Forget Absorb. This is the new mechanic I REALLY want to see in existing sets...
By
Basilisk,
Posted on: 2012-08-09 05:58 in Suggestions and Ideas
That's not a bad idea. Or, for example, Insulation Shield could debuff damage when used on an enemy.
Dr. Todt's theme.
i make stuff...
Soul Transfer used as a PBAoE stun. While alive.
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don'T attempt to read tHis mEssaGe, And believe Me, it is not a codE.
Actually, I'm pretty sure this update is a test-bed for just this sort of power, and the first place you'll see it used is with powers like Resurgence, Rise of the Phoenix and Resurrect, such that they gain some form of utility outside of having someone die, similar to how Howling Twilight can work as just a debuff with nobody dead. People have been asking for this for years, and though I never felt it strictly "necessary," that's where I foresee things going.
Personally, I'd like to see all powers in all powersets done such that they have a use even for a solo player. This doesn't have to be AS POWERFUL a use as in a team context, but just being able to get SOME benefit would be appreciated.
Chiefly, I want to see Mastermind Support set "resurrection" powers given some use. I'm not sure why pets are made to be impossible to resurrect considering how slow these powers are and how much they cost, but if that's not an option, then I'd like to see them offer buffs or debuffs on still-living targets.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Make it similar to DNA Siphon. Regen/Recov bonus for all living entities near the caster. On death, it works like regular Soul Transfer.
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
Soul Transfer used as a PBAoE stun. While alive.
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"Dark Armor is a complete waste as a tanking set."
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I don't see why not, Howling Twilight for Defenders etc already does that, so...
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Originally Posted by Dechs Kaison
Soul Transfer used as a PBAoE stun. While alive.
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Originally Posted by Zwillinger
GG, I would tell you that "I am killing you with my mind", but I couldn't find an emoticon to properly express my sentiment.
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Originally Posted by Captain_Photon
NOTE: The Incarnate System is basically farming for IOs on a larger scale, and with more obtrusive lore.
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Rise of the Phoenix is a fun corpse nova power. It's easily my favorite out of the self-rezzes since it's immensely awesome--damage and big old stun wave? Compared to "slightly buffed but having to turn back on all my toggles and then enjoy the debuff that'll hit me soon" that WP's revive is and "I bought this power just to save myself having to carry around an Awaken" that Regen's revive is. Of course if they put in some mechanic where you could use Rise while alive but as a weakened PBAoE that gained damage depending on how damaged you are when you click it...| such that they gain some form of utility outside of having someone die, |
WP using Resurgence while alive could be like using a green+blue? inspiration when alive. A WP being able to pop a reconstruct-like power could come in handy. You reach in and pull out more fight. Or there's that Paragon Reward power that randomly generates Inspirations--it could do that!
Regen's Revive has always sucked. A power that's no different from using an Awaken inspiration? Why not just carry an Awaken and not waste a power pick. I'd suggest making it instantly recharge Instant Healing if used while alive, but the devs might consider that to be too OP and do something horrific like nerf IH again and saddle it with a 30 minute cooldown timer or something. I guess they could tag it with +Healing so any heals a Regen has hit them heal them better? I dunno. They could make it create an Absorb bubble that can soak up some damage for you maybe. I haven't looked at how that new game mechanic is supposed to work.
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Exactly. And I would even accept one third the magnitude...
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Originally Posted by Techbot Alpha
I don't see why not, Howling Twilight for Defenders etc already does that, so...
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Where to now?
Check out all my guides and fiction pieces on my blog.
The MFing Warshade | The Last Rule of Tanking | The Got Dam Mastermind
Everything Dark Armor | The Softcap
don'T attempt to read tHis mEssaGe, And believe Me, it is not a codE.
Well, I don't necessarily expect these powers to have the same effects when used while alive. At the very least, Rise of the Phoenix's autohit damage won't fly very well. I imagine they'll be reworked to be more drastically different, in the same way the various versions of Assassin's Strike are - similar conceptual effects, wholly separate stats.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Probably so a /Dark user can't use Howling Twilight after all their pets get wiped.
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Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Actually, I'm pretty sure this update is a test-bed for just this sort of power, and the first place you'll see it used is with powers like Resurgence, Rise of the Phoenix and Resurrect, such that they gain some form of utility outside of having someone die, similar to how Howling Twilight can work as just a debuff with nobody dead. People have been asking for this for years, and though I never felt it strictly "necessary," that's where I foresee things going.
Personally, I'd like to see all powers in all powersets done such that they have a use even for a solo player. This doesn't have to be AS POWERFUL a use as in a team context, but just being able to get SOME benefit would be appreciated. Chiefly, I want to see Mastermind Support set "resurrection" powers given some use. I'm not sure why pets are made to be impossible to resurrect considering how slow these powers are and how much they cost, but if that's not an option, then I'd like to see them offer buffs or debuffs on still-living targets. |
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Well... That might have been a big deal once upon a time, but you have to remember that henchmen lose their auto powers when they die and right now, I can resummon henchmen almost instantly anyway. But I can roll with what you're saying because it makes sense. Howling Twilight already has a non-resurrection debuff component, so exempting it as the only resurrect power that doesn't rez henchmen is just fine by me.
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Originally Posted by Mad Grim
Probably so a /Dark user can't use Howling Twilight after all their pets get wiped.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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I think there are some great ideas here.
What would Fallout do?!
Thanks for eight fun years, Paragon.
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I would make it targetable on enemy corpses like Unchain Essence from the Umbral Blast set. It would provide damage and debuffs commensurate with enemy levels, with Minions and Underlings providing the least damage and GMs and Players doing the most.
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Originally Posted by ChrisMoses
I think there are some great ideas here.
What would Fallout do?! |
My story arcs: #2370- Noah Reborn, #18672- The Clockwork War, #31490- Easy Money
Sartre once said, "Hell is other people." What does that make an MMO?
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To keep with the theme of the power, I'd assume a dead-enemy-target power for a significantly weaker debuff, but one that's harder to resist, say by having an unresistable portion. Would be useful for large AV fights when "adds" show up, but it's probably not going to make a huge difference in normal sweeping.|
Originally Posted by ChrisMoses
What would Fallout do?!
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Or we could go with a buff for living allies, that's also a possibility. Dead ally explodes, living ally gets strengthened.
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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Can I just spend a post to say how cool I think this idea would be? It was just a quick brainstorm off the top of my head so the OP wouldn't boil down to "buff Empathy," but it's really grown on me since then. I think it'd be a really neat mechanic. I love temp powers.
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Originally Posted by Vanden
And here's a cool idea: what if Masterminds could use their minion upgrade powers on other players to grant them temporary powers based on their set? Demon Summoners could give teammates a clone of the upcoming Arcane Bolt, while Mercs could equip their allies with frag grenades.
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Issue 16 made me feel like this.
Warning: This poster likes to play Devil's Advocate.
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this would be FANTASTIC for powers in a lot of the buff sets [and rezzes as mentioned] with powers that are ally-only, but could gain great versatility and utility with a second affect when on an enemy.|
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow
Actually, I'm pretty sure this update is a test-bed for just this sort of power, and the first place you'll see it used is with powers like Resurgence, Rise of the Phoenix and Resurrect, such that they gain some form of utility outside of having someone die, similar to how Howling Twilight can work as just a debuff with nobody dead. People have been asking for this for years, and though I never felt it strictly "necessary," that's where I foresee things going.
Personally, I'd like to see all powers in all powersets done such that they have a use even for a solo player. This doesn't have to be AS POWERFUL a use as in a team context, but just being able to get SOME benefit would be appreciated. Chiefly, I want to see Mastermind Support set "resurrection" powers given some use. I'm not sure why pets are made to be impossible to resurrect considering how slow these powers are and how much they cost, but if that's not an option, then I'd like to see them offer buffs or debuffs on still-living targets. |
so far there are what, four categories? or five?
-ally
-dead ally
-enemy
-dead enemy
-yellow-boxed-neutral-until-attacked-enemy? or is that just enemy?
i'm having major brain farts trying to figure what would be the next logical power or two to extend a secondary function to without changing the set too much. rezzes being given a heal or other affect similar to dark maisma and nature affinity's rez first, but then what?
great ideaz.
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It's rather more complicated than that. Per chance the system relies on cues similar to /target_custom_next, you have:|
Originally Posted by daveyj3
so far there are what, four categories? or five?
-ally -dead ally -enemy -dead enemy -yellow-boxed-neutral-until-attacked-enemy? or is that just enemy? |
enemy - Hostile enemies.
friend - Friendlies (including pets).
defeated - 0 HP targets.
alive - Living targets.
mypet - Include only your pets.
notmypet - Exclude your pets.
base - Include only passive base items.
notbase - Exclude passive base items.
teammate - Include only teammates.
notteammate - Exclude teammates.
Mind you, a lot of powers in the game target a combination of these cues. For instance, "Mutation," the Radiation Emission resurrect targets "DeadPlayerFriend." Even if what's in /target_custom_next isn't representative of how powers pick what critters they can target, their system is actually quite complex. For instance, selecting an enemy and queuing up a heal will actually cause you to heal the ally the enemy is currently targeting, in effect letting you assist through the enemy because the power can't work on what you have targeted.
Personally, I'd stick to wishing what we want the powers to actually do unless we get an Arcana post explaining this, since otherwise we're just guessing if we try to suggest HOW they do it
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.
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The whole premise is great, but this could make Masterminds a lot more popular. I don't play them much personally, but this would be a great way to use the temp power tray. Each MM Primary could provide a small attack power from the first upgrade, and a small auto-buff from the second perhaps? Don't have the temp powers be affected by enhancements like other temp powers, but it could be useful.|
Originally Posted by Vanden
And here's a cool idea: what if Masterminds could use their minion upgrade powers on other players to grant them temporary powers based on their set? Demon Summoners could give teammates a clone of the upcoming Arcane Bolt, while Mercs could equip their allies with frag grenades.
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I figure the attack power would have a handful of charges, like a maximum of 5, while the auto power would last until the MM leaves the team or the target dies, like the upgrades on henchmen act.
Some ideas-
Bots- Photon Grenade, Armor Plating (Lethal Resist)
Demons- Arcane Bolt, Ember Boost (+Fire/Cold Resist)
Mercs- Frag Grenade, Nightvision Goggles (+Perception/+ToHit)
Beasts- Fang Dagger/Throwing Knife, Primal Rage (Damage boost?)
Thugs- Molotov Cocktail, Safety In Numbers (+Def per teammate nearby?)
Ninjas- Shurikens, Ninja Vanish (+Stealth)
Zombies- Dark Blast, Plaguebearer (Adds very minor toxic damage to all attacks)
I mean, the numbers would have to be tiny, but it would really make MMs more interesting as teammates.
The "different effects depending on the target" mechanic, as seen in such upcoming powers as Rebirth, Enflame, and Unrelenting. This would be a great way to add functionality to existing sets without violating the cottage rule. For example, Empathy, which often finds itself overshadowed by other, less specialized support sets in late-game content. I'd like to see Resurrect become usable on living allies as well as defeated ones, and on enemies to cause them to pulse a healing and +end aura that affects your allies. (Maybe change the name to Life Channel or something) Clear Mind could be used on enemies to reduce their mez resistance and ToHit. Adrenaline Boost could double as a mega debuff, crashing the regeneration and recovery of foes while reducing their damage, secondary effects, recharge, and max HP.
And here's a cool idea: what if Masterminds could use their minion upgrade powers on other players to grant them temporary powers based on their set? Demon Summoners could give teammates a clone of the upcoming Arcane Bolt, while Mercs could equip their allies with frag grenades.
I think this could make for some even more exciting change-ups in the established game, at a time when the game is already going through some exciting change-ups.
Issue 16 made me feel like this.
Warning: This poster likes to play Devil's Advocate.