Tanking iTrials


5th_Elemental

 

Posted

Hello tankers!

Since my recent return to the game, I've semi settled on an ill/rad controller with which I'm having a blasty blast. Having enjoyed that though, I also wanted to make a melee and tankers seem not only the most useful, but also relatively smallest in population so I decided on that AT. My question is about what power set(s) to choose if the intention is tanking current and future iTrials eventually.

I've read the guides and think I've got a fairly good understanding of the sets themselves and what their strengths and weaknesses are, my question is more practical in nature. I know, for example, that inv is a great set, but the idea of blowing up instantly when faced with psi damage made me uncomfortable. At the moment I think ela looks like where I'm leaning, but how bad is having no ddr? I know people post a lot about that as a failure theoretically, but how is it in practice? Assuming you cap at least s/l/e resistance and softcap (or close) s/l/e/n defense, do you often find the lack of ddr to cause defense failure and if so, do you find it makes you not survivable enough overall?

I'll admit, I've mostly been considering resistance sets instead of defensive ones as they seem the most survivable overall, but if I'm wrong let me know!

Side note: For secondaries I kind of dislike weapon sets due to finding redraw annoying. If needed i could roll one, but have been trying to conceptualize builds without parry, defensive sweep, etc.

Thanks in advance!


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mordheim View Post
do you often find the lack of ddr to cause defense failure and if so, do you find it makes you not survivable enough overall?
I know on my Icer (Ice/Kin/Soul Tanker) that during TPN trials I can end up having my health halved with pacifism. Many of the trials (Especially BAF/Lam) feel so zergy that often I don't feel like I'm a tanker at all.

And then there are other occassions in iTrials where you actually have that "Tanker" feel.

The main trouble with trials, in my personal view, is they're designed to exploit every single weakness they can find in a build.

As Invul, eventually you'll find yourself against some psi damage.
As Ice Armour, you'll eventually be up against Fire or Toxic.
As a granite, you'll eventually be in a situation of trying to get out of "circle of deaths"
Etc

However, the majority of the time there are so many team buffs going on, that these holes close up in the mess of the league's buffs/regens/heals.


 

Posted

I have tanked many Itrials on both res tanks, and def tanks it all boils down on how u play your tank, and the how u build them. My SR tank has no res but has high def and I hardly die with it, but once in awhile they do get that lucky shot in where I do have to heal my self. But it is like flints said every tank (or AT for that matter) has a hole in there armor sort of speak.


 

Posted

SHIELD is your answer!

I love my Shield Tank, he Tanked all the I-Trials as they came out and I was never disappointed.

Shield has a great mix of Defense and Resistance, Tough and Weave complement it perfectly.

You can cap out your Defense and have over 50% resistances.

And Shield Charge Rocks!


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Posted

I built my Elec/DM with 20% Def to all vectors (one medium purple from normal softcap to every attack type). I have done reasonably well on the small set of trials I have been on. I don't particularly like raid-type content, which is why I haven't done all that many.

Note: Leading Antimatter around by the nose with no assistance does feel pretty good.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caulderone View Post
Note: Leading Antimatter around by the nose with no assistance does feel pretty good.
I do that on my SD tank. PPl say i was crazy to add hover on it, I did it for 2 reasons 1 Keys for extra def, 2 HAMI ( Mostly HAMI), and I have not had problems on my SR tank on any of the Itrials.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by LSK View Post
I do that on my SD tank. PPl say i was crazy to add hover on it, I did it for 2 reasons 1 Keys for extra def, 2 HAMI ( Mostly HAMI), and I have not had problems on my SR tank on any of the Itrials.
That was a comment in relation to the "I don't like raids all that much" line. It's one of the few things I've actually found to be something "personal" I can do other than be a good zergling.

I have fly. I like fly.


 

Posted

I have been thinking about this rather a lot, and am coming to the conclusion that the 'best' iTanks are going to be either shield defense or willpower, with SR and Dark as distant seconds.

Why? Confuse/terror resistance. SD and will offer both, SR has confuse, Dark has terror.

After that, any of the 'traditional' heavy armor sets is viable, with the caveat that you better run leadership and carry breakfree's. Heck, I'd have some breakfree's ready on ANY tanker in incarnate content.

I have tanked many an UG on a stone/ss, and on my beloved inv/ax. Both have quite good builds and did fine, aside from the occasional faceplant caused by Olympian Guards.

MoM is a bit rough on an invuln, but quite doable with dull pain and rebirth.

DD is not that hard to tank, in my experience.

Keyes is tankable by my fires or my invuln, never tried the stoner because you want to be able to run around, but I've seen a teleporting stoner do it amazingly well.

But a top-shelf shield defense or willpower build would, I believe, have the strongest performance envelope in that content.

SR tanks might be a bit crunchy on iTrials, but my tooled up SR scrapper with rebirth does just fine. Rebirth COMPLETELY re-makes SR. Dark, well, the endurance issues and general squish factor can both be handled on a good build.

In my mind, a growing concern s going to be taunt resistance. Namely, we ain't got none.


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by 5th_Elemental View Post
SHIELD is your answer!

I love my Shield Tank, he Tanked all the I-Trials as they came out and I was never disappointed.

Shield has a great mix of Defense and Resistance, Tough and Weave complement it perfectly.

You can cap out your Defense and have over 50% resistances.

And Shield Charge Rocks!
Did you find that the relatively low resists were fine on their own, or is it that there were plenty of +res buffs being tossed around to make up for it? Same question to the SR people really. Defense sets scared me because it seemed way easier to use IOs/pool power to fill defensive holes in resist sets rather than vice versa, but it's good to hear that the primarily defensive sets are still holding up to the content!


 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mordheim View Post
Did you find that the relatively low resists were fine on their own, or is it that there were plenty of +res buffs being tossed around to make up for it? Same question to the SR people really. Defense sets scared me because it seemed way easier to use IOs/pool power to fill defensive holes in resist sets rather than vice versa, but it's good to hear that the primarily defensive sets are still holding up to the content!
In terms of regular buffs you'll find that defense buffs are a bit more common, but so many people take barrier that as long as you're running relatively close to the group you'l probably have at least 1 or 2 on at all times.

As for tank choice...I actually found it a bit easier to tank the iTrials on my electric tank than on my willpower tank. Ageless debuff resistance is as big a game changer on elec as rebirth is on SR.

I know a lot of people seem to avoid them, but I'd say (icapped) shield or SR might be best for tanking these things given the huge mix of damage types and status effects and the prevalence of barrier. Just say screw it and take the positional defense, haha...I'm not speaking from experience, though, so maybe there are a lot of non-position attacks flying around that I don't know about.


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Posted

I'm leveling an Electric/DM tank as my super tough itrial tank. I put together a build that has 45% defense to S/L, with a couple stacks of the ATO proc it's at capped S/L/E resist, 70% or so to F/C/Psi and 55% Negative resist. It has pretty nice regen thanks to Energize and other IO bonuses, and Siphon life at 20% heal at 3s recharge. My plan was to go with Rebirth to push regen up even more, but I hadn't thought about Ageless giving debuff resist, I might have to try that too. All in all I like it because it has strengths in most areas. It's not best at anything, except maybe overall resists, but it's strong in a lot of areas, plus it has a damage aura, and some global recharge in LR.

The reason I liked Electric over some of the other sets is that it has the highest base resists, it doesn't have any resist holes except toxic, which most everything has, and it had some offensive skills. With IO's it's easier to stack up defense and regen then resists. The two real weaknesses I saw for the set were it's lack of strong heals, Energize is great, but it's not quite enough, and no DDR. Siphon Life from DM fixes the heal part, and I just have to live with the lack of DDR.

The other reason I liked Electric is that incarnate trials so far are heavy in Energy and Psi damage, and Electric has the best resists to both those available.


 

Posted

Actually Dark has the best psi resists by a bit...and S/L can be capped and Neg. Energy will cap, Energy is lower, but defense can shore that up.

My Dark/Fire tank is nasty with 45% S/L/E/N and nearly capped S/L (89%) and capped Neg (90%), and Psi is 3% shy of the cap (87%)


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Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by planet_J View Post
Actually Dark has the best psi resists by a bit...and S/L can be capped and Neg. Energy will cap, Energy is lower, but defense can shore that up.

My Dark/Fire tank is nasty with 45% S/L/E/N and nearly capped S/L (89%) and capped Neg (90%), and Psi is 3% shy of the cap (87%)
Hm, this is true. I swear I had compared Dark and Electric in the past and Electric had better Psi resist. Not sure what I did. Maybe I compared a slotted build for Electric with base values on Dark. Out of curiosity how did you get your S/L Resist so high on your dark tanker? I'm only seeing about 70% with slotted Tough and Dark Embrace. I admit that Electric only gets up to 78%, but when you are near the cap, every little bit means that much more. Also how are you getting capped on Negative? I'm only seeing 62.5% from the dark shields and slotting.

That said, I do see how Dark would be a good contender, It's got a bit less base resists for S/L/F/C/E but better Negative obviously, and Psi and it has some ok Toxic where Electric has none. Also has a nice boost on the defense side with CoD, which is definitely a much better boost on a tank then a brute or scrapper.


 

Posted

With a tier 4 Resilient core alpha slotted, my Dark tank has 88.4% S/L resists, 63.3% F/C resists, 42.7% Energy and 79.2 % NegEnergy resists, 43.1 Toxic resists and 90% (capped) psi resists. This is on top of S/L/E/N softcapped Defense. While I can see the case for Elec (Vysires and I have had this discussion in other threads), Dark is definitely a strong contender. With Melee hybrid active, the S/L and Negative Energy resistances all hit cap.

Also, to speak to the OP's concern about the lack of DDR in tankers doing iTrials with softcapped Defense as a major part of their total survivability plan, I'd like to highlight the radial path of the Ageless destiny incarnate power, which provides a source of DDR. Unless I have a specific reason to do otherwise (e.g. Clarion needed for a UGT), I always run my tier 4 Ageless Radial Epiphany and I have it set on autocast. It works.


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