In theory, it seems like it's a combo with whatever the opposite of synergy is, at least with respect to pet protection. You add a decent amount of resists (40 from shields and dispersion + 10 from IO) to a small amount of def that ninjas have. You'd pretty much need to take Aid Other and you'd be interrupted more than other sets that cause enemies to hit less, whether due to -tohit, +def or both.
I haven't played Sonic Resonance on a MM but I have for other ATs. Disruption is very costly for them and even moreso for MMs.
It's also worth noting that Sonic is endurance intensive. But I just noticed in Mids it appears the endurance cost is the same as for the other ATs that have Sonic, so masterminds get a bargain if that's true. Normally MMs use 25% more endurance for secondary powers, so Sonic has that going for it (again, if Mids is right).
Having said all this, I've always maintained any MM can get to 50 and do the missions they're assigned. I just think this would require more savvy on the player's part.
Global = Hedgefund (or some derivation thereof)
Problem is that Sonic is a resist set with no heal in it. This is fine for a defense set, because you don't get hit at all and can thus roll with Aid Other only, but a resist set is getting hit. And no matter how high you can get those resists, Mastermind pets just don't have the HP and will fold through attrition.
And you're pairing that with pets who are legendary for their squishy desire to die. I wouldn't particularly recommend /Sonic at all for Masterminds because of the healing issue*, but Ninjas want to die. They demand it. I swear, these guys have dishonoured themselves somehow and want to perish in battle. Their native defense is...rubbish...and they don't even have a base level of good resists to be building on. If you're one of the cheerful nutbars who only care about your hilarious levels of debuffing tastiness, and not how many poor pets you burnt through leveraging them....great, fill your boots. Ninjas naturally output truly absurd amounts of damage and /Sonic will blast those numbers into the skybox, but it's going to do sod all to keep them alive. Sod. All. Those resists are going to be largely pointless with the heat coming down on them, and you haven't got other methods of mitigation to deal with it.
*I wouldn't, but crazy people who love micro and hate their pets would. I get annoyed when one dies. The payoff is that /Sonic has OMGWTFBBQ debuffs. I cry every time I see the set, because I want those debuffs but know I couldn't cope with only having Aid Other for it.
Chairman of the Charity of Pain; accepting donations of blood and guts.
Prophet of the Creamy Truth; "If it's empty, fill it with cream."
Nin/Sonic will suck pretty hard. Beast/Sonic actually has good synergies. Here is why I think:
1. If you have played Nin/Thermal or Ninj/Pain, you'll know that you still need to heal constantly to keep them alive because Genins and Jounins have no resistance to stack with the resistance buffs.
2. /Sonic has no heal (your only option is Aid Other) and while its +resistance is good, you won't have enough ways to push your Ninjas' defense over soft-cap. Capped defense is very important for me to enjoy Ninjas because I am tired of constantly healing them or resummoning them. If the game setting is higher than +2, your Genin may die from one hit from most Lts and Bosses.
This is not to say Nin/Sonic can't work. You can get another buddy to play /sonic or /thermal or /pain to stack even more resist.
Now, Beast/sonic works much better because Beast naturally has more defense and Fortify Packs can push their defense over soft-cap. If you have high defense plus high resistance, the survival issue is much less which means you need less healing. The lack of +damage/critical from PM during FP can be made up with the two -resistance debuffs in /sonic. It's a fair trade. I still don't make Beast/Sonic (I like Beast/Time a whole lot more) though.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
Quote:
It don't have synerge, you won't be able to heal then and would die alot, Ninjas don' have good def, his def is next to nothing, it not worth the effort, Other combos would be a have better performer.|
Originally Posted by Beelzy
Just wondering about this combo, whether it has synergy, what are its weaknesses, and whether it is worth it... Also anything I should know about either the primary or secondary before going down this path
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Ninjas need set that give AoE healing
I want /Fire stalker. Because nothing says stealth like dumping a can of gasoline on yourself and lighting a match. -Morac
Ninjas are best paired with large-scale Defense buffs and/or large-scale Tohit debuffs. Nin/Time is probably the best.
Nin/FF, Nin/Traps, and Nin/Dark work okay too.
If you want a primary to pair with Sonic, Demons is where it's at. You can get them up about 40% resist from Sonic buffs and 20% more from IOs. They all have 20%+ resists to S/L and their native damage type, and the Ember Demon buffs their resistances even further. I think it's plausible that you could hard-cap them to S/L and their native damage types.
Plus, there's another 10% resist+regeneration IO coming out In The Future if the Beta leak doesn't get changed.
@Draeth Darkstar
Virtue [Heroes, Roleplay], Freedom [Villains], Exalted [All Sides, Roleplay]
Code:
I24 Proc Chance = (Enhanced Recharge + Activation Time) * (Current PPM * 1.25) / 60*(1 + .75*(.15*Radius - 0.011*Radius*(360-Arc)/30)) Single Target Radius = 0. AoE Non-Cone Arc = 360.
Perhaps the synergy I thought I saw was because I have not played a MM before, and was approaching the set as a herd-stalker type of set. Focusing more on strategic fighting than aggroing everything possible and trying to keep the kittens kicking...
That being said, I'll think hard before I put this together...
As an aside, does anyone play /Sonic?
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Hi Beelzy,|
Originally Posted by Beelzy
Perhaps the synergy I thought I saw was because I have not played a MM before, and was approaching the set as a herd-stalker type of set. Focusing more on strategic fighting than aggroing everything possible and trying to keep the kittens kicking...
That being said, I'll think hard before I put this together... As an aside, does anyone play /Sonic? |
I have no idea what a "herd-stalker" is, even after your explanation. That term is an oxymoron. Kind of like pairing Ninjas/ with /Sonic. Someone above mentioned that Ninjas requires an AoE heal to perform best. This is some great advice and also something that does not come with the /Sonic set.
To answer your question above: Yes. I have a Bots/Sonic fully IO'ed and Incarnated. With all the brain power at work in this thread, no one has mentioned the main advantage to why a player would select the Sonic secondary. Perhaps with some more boo hooing we will all be enlightened!
Quote:
In terms of "herd-stalker," think of the velociraptors in Jurassic Park. In game terms, the goal would be to utilize smoke flash to get positioning and minimize aggro. I understand that it is likely that some of the pets will bite the bullet, but it just necessitates an unorthodox playing style. Looking at Sonic Siphon and Disruption Field added to the high burst damage of Ninjas, and you may have the synergy necessary to overcome the defensive shortcomings of the combo...|
Originally Posted by LIinfinity
Hi Beelzy,
I have no idea what a "herd-stalker" is, even after your explanation. That term is an oxymoron. Kind of like pairing Ninjas/ with /Sonic. Someone above mentioned that Ninjas requires an AoE heal to perform best. This is some great advice and also something that does not come with the /Sonic set. To answer your question above: Yes. I have a Bots/Sonic fully IO'ed and Incarnated. With all the brain power at work in this thread, no one has mentioned the main advantage to why a player would select the Sonic secondary. Perhaps with some more boo hooing we will all be enlightened! |
Here is what I was thinking,
Villain Plan by Mids' Villain Designer 1.956
http://www.cohplanner.com/
Click this DataLink to open the build!
Level 50 Magic Mastermind
Primary Power Set: Ninjas
Secondary Power Set: Sonic Resonance
Power Pool: Leaping
Power Pool: Concealment
Power Pool: Teleportation
Ancillary Pool: Heat Mastery
Villain Profile:
Level 1: Call Genin -- SCotMastermind-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(A), SCotMastermind-Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(3), SCotMastermind-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(3), SCotMastermind-Rchg/PetAoEDef(5), S'bndAl-Build%(17), S'bndAl-Dmg/EndRdx(19)
Level 1: Sonic Siphon -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(7)
Level 2: Sonic Barrier -- S'fstPrt-ResDam/Def+(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(5), RctvArm-ResDam(7), RctvArm-EndRdx(34), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(36), ImpSkn-Status(50)
Level 4: Sonic Haven -- GA-3defTpProc(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(9), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(9), RctvArm-ResDam(34), RctvArm-EndRdx(43)
Level 6: Train Ninjas -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 8: Fistful of Arrows -- Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(A), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(11), Posi-Dmg/Rng(11), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(13), Posi-Dam%(13)
Level 10: Combat Jumping -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def(36)
Level 12: Call Jounin -- EdctM'r-PetDef(A), SvgnRt-PetResDam(15), S'bndAl-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(15), S'bndAl-Acc/Rchg(17), SCotMastermind-Acc/Dmg(19), SCotMastermind-Dmg/EndRdx(21)
Level 14: Super Jump -- Zephyr-Travel(A), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(25), Zephyr-ResKB(25)
Level 16: Disruption Field -- EndRdx-I(A), EndRdx-I(21)
Level 18: Smoke Flash -- RechRdx-I(A), RechRdx-I(36)
Level 20: Sonic Dispersion -- Aegis-Psi/Status(A), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx(23), RctvArm-ResDam/EndRdx/Rchg(23), RctvArm-ResDam(46), RctvArm-EndRdx(46)
Level 22: Spring Attack -- Oblit-Acc/Rchg(A), Oblit-Dmg/Rchg(29), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(29), Oblit-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx/Rchg(31), Oblit-%Dam(31), Oblit-Dmg(50)
Level 24: Stealth -- LkGmblr-Rchg+(A), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx(27), LkGmblr-Def/EndRdx/Rchg(27)
Level 26: Oni -- SvgnRt-Acc/Dmg(A), SvgnRt-Dmg/EndRdx(31), SvgnRt-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(33), SvgnRt-Acc(33), S'bndAl-Dmg(33), S'bndAl-Dmg/Rchg(34)
Level 28: Recall Friend -- Zephyr-ResKB(A)
Level 30: Teleport -- Zephyr-ResKB(A), Zephyr-Travel(37), Zephyr-Travel/EndRdx(37)
Level 32: Kuji In Zen -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 35: Clarity -- EndRdx-I(A)
Level 38: Liquefy -- BasGaze-Acc/Rchg(A), BasGaze-Rchg/Hold(39), BasGaze-EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(39), BasGaze-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg/Hold(39), Achilles-ResDeb%(40), SipInsght-ToHitDeb/EndRdx/Rchg(43)
Level 41: Fire Blast -- Decim-Dmg/EndRdx(A), Decim-Dmg/Rchg(42), Decim-Acc/EndRdx/Rchg(42), Decim-Acc/Dmg/Rchg(42), Decim-Build%(43)
Level 44: Fire Ball -- Posi-Dmg/EndRdx(A), Posi-Dmg/Rchg(45), Posi-Dmg/Rng(45), Posi-Acc/Dmg/EndRdx(45), Posi-Dam%(46)
Level 47: Rise of the Phoenix -- Stpfy-Acc/Rchg(A), Stpfy-EndRdx/Stun(48), Stpfy-Acc/EndRdx(48), Stpfy-Stun/Rng(48), Stpfy-Acc/Stun/Rchg(50)
Level 49: Long Range Teleport -- RechRdx-I(A)
Level 2: Swift -- Run-I(A)
Level 2: Health -- Mrcl-Rcvry+(A), Numna-Regen/Rcvry+(37), Numna-Heal(40)
Level 2: Hurdle -- Jump-I(A)
Level 2: Stamina -- P'Shift-End%(A), P'Shift-EndMod(40)
Level 1: Brawl -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Dash -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Slide -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Quick -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Rush -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Prestige Power Surge -- Empty(A)
Level 1: Sprint -- SprngFt-EndRdx/Jump(A)
Level 1: Supremacy
Level 2: Rest -- Empty(A)
Level 4: Ninja Run
Level 50: Cardiac Core Paragon
------------
Code:
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I don't like /sonic but if I am forced to make one, it will be beast, demon and maybe thug.
Beast and Demon are probably the best choices. Thug has bruiser so can be workable too.
Hard to pair with Merc because you'll need to goto a lot to get Disruption to work, and I guess same thing with Robot. The difference is that Assault Robot has two target aoe and Commando and Soldiers are mostly cone attacks, which means they are better standing far than going in.
Maybe Necro would work but as a fan of Necro, I can't imagine not having a good heal for them. Those zombies/grave knights melt just as fast as Ninja in some cases.
What's left is to normalize all Assassin Strikes and improve Stalker's old sets (Claw, MA and EM)! You don't need to bring back the missing PbAoE attack. You just need to make the existing ones better! For example, make Slice a WIDER and LONGER cone.
If you are set on sonic, I'd recommend Beast.
-Beast has innate res to stack with it
-Beast has innate def for when your res can't go any higher
-Beasts have innate heals except for the two normal wolves
-the T7, Fortify Pack. With no slots and the full 10 pack mentality (which you get within the first 10 seconds of a fight), you gives them 15% def and about 500% regen. Their natural def is 12%. Add in a def IO and maneuvers, your pets are nigh invulnerable killing machines.
Quote:
I tested Necro/Sonic on the proliferation beta last summer; it wasn't pretty once the difficulty was boosted. I still have nightmares... Disruption was fine, but keeping the lich protected at range while the others were in melee was a pain. Zombie heals were ill-timed (almost by design I began to suspect), the only controls were from the lich (slotted for hit debuff) and PPPs (ran with Soul Mastery on the test). Bodyguard was out against many adversaries to avoid the minions being whittled away by a constant stream of damage, and any AOE at all would bring about catastrophic minion failure. |
Originally Posted by Jibikao
Maybe Necro would work but as a fan of Necro, I can't imagine not having a good heal for them. Those zombies/grave knights melt just as fast as Ninja in some cases.
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Demons on the other hand -- like night and day.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Arcanaville
...[I]t would be more proper to say this game is slooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooowly dying.
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Demons are the way to go for sonic. The more IO auras we get the more petsets that can offload those into non MM pet powers profit. Demons will later on probably have 6 IO Auras, while still being able to 6 slot every pet for damage/end/accuracy. They are also ranged, do exotic damage and have an AoE heal. Which is alot better than NOT having a AoE heal.
If you are set on Melee pets Beast should be doable, 4 out of 6 pets have a decent heal. Though by god i do not know how you are going to manage slotting 4 IO aura pieces into your 3 pet powers, especially not if you try to add a heal IO to get a little more mileage out of their heals ...
So yeah, maybe better stick with necros for melee. With /Sonic you'll eventually sit around 70% resists (30% from IOs, 40 from sonic), and between liquify, the lich and a potential ghost you should have enough -tohit to atleast get a couple aid others off. Which you will need to do. Alot.
Just wondering about this combo, whether it has synergy, what are its weaknesses, and whether it is worth it... Also anything I should know about either the primary or secondary before going down this path