin the team to its best. Try stayin in a big battle and keepin up that endbar as u said so lightly. Especially u as stormie with 3 toggles, although earth has a lot of rather cheap drops.
Its just a matter of playstyle: give it all u got, or be conservative

Stamina is essential in PvP. If u dont have it you will be demoted to a rather passive player. Even with transference on my troller, i lack end sometimes. Without stamina u cant stay long enough in battle to be of good use, especially when u have a few toggles running (think CJ, Acro and take a look at storm and rad)
Casting a few powers and then anxiously looking around while your endbar is alarmingly low is not real playin...
And AM, recov Aura, or speedboost is not particularly on command.

PMSL!! One of the best jokes i came across this week.

One thing: demand a free respec if u have been lured into that utter non-sense triage beacon. 100% regen? think they added two zeros too much ...

Well i just read ur swimming in slots. If u want to put them in deceive, id recommend to slot a range rather then recharge. Activation time on deceive is pretty long, so its almost recharged (with hasten) before u can use it again.
Slottin range, gives u the advantage u can stay out of agro range in general and especually if u want to deceive an Lt or boss in the back of a group of mobs.

True, unions become a sort of ghostcity. Teamin is still possible, but the variety and many good players t playin on the dark side now...
Not happy with it either

Btw , u play toxic thing on COV, if so, ive teamed with u yesterday

Nemesis have a great resistance to confuse indeed. Puttin in 3 accu's in deceive is a waist of at least 1 slot. I have a few toons up to 50 with confuse/deceive, and cos of the 20% inherent accu bonus i can hit almost anything very accurately at +2/3 with only 1 accu slotted and if u have tactics, well... (Bosses always need 2 hits to be confused btw)
U can slot 2 accu if u want to hit all the time, but that third slot can surely be used to much more effect in another power.

With much joy ive been playin my ill/kin troller to 50 and maybe except for my recently discovered beloved earttroller, its been my favo toon all the way.
Hes now build as pure pvp toon, but i can share my view on the slottin of ur ill/kin troller in general.

The hasten thing: if u dont want hasten, i strongly advice siphonspeed. It stacks, so the 20% recharge buff can be doubled by puttin in 2 or 3 recharge as the recharge buff applies to siphon speed itself as well. So u can have an almost premanent 40% recharge if u like without hasten. The -recharge and -speed (speedbuff is unsupressed in contrary to ss :-) debuff i like a lot too as tactical tool.

Regarding the accu. The evident drop of accu with tactics only filled with 3 to hitt buffs, makes slottin ur powers with 2 accu even more needed. I always have had accuracy wellslotted (seeing i basically always play min +3 mobs), even with fullslotted tactics puttin in 2 accu in core powers like transfusion, transference and blind ( with 3 accu i almost never missed +3 bosses without tactics For me siphon speed is important-the slow recharge and the tohit need finds me i want 2 accu there as well

As far as ur end needs: running all kinds of toggles like sup invis, assault, tactics and maybe acro/combatjump/xx as well (and later on shields too) takes a lot of end i have stamina too, cos with the fast moving opponents in pvp and to hit requirement, i cannot totally rely on the end buff for myself and use it a lot as a tool to debuff end. (Always had stamina btw cos i have an intensive playin style and hasten too) In PvE u can get away without stamina, but i found i played much better by havin it.

So all in all, considerin the ED nerfe hittin tactics, id say u slot all powers with 2 accu and combined with tactics ur able to put up a good show. Take siphon speed, put in 2 recharge in siph speed and transference and ur quite set for good battle. And without sayin it: put in 3 recharge in fulcrum as ur team will love you for it :=D

Have fun!

Count me in for a hammi picknick.