Mastermind: Customizable Henchmen!!!


daveyj3

 

Posted

I love my DSMM but I'd rather summon a pack of ravenous werewolves instead of the same old hell spawn thingies. This probably isn't a new thread concept here but I just wanted to throw some fuel on the MM fire. I'd be content with being able simply assign preexisting npc models to my minion tiers.

Tier 1: 3 of those circle of thrones specter things
Tier 2: 2 of the giant werewolf models
Tier 3: Well, I actually like my demon prince. Id rather see him replaced with a Cerberus type creature or a demon bear.

This all brings me around to my other idea for hero versions of mastermind that can summon animals or clones of your character but that's for another thread.


 

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*Points to the thread in her sig* That right there is what I want for customization.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin Credible View Post
I love my DSMM but I'd rather summon a pack of ravenous werewolves instead of the same old hell spawn thingies. This probably isn't a new thread concept here but I just wanted to throw some fuel on the MM fire. I'd be content with being able simply assign preexisting npc models to my minion tiers.

Tier 1: 3 of those circle of thrones specter things
Tier 2: 2 of the giant werewolf models
Tier 3: Well, I actually like my demon prince. Id rather see him replaced with a Cerberus type creature or a demon bear.

This all brings me around to my other idea for hero versions of mastermind that can summon animals or clones of your character but that's for another thread.
Welcome to the game...

Just as an FYI the topics of "Customizable Mastermind Henchmen" and "Hero Masterminds" have popped up here literally hundreds of times since October 2005 (when City of Villains launched). Feel free to add "fuel" to those fires but try to keep some perspective on them as well. At the very least don't hold your breath for these kinds of things to happen anytime soon.


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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lothic View Post
Just as an FYI the topics of "Customizable Mastermind Henchmen" and "Hero Masterminds" have popped up here literally hundreds of times since October 2005 (when City of Villains launched). Feel free to add "fuel" to those fires but try to keep some perspective on them as well. At the very least don't hold your breath for these kinds of things to happen anytime soon.
We can have hero masterminds now. Hero masterminds from level 1, even. Just saying.

Edit: Ah, I didn't see his suggestion for new *powersets*. Got it.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Placta View Post
We can have hero masterminds now. Hero masterminds from level 1, even. Just saying.

Edit: Ah, I didn't see his suggestion for new *powersets*. Got it.
Yes I'm well aware you can start a new character with the Mastermind AT as a hero now.

But for years when most people ever mentioned wanting "Hero Masterminds" the suggestion usually involved allowing players to create a new kind of blueside Mastermind with "heroic" styled powersets like Justin Credible was talking about.


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Posted

Be right back... Getting the popcorn ready now...


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Originally by Arcanaville: Everything in Praetoria was designed during a drinking binge in which the devs temporarily forgot the rules.

 

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Since players can get their henchies to speak and use emotes I am sure you can all figure out why we don't have female henchies.


 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by VoodooGirl View Post
Since players can get their henchies to speak and use emotes I am sure you can all figure out why we don't have female henchies.
Since I can make my female PCs talk and use emotes I guess the real mystery is why the Devs allowed us to make female characters in the first place.


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Quote:
Originally Posted by VoodooGirl View Post
Since players can get their henchies to speak and use emotes I am sure you can all figure out why we don't have female henchies.
Because the Devs are AFRAID of something they shouldn't worry about as Devs.


It's the end. But the moment has been prepared for ...

 

Posted

Quote:
Originally Posted by VoodooGirl View Post
Since players can get their henchies to speak and use emotes I am sure you can all figure out why we don't have female henchies.
Yes, because that doesn't already happen now with the male henchies. Next excuse please.

Let's remember something here....
MOST players have functioning brains and know that what the Devs are claiming would happen (using emotes to ERP or doing other things that violate both the EULA and the T for TEEN rating) would get them banned.
The small percentage that would abuse the abilities are already doing it, and nothing would change if they (the Devs) allowed female minions.


 

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Mastermind customization ties into power customization and presents an immense workload. That's the real excuse. Unlike other summons, Mastermind henchmen have a variety of costumes per henchman, and often a variety of varieties if you have dissimilar, random-appearance for your henchmen like Thugs do.

Basically, each henchman has four costumes: one default, one with just the first upgrade, one with just the second upgrade and one with both. Each Mastermind has three tiers of henchmen, so that's three times four costumes. Some henchmen, like Ninja, Thugs and Mercs, also have multiple models for all their henchmen, and each model has four costumes to itself. For Thugs, in fact, most of their upgrade powers is just costume piece calls - a huge list of them - to make sure a black guy doesn't turn into a white guy when he puts on a jacket and one guy's face doesn't change into another guy's face when he puts on a bandana. What this equates to is a giant lump of artwork to even mess with these things.

There's also UI work. Normally, summons either spawn one entity, or else spawns a group of the same entities, so you can use one option to customize them all. Mastermind henchmen often spawn three very dissimilar entities with just one power. I think the Demon Summoning Demonlings are the best example - each looks different and has different powers of a different colour. Considering the UI doesn't even let us keep our toggles on so we can see what we're changing and STILL only has the light/dark part of the screen take up a 4x3 rectangle on the right of my 16x9 monitor, I'd say that's a problem.

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All of that said... Sure. Of course I'd like to see customizable henchmen. One of my dreams has always been to see a sort of "storm trooper" appearance for Mercenaries henchmen. Right now, the only "futuristic" henchmen we have are Robotics robots, with the Mercs more resembling 1970s Vietnam era US soldiers, complete with the Arnold Schwartzenegger shirtless commando who'd have his eyes sucked out of his head Total Recall style if he actually went out in space like what I want to have mine do.

Mastermind henchmen customization is one of the big things left in this game, right next to the ability to fire non-weapon powers (Ice Blast, say) out of guns and weapon powers out of our hands or hand-mounted implements. It's always been a good idea.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.

 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Samuel_Tow View Post
Mastermind customization ties into power customization and presents an immense workload. That's the real excuse. Unlike other summons, Mastermind henchmen have a variety of costumes per henchman, and often a variety of varieties if you have dissimilar, random-appearance for your henchmen like Thugs do.

Basically, each henchman has four costumes: one default, one with just the first upgrade, one with just the second upgrade and one with both.

---

All of that said... Sure. Of course I'd like to see customizable henchmen. One of my dreams has always been to see a sort of "storm trooper" appearance for Mercenaries henchmen. Right now, the only "futuristic" henchmen we have are Robotics robots, with the Mercs more resembling 1970s Vietnam era US soldiers, complete with the Arnold Schwartzenegger shirtless commando who'd have his eyes sucked out of his head Total Recall style if he actually went out in space like what I want to have mine do.

Mastermind henchmen customization is one of the big things left in this game, right next to the ability to fire non-weapon powers (Ice Blast, say) out of guns and weapon powers out of our hands or hand-mounted implements. It's always been a good idea.
I honestly feel the best way to achieve MM customization is to allow players to unlock alternate "skins" for their pets via badges. the alternate skins would be models of already-in-game critters which there are definitely enough variety with continuity to avoid needing to make so many new costumes, and to avoid the potential mess of completely custom critters. More than color customization, most people want alt pet skins for thematic purposes. then maybe color changing of all or part. then complete customization [which honestly im indifferent to, also it's a lot of work and information] so alt skins is, if we get MM customization, what we'll probably get. [Like the OP suggested, Demons could potentially summon CoT demons instead, or Rularuu critters might work, and so-on. This could even finally introduce female MM pets with Knives as Mercs or succubus demons, etc.]

there are so many robots, zombies, demonic, a few ninja-esque, and zillions of potential thugs and mercs. and each enemy group has enough costumes to make up for the costume changes and continuity of the "upgrade" costume changes. and if all that is needed is to mark the pet with the corresponding chosen critter costume skin, retaining the same powers, etc, than i think this would satisfy the majority of players. also, since we can have Lore pets related to NPC groups, Patron pet powers, NPC costume change powers, and Signature Summons this would totally make sense and fit great.

granted, i dont know what it would take to make this happen, i'm no programmer designer what-have-you, but i think this is possible with the npc costume change powers we have, the ability to rename individual pets, and badge unlocked costume pieces already in game.

then we could reasonably have:
Pets [within the powers customization menu]
[Custom or Default selection dropdown menu]
tier 1 zombie 1: vhaz
tier 1 zombie 2: banished pantheon [husk]
tier 1 zombie 3: default

tier 2 zombie 1: zombie apocalypse [reanimated corpse]
tier 2 zombie 2: banished pantheon [dry chamber]

tier 3 lich: default

necromancy ghost: CoT [Spectral Night]



the list of NPC critters and groups would be awesome to be able to unlock, and to me, wrap up this issue pretty easily. would even stall the need for new MM primaries [although i can come up with plenty of those too though.] but imagine with me for a moment, a CoH where MMs can summon, if they want, clockwork and Behemoths instead of the goofy robots and ugly-loud-annoying-ALWAYS-IN-THE-WAY demons. :sigh: what a wonderful world that will be.


 

Posted

Humanoid henchmen customization is easy. Just swap the base model and you're set. The problem is with the non-human ones using exotic animations and/or rigs. The Robotics robots use their own unique models only slightly modelled after the Malta Hercules/Zeus titans. They're so unique that they're actually the BASIS for a couple of other character rigs, like the PPD bots. There isn't all that much to swap them with, because the Robotics bots have their own unique animations that I'm pretty sure wouldn't work on other character models.

Demon Summoning is kind of the same. You can swap the Demon models for Behemoths, say, but would those Behemoths be able to use the same animations that Demons do directly? Because I doubt this, as demons - especially the Hellfire Gargoyle and the other one, have such unique stances and the Hellfire effects in general are so eccentric.

There are a lot of pitfalls here that make for greater complication than it seems. That's the primary reason why it's taking so long.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcanaville View Post
Samuel_Tow is the only poster that makes me want to punch him in the head more often when I'm agreeing with him than when I'm disagreeing with him.