Brutes Vs. Scrappers

Hey, just returning to CoX, and I would like to know whether to roll a scrapper or a brute basically, which got the upper hand at the moment and why? thx
p.s. both pve and pvp wise.. some pros and cons would be nice

Brutes had upper hand for a while, now it's mostly even. There is no real "better." Fury generation was modified so that its easy to build but gets progressively harder. So in general Scrappers will still have the damage advantage while Brutes the survival.

At the end of the day, it depends on what you want to do with it and what powersets you want to play with. Fiery Aura? Go with Brute (::grumble grumble stupid mobs running away from my Burn... :: )

Shield and elec get teleport attacks that do their damage by summoning what's known as a pseudopet at your location. Pets have a 400% damage cap. This is fine for scrappers because their archetype damage modifier is very high, so limited buffability for their pseudopets isn't a factor. Brutes, on the other hand, have a much higher damage cap, much lower modifier, and fury is a huge damage buff. This means that it's trivially easy for a brute to cap their pet's damage... at a much lower value than scrappers get.

Titan weapons, on the other hand, seems like a fine set for both brutes and scrappers so I'm not too sure about that one.

On damage aura defense sets, I'd most often choose a Brute. For several reasons, but most conspicuously, because the damage aura can't crit, but does get the fury damage buff.

Edit: But really, it's close enough that you can just pick whichever playstyle you prefer and make the build as scrapper or brute, and you'll be fine.

Honestly, it comes down to which powersets you want. Spines, for instance, is an awesome power set but unique to scrappers. Super Strength, not for scrappers. I think brutes win out in the long run because survivability makes damage output higher.

The other thing to consider is that Brutes do not have a damage cap at level 1, so its possible to use reds in AE missions to kill large mobs fairly quickly, but examplared down you still get the same level of XP. The devs will probably nerf it eventually, but for now that brings Brutes out in front for me because of the faster leveling.

Its something like this. If you have a PbAoE toggle than becuase of stupid A.I. mobs will be running away from your character. Brutes and tankers negate this effect so mobs don't run from them so if you are using a power that is a toggle PBAoE it is better on a brute.

Like someone mentioned there are some pseudo-pet damage powers in some sets these performs better on scrappers for provided reason.

Any set that does high burst damage is better on scrapper because;

1) scrappers have a higher base modifier than brutes (brutes are 0.75 while scrappers are 1.125)

2) since they have higher base damage values any damage buff will be higher on scrappers for example if something gives %30 damage buff than while it is making brutes attack power 0.975 it makes scrappers attack power 1.4625

3) Fury only boosts base damage however critical doubles enhanced damage so combined with previous facts the higher base damage a power has a chance to make more damage in a scrapper set.

with the fury proc in the ATO set brutes are back to parity or higher for sustained DPS. Scraps generally have the burst damage nod (except probably vs. SS/Fire/Soul brutes)

Its even I think. Brutes do less damage at the begining of a battle than a scrapper but can get to their level of damage with fury and "I think" surpass it. Though brutes have naturally more survivability than scrappers.

Scrappers = Kill fast before killed.
Brutes = kill but not too fast.

a full fury bar on a brute is equivalent to something like +100% damage...and you can stay somewhere around 85-95% in mobs, with the ATO fury proc, pretty stustained...so think of that as +90% damage +/- if you can keep fury up, you will do more damage than your average scrapper, but keeping it up is a bear to do outside of farms and hordes of enemies. My DM/INV brute can do it pretty easily...but he's invuln and loves to swim in enemies. My Kat/Dark brute however has somewhat more trouble keeping the fury bar full because he isn't well slotted yet and dies more quickly than my INV brute does...but once I get him slotted I think the death shrouds aura will help him get the bar full pretty well.

Actually, I believe that a full bar of Fury grants a 200% bonus to the base damage of an attack.

A full bar of Fury does result in a 200% damage buff. However, because of the way fury is generated with diminishing returns, it is very difficult to push Fury above 80 (160%dmg buff).

If a brute can maintain their Fury at 75+, then assuming both players are unbuffed by others, brutes can overall out-dps a scrapper. A scrapper's crits do hit hard, but a brute with high fury can dish dps out faster with noticeably more damage on all of their attacks (instead of infrequent crits). Running into low endurance or low health is the main thing causing a brute to let their Fury bar drop. Heavy use of inspirations prolongs these 'high fury' periods. But frankly, running into low health or endurance makes a scrapper stop too.

When in a group though... IF the brute is not the primary tank, a scrapper can surpass the brute's dps, as the brute lacks the mob aggro to generate high fury. If the group has fulcrum shift though, and both the brute and scrapper are buffed to their damage cap... then the brute will stand out as the higher dps character again, until level 50 when the scrapper's damage cap catches up.

At level 50, the 775% damage cap of brutes (with lower base damage on their attacks) and the 500% damage cap of scrappers (with somewhat higher base damage), is almost identical. For example Lightning Rod in electrical melee, at the damage cap for scrappers and brutes respectively, is within a couple damage points. I don't see reaching either of those caps without a Kin on your team though.

In most cases, brutes are noticeably more durable than scrappers. This depends greatly on the build though. Brutes can generally "tank" effectively, having gauntlet (built in taunt effects) in all of their attacks, and having an aggro aura in every secondary set. Some scrapper power sets do have an aggro aura though. And some aggro aura's seem stronger than others. For example Entropic Aura (energy aura set), has a very potent aggro effect, possibly due to the recharge debuff that is also in the power. Scrappers in general will have to work much harder to gain and hold aggro if they choose to attempt to tank though, and will (in most builds) find themselves less durable than a brute.

Honestly I think brutes are hard to beat. They're stronger in solo play, more durable, able to tank, and have more tools to pull mobs into melee range and keep them there to dish out dps. With a build that has plenty of endurance and a way of healing oneself, or heavy use of inspirations with very high damage output (keeps inspirations from kills coming faster), a brute can generally do more damage. 160% dmg buff from 80 Fury is going to provide noticeably more dps over time than a fairly infrequent chance to crit for double damage. You'd have to crit more than half the time to keep up.

example: 133 base damage, at 80 fury (+160%) = 345 dmg, vs. a scrapper's higher 200 base damage, which can crit to 400 base damage. Assuming a brute could maintain 80 fury, a scrapper would have to crit like 3/4ths of the time to keep up in dps.

After leveling 2 scrappers to 50 as a duo with my boyfriend who leveled the same power sets to 50, but his characters were brute versions... I observed that my overall dps was a little weaker, and I was definitely more squishy than my boyfriend's brute versions. And on teams, he could tank, while I was pretty much restricted to only melee dps, for lack of aggro holding capability. In incarnate content, our dps evened out as his brutes lost some fury to big teams, my scrappers reached their level-slanted dmg cap, and we both got damage buffed by a large number of support characters. But his brutes were still more durable.

I could see taking a scrapper for something that has a hard hitting first strike, like electrical melee/shield def. Or for a high recharge build where taking Shadow Meld in the soul mastery ancillary set would make you nigh invincible for 15s every 25s or so. And unless the brute is tanking, on an incarnate trial brute & scrapper dps evens out.

I'd say Brute looks better "in general". They're more durable in solo play, they can tank for a team, they can reach their damage cap of 775% while leveling up (scrappers are level limited in dmg cap and don't hit 500% until lvl50), and they seem to put out more damage than a scrapper once they are slotted to be durable enough to really fill up their Fury bar. Final DPS also depends on being tough enough to keep up an attack chain without fear of death, this favors brutes. In end-game incarnate content, they're a wash dps-wise, but brutes still have more base health and a 'much' higher health cap, and a higher resistance cap. But you really need to look at the detailed specifics of the exact power sets you're taking, and your playstyle preference. I don't think brutes are better "in every case"
...just in most cases.

I say this not as a brute fangirl, but more as someone who's realized that some of her many scrappers probably should have been brutes.

I think the game devs themselves must play Brutes and VEATs primarily, and never ever play Keldians.